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Interbike 2017
Photos with text at
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Vs26GExC_oC476V4oZl-dDn_2TcvWFCAuDZwjJN_MYE/edit?usp=sharing Interbike is in a Death Spiral E-Bikes Lights Cleaning and Lubrication Bamboo Cameras Power Meters Smart Helmets Folding Bikes Locks WIKE Salamander Pure Cycles Rod Brakes Are Back! Tent What I Won What I bought |
Interbike 2017
On Friday, September 22, 2017 at 2:31:56 PM UTC-7, sms wrote:
Photos with text at https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Vs26GExC_oC476V4oZl-dDn_2TcvWFCAuDZwjJN_MYE/edit?usp=sharing Interbike is in a Death Spiral E-Bikes Lights Cleaning and Lubrication Bamboo Cameras Power Meters Smart Helmets Folding Bikes Locks WIKE Salamander Pure Cycles Rod Brakes Are Back! Tent What I Won What I bought I thought I missed the boat because my new bike will have rim brakes instead of discs. I should have waited for rod brakes -- or traveled back in time.. BTW, I rode with a guy last week who had been in marketing for Chris King. He was riding a Cielo with CK components. Pretty bike. CK quit manufacturing Cielo in August. It has also laid-off a lot of employees from its core component business since this article: https://bikeportland.org/2017/08/16/...-frames-239074 Whole lot of hurting going on in the high-end market. The same guy then went to work for Mavic trying to help them revive their brand in the US -- another slow death from a company that is not keeping up. It bought Enve, so it will probably concentrate on that brand. It seems odd that bicycle sales are struggling so much, being that it is still popular. Is it because of eBikes or something else? Speaking of eBikes, I got dumped by some chick on an eBike the other night. I was struggling to keep up and thought I was having a heart attack. As it turned out, my rear cable disc was stuck on. ****ty return springs on the first-gen BB7s, and the rear cable run on my new warranty-repalcement CAADX is all in housing and takes some nasty turns, so the system is pretty draggy. It was really designed for hydraulic brakes. I'm going to work on that tonight. -- Jay Beattie. |
Interbike 2017
On Friday, September 22, 2017 at 3:32:53 PM UTC-7, jbeattie wrote:
On Friday, September 22, 2017 at 2:31:56 PM UTC-7, sms wrote: Photos with text at https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Vs26GExC_oC476V4oZl-dDn_2TcvWFCAuDZwjJN_MYE/edit?usp=sharing Interbike is in a Death Spiral E-Bikes Lights Cleaning and Lubrication Bamboo Cameras Power Meters Smart Helmets Folding Bikes Locks WIKE Salamander Pure Cycles Rod Brakes Are Back! Tent What I Won What I bought I thought I missed the boat because my new bike will have rim brakes instead of discs. I should have waited for rod brakes -- or traveled back in time. BTW, I rode with a guy last week who had been in marketing for Chris King.. He was riding a Cielo with CK components. Pretty bike. CK quit manufacturing Cielo in August. It has also laid-off a lot of employees from its core component business since this article: https://bikeportland.org/2017/08/16/...-frames-239074 Whole lot of hurting going on in the high-end market. The same guy then went to work for Mavic trying to help them revive their brand in the US -- another slow death from a company that is not keeping up. It bought Enve, so it will probably concentrate on that brand. It seems odd that bicycle sales are struggling so much, being that it is still popular. Is it because of eBikes or something else? Speaking of eBikes, I got dumped by some chick on an eBike the other night. I was struggling to keep up and thought I was having a heart attack. As it turned out, my rear cable disc was stuck on. ****ty return springs on the first-gen BB7s, and the rear cable run on my new warranty-repalcement CAADX is all in housing and takes some nasty turns, so the system is pretty draggy. It was really designed for hydraulic brakes. I'm going to work on that tonight. -- Jay Beattie. I think that the Chinese are absolutely flooding the marketplace with high end bikes for low end prices. Nashbar was advertising a disk brake carbon with a 105 group for $999. Why should someone buy a used bike no matter how good for more money? Why should someone buy a high end carbon bike for last years high end prices? |
Interbike 2017
On 9/22/2017 3:32 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Friday, September 22, 2017 at 2:31:56 PM UTC-7, sms wrote: Photos with text at https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Vs26GExC_oC476V4oZl-dDn_2TcvWFCAuDZwjJN_MYE/edit?usp=sharing Interbike is in a Death Spiral E-Bikes Lights Cleaning and Lubrication Bamboo Cameras Power Meters Smart Helmets Folding Bikes Locks WIKE Salamander Pure Cycles Rod Brakes Are Back! Tent What I Won What I bought I thought I missed the boat because my new bike will have rim brakes instead of discs. I should have waited for rod brakes -- or traveled back in time. BTW, I rode with a guy last week who had been in marketing for Chris King. He was riding a Cielo with CK components. Pretty bike. CK quit manufacturing Cielo in August. It has also laid-off a lot of employees from its core component business since this article: https://bikeportland.org/2017/08/16/...-frames-239074 Whole lot of hurting going on in the high-end market. The same guy then went to work for Mavic trying to help them revive their brand in the US -- another slow death from a company that is not keeping up. It bought Enve, so it will probably concentrate on that brand. It seems odd that bicycle sales are struggling so much, being that it is still popular. Is it because of eBikes or something else? I was in a store near Stanford this afternoon. There were five Stanford students buying new bicycles. When you're spending $80K a year on college (or your parents are), the cost of a bicycle is pretty much lost in the noise. Stanford is a big biking campus and it's very large. Which is why it was depressing that the store was Walmart and they were buying the worst pieces of crap you can imagine. I understood enough Mandarin to know what they were talking about. One girl said that the bicycle was "good looking," or "好看." Speaking of eBikes, I got dumped by some chick on an eBike the other night. I was struggling to keep up and thought I was having a heart attack. As it turned out, my rear cable disc was stuck on. ****ty return springs on the first-gen BB7s, and the rear cable run on my new warranty-repalcement CAADX is all in housing and takes some nasty turns, so the system is pretty draggy. It was really designed for hydraulic brakes. I'm going to work on that tonight. Apparently e-bikes are extremely popular in Europe and Asia where there's more transportational cycling, and not in the U.S. where it's more recreational. |
Interbike 2017
On Friday, September 22, 2017 at 5:26:32 PM UTC-7, sms wrote:
On 9/22/2017 3:32 PM, jbeattie wrote: On Friday, September 22, 2017 at 2:31:56 PM UTC-7, sms wrote: Photos with text at https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Vs26GExC_oC476V4oZl-dDn_2TcvWFCAuDZwjJN_MYE/edit?usp=sharing Interbike is in a Death Spiral E-Bikes Lights Cleaning and Lubrication Bamboo Cameras Power Meters Smart Helmets Folding Bikes Locks WIKE Salamander Pure Cycles Rod Brakes Are Back! Tent What I Won What I bought I thought I missed the boat because my new bike will have rim brakes instead of discs. I should have waited for rod brakes -- or traveled back in time. BTW, I rode with a guy last week who had been in marketing for Chris King. He was riding a Cielo with CK components. Pretty bike. CK quit manufacturing Cielo in August. It has also laid-off a lot of employees from its core component business since this article: https://bikeportland.org/2017/08/16/...-frames-239074 Whole lot of hurting going on in the high-end market. The same guy then went to work for Mavic trying to help them revive their brand in the US -- another slow death from a company that is not keeping up. It bought Enve, so it will probably concentrate on that brand. It seems odd that bicycle sales are struggling so much, being that it is still popular. Is it because of eBikes or something else? I was in a store near Stanford this afternoon. There were five Stanford students buying new bicycles. When you're spending $80K a year on college (or your parents are), the cost of a bicycle is pretty much lost in the noise. Stanford is a big biking campus and it's very large. Which is why it was depressing that the store was Walmart and they were buying the worst pieces of crap you can imagine. I understood enough Mandarin to know what they were talking about. One girl said that the bicycle was "good looking," or "好看." Speaking of eBikes, I got dumped by some chick on an eBike the other night. I was struggling to keep up and thought I was having a heart attack. As it turned out, my rear cable disc was stuck on. ****ty return springs on the first-gen BB7s, and the rear cable run on my new warranty-repalcement CAADX is all in housing and takes some nasty turns, so the system is pretty draggy. It was really designed for hydraulic brakes. I'm going to work on that tonight. Apparently e-bikes are extremely popular in Europe and Asia where there's more transportational cycling, and not in the U.S. where it's more recreational. It's cheating, but I'm going to buy one for my wife -- and then use it. Sorry, honey, got to take the eBike today. It's the rare transportational cyclist riding an eBike around here, but that may change over time. I have no qualms about drafting eBikes since most are too fast to be in the bike lanes anyway. Some are just lightweight motorcycles. It's like Kommuter Keirin for me -- except for this one woman I see a lot who has an eCargoBike that goes zero to thirty in like a second. I don't have the thighs or lungs for that, and she drops me off the lights. -- Jay Beattie. |
Interbike 2017
I doahno ? Suggest taking a good look at your group as relatively finite.
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Interbike 2017
On 9/22/2017 7:40 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Friday, September 22, 2017 at 5:26:32 PM UTC-7, sms wrote: On 9/22/2017 3:32 PM, jbeattie wrote: On Friday, September 22, 2017 at 2:31:56 PM UTC-7, sms wrote: Photos with text at https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Vs26GExC_oC476V4oZl-dDn_2TcvWFCAuDZwjJN_MYE/edit?usp=sharing Interbike is in a Death Spiral E-Bikes Lights Cleaning and Lubrication Bamboo Cameras Power Meters Smart Helmets Folding Bikes Locks WIKE Salamander Pure Cycles Rod Brakes Are Back! Tent What I Won What I bought I thought I missed the boat because my new bike will have rim brakes instead of discs. I should have waited for rod brakes -- or traveled back in time. BTW, I rode with a guy last week who had been in marketing for Chris King. He was riding a Cielo with CK components. Pretty bike. CK quit manufacturing Cielo in August. It has also laid-off a lot of employees from its core component business since this article: https://bikeportland.org/2017/08/16/...-frames-239074 Whole lot of hurting going on in the high-end market. The same guy then went to work for Mavic trying to help them revive their brand in the US -- another slow death from a company that is not keeping up. It bought Enve, so it will probably concentrate on that brand. It seems odd that bicycle sales are struggling so much, being that it is still popular. Is it because of eBikes or something else? I was in a store near Stanford this afternoon. There were five Stanford students buying new bicycles. When you're spending $80K a year on college (or your parents are), the cost of a bicycle is pretty much lost in the noise. Stanford is a big biking campus and it's very large. Which is why it was depressing that the store was Walmart and they were buying the worst pieces of crap you can imagine. I understood enough Mandarin to know what they were talking about. One girl said that the bicycle was "good looking," or "好看." Speaking of eBikes, I got dumped by some chick on an eBike the other night. I was struggling to keep up and thought I was having a heart attack. As it turned out, my rear cable disc was stuck on. ****ty return springs on the first-gen BB7s, and the rear cable run on my new warranty-repalcement CAADX is all in housing and takes some nasty turns, so the system is pretty draggy. It was really designed for hydraulic brakes. I'm going to work on that tonight. Apparently e-bikes are extremely popular in Europe and Asia where there's more transportational cycling, and not in the U.S. where it's more recreational. It's cheating, but I'm going to buy one for my wife -- and then use it. Sorry, honey, got to take the eBike today. It's the rare transportational cyclist riding an eBike around here, but that may change over time. I have no qualms about drafting eBikes since most are too fast to be in the bike lanes anyway. Some are just lightweight motorcycles. It's like Kommuter Keirin for me -- except for this one woman I see a lot who has an eCargoBike that goes zero to thirty in like a second. I don't have the thighs or lungs for that, and she drops me off the lights. -- Jay Beattie. I sincerely just don't get it. Is it faster than a much less expensive new moped? https://www.amazon.com/Street-Legal-..._&dpSrc=detail Similar features - Too heavy to carry upstairs and it's not a bicycle. If you want power, that's available at much cheaper rates than an electric thingy. -- Andrew Muzi www.yellowjersey.org/ Open every day since 1 April, 1971 |
Interbike 2017
On Fri, 22 Sep 2017 20:14:43 -0500, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/22/2017 7:40 PM, jbeattie wrote: On Friday, September 22, 2017 at 5:26:32 PM UTC-7, sms wrote: On 9/22/2017 3:32 PM, jbeattie wrote: On Friday, September 22, 2017 at 2:31:56 PM UTC-7, sms wrote: Photos with text at https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Vs26GExC_oC476V4oZl-dDn_2TcvWFCAuDZwjJN_MYE/edit?usp=sharing Interbike is in a Death Spiral E-Bikes Lights Cleaning and Lubrication Bamboo Cameras Power Meters Smart Helmets Folding Bikes Locks WIKE Salamander Pure Cycles Rod Brakes Are Back! Tent What I Won What I bought I thought I missed the boat because my new bike will have rim brakes instead of discs. I should have waited for rod brakes -- or traveled back in time. BTW, I rode with a guy last week who had been in marketing for Chris King. He was riding a Cielo with CK components. Pretty bike. CK quit manufacturing Cielo in August. It has also laid-off a lot of employees from its core component business since this article: https://bikeportland.org/2017/08/16/...-frames-239074 Whole lot of hurting going on in the high-end market. The same guy then went to work for Mavic trying to help them revive their brand in the US -- another slow death from a company that is not keeping up. It bought Enve, so it will probably concentrate on that brand. It seems odd that bicycle sales are struggling so much, being that it is still popular. Is it because of eBikes or something else? I was in a store near Stanford this afternoon. There were five Stanford students buying new bicycles. When you're spending $80K a year on college (or your parents are), the cost of a bicycle is pretty much lost in the noise. Stanford is a big biking campus and it's very large. Which is why it was depressing that the store was Walmart and they were buying the worst pieces of crap you can imagine. I understood enough Mandarin to know what they were talking about. One girl said that the bicycle was "good looking," or "好看." Speaking of eBikes, I got dumped by some chick on an eBike the other night. I was struggling to keep up and thought I was having a heart attack. As it turned out, my rear cable disc was stuck on. ****ty return springs on the first-gen BB7s, and the rear cable run on my new warranty-repalcement CAADX is all in housing and takes some nasty turns, so the system is pretty draggy. It was really designed for hydraulic brakes. I'm going to work on that tonight. Apparently e-bikes are extremely popular in Europe and Asia where there's more transportational cycling, and not in the U.S. where it's more recreational. It's cheating, but I'm going to buy one for my wife -- and then use it. Sorry, honey, got to take the eBike today. It's the rare transportational cyclist riding an eBike around here, but that may change over time. I have no qualms about drafting eBikes since most are too fast to be in the bike lanes anyway. Some are just lightweight motorcycles. It's like Kommuter Keirin for me -- except for this one woman I see a lot who has an eCargoBike that goes zero to thirty in like a second. I don't have the thighs or lungs for that, and she drops me off the lights. -- Jay Beattie. I sincerely just don't get it. Is it faster than a much less expensive new moped? https://www.amazon.com/Street-Legal-..._&dpSrc=detail Similar features - Too heavy to carry upstairs and it's not a bicycle. If you want power, that's available at much cheaper rates than an electric thingy. Perhaps the Whizzer will make a comeback :-) -- Cheers, John B. |
Interbike 2017
On 9/22/2017 5:40 PM, jbeattie wrote:
snip It's the rare transportational cyclist riding an eBike around here, but that may change over time. I have no qualms about drafting eBikes since most are too fast to be in the bike lanes anyway. Some are just lightweight motorcycles. It's like Kommuter Keirin for me -- except for this one woman I see a lot who has an eCargoBike that goes zero to thirty in like a second. I don't have the thighs or lungs for that, and she drops me off the lights. I rode one eBike on the test track that was amazingly powerful. The ones with the manual throttle tend to be more powerful than the ones with "pedal assist." "Pedal assist" is apparently a legal thing, to prevent it from being classified as a moped or motorbike. |
Interbike 2017
On 9/22/2017 3:32 PM, jbeattie wrote:
snip Speaking of eBikes, I got dumped by some chick on an eBike the other night. I was struggling to keep up and thought I was having a heart attack. As it turned out, my rear cable disc was stuck on. ****ty return springs on the first-gen BB7s, and the rear cable run on my new warranty-repalcement CAADX is all in housing and takes some nasty turns, so the system is pretty draggy. It was really designed for hydraulic brakes. I'm going to work on that tonight. All those cable issues is why rod brakes are the new big thing. No cables to snap, no long cable runs with nasty turns. |
Interbike 2017
On 9/22/2017 6:14 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/22/2017 7:40 PM, jbeattie wrote: On Friday, September 22, 2017 at 5:26:32 PM UTC-7, sms wrote: On 9/22/2017 3:32 PM, jbeattie wrote: On Friday, September 22, 2017 at 2:31:56 PM UTC-7, sms wrote: Photos with text at https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Vs26GExC_oC476V4oZl-dDn_2TcvWFCAuDZwjJN_MYE/edit?usp=sharing Interbike is in a Death Spiral E-Bikes Lights Cleaning and Lubrication Bamboo Cameras Power Meters Smart Helmets Folding Bikes Locks WIKE Salamander Pure Cycles Rod Brakes Are Back! Tent What I Won What I bought I thought I missed the boat because my new bike will have rim brakes instead of discs. I should have waited for rod brakes -- or traveled back in time. BTW, I rode with a guy last week who had been in marketing for Chris King.* He was riding a Cielo with CK components. Pretty bike. CK quit manufacturing Cielo in August.* It has also laid-off a lot of employees from its core component business since this article: https://bikeportland.org/2017/08/16/...-frames-239074 Whole lot of hurting going on in the high-end market. The same guy then went to work for Mavic trying to help them revive their brand in the US -- another slow death from a company that is not keeping up.* It bought Enve, so it will probably concentrate on that brand. It seems odd that bicycle sales are struggling so much, being that it is still popular.* Is it because of eBikes or something else? I was in a store near Stanford this afternoon. There were five Stanford students buying new bicycles. When you're spending $80K a year on college (or your parents are), the cost of a bicycle is pretty much lost in the noise. Stanford is a big biking campus and it's very large. Which is why it was depressing that the store was Walmart and they were buying the worst pieces of crap you can imagine. I understood enough Mandarin to know what they were talking about. One girl said that the bicycle was "good looking," or "好看." Speaking of eBikes, I got dumped by some chick on an eBike the other night.* I was struggling to keep up and thought I was having a heart attack.* As it turned out, my rear cable disc was stuck on. ****ty return springs on the first-gen BB7s, and the rear cable run on my new warranty-repalcement CAADX is all in housing and takes some nasty turns, so the system is pretty draggy. It was really designed for hydraulic brakes.* I'm going to work on that tonight. Apparently e-bikes are extremely popular in Europe and Asia where there's more transportational cycling, and not in the U.S. where it's more recreational. It's cheating, but I'm going to buy one for my wife -- and then use it. Sorry, honey, got to take the eBike today. It's the rare transportational cyclist riding an eBike around here, but that may change over time. I have no qualms about drafting eBikes since most are too fast to be in the bike lanes anyway. Some are just lightweight motorcycles. It's like Kommuter Keirin for me -- except for this one woman I see a lot who has an eCargoBike that goes zero to thirty in like a second. I don't have the thighs or lungs for that, and she drops me off the lights. -- Jay Beattie. I sincerely just don't get it. Is it faster than a much less expensive new moped? You can ride a e-bike on bicycle multi-use paths. Mopeds aren't allowed. Even when motorized bicycles aren't allowed, a lot of them are not obvious enough for anyone to complain, and since on the "pedal assist" models you have to be pedaling, there's some legal distinction in some states. |
Interbike 2017
On Saturday, September 23, 2017 at 3:14:48 AM UTC+2, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/22/2017 7:40 PM, jbeattie wrote: On Friday, September 22, 2017 at 5:26:32 PM UTC-7, sms wrote: On 9/22/2017 3:32 PM, jbeattie wrote: On Friday, September 22, 2017 at 2:31:56 PM UTC-7, sms wrote: Photos with text at https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Vs26GExC_oC476V4oZl-dDn_2TcvWFCAuDZwjJN_MYE/edit?usp=sharing Interbike is in a Death Spiral E-Bikes Lights Cleaning and Lubrication Bamboo Cameras Power Meters Smart Helmets Folding Bikes Locks WIKE Salamander Pure Cycles Rod Brakes Are Back! Tent What I Won What I bought I thought I missed the boat because my new bike will have rim brakes instead of discs. I should have waited for rod brakes -- or traveled back in time. BTW, I rode with a guy last week who had been in marketing for Chris King. He was riding a Cielo with CK components. Pretty bike. CK quit manufacturing Cielo in August. It has also laid-off a lot of employees from its core component business since this article: https://bikeportland.org/2017/08/16/...-frames-239074 Whole lot of hurting going on in the high-end market. The same guy then went to work for Mavic trying to help them revive their brand in the US -- another slow death from a company that is not keeping up. It bought Enve, so it will probably concentrate on that brand. It seems odd that bicycle sales are struggling so much, being that it is still popular. Is it because of eBikes or something else? I was in a store near Stanford this afternoon. There were five Stanford students buying new bicycles. When you're spending $80K a year on college (or your parents are), the cost of a bicycle is pretty much lost in the noise. Stanford is a big biking campus and it's very large. Which is why it was depressing that the store was Walmart and they were buying the worst pieces of crap you can imagine. I understood enough Mandarin to know what they were talking about. One girl said that the bicycle was "good looking," or "好看." Speaking of eBikes, I got dumped by some chick on an eBike the other night. I was struggling to keep up and thought I was having a heart attack.. As it turned out, my rear cable disc was stuck on. ****ty return springs on the first-gen BB7s, and the rear cable run on my new warranty-repalcement CAADX is all in housing and takes some nasty turns, so the system is pretty draggy. It was really designed for hydraulic brakes. I'm going to work on that tonight. Apparently e-bikes are extremely popular in Europe and Asia where there's more transportational cycling, and not in the U.S. where it's more recreational. It's cheating, but I'm going to buy one for my wife -- and then use it. Sorry, honey, got to take the eBike today. It's the rare transportational cyclist riding an eBike around here, but that may change over time. I have no qualms about drafting eBikes since most are too fast to be in the bike lanes anyway. Some are just lightweight motorcycles. It's like Kommuter Keirin for me -- except for this one woman I see a lot who has an eCargoBike that goes zero to thirty in like a second. I don't have the thighs or lungs for that, and she drops me off the lights.. -- Jay Beattie. I sincerely just don't get it. Is it faster than a much less expensive new moped? 1 out of 3 sold bikes here in the Netherlands is a E bike and sales going up every year. The majority electric assisted (up to 25 km/hr). The people aren't 'ashamed' anymore and they really look like a normal bike. We have a discussion now because more deadly accidents happened the last year due to accidents involving E bikes. Older people can't handle the speed and that heavy bike. Similar features - Too heavy to carry upstairs and it's not a bicycle. We don't carry bikes upstairs. If you want power, that's available at much cheaper rates than an electric thingy. You are missing the point Andrew. If you had a utility bike shop here you would go out of business if you didn't offer E bikes. Lou |
Interbike 2017
Where's the 1 liter car ?
A profile from Jones https://www.google.com/search?q=prof...obile&ie=UTF-8 |
Interbike 2017
On 9/22/2017 8:14 PM, AMuzi wrote:
I sincerely just don't get it. Is it faster than a much less expensive new moped? https://www.amazon.com/Street-Legal-..._&dpSrc=detail Similar features - Too heavy to carry upstairs and it's not a bicycle. If you want power, that's available at much cheaper rates than an electric thingy. Short version: 1. The China scooters are 1/5th the price of the Japanese stuff, but they suffer a lot of reliability issues and have no dealer support. 2. Normal motorcycle shops won't work on them, for various reasons, so when the thing breaks you will probably have to fix it yourself. That is--IF you can find anywhere to buy the correct parts... Disclaimer: I've never owned one. Some friends and acquaintances bought them. The China scooters got wildly popular in my area a number of years back, because a few of the local independent use-car lots began selling them right off the lots. The scooters were cheap and looked good, but the reliability sucked. Within ~3 years all three of the places selling them all stopped for various reasons, and the scooters disappeared from the roads within a couple years after. They're still cheap on the internet--but lots of user reviews say that the problems are still the same--poor reliability and no dealer/parts support. Meanwhile--the people I know who bought Honda/Kawasaki/Yamaha/Suzuki scooters are still riding them around, 10+ years later. The China 50cc scooters cost $500, and the Japanese 50cc scooters cost ~$2500. If you buy a China 50cc scooter and you get one year of moderate use out of it, you probably got your money's worth. ,,,,,,,,,, So with this information added to the comparison--I would dare say that a $500 e-bike may be a better deal for most people (for short-range use) than a $500 50cc China scooter. 1. The e-bike requires no license or insurance or fuel, and can be used on bicycle-only routes. 2. If (when) either breaks down, the e-bike is a lot easier for an average person to fix themselves. |
Interbike 2017
On 9/22/2017 8:43 PM, sms wrote:
On 9/22/2017 5:40 PM, jbeattie wrote: ,,, I rode one eBike on the test track that was amazingly powerful. The ones with the manual throttle tend to be more powerful than the ones with "pedal assist." "Pedal assist" is apparently a legal thing, to prevent it from being classified as a moped or motorbike. This is known as the "e-vehicle façade", if you did not know... Piston motors have very low torque when idling and usually have their power peak up around 75% of their maximum RPMs. Electric motors generally put out their maximum torque at zero RPMs and their torque decreases as RPMs go up. So e-vehicles typically have HUGE power when accelerating, especially from a standstill. This is easy for dealers to demonstrate, and it is usually pretty impressive. And it's been this way always: there are articles online from electric cars 100 years ago where people talked about it. The two major shortcoming of e-vehicles (that use on-board storage batteries) are things that you don't notice on a short test drive. The first is overall range, and the second is the actual-cost-per-mile, after battery replacement is factored in. The highest operating cost is not the electricity involved in changing the batteries, it is replacing the batteries as they expire. And they all do expire. The current crop of e-car makers insists it's not an issue, but they warranty the batteries for the original purchaser--which only means that the person who bought the car new won't get stuck with replacement battery costs. That (BIG) bill is getting dropped on the next person who buys the car used. A MAJOR chapter of the e-car story is not yet written: what happens when these new cars become used cars and nobody will buy them because they immediately need a $3000-$5000+ battery put in? Is the dealer going to pay for that too? Or will there be another govt subsidy? If not, then how much would you pay for any new car that had little to no resale value?.... Stay tuned.... Replacement battery costs is the reason that no battery-powered large vehicles have ever come into common use before. By far, the most common electric vehicles world-wide is trains, that are fed from overhead wires and so are freed from the costs of batteries entirely. The most popular options for Tesla cars may yet become a pantograph. |
Interbike 2017
On Friday, September 22, 2017 at 6:47:11 PM UTC-7, sms wrote:
On 9/22/2017 6:14 PM, AMuzi wrote: On 9/22/2017 7:40 PM, jbeattie wrote: On Friday, September 22, 2017 at 5:26:32 PM UTC-7, sms wrote: On 9/22/2017 3:32 PM, jbeattie wrote: On Friday, September 22, 2017 at 2:31:56 PM UTC-7, sms wrote: Photos with text at https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Vs26GExC_oC476V4oZl-dDn_2TcvWFCAuDZwjJN_MYE/edit?usp=sharing Interbike is in a Death Spiral E-Bikes Lights Cleaning and Lubrication Bamboo Cameras Power Meters Smart Helmets Folding Bikes Locks WIKE Salamander Pure Cycles Rod Brakes Are Back! Tent What I Won What I bought I thought I missed the boat because my new bike will have rim brakes instead of discs. I should have waited for rod brakes -- or traveled back in time. BTW, I rode with a guy last week who had been in marketing for Chris King.Â* He was riding a Cielo with CK components. Pretty bike. CK quit manufacturing Cielo in August.Â* It has also laid-off a lot of employees from its core component business since this article: https://bikeportland.org/2017/08/16/...-frames-239074 Whole lot of hurting going on in the high-end market. The same guy then went to work for Mavic trying to help them revive their brand in the US -- another slow death from a company that is not keeping up.Â* It bought Enve, so it will probably concentrate on that brand. It seems odd that bicycle sales are struggling so much, being that it is still popular.Â* Is it because of eBikes or something else? I was in a store near Stanford this afternoon. There were five Stanford students buying new bicycles. When you're spending $80K a year on college (or your parents are), the cost of a bicycle is pretty much lost in the noise. Stanford is a big biking campus and it's very large. Which is why it was depressing that the store was Walmart and they were buying the worst pieces of crap you can imagine. I understood enough Mandarin to know what they were talking about. One girl said that the bicycle was "good looking," or "好看." Speaking of eBikes, I got dumped by some chick on an eBike the other night.Â* I was struggling to keep up and thought I was having a heart attack.Â* As it turned out, my rear cable disc was stuck on. ****ty return springs on the first-gen BB7s, and the rear cable run on my new warranty-repalcement CAADX is all in housing and takes some nasty turns, so the system is pretty draggy. It was really designed for hydraulic brakes.Â* I'm going to work on that tonight. Apparently e-bikes are extremely popular in Europe and Asia where there's more transportational cycling, and not in the U.S. where it's more recreational. It's cheating, but I'm going to buy one for my wife -- and then use it. Sorry, honey, got to take the eBike today. It's the rare transportational cyclist riding an eBike around here, but that may change over time. I have no qualms about drafting eBikes since most are too fast to be in the bike lanes anyway. Some are just lightweight motorcycles. It's like Kommuter Keirin for me -- except for this one woman I see a lot who has an eCargoBike that goes zero to thirty in like a second. I don't have the thighs or lungs for that, and she drops me off the lights. -- Jay Beattie. I sincerely just don't get it. Is it faster than a much less expensive new moped? You can ride a e-bike on bicycle multi-use paths. Mopeds aren't allowed. Even when motorized bicycles aren't allowed, a lot of them are not obvious enough for anyone to complain, and since on the "pedal assist" models you have to be pedaling, there's some legal distinction in some states. That's exactly it -- beating traffic without undue exertion. You can't lane split on a motorcycle here in Oregon, so next best thing -- speed in the bike lane. I'm interested in what Lou has to say and the experience in NL because it seems like a dangerous mix -- but then again, you get some of the same problems mixing stronger and weaker riders even without motors. We're no Amsterdam, but we do have a lot of bicycles for a US city, and bike conflicts are common in some places. -- Jay Beattie. |
Interbike 2017
There was one Korean company that is coming out with a very nice e-bike mid-drive conversion kit in 2018. You don't lose the front derailleur. A cylindrical battery pack attaches to the motor and mounts under the downtube--no wires to a remote battery. Only the left crank arm is removed for installation. It's not on their web site yet. With other mid-drive conversions you only have a single chain wheel.
This company also had some very high quality bicycle lights, including a new 5000 lumen model. 500 lumen appears to be the low end now for lighting companies, 1500-2000 is mid-range, 2500-5000 is high-end. But like many companies, they won't sell through QBP and few shops will meet their MOQ. Very good marketing person, who spoke perfect English in the booth. The Korean companies tend to have their act together at trade shows. http://www.luutech.com |
Interbike 2017
Jay gonna buy a Yama ha ? Go for it.
Minus on your legs. Keep track ! |
Interbike 2017
Cycling environment Lou brought us maybe Lou's garage
https://www.google.com/search?client...iw=360&bih=560 |
Interbike 2017
On 9/22/2017 5:40 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Friday, September 22, 2017 at 5:26:32 PM UTC-7, sms wrote: [big snip] Apparently e-bikes are extremely popular in Europe and Asia where there's more transportational cycling, and not in the U.S. where it's more recreational. It's cheating, but I'm going to buy one for my wife -- and then use it. Sorry, honey, got to take the eBike today. Damn - great minds really do think alike! Just took my wife for an e-bike test ride Friday. She liked it. I'm figuring she can motor-pace me some days. I'm feeling the temptation, but holding the line on getting one for me - for now. It's the rare transportational cyclist riding an eBike around here, but that may change over time. I have no qualms about drafting eBikes since most are too fast to be in the bike lanes anyway. Some are just lightweight motorcycles. It's like Kommuter Keirin for me -- except for this one woman I see a lot who has an eCargoBike that goes zero to thirty in like a second. I don't have the thighs or lungs for that, and she drops me off the lights. Yup, I've seen two or three on my commute (the slower ebikes, look like hub motors mostly). Hard to hold that wheel. Mark J. |
Interbike 2017
On 9/24/2017 7:58 PM, Mark J. wrote:
On 9/22/2017 5:40 PM, jbeattie wrote: On Friday, September 22, 2017 at 5:26:32 PM UTC-7, sms wrote: [big snip] Apparently e-bikes are extremely popular in Europe and Asia where there's more transportational cycling, and not in the U.S. where it's more recreational. It's cheating, but I'm going to buy one for my wife -- and then use it. Sorry, honey, got to take the eBike today. Damn - great minds really do think alike!Â* Just took my wife for an e-bike test ride Friday.Â* She liked it. I'm figuring she can motor-pace me some days. I'm feeling the temptation, but holding the line on getting one for me - for now. I am hoping that the mid-drive retrofit kit that is coming out next year from a Korean company will be priced reasonably. It looks much better than the Chinese Bafang retrofit kits that have become popular and that cost $800-900 with battery. LUU Lighting has very good quality lighting products so hopefully their retrofit kit will be the same. They said that they are exhibiting it at CES in January, and that the Korean government is paying for their CES booth because of this product. They had a single sheet flier about it at Interbike. The electric wheels all have drawbacks. Having a large battery spinning inide a wheel, or even stationary inside a wheel just seems like the wrong approach. At least the Copenhagen wheel has regenerative braking so the batter size can be a little smaller, but most e-Bikes don't have this. |
Interbike 2017
On 9/25/2017 1:07 PM, sms wrote:
... The electric wheels all have drawbacks. Having a large battery spinning inide a wheel, or even stationary inside a wheel just seems like the wrong approach. At least the Copenhagen wheel has regenerative braking so the batter size can be a little smaller, but most e-Bikes don't have this. Back when I was doing a cost comparison of gas vs electric e-bike setups, the example I used for e-bikes was the BionX system, because they were the only company that would actually publish real numbers for range and battery recharge life-cycle estimates. And at the time I think it was the only one that had regenerative braking, and users on endless-sphere forums reported that using the feature really didn't add much range unless you were literally riding down a mountain. At best it would add maybe 5% under typical riding conditions. If all it takes to implement is a few more tiny electrical parts then including it is no big weight penalty, but (as of maybe 5 years ago) there didn't seem to be any great advantage to it in the case of e-bikes. |
Interbike 2017
@Steve,
You summed up Interbike pretty well. American Outdoors was there, doing live interviews with companies and products they chose as best in show. They chose Oculus as the best light, by far. If there's any justification for the cost of going despite the terrible floor traffic, an interview/infomercial like this would cost many times what the cost of my week at Interbike was. Check out the interview they did. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O68Sc72mKJ4 Many perennial big name brands weren't there. Others scaled way down. Sales this year was a flop. Last year I sold eleven lights. This year only three. Floor traffic was way down. Last year, attendees took 200 flyers and show special sheets, that led to stores coming onboard and event sales and support deals. This year, only ~75 sheets. Planet Bike wasn't there nor some CCBL companies that usually exhibit. Serfas wasn't around. CygoLights had a full exhibit, and took on the misconception that they're just a CCBL company with signage about being designed and assembled in the USA. Owner is an American citizen of Japanese descent. He and I had a fruitful conversation about the state of the bike lighting industry in general and what it takes to launch a new product. Reps from Gaciron and other Chinese companies stopped by my booth who had their own exhibits in past years.. They didn't stay long after I said I'm made in USA, not interested in reselling lights made by anyone else. Even Cateye only had a wall of lights up at the JBi combined exhibit. This year I exhibited solo, a few different people weren't available to help out, and so many other regulars weren't going this year either who would have manned the booth to free me up to have meetings and check out other exhibits. If you haven't exhibited at a show like this, then I can see your feeling of wanting more more attention when approaching a booth. It can be overwhelming to try to do a full day's work while exhibiting at a major show, so I apologize that I couldn't get to you quickly. I called out to you after excusing myself from the call I was on but you were already walking away. You caught me on the phone either with my mother wishing her happy holidays or the guy from La Jolla Cyclery, an Oculus reseller, who was supposed to come up for the day and I got credentials for, but called later on to say that the dog-sitter they had cancelled at the last minute so they couldn't make it. If there's a waking giant in the bike light market, its for German STVZO compliant e-bike lights. STVZO are the go-to lights for the big e-bike makers who want a single, global product, with a real vehicular type headlight beam. My STVZO beam is twice as bright, using the same or less power, in as small a footprint and package, costing the same or less to produce, as the typical STVZO Supernova brand that most bike light makers are using by default for lack of better product available. Sales figures to e-bikes have exceeded industry projections each year since 2014, and keep increasing. Getting my STVZO beam into production under license with one of the big three is a daunting task, where I already have traction but anyone whose launched a business knows the long way from first conceptual discussion to having a signed and profitable design and licensing agreement. Interbike is in a Death Spiral E-Bikes Lights Cleaning and Lubrication Bamboo Cameras Power Meters Smart Helmets Folding Bikes Locks WIKE Salamander Pure Cycles Rod Brakes Are Back! Tent What I Won What I bought |
Interbike 2017
On 9/26/2017 3:07 PM, Oculus Lights wrote:
If there's a waking giant in the bike light market, its for German STVZO compliant e-bike lights. STVZO are the go-to lights for the big e-bike makers who want a single, global product, with a real vehicular type headlight beam. My STVZO beam is twice as bright, using the same or less power, in as small a footprint and package, costing the same or less to produce, as the typical STVZO Supernova brand that most bike light makers are using by default for lack of better product available. I'm glad you're working on an StVZO headlight. -- - Frank Krygowski |
Interbike 2017
On 9/26/2017 2:07 PM, Oculus Lights wrote:
@Steve, You summed up Interbike pretty well. -snip snip- CygoLights had a full exhibit, and took on the misconception that they're just a CCBL company with signage about being designed and assembled in the USA. What does CCBL mean? https://www.acronymfinder.com/CCBL.html -- Andrew Muzi www.yellowjersey.org/ Open every day since 1 April, 1971 |
Interbike 2017
On Tuesday, September 26, 2017 at 1:26:07 PM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 9/26/2017 3:07 PM, Oculus Lights wrote: If there's a waking giant in the bike light market, its for German STVZO compliant e-bike lights. STVZO are the go-to lights for the big e-bike makers who want a single, global product, with a real vehicular type headlight beam. My STVZO beam is twice as bright, using the same or less power, in as small a footprint and package, costing the same or less to produce, as the typical STVZO Supernova brand 205 lm that most bike light makers are using by default for lack of better product available. I'm glad you're working on an StVZO headlight. -- - Frank Krygowski This is my STVZO beam measurement with a lame old Cree XPG. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SXuE3JmBclM Note that my lumens of 325, measured in a reasonably trustable lab, is also abnormally high for the max lux amount. The beam is much more even than other STZO lights put out, similar to a high performance car headlight spread. STVZO lights currently for sale look like a paint brush stroke across the bright spot, and not much more anywhere else. Step up to a newer high bin LED and more power and this goes up to 600+ in manufacturable form, without exceeding 2 lux maximum at the horizontal. Its ironic, and I think, bad business for other companies, to spend tens of thousands on an in-house design effort using conventional wisdom that won't make a light better than what's on the market already, when I have a STVZO beam ready to go to manufacture, that exceeds the performance and costs the same or less to manufacture than the competing lights already on the market. |
Interbike 2017
On 9/26/2017 2:46 PM, Oculus Lights wrote:
snip Its ironic, and I think, bad business for other companies, to spend tens of thousands on an in-house design effort using conventional wisdom that won't make a light better than what's on the market already, when I have a STVZO beam ready to go to manufacture, that exceeds the performance and costs the same or less to manufacture than the competing lights already on the market. Have you considered adding a dynamo mode to the existing light? Maybe put the circuitry inside the light to be able to charge the internal battery and/or operate the light at reduced power when powered only from the dynamo. |
Interbike 2017
On 9/26/2017 1:54 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/26/2017 2:07 PM, Oculus Lights wrote: @Steve, You summed up Interbike pretty well. -snip snip- CygoLights had a full exhibit, and took on the misconception that they're just a CCBL company with signage about being designed and assembled in the USA. What does CCBL mean? Cheap Chinese Bicycle Lights. |
Interbike 2017
Making a dynamo version of a light is a ki$$ of death. Minimal market for the huge investment needed compared to market return. e-bike circuits are a simple DC-DC converter. Dynamo output is erratic crap-wave shaped power needing special circuitry. IF you want to pay for design, tooling, and production costs, it would fit on the existing main circuit board.
My workaround is that I provide external DC input holes on the main circuit board, and the end-user can solder leads from any power adapter they wish that provides 3.0 to 4.2VDC. Another option is to plug in a Generator to USB adapter. The common 5VDC 1A USB feed will drive the light at its middle setting nearly endlessly if you also have a battery installed. On Friday, September 22, 2017 at 2:31:56 PM UTC-7, sms wrote: Photos with text at https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Vs26GExC_oC476V4oZl-dDn_2TcvWFCAuDZwjJN_MYE/edit?usp=sharing Interbike is in a Death Spiral E-Bikes Lights Cleaning and Lubrication Bamboo Cameras Power Meters Smart Helmets Folding Bikes Locks WIKE Salamander Pure Cycles Rod Brakes Are Back! Tent What I Won What I bought |
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