Touchy front brakes
 

Some people are crashing bikeshare e-bikes because the front brakes are
too touchy.
https://www.autoblog.com/2019/04/15/...recall-brakes/

Some discussions on the topic claim the brakes in question are probably
Shimano Rollerbrakes; that is, drum brakes filled with lots of grease.
https://www.sheldonbrown.com/rollerbrakes.html One person theorized
that the grease is washing out while the bikes are parked outside,
turning them into "binary" units - on or off. But I don't know if that's
been proven yet.

If any front brake is to be capable of stopping a bike in the shortest
feasible distance, it's capable of dumping a novice who doesn't know to
brace oneself against the handlebars. (Jobst claimed most "over the bar"
crashes were really caused by insufficient bracing; that the cyclist
inadvertently knocked the handlebars sideways as he slid forward on the
bike.) So, given that bike share bikes will be used by lots of novices,
should they purposely be given weak front brakes?

I've long thought that it's a bad idea to have bike brakes with large
mechanical advantage - IOW, that can be locked up with very little
finger pressure. I've seen a novice go OTB the first time she tried to
stop quickly using Shimano Dual Pivot calipers, vs. single pivot caliper
brakes. I suspect OTB happens a lot more these days.

--
- Frank Krygowski

Touchy front brakes
 

On Wednesday, April 17, 2019 at 9:34:19 AM UTC-5, Frank Krygowski wrote:
So, given that bike share bikes will be used by lots of novices,
should they purposely be given weak front brakes?
--
- Frank Krygowski

I'll argue about this assumption since I have nothing else to do. Do people who do not ride bikes ever, rent these communal bikes and ride them? I find that hard to believe. I can believe that young, fit, athletic people who work out, jog, but don't ride much, do rent these bikes. But I would still suspect they are familiar with bicycling and have ridden some. Bicycling, even these rental bikes, require effort and muscle and strength and sweat. Something a person who does not bicycle already, will NOT do.

Touchy front brakes
 

On 4/17/2019 1:50 PM, wrote:
On Wednesday, April 17, 2019 at 9:34:19 AM UTC-5, Frank Krygowski wrote:
So, given that bike share bikes will be used by lots of novices,
should they purposely be given weak front brakes?
--
- Frank Krygowski

I'll argue about this assumption since I have nothing else to do. Do people who do not ride bikes ever, rent these communal bikes and ride them? I find that hard to believe. I can believe that young, fit, athletic people who work out, jog, but don't ride much, do rent these bikes. But I would still suspect they are familiar with bicycling and have ridden some. Bicycling, even these rental bikes, require effort and muscle and strength and sweat. Something a person who does not bicycle already, will NOT do.


The Citi are motorized, with an electric motor & battery.
For regular rental bikes you'd have a stronger argument but
I don't know, haven't seen any local/tourist rental numbers.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

Touchy front brakes
 

AMuzi wrote:
:On 4/17/2019 1:50 PM, wrote:
: On Wednesday, April 17, 2019 at 9:34:19 AM UTC-5, Frank Krygowski wrote:
: So, given that bike share bikes will be used by lots of novices,
: should they purposely be given weak front brakes?
: --
: - Frank Krygowski
:
: I'll argue about this assumption since I have nothing else to do. Do people who do not ride bikes ever, rent these communal bikes and ride them? I find that hard to believe. I can believe that young, fit, athletic people who work out, jog, but don't ride much, do rent these bikes. But I would still suspect they are familiar with bicycling and have ridden some. Bicycling, even these rental bikes, require effort and muscle and strength and sweat. Something a person who does not bicycle already, will NOT do.
:

:The Citi are motorized, with an electric motor & battery.
:For regular rental bikes you'd have a stronger argument but
:I don't know, haven't seen any local/tourist rental numbers.

Judging by what I see in Chicago, most people riding a Divvy bike are
not regular bike riders. Lots of tourists, particularly along the
lake. There is a base of users that use them for the first and last
miles of commutes. I don't know the actual numbers, though.



--
sig 111

Touchy front brakes
 

A few years ago I commuted by electric bicycle to work. One time I was riding home and at the first stop the slightest touch of the brakes it locked up and I went over and scraped both palms, beyond other injuries. Tried it afterward and it was ok and never had the problem again. So squeeze the brakes before starting out to hopefully avoid this problem.

Touchy front brakes
 

On Wednesday, April 17, 2019 at 2:33:39 PM UTC-5, AMuzi wrote:
On 4/17/2019 1:50 PM, wrote:
On Wednesday, April 17, 2019 at 9:34:19 AM UTC-5, Frank Krygowski wrote:
So, given that bike share bikes will be used by lots of novices,
should they purposely be given weak front brakes?
--
- Frank Krygowski

I'll argue about this assumption since I have nothing else to do. Do people who do not ride bikes ever, rent these communal bikes and ride them? I find that hard to believe. I can believe that young, fit, athletic people who work out, jog, but don't ride much, do rent these bikes. But I would still suspect they are familiar with bicycling and have ridden some. Bicycling, even these rental bikes, require effort and muscle and strength and sweat. Something a person who does not bicycle already, will NOT do.


The Citi are motorized, with an electric motor & battery.
For regular rental bikes you'd have a stronger argument but
I don't know, haven't seen any local/tourist rental numbers.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

Pretty positive the rental bikes in downtown Des Moines are regular pedal powered bikes. Not electric. I have not observed who rides them.

Touchy front brakes
 

On 17/04/2019 4:37 p.m., David Scheidt wrote:
AMuzi wrote:
:On 4/17/2019 1:50 PM, wrote:
: On Wednesday, April 17, 2019 at 9:34:19 AM UTC-5, Frank Krygowski wrote:
: So, given that bike share bikes will be used by lots of novices,
: should they purposely be given weak front brakes?
: --
: - Frank Krygowski
:
: I'll argue about this assumption since I have nothing else to do. Do people who do not ride bikes ever, rent these communal bikes and ride them? I find that hard to believe. I can believe that young, fit, athletic people who work out, jog, but don't ride much, do rent these bikes. But I would still suspect they are familiar with bicycling and have ridden some. Bicycling, even these rental bikes, require effort and muscle and strength and sweat. Something a person who does not bicycle already, will NOT do.
:

:The Citi are motorized, with an electric motor & battery.
:For regular rental bikes you'd have a stronger argument but
:I don't know, haven't seen any local/tourist rental numbers.

Judging by what I see in Chicago, most people riding a Divvy bike are
not regular bike riders. Lots of tourists, particularly along the
lake. There is a base of users that use them for the first and last
miles of commutes. I don't know the actual numbers, though.




I have friends that live in downtown Montreal that use the Bixies.
Mostly they don't have safe places to secure their road bikes so they
opt for the bike share option.

But there are also a lot of tourists, students and local residents that
just use them. Anyone using one more than a block or so would likely
figure out the brakes though. Especially around the Plateau or Mont
Royal with the hills and traffic. I have not heard of anyone going OTB
on a Bixie. I don't think I'm seeing the issue here.

Touchy front brakes
 

On 4/18/2019 12:01 AM, wrote:
On Wednesday, April 17, 2019 at 2:33:39 PM UTC-5, AMuzi wrote:
On 4/17/2019 1:50 PM, wrote:
On Wednesday, April 17, 2019 at 9:34:19 AM UTC-5, Frank Krygowski wrote:
So, given that bike share bikes will be used by lots of novices,
should they purposely be given weak front brakes?
--
- Frank Krygowski

I'll argue about this assumption since I have nothing else to do. Do people who do not ride bikes ever, rent these communal bikes and ride them? I find that hard to believe. I can believe that young, fit, athletic people who work out, jog, but don't ride much, do rent these bikes. But I would still suspect they are familiar with bicycling and have ridden some. Bicycling, even these rental bikes, require effort and muscle and strength and sweat. Something a person who does not bicycle already, will NOT do.


The Citi are motorized, with an electric motor & battery.
For regular rental bikes you'd have a stronger argument but
I don't know, haven't seen any local/tourist rental numbers.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

Pretty positive the rental bikes in downtown Des Moines are regular pedal powered bikes. Not electric. I have not observed who rides them.

We used the bike share in Paris a few years ago, in the pre-electric
days. On one hand, I can confirm that the French people using the bikes
seemed to be much fitter looking than the average American.

But then, almost all the French people were much fitter looking than the
average American.


--
- Frank Krygowski

Touchy front brakes
 

On Thursday, April 18, 2019 at 9:41:51 AM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 4/18/2019 12:01 AM, wrote:
On Wednesday, April 17, 2019 at 2:33:39 PM UTC-5, AMuzi wrote:
On 4/17/2019 1:50 PM, wrote:
On Wednesday, April 17, 2019 at 9:34:19 AM UTC-5, Frank Krygowski wrote:
So, given that bike share bikes will be used by lots of novices,
should they purposely be given weak front brakes?
--
- Frank Krygowski

I'll argue about this assumption since I have nothing else to do. Do people who do not ride bikes ever, rent these communal bikes and ride them? I find that hard to believe. I can believe that young, fit, athletic people who work out, jog, but don't ride much, do rent these bikes. But I would still suspect they are familiar with bicycling and have ridden some. Bicycling, even these rental bikes, require effort and muscle and strength and sweat. Something a person who does not bicycle already, will NOT do.


The Citi are motorized, with an electric motor & battery.
For regular rental bikes you'd have a stronger argument but
I don't know, haven't seen any local/tourist rental numbers.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

Pretty positive the rental bikes in downtown Des Moines are regular pedal powered bikes. Not electric. I have not observed who rides them.

We used the bike share in Paris a few years ago, in the pre-electric
days. On one hand, I can confirm that the French people using the bikes
seemed to be much fitter looking than the average American.

But then, almost all the French people were much fitter looking than the
average American.


--
- Frank Krygowski

I did a 51 mile ride with over a thousand feet of climbing yesterday. I felt fine when I got home and it was take out the garbage night so I mowed the lawns and pulled a lot of weeds though you couldn't tell anything has changed. That REALLY broke the camel's spine though and I am still exhausted today.

Touchy front brakes
 

On Wed, 17 Apr 2019 11:50:42 -0700 (PDT), wrote:
On Wednesday, April 17, 2019 at 9:34:19 AM UTC-5, Frank Krygowski wrote:
So, given that bike share bikes will be used by lots of novices, should they purposely be given
weak front brakes? -- - Frank Krygowski

I'll argue about this assumption since I have nothing else to do. Do people who do not ride bikes
ever, rent these communal bikes and ride them? I find that hard to believe. I can believe that
young, fit, athletic people who work out, jog, but don't ride much, do rent these bikes. But I
would still suspect they are familiar with bicycling and have ridden some. Bicycling, even these
rental bikes, require effort and muscle and strength and sweat. Something a person who does not
bicycle already, will NOT do.

Around here, at least, we have a couple of bikeshare options (NiceBike, Lime, etc.). The main users I
see appear to be college students- rather than locking up a bike on campus, they just pick one up for
the time they need it. But electric scooters were available for a time last year and were much mroe
popular than bikes (probably for the reasons above). I haven't seen the scooters around lately.