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Old October 28th 14, 10:42 AM posted to rec.bicycles.soc
Blackblade[_2_]
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Posts: 214
Default Our wildlands are not outdoor gymnasiums or amusement parks.

We are doing two entirely separate things when we are using a

trail. You are doing a sport. I am doing an appreciation of nature,

which can

only be accomplished by moving slowly on your own two feet. They don't

mix.

Yes, we're doing different ... RECREATIONS ! Unless and

until you can show that you NEED to be there this is axiomatically the
case. Nature doesn't need you to appreciate it ... in fact, your
appreciation creates erosion and disturbs nature ... you WANT to go there for
your own purposes.

Not all recreations are equal. Until this sinks into your bog
of a brain, we are at an impasse.


I have never said they are all equal. The impasse is because, despite your inability to prove it in any objective way, you insist on asserting that hiking is axiomatically a better recreation. It isn't ... that's just your opinion.

You
disturb and destroy what I am doing just as a motorcyclist would

disturb and
destroy what you are doing, although he is also doing what you are

doing -
engaging in a sport - but on a different level.


I agree that, in your case, there is a degree of conflict.

So, we need to find a compromise. As I've already said, I'm not at all
averse to having some hiker only trails and some biker only trails.
However, what I am vehemently against is your attempt to annexe the entire
trails network for your recreation only.

Bikers will have to get their own trails. That is the only
compromise I am willing to make. There can be no sharing of trails. Walkers and
morons on wheels do not mix.


No, some trails will be shared and some will be hiker or biker only as suits local conditions. I don't care what compromises you are willing, or not willing, to make; your opinion counts for nothing because you are an extremist and I only ever negotiate with reasonable people.

All recreations are NOT
equal. The expert on environmental impacts is Mr. Vandeman. I am the

expert on
what trails are for based on philosophical considerations.


I have never said that all recreations are equal ... I think

mountainbiking is a better recreation than hiking ... and, yes, I do engage in
both.

You keep opining that hiking is better but fail to understand that

this is simply your opinion which, therefore, no one else is required to
share. You are going to keep flailing around unless and until you accept
that different people have different opinions and that, no, you are not
axiomatically right anymore than anyone else is ether.

I don't much care which is better - hiking or biking. But I am
stating as clearly as I can that they are DIFFERENT! One is a sport and the
other is an appreciation of nature. Like you, I do both.


So, they are different. I agree. So what ? What are the logical implications thereof ? Given that they are both recreations undertaken by people for the purposes of enjoyment, rather than necessity, they have equal status in terms of rights to use a limited, publicly owned resource.

You can do what you do in a million different places. I can
only do what I do in a few rare places left on this earth where the

natural
scene has not been corrupted by mankind's constructions and practical
usages.


Ed, we are talking about trails ! They are man-made

constructions to allow people to get to natural places but, in and of
themselves, they are a corruption too.

If you really cared about nature that much then you would eschew

hiking too.

No, that would be taking things too far. However, Mr. Vandeman
might find some sense in that proposition. He cares more about the wildlife than
you or I do.


So, you just admitted that you don't want to give up hiking ... irrespective of the impact on nature ... because you enjoy it.

I have a mountain bike myself which I ride on the gravel roads
here in Nobles County, Minnesota. The only extremist here is

you.

I didn't put the words in your mouth ... it was you who wrote that

the presence of a mountainbike on a trail caused you "Mental Torture".

It is "mental torture" and it would be for you too if you had
a decent regard for nature relatively undisturbed by mankind.


You're doing the exact same disturbing yourself !

I call you an extremist because you are. You want to never

have to share a trail with a mountainbiker. That's just not
feasible. I'm not saying you have to share them all though ... because,
unlike you, I'm not an extremist.

I repeat myself endlessly on this, but you are the only
extremist here with your rank disregard for the sacredness of trails. You are
trespassing in my church. You are a desecrator and a barbarian. Your own
grandfather would disown you!


If it were your church then you'd have a point ... but it's not. You're trying to build your 'church' on public land. Trails are not sacred; most of them arose as transport in previous centuries. You've simply adopted them for your activity and are now objecting because others want to use them for different activities.

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