On 29/06/2017 2:22 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Thursday, June 29, 2017 at 9:34:02 AM UTC-7, Doug Landau wrote:
On Thursday, June 29, 2017 at 7:18:34 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-06-28 11:31, Duane wrote:
On 28/06/2017 12:49 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Wednesday, June 28, 2017 at 7:03:26 AM UTC-7, Duane wrote:
On 27/06/2017 7:44 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Tuesday, June 27, 2017 at 3:55:02 PM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 6/27/2017 5:07 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 6/27/2017 12:23 PM, wrote:


You can get the latest Michelin Power Endurance tires for
only a little less than the Gatorskins. So far the Pro4
Endurance tires have impressed the hell out of me.

https://www.merlincycles.com/micheli...YaAlsK8P8 HAQ



What impresses me the most is that I've gotten only one
flat and it was from a goat's head thorn. The traction is
a LOT better on the road than Gatorskins are. Though the
long term wear I can't tell yet.

A serious question about traction: What sort of road riding
lets you know one make of tire has better traction than
another?

I know how to evaluate traction only by exceeding its limit;
that is by skidding when braking, or by sliding out when
cornering.

But I've hardly ever skidded when braking except when doing
parking lot exercises to teach quick stopping to other
cyclists. And one of my (only two ever) on-road falls was a
slide out, but it was due to winter road salt. I doubt any
tire would have maintained traction.

Granted, I'm very conservative with cornering. I don't ever
look like this:
http://www.trentobike.org/Countries/...y/tiretest.jpg



So do others regularly take their cornering to the limit,
then note how the tires behave?



Harder tread compounds feel odd in corners as compared to
Michelins.

Absolute traction /in extremis/ is a different matter; I
don't know. I assume other factors outweigh tread material
at that point because pretty much any two-wheeler can skid
with normal braking force.

Personally, I have two spots where I test tire traction in wet
weather -- the chute into my garage with a tight turn (which is
smooth cement) and a short, steep section on my way home -- going up
seated and sanding. It's easy to gauge traction at that spot because
your rear tire slips out, and moving fore-aft doesn't make a
difference. Going down the chute, you can feel how much sliding you
get with hard braking. Misjudging in both cases is fairly low
consequence, although a guy in my building crashed and broke his him
on the chute. Then they put in non-skid, which wore off about 15
years ago. I crashed there on a pair of early Michelin colored tires
with a clay based pigment. Downside of sale table finds. I can't
tell the difference in traction between two quality tires -- say a
Pro4 and a Conti 4000, but some sale table tires are like riding on
banana peels, even after break-in.

How do you like the Conti 4000? I usually use Specialized Pro but my
favorite LBS is dropping Specialized so I'll have to find a replacement
tire. Specialized tires don't seem to be available online.
Do they have good flat protection? Grip? ...

Conti 4000 are wickedly expensive and prone to sidewall cuts, IMO.
Lou prefers them and can get a good deals in Europe. For me, they are
always 20-50% more than Michelins. As for ride and grip, I think the
Contis are a bit more plush feeling than Pro4s. I have a Conti front
tire on my Roubaix; its 25mm nominal but looks and rides bigger.

Oddly enough, the Conti 4Seasons are heavier and have more rolling
resistance than the Pro4s and the 4000, but I really liked them on my
Roubaix winter bike. They're just too expensive, so I'm using Pro4
Endurance rear tire right now -- which are good, but I don't think
they are as grippy as the regular Pro4s or the 4Seasons, but that
impression could be effected by the fact that it's easy to skid my
rear wheel on the Roubaix because the disc is so powerful.

Like I said, all the differences are subtle between the high end tires
from Michelin or Continental.


Thanks.

I think the Conti 4000s is about the same price here as the Spec Pros
that I use. I guess I'll find out shortly if I like them.

I find Michelins a bit sluggish and hard to mount. Although I just
watched a guy mounting a Conti in the pouring rain Sunday and he didn't
seem to be enjoying it. It was a sidewall cut actually. He hit a piece
of strip metal.


When I had my last side wall failure on a Conti Gatorskin I called my
wife to pick me up with her car. I could have put a chunk of cloth in
but I didn't want to go through an hour of wrestling again. Now I
switched to tires with sturdier side walls.

Conti Gatorskins are absolutely awesome. Winter commuting, two or more flats per week, switch to gatorskins, no more flats.

I ride Gatorskins, too, and they're relatively problem free. I've had problems with the uber-expensive Conti Grand Prix 4000S II version 10 back-slash zed, etc., etc. The super-tire. It's a very nice riding tire and many people find them to be reliable, but I had some problems and find Pro4s to be fine for me and much cheaper, particularly now that they are going out of production in favor of the latest and greatest "Power" tires from Michelin.


What sort of problems did you have with the 4000s? You mean like flats
or handling or bad wear or what? Those are probably what I'm switching
too... As for pricing, I know a guy...