On 2017-08-14 05:48, wrote:
On Sunday, August 13, 2017 at 6:42:16 PM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski
wrote:
On 8/13/2017 12:16 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-08-12 23:45, John B. wrote:

[...]


The point that you, and others, seems to be missing was that
Holland started their bicycle transportation planning just
after WW I ended. In the 1920's bicycles were used in 80% of
the distance of all trips made. By the 1950's there were 400
bicycle parking facilities in Amsterdam - some 70,000 parking
spaces.

The first comprehensive bicycle census in Amsterdam was held in
1930. 250 intersections were monitored on a single day from
6.30 am until 6.30 pm. On the section from Leidsestraat to
Leidseplein 30,000 cyclists passed during the period and some
1100 of whom passed by between 8.45 and 9.00 am!

Now compare that data with the U.S.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lHdbIhL0eso

This is about 50mi from here. So yes, it is possible.

sigh That's a video taken at a college campus that actively
dissuades the use of cars on campus.


They do not. I drove there by car a lot because I needed to schlepp a
compressor and other gear. Very easy car access, nice circular roads
that get you everywhere, plenty of parking.


... Anyone can read about U.C.
Davis and its bike-related history.


Don't read, go there and see for yourself.


As I've said, the key element is dissuading car traffic. Without
that, bike infrastructure is almost never capable of generating
more than 3% bike mode share.

Auto's were relatively cheap even before WW I. In 1910 Ford
produced 12,000 cars. In 1914 Ford built more automobiles then
all other car makers combined. A Ford cost $900 1910 and $390
in 1915. My father, who came from a normal (i.e., not wealthy)
New England farming family, had a Ford when he went to collage
in 1926.


We have to stop lamenting "Oh, we didn't start on the correct
foot 100 years ago so to heck with it, let's just throw in the
towel". We ought to learn from other countries and that goes
vice-versa as well.

That's a good idea only if you somehow learn to turn the United
States into a nation smaller than West Virginia, but almost dead
flat.

Also, give it at least four times higher population density to
equal Denmark's, or twelve times higher to equal Netherlands'.
Somehow give it a long history of high utility bike mode share long
before bike facilities. Make sure the average trip distance is just
a couple miles as well. Do away with most of the hot weather, too.
And as mentioned, do whatever you can to dissuade use of private
cars.

That's what's behind Netherlands' and Denmark's current bike mode
share.

Frank - most major cities in the US have the population and the
density.


Frank really doesn't have a clue about the Netherlands yet always voices
an opinion anyhow. I lived in Zuid Limburg Province and that is largely
rural plus hilly. Lots of bike paths, lots of cyclists. So far for
Frank's great theory.


... A really good local bike shop is giving it up after five
years of trying because they just can't sell enough bikes or outsell
the Internet on components.


That is strange. We had two new bike shops open up over the last five
yeas, in a village of around pop 16,000. At one of them I bought my MTB
in 2014. I could have bought it for $100 less online but I wanted to
support a local business. He also handled a few warranty claims I had
(which was bound to happen ...).

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/