On Friday, September 1, 2017 at 8:05:32 AM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 9/1/2017 9:54 AM, wrote:
On Thursday, August 31, 2017 at 6:02:23 PM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 8/31/2017 5:56 PM, wrote:
On Thursday, August 31, 2017 at 10:05:44 AM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 8/30/2017 10:33 AM, wrote:
On Wednesday, August 30, 2017 at 5:39:46 AM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/...icle-1.3453744

There are some tunnels on the San Francisco Penesula that are damned scary. One in particular has you 100 yards into the approach on a slight downhill grade going 20 mph or so and there's a sign that reads "Bicycles not Recommended".

Coming from bright sunlight into the tunnel cars do NOT turn on their lights and bicycles become invisible as the cars speed up to 50+ mph. There is a shoulder wide enough that you aren't in too much danger.

But the other side of the tunnel you are in the number 1 lane of a freeway exit that is four lanes wide with cars exiting the freeway at 70+ mph.

Hugging the left curb until there's a break in traffic I managed to get across into the right shoulder but you can be damn certain I won't be making that mistake again.

Two blocks before that entrance there is a sign that says - "bicycles recommended route" - but there is a lot of truck traffic in that area and it's very easy to miss the sign while watching the traffic.

This is the sort of thing that causes Joerg to make his comments about bicycle paths. Of course as we all know this wouldn't even give Frank a pause.

There are certainly places that "give me pause." I recall years ago, on
a solo overnight camping trip, I rode toward Pittsburgh before heading
further south. At one point near rush hour I found myself trapped on a
limited access highway along a river, probably 45 mph speed limit with
two narrow lanes (maybe nine feet wide), rough pavement, high traffic
and a wall at my right side. I had to ride it for maybe two or three
miles before managing to get to an intersection where I could escape.

Cycling was legal there, but I wouldn't repeat the experience. It was
VERY unpleasant, and had I known the situation ahead of time I'd have
found some alternative. But sometimes these things happen, especially
riding in unfamiliar areas.

BTW, what did I do while riding that stretch of road? I controlled the
lane, of course. Yes, motorists didn't like it. Many honked. But there
was literally no alternative to riding lane center. Letting people
squeeze by without changing lanes would have been stupidly risky.

There, now that didn't hurt did it? That is, admitting that there are some times where vehicular riding just isn't right. I do vehicular riding as much as possible but there are simply times when a bike path is a relief.

Like many vehicular cycling skeptics, you're pretending that vehicular
cyclists say things they never say. You're constructing straw men to
argue against, as a way to pretend to yourself that you've won some
argument.

Of course there are roads that are better and roads that are worse. Some
are far worse. I've never said a cyclist can comfortably ride absolutely
everywhere. I don't know a single cyclist that has said that, and I've
met and corresponded with the most prominent people who have developed
and taught vehicular cycling techniques.

And all you're doing here is complaining that you were caught saying exactly the same thing as Joerg after telling him he's full of crap.

Joerg posted a photo of a totally empty, completely straight two lane
road in open country and said it was very dangerous.

I said riding in fast, dense rush hour traffic in a nine foot lane was
very unpleasant.

Are you claiming those two statements are exactly the same?

I can post a photo of Highland Rd. in the Livermore Valley that can be completely empty. When the freeways are full people will use these narrow roads as shortcuts going at or above freeway speeds and leaving no room at all for bicycles dodging potholes.

Are you suggesting that this wasn't the case with Joerg's photos?

It sounds to me like you're arguing purely to keep from looking like what you actually appear to be.