Leather Saddle Care Whlist Riding?

On Saturday, March 2, 2013 1:41:02 PM UTC, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Friday, March 1, 2013 8:18:41 PM UTC-5, Sir Ridesalot wrote:

One thing I've often wondered about an all leather saddle is how do you care for it during a 100 miles long ride if it starts to rain heavilly and your bicycle does not have fenders. Will the spray from the rear tire eventually soak the lather even if the saddle has been treated? If the saddle does get wet will it stretch? If it stretches what do you do for the rest of the ride to prevent it from stretching further or from losing its shape? When you do get to the end of the ride what do you do to return the saddle to its proper condition? I imagine that the first thing is to allow the leather to dry slowly.







Thanks and cheers



Okay.



Based on the on-topic replies I see.



Back in the day when leather saddled were popular and today those who still use a leather saddle, carry a waterproof protective saddle cover ALL THE TIME.



People never decide on the spur of the moment to go on a long ride nor do they ever start out on a medium distance or long ride and as they ride decided to go a lot further than when they started. People never get caught in an unforecasted heavy rain whilst riding. Everyone's racing geometry bikes has a rear fender at least. No one ever parks a bike and has it rain whilst they are away from the bike - say whilst stopping for a bite to eat on a ride. VBEG LOL ;)



Now, let's say that due to any reason the all leather saddle did/does get soaked. How did/do you care for it post ride? Did/do you need to wait until it was completely dry before using it again?



Cheers

When you get the leather saddle, before you fit it, soak it in neatsfoot oil, motor oil, olive oil, or whatever you fancy. This is done by putting it upside down in a baking pan or a glass dish, and filling the saddle with oil until the pan is over the top of the saddle. Remove after x period, let stand 24 or 48 hours until dry, polish with a soft cloth. I used neatsfoot (which caused cries of outrage from the resident idiots on RBT but is sanctified by generations adding up to centuries of huntsmen for horse-leather). I soaked my saddle for about twenty minutes, and now three years later, with the protection wearing off, I think I should have tried an hour or two because at 6400km my saddle (a semi-hefty B73) is hardly broken in. Not that it is uncomfortable -- it was comfortable to start with, straight out of the box. But you can see where sweat has darkened the leather, but there are as yet no indentations from sit bones.

An alternative initial treatment is to slather on quite a bit of proofide or that American equivalent Chalo likes -- German name, someone help, please -- onto the bottom, and only a reasonable amount on the top of the saddle, then leave and polish later as above. In my opinion, Proofide does very little to protect the top of the saddle against anything more than light rain, as Krygowski says. Still, my saddle, with very light applications of Proofide at six-month intervals still beads up rain rather than soaking it in.

The routine maintenance after soaking in oil (or the first big Proofide) is to rub Proofide or more neatsfoot over the top only, let stand for 24 hours and polish off. The first big treatment is supposed to protect the seat from mildew, not water thrown up by the rear wheel; Brooks apparently assumes you have mudguards...

Brooks makes a very nice waxed cotton seat cover in black with their name on it, in two sizes, one size for the bigger saddles for adults, and the other one for sort of saddles racers like. The cover has an elastic rim and mine, the bigger one, also has a strip of velcro goes around the cross rail below the helical springs of the bigger saddles, i.e. the bar running between the saddlebag loops.

Peter White (the wheelbuilder and retailer with the very informative site who imports BUMM lamps) at one point showed his own bike with a Carradice Nelson Longflap saddle bag which seemed to me very likely to keep water off the underside of the saddle. Just an idea. A mate to whom I suggested this as a solution to a wet bottom if he wanted 60mm Big Apples, which require removing the mudguards on his Pedersen, was most pleased with it, though the underside of the Nelson looked disgusting when I ran into him at the end of a forest trail as Autumn turned into Winter last year.

Of course, you don't want to carry a great big saddlebag on training rides. Seems to me leather is pretty tough and for hundred bucks or whatever, you can treat your saddle as a replaceable service item, save up to buy a new one if and when the old one rots away. No evidence that mine or any badly indented Brooks I've seen were rotting or tearing or whatever. It may be that your care is unnecessary.

Andre Jute

I just found the Peter White photo... or one like it, anyway; I thought there were tomatoes in the the saddlebag in the photo I remember. http://www.peterwhitecycles.com/carradice.asp

On Friday, March 1, 2013 8:18:41 PM UTC-5, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
One thing I've often wondered about an all leather saddle is how do you care for it during a 100 miles long ride if it starts to rain heavilly and your bicycle does not have fenders. Will the spray from the rear tire eventually soak the lather even if the saddle has been treated? If the saddle does get wet will it stretch? If it stretches what do you do for the rest of the ride to prevent it from stretching further or from losing its shape? When you do get to the end of the ride what do you do to return the saddle to its proper condition? I imagine that the first thing is to allow the leather to dry slowly.



Thanks and cheers

Nice reply but it still doesn't answer the question. HOW DO YOU CARE FOR A LEATHER SADDLE AFTER IT GETS SOAKED WITH WATER OR RAIN?

Cheers

On Mar 2, 5:41*am, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Friday, March 1, 2013 8:18:41 PM UTC-5, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
One thing I've often wondered about an all leather saddle is how do you care for it during a 100 miles long ride if it starts to rain heavilly and your bicycle does not have fenders. Will the spray from the rear tire eventually soak the lather even if the saddle has been treated? If the saddle does get wet will it stretch? If it stretches what do you do for the rest of the ride to prevent it from stretching further or from losing its shape? When you do get to the end of the ride what do you do to return the saddle to its proper condition? I imagine that the first thing is to allow the leather to dry slowly.

Thanks and *cheers

Okay.

Based on the on-topic replies I see.

Back in the day when leather saddled were popular and today those who still use a leather saddle, carry a waterproof protective saddle cover ALL THE TIME.

People never decide on the spur of the moment to go on a long ride nor do they ever start out on a medium distance or long ride and as they ride decided to go a lot further than when they started. People never get caught in an unforecasted heavy rain whilst riding. Everyone's racing geometry bikes has a rear fender at least. No one ever parks a bike and has it rain whilst they are away from the bike - say whilst stopping for a bite to eat on a ride. VBEG LOL ;)

Now, let's say that due to any reason the all leather saddle did/does get soaked. How did/do you care for it post ride? Did/do you need to wait until it was completely dry before using it again?

I would take the saddle off and put it on my boot dryer -- which is a
very low heat low air velocity dryer. In other words, I would treat it
like a leather shoe. Once dried, I would put Sno-Seal on it, but that
might void the Brooks warranty or neutralize the magicality of the
saddle. http://www.atsko.com/products/waterp.../sno-seal.html

I got a Brooks saddle as OE on a 1987 Cannondale T1000 that was
frequently ridden in the rain and put away wet in my garage. It grew
mold. I swapped the saddle out for a Unicanitor or Ideale 2002 I had
lying around. I ultimately cleaned up the Brooks, treated it with
something (I don't remember now), and my wife adopted it as her tandem
saddle. It was very comfortable to her.

-- Jay Beattie.

On 3/2/2013 10:18 AM, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Friday, March 1, 2013 8:18:41 PM UTC-5, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
One thing I've often wondered about an all leather saddle is how do you care for it during a 100 miles long ride if it starts to rain heavilly and your bicycle does not have fenders. Will the spray from the rear tire eventually soak the lather even if the saddle has been treated? If the saddle does get wet will it stretch? If it stretches what do you do for the rest of the ride to prevent it from stretching further or from losing its shape? When you do get to the end of the ride what do you do to return the saddle to its proper condition? I imagine that the first thing is to allow the leather to dry slowly.



Thanks and cheers

Nice reply but it still doesn't answer the question. HOW DO YOU CARE FOR A LEATHER SADDLE AFTER IT GETS SOAKED WITH WATER OR RAIN?

Cheers


Like good leather shoes, a thorough soaking risks severe and
possibly fatal damage.

Although there's a school of thought which says misshapen
swaybacked saddles are comfortable[1], most of us expect to
be supported at the ischia without pressure across the
middle of the saddle. Once the sides smoosh in, that center
contact is annoying to most riders.

[1] no one's wrong about his opinion but I do not share this
one.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

On Saturday, March 2, 2013 10:43:27 AM UTC-6, AMuzi wrote:
[snip]
Although there's a school of thought which says misshapen

swaybacked saddles are comfortable[1], most of us expect to

be supported at the ischia without pressure across the

middle of the saddle. Once the sides smoosh in, that center

contact is annoying to most riders.



[1] no one's wrong about his opinion but I do not share this

one.


But when you pay a hundred and change, you're gonna get your money's worth out of that saddle, dammit. I just don't see the appeal. Cinelli changed the game in 62. Unicanitors/clones and SSTs are reasonably affordable and weather proof, keeping a consistent shape for years. Leather's good for fender strut washers, though...

Sir Ridesalot wrote:
Nice reply but it still doesn't answer the question. HOW DO YOU CARE
FOR A LEATHER SADDLE AFTER IT GETS SOAKED WITH WATER OR RAIN?

It's not rocket science. Don't sit on it until it is dry. That's it.
This might take several days depending on the ambient temperature and
humidity.

Prevention is key - don't get it wet in the first place. Fenders and/or
a waterproof cover (even a plastic bag) are the solution. I use both.

--
K.

Lang may your lum reek.

On Mar 2, 10:48 am, (Király) wrote:
Sir Ridesalot wrote:
Nice reply but it still doesn't answer the question. HOW DO YOU CARE
FOR A LEATHER SADDLE AFTER IT GETS SOAKED WITH WATER OR RAIN?

It's not rocket science. Don't sit on it until it is dry. That's it.
This might take several days depending on the ambient temperature and
humidity.

Prevention is key - don't get it wet in the first place. Fenders and/or
a waterproof cover (even a plastic bag) are the solution. I use both.


I've never had a leather bike saddle, but have cared for boots and
full motorcycle leathers. I remember well not to put Armor All on the
motorcycle seat - unless you want to be slipping off of it - and
thought for the same reason that something like Sno Seal would be
undesirable on a bicycle seat. But if so many people find a plastic
bag or whatever acceptable, Sno Seal (which has bees wax in it) might
be okay.

Leather can be made waterproof and remain supple (though non-porous
and a slightly "greasy") using Sno Seal. First clean the leather with
saddle soap, slow dry, then (when the inside is still warm from the
boot dryer) heat from the outside as multiple applications of Sno Seal
are applied.

Per landotter:
But when you pay a hundred and change, you're gonna get your money's worth out of that saddle, dammit. I just don't see the appeal. Cinelli changed the game in 62. Unicanitors/clones and SSTs are reasonably affordable and weather proof, keeping a consistent shape for years. Leather's good for fender strut washers, though...

I'm no fan of leather either, but for the broad-of-butt the sling saddle
has the advantage of maximizing usable width.

Looking at most saddles from underneath I see a "usable" area that is
bounded by the saddle's rails on each side.

If the sit bones are riding on the rails it's apparent after awhile.

With a sling like one of the Brooks leather saddles, there are no rails
and the full width is usable.
--
Pete Cresswell

On Mar 2, 1:41*pm, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Friday, March 1, 2013 8:18:41 PM UTC-5, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
One thing I've often wondered about an all leather saddle is how do you care for it during a 100 miles long ride if it starts to rain heavilly and your bicycle does not have fenders. Will the spray from the rear tire eventually soak the lather even if the saddle has been treated? If the saddle does get wet will it stretch? If it stretches what do you do for the rest of the ride to prevent it from stretching further or from losing its shape? When you do get to the end of the ride what do you do to return the saddle to its proper condition? I imagine that the first thing is to allow the leather to dry slowly.

Thanks and *cheers

Okay.

Based on the on-topic replies I see.

Back in the day when leather saddled were popular and today those who still use a leather saddle, carry a waterproof protective saddle cover ALL THE TIME.

People never decide on the spur of the moment to go on a long ride nor do they ever start out on a medium distance or long ride and as they ride decided to go a lot further than when they started. People never get caught in an unforecasted heavy rain whilst riding. Everyone's racing geometry bikes has a rear fender at least. No one ever parks a bike and has it rain whilst they are away from the bike - say whilst stopping for a bite to eat on a ride. VBEG LOL ;)

Now, let's say that due to any reason the all leather saddle did/does get soaked. How did/do you care for it post ride? Did/do you need to wait until it was completely dry before using it again?

Rub it dry with a towel, stuff the underside with crumpled newspaper,
let off the tension a little and leave it in a draught.

Use other bike if leather saddle is still cold to the touch.

On Mar 2, 2:33*pm, Andre Jute wrote:
On Saturday, March 2, 2013 1:41:02 PM UTC, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Friday, March 1, 2013 8:18:41 PM UTC-5, Sir Ridesalot wrote:

One thing I've often wondered about an all leather saddle is how do you care for it during a 100 miles long ride if it starts to rain heavilly and your bicycle does not have fenders. Will the spray from the rear tire eventually soak the lather even if the saddle has been treated? If the saddle does get wet will it stretch? If it stretches what do you do for the rest of the ride to prevent it from stretching further or from losing its shape? When you do get to the end of the ride what do you do to return the saddle to its proper condition? I imagine that the first thing is to allow the leather to dry slowly.

Thanks and *cheers

Okay.

Based on the on-topic replies I see.

Back in the day when leather saddled were popular and today those who still use a leather saddle, carry a waterproof protective saddle cover ALL THE TIME.

People never decide on the spur of the moment to go on a long ride nor do they ever start out on a medium distance or long ride and as they ride decided to go a lot further than when they started. People never get caught in an unforecasted heavy rain whilst riding. Everyone's racing geometry bikes has a rear fender at least. No one ever parks a bike and has it rain whilst they are away from the bike - say whilst stopping for a bite to eat on a ride. VBEG LOL ;)

Now, let's say that due to any reason the all leather saddle did/does get soaked. How did/do you care for it post ride? Did/do you need to wait until it was completely dry before using it again?

Cheers

When you get the leather saddle, before you fit it, soak it in neatsfoot oil, motor oil, olive oil, or whatever you fancy. This is done by putting it upside down in a baking pan or a glass dish, and filling the saddle with oil until the pan is over the top of the saddle. Remove after x period, let stand 24 or 48 hours until dry, polish with a soft cloth. I used neatsfoot (which caused cries of outrage from the resident idiots on RBT but is sanctified by generations adding up to centuries of huntsmen for horse-leather).. I soaked my saddle for about twenty minutes, and now three years later, with the protection wearing off, I think I *should have tried an hour or two because at 6400km my saddle (a semi-hefty B73) is hardly broken in. Not that it is uncomfortable -- it was comfortable to start with, straight out of the box. But you can see where sweat has darkened the leather, but there are as yet no indentations from sit bones.

An alternative initial treatment is to slather on quite a bit of proofide or that American equivalent Chalo likes -- German name, someone help, please -- onto the bottom, and only a reasonable amount on the top of the saddle, then leave and polish later as above. In my opinion, Proofide does very little to protect the top of the saddle against anything more than light rain, as Krygowski says. Still, my saddle, with very light applications of Proofide at six-month intervals still beads up rain rather than soaking it in..

The routine maintenance after soaking in oil *(or the first big Proofide) is to rub Proofide or more neatsfoot over the top only, let stand for 24 hours and polish off. The first big treatment is supposed to protect the seat from mildew, not water thrown up by the rear wheel; Brooks apparently assumes you have mudguards...

Brooks makes a very nice waxed cotton seat cover in black with their name on it, in two sizes, one size for the bigger saddles for adults, and the other one for sort of saddles racers like. The cover has an elastic rim and mine, the bigger one, also has a strip of velcro goes around the cross rail *below the helical springs of the bigger saddles, i.e. the bar running between the saddlebag loops.

Peter White (the wheelbuilder and retailer with the very informative site who imports BUMM lamps) at one point showed his own bike with a Carradice Nelson Longflap saddle bag which seemed to me very likely to keep water off the underside of the saddle. Just an idea. A mate to whom I suggested this as a solution to a wet bottom if he wanted *60mm Big Apples, which require removing the mudguards on his Pedersen, was most pleased with it, though the underside of the Nelson looked disgusting when I ran into him at the end of a forest trail as Autumn turned into Winter last year.

Of course, you don't want to carry a great big saddlebag on training rides.

I didn't, but my clubmates who had a faster climbing ability did use
great big saddlebags loaded with bricks.

Seems to me leather is pretty tough and for hundred bucks or whatever, you can treat your saddle as a replaceable service item, save up to buy a new one if and when the old one rots away. No evidence that mine or any badly indented Brooks I've seen were rotting or tearing or whatever. It may be that your care is unnecessary.


I only had problems with Ideal, which was a thin leather, and I had no
idea at the time about caring for a saddle.

You can only form leather when it is holding water, so you will have
to leave that saddle until it dries of the oils you have added. It's
not going to harm it if you don't wax it while the leather forms. If
you wanted to speed the process then you could use fuller's earth to
help draw some of the oil from the saddle, then so giving space for
the water to get in.