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#61
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Desperate needs = desperate but workable solution
On 2018-05-08 08:49, jbeattie wrote:
On Tuesday, May 8, 2018 at 7:18:39 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote: snip That tire belongs on the trash heep and that's where mine went. I didn't see the first one, but I'm still not concerned. It's not bulging, and if I were worried and didn't want to trash the tire (they're not cheap), I'd put a patch behind the scuff and throw some Shoe Goo on it. I know people who even think about their car tires that way. Some threads showing? Aw, heck! Quit crab-walking. We're not talking about cars. We're not talking about MTBs. We're not talking about a fox in a box. We're talking about a scuff on a Gatorskin -- a road tire on a rear wheel. It's not a runaway truck filled with nitroglycerin. It's similar. Also, a road bike has two wheels, not just a rear wheel. [...] Once again, we're talking about a scuffed road tire and not some epic smashing of a MTB tire on rocks. You're talking about riding a scuffed tire as terribly dangerous, yet every story is about exploding tires on gnarly trails and physical conditions that tax ordinary bicycles. For you, maybe a scuff is fatal. On a normal road bike not so much. Yeah, right. As a kid I had a front blow-out in a tunnel on the way back home from school. Just a normal paved road. Narrow one-lane tunnel and I wanted to beat the traffic light that guided direction. The long descent before the tunnel helped me get to speed. I must have hit some sort of pothole in the fairly dark tunnel ... *KAPOW* ... I did come out of that tunnel but separated from my road bike and the school pack came rolling out last according to the first driver waiting at the light on the other side. The front tire had popped. For a few days I had to sleep on one side because the other hurt a lot. So what? You blew a tire in a pot hole. I'm not getting how this illustrates anything except how lucky you were that you didn't go OTB -- the usual consequence of hitting a pot hole at high speed. What are you suggesting here -- solid tires? Tires with proper side walls. That's what blew out in the tunnel. Again, I don't care whether you, Doug or others use Gatorskins with compromised side walls. It's your lives. Here at our house they are banned and will no longer be purchased. You know the manufacturers are so stupid. That fat Michelin man. I call him sad Michelin man -- a failing tire company. If they did like I suggested in 1982 and made solid tires, they would be great again. Losers. BTW, I've never crashed because of an equipment failure. I've broken three pedals, snapped six or more cranks (at least three while out of the saddle sprinting), broken handle bars, seat posts. No fork failures or wheel collapses, which I would expect to cause a crash. Never crashed because of a blown tire. Oh, I take it back, I picked up a thorn riding over to the Alpenrose velodrome and ultimately flatted in a bank and slid down -- but that's only because I stopped pedaling. http://hubalabike.com/wp-content/upl...me_43_bank.jpg That's the same kind of "logic" as saying that grandpa tooled around in the old Studebaker which didn't have seat belts and he lived to ripe old age, so seat belts are "not needed". The worst crash in our family happened to my dad when he was young. The frame of his bike broke in half at a good speed. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ |
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#62
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Desperate needs = desperate but workable solution
On 08/05/2018 12:43 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-05-08 08:49, jbeattie wrote: On Tuesday, May 8, 2018 at 7:18:39 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote: snip That tire belongs on the trash heep and that's where mine went. I didn't see the first one, but I'm still not concerned.Â* It's not bulging, and if I were worried and didn't want to trash the tire (they're not cheap), I'd put a patch behind the scuff and throw some Shoe Goo on it. I know people who even think about their car tires that way. Some threads showing? Aw, heck! Quit crab-walking. We're not talking about cars.Â* We're not talking about MTBs.Â* We're not talking about a fox in a box.Â* We're talking about a scuff on a Gatorskin -- a road tire on a rear wheel. It's not a runaway truck filled with nitroglycerin. It's similar. Also, a road bike has two wheels, not just a rear wheel. [...] Once again, we're talking about a scuffed road tire and not some epic smashing of a MTB tire on rocks.Â* You're talking about riding a scuffed tire as terribly dangerous, yet every story is about exploding tires on gnarly trails and physical conditions that tax ordinary bicycles.Â* For you, maybe a scuff is fatal.Â* On a normal road bike not so much. Yeah, right. As a kid I had a front blow-out in a tunnel on the way back home from school. Just a normal paved road. Narrow one-lane tunnel and I wanted to beat the traffic light that guided direction. The long descent before the tunnel helped me get to speed. I must have hit some sort of pothole in the fairly dark tunnel ... *KAPOW* ... I did come out of that tunnel but separated from my road bike and the school pack came rolling out last according to the first driver waiting at the light on the other side. The front tire had popped. For a few days I had to sleep on one side because the other hurt a lot. So what? You blew a tire in a pot hole. I'm not getting how this illustrates anything except how lucky you were that you didn't go OTB -- the usual consequence of hitting a pot hole at high speed. What are you suggesting here -- solid tires? Tires with proper side walls. That's what blew out in the tunnel. Again, I don't care whether you, Doug or others use Gatorskins with compromised side walls. It's your lives. Here at our house they are banned and will no longer be purchased. Yeah but your evidence seems flawed. You're saying that you careem downhill at speed on a road bike into a dark tunnel, hit a pothole blowing a tire and crash and it's the tire's fault? You know the manufacturers are so stupid. That fat Michelin man.Â* I call him sad Michelin man -- a failing tire company. If they did like I suggested in 1982 and made solid tires, they would be great again. Losers. BTW, I've never crashed because of an equipment failure. I've broken three pedals, snapped six or more cranks (at least three while out of the saddle sprinting), broken handle bars, seat posts.Â* No fork failures or wheel collapses, which I would expect to cause a crash. Never crashed because of a blown tire. Oh, I take it back,Â* I picked up a thorn riding over to the Alpenrose velodrome and ultimately flatted in a bank and slid down -- but that's only because I stopped pedaling. http://hubalabike.com/wp-content/upl...me_43_bank.jpg That's the same kind of "logic" as saying that grandpa tooled around in the old Studebaker which didn't have seat belts and he lived to ripe old age, so seat belts are "not needed". No, I think what he means is **** happens more to you than to most people. But you seem to blame the equipment. I get that mountain biking can be more extreme but we're talking about road bikes here. The worst crash in our family happened to my dad when he was young. The frame of his bike broke in half at a good speed. I've never even heard of a bike breaking in half much less a presumably steel bike. What did he hit? |
#63
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Desperate needs = desperate but workable solution
On 2018-05-08 10:09, Duane wrote:
On 08/05/2018 12:43 PM, Joerg wrote: On 2018-05-08 08:49, jbeattie wrote: On Tuesday, May 8, 2018 at 7:18:39 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote: snip That tire belongs on the trash heep and that's where mine went. I didn't see the first one, but I'm still not concerned. It's not bulging, and if I were worried and didn't want to trash the tire (they're not cheap), I'd put a patch behind the scuff and throw some Shoe Goo on it. I know people who even think about their car tires that way. Some threads showing? Aw, heck! Quit crab-walking. We're not talking about cars. We're not talking about MTBs. We're not talking about a fox in a box. We're talking about a scuff on a Gatorskin -- a road tire on a rear wheel. It's not a runaway truck filled with nitroglycerin. It's similar. Also, a road bike has two wheels, not just a rear wheel. [...] Once again, we're talking about a scuffed road tire and not some epic smashing of a MTB tire on rocks. You're talking about riding a scuffed tire as terribly dangerous, yet every story is about exploding tires on gnarly trails and physical conditions that tax ordinary bicycles. For you, maybe a scuff is fatal. On a normal road bike not so much. Yeah, right. As a kid I had a front blow-out in a tunnel on the way back home from school. Just a normal paved road. Narrow one-lane tunnel and I wanted to beat the traffic light that guided direction. The long descent before the tunnel helped me get to speed. I must have hit some sort of pothole in the fairly dark tunnel ... *KAPOW* ... I did come out of that tunnel but separated from my road bike and the school pack came rolling out last according to the first driver waiting at the light on the other side. The front tire had popped. For a few days I had to sleep on one side because the other hurt a lot. So what? You blew a tire in a pot hole. I'm not getting how this illustrates anything except how lucky you were that you didn't go OTB -- the usual consequence of hitting a pot hole at high speed. What are you suggesting here -- solid tires? Tires with proper side walls. That's what blew out in the tunnel. Again, I don't care whether you, Doug or others use Gatorskins with compromised side walls. It's your lives. Here at our house they are banned and will no longer be purchased. Yeah but your evidence seems flawed. You're saying that you careem downhill at speed on a road bike into a dark tunnel, hit a pothole blowing a tire and crash and it's the tire's fault? It wasn't a major pothole and I expect from any road vehicle that it is able to handle ... roads. You know the manufacturers are so stupid. That fat Michelin man. I call him sad Michelin man -- a failing tire company. If they did like I suggested in 1982 and made solid tires, they would be great again. Losers. BTW, I've never crashed because of an equipment failure. I've broken three pedals, snapped six or more cranks (at least three while out of the saddle sprinting), broken handle bars, seat posts. No fork failures or wheel collapses, which I would expect to cause a crash. Never crashed because of a blown tire. Oh, I take it back, I picked up a thorn riding over to the Alpenrose velodrome and ultimately flatted in a bank and slid down -- but that's only because I stopped pedaling. http://hubalabike.com/wp-content/upl...me_43_bank.jpg That's the same kind of "logic" as saying that grandpa tooled around in the old Studebaker which didn't have seat belts and he lived to ripe old age, so seat belts are "not needed". No, I think what he means is **** happens more to you than to most people. But you seem to blame the equipment. I use my equipment for what it was intended to be used. Regarding road tires I found that cheap Asian tires do not suffer from such fast side wall deterioration. Compared to Gatorskin I get only half the miles out of a rear tire but then again they cost $15 or less versus $40 or more that the Gatorskins used to cost me. Plus no premature side wall failures. When a Gatorskin blew its side wall at less than 1000mi and ruined a $15 thorn-resistant tube in the wake I was very p....d. This isn't too surprising because I found the same effect with MTB tires. Pricey "name brand" tires failed in the sidewalls, including expensive S-Works tires. Cheap Thai tires don't. The only "Western" tire with really good side walls that I saw so far is the Schwalbe Hans Dampf but they want a whopping 90(!) bucks for a 29er. Which boils down to more than 10c/mile just for a rear tire. No thanks. ... I get that mountain biking can be more extreme but we're talking about road bikes here. The worst crash in our family happened to my dad when he was young. The frame of his bike broke in half at a good speed. I've never even heard of a bike breaking in half much less a presumably steel bike. What did he hit? Nothing, it just broke apart while riding along a cobblestone road which shakes a bike a bit but not excessively. It was a good quality name-brand steel frame bike similar to a Dutch city bike. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ |
#64
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Desperate needs = desperate but workable solution
On 08/05/2018 1:32 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-05-08 10:09, Duane wrote: On 08/05/2018 12:43 PM, Joerg wrote: On 2018-05-08 08:49, jbeattie wrote: On Tuesday, May 8, 2018 at 7:18:39 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote: snip That tire belongs on the trash heep and that's where mine went. I didn't see the first one, but I'm still not concerned.Â* It's not bulging, and if I were worried and didn't want to trash the tire (they're not cheap), I'd put a patch behind the scuff and throw some Shoe Goo on it. I know people who even think about their car tires that way. Some threads showing? Aw, heck! Quit crab-walking. We're not talking about cars.Â* We're not talking about MTBs.Â* We're not talking about a fox in a box.Â* We're talking about a scuff on a Gatorskin -- a road tire on a rear wheel. It's not a runaway truck filled with nitroglycerin. It's similar. Also, a road bike has two wheels, not just a rear wheel. [...] Once again, we're talking about a scuffed road tire and not some epic smashing of a MTB tire on rocks.Â* You're talking about riding a scuffed tire as terribly dangerous, yet every story is about exploding tires on gnarly trails and physical conditions that tax ordinary bicycles.Â* For you, maybe a scuff is fatal.Â* On a normal road bike not so much. Yeah, right. As a kid I had a front blow-out in a tunnel on the way back home from school. Just a normal paved road. Narrow one-lane tunnel and I wanted to beat the traffic light that guided direction. The long descent before the tunnel helped me get to speed. I must have hit some sort of pothole in the fairly dark tunnel ... *KAPOW* ... I did come out of that tunnel but separated from my road bike and the school pack came rolling out last according to the first driver waiting at the light on the other side. The front tire had popped. For a few days I had to sleep on one side because the other hurt a lot. So what? You blew a tire in a pot hole. I'm not getting how this illustrates anything except how lucky you were that you didn't go OTB -- the usual consequence of hitting a pot hole at high speed. What are you suggesting here -- solid tires? Tires with proper side walls. That's what blew out in the tunnel. Again, I don't care whether you, Doug or others use Gatorskins with compromised side walls. It's your lives. Here at our house they are banned and will no longer be purchased. Yeah but your evidence seems flawed.Â* You're saying that you careem downhill at speed on a road bike into a dark tunnel, hit a pothole blowing a tire and crash and it's the tire's fault? It wasn't a major pothole and I expect from any road vehicle that it is able to handle ... roads. Don't try driving on Quebec roads then. Hitting a pothole around here can bust a tie rod. Been there, done that. There's even a law that excludes the municipality from liability in that case. What world do you live in where equipment can take any abuse you throw at it? Anyway, what you described is reckless behavior, even if you now say that it wasn't a big pothole. Maybe the hill wasn't that steep and the tunnel not that dark. Stick with your Chinese import tires if you like but quick complaining about it. You know the manufacturers are so stupid. That fat Michelin man.Â* I call him sad Michelin man -- a failing tire company. If they did like I suggested in 1982 and made solid tires, they would be great again. Losers. BTW, I've never crashed because of an equipment failure. I've broken three pedals, snapped six or more cranks (at least three while out of the saddle sprinting), broken handle bars, seat posts.Â* No fork failures or wheel collapses, which I would expect to cause a crash. Never crashed because of a blown tire. Oh, I take it back,Â* I picked up a thorn riding over to the Alpenrose velodrome and ultimately flatted in a bank and slid down -- but that's only because I stopped pedaling. http://hubalabike.com/wp-content/upl...me_43_bank.jpg That's the same kind of "logic" as saying that grandpa tooled around in the old Studebaker which didn't have seat belts and he lived to ripe old age, so seat belts are "not needed". No, I think what he means is **** happens more to you than to most people. But you seem to blame the equipment. I use my equipment for what it was intended to be used. Regarding road tires I found that cheap Asian tires do not suffer from such fast side wall deterioration. Compared to Gatorskin I get only half the miles out of a rear tire but then again they cost $15 or less versus $40 or more that the Gatorskins used to cost me. Plus no premature side wall failures. When a Gatorskin blew its side wall at less than 1000mi and ruined a $15 thorn-resistant tube in the wake I was very p....d. This isn't too surprising because I found the same effect with MTB tires. Pricey "name brand" tires failed in the sidewalls, including expensive S-Works tires. Cheap Thai tires don't. The only "Western" tire with really good side walls that I saw so far is the Schwalbe Hans Dampf but they want a whopping 90(!) bucks for a 29er. Which boils down to more than 10c/mile just for a rear tire. No thanks. Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* ... I get that mountain biking can be more extreme but we're talking about road bikes here. The worst crash in our family happened to my dad when he was young. The frame of his bike broke in half at a good speed. I've never even heard of a bike breaking in half much less a presumably steel bike.Â* What did he hit? Nothing, it just broke apart while riding along a cobblestone road which shakes a bike a bit but not excessively. It was a good quality name-brand steel frame bike similar to a Dutch city bike. |
#65
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Desperate needs = desperate but workable solution
On 5/7/2018 8:47 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Monday, May 7, 2018 at 7:02:00 PM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote: On 5/7/2018 9:28 PM, jbeattie wrote: On Monday, May 7, 2018 at 4:39:31 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote: And what do you do for the front? Bikes have two wheels. Call your wife from the hospital that dinner is off tonight, and the next 10-20 days? Wow, you're a nervous nelly. And what about the front? We're talking about a rear wheel and a casing scuff. If it were on the front tire, I'd keep an eye on it. I've ridden front tires booted with a $1 bill for many, many miles. On our coast-to-coast tour, my daughter got a gash over 1/2" in the front tire of her Terry bike. That bike has an odd size front wheel. Late Saturday in South Dakota, there was absolutely no way to get a replacement tire. Ditto Sunday, Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday... The best we could do was to call Terry Inc. on Monday and get it quick-shipped to the next bike shop on our route, which was well over a hundred miles away. On the road, I triple-booted the tire and we ran low pressure the rest of that day. In the motel, I stitched the gash back together as well as I could, re-did the internal boots, and rode the tire all those miles to that bike shop. I guess Joerg would have taken a taxi? No, Joerg's tire would have exploded violently, blowing his body parts all over the road. He would have been mailed home in a giant Ziplock bag. Mundane mechanical failures are catastrophic, life endangering events for Joerg. BTW, you guys sure did go north. I was further south on the Bikecentennial alignment through Colorado, Kansas and then Missery. It was an unremarkable trip from a tire standpoint except that the locals always wanted to know how many tires we had gone through. It was the question right after "where are you from." The only memorable part tire-wise was buying a couple Michelin tubes that I couldn't get to hold a patch. The mold release was nasty, and I had to sand the hell out of them to get anything to stick. I still have my first-generation Specialized folding Turbo spare from that trip -- which I never had to use and couldn't use now because its a 27" -- because that's what was more available back then (and Schrader valves). I remember looking at the original Terry bikes with the two different size wheels and thinking that those would not be the best choice for touring, even though there was a good reason for the different sized wheels. On long tours I do carry one fold-up tire, but generally everyone has a bicycle with same 700c wheels and anyone can use the tire if need be. I was on a local ride with my kids once where the sidewall of the tire was failing and I booted it so the tube wouldn't pop out and we detoured over to Performance and I bought a tire and put it on in the parking lot, but on an Oregon Coast tour the bicycle shops were few and far between, though most towns had a Coast to Coast hardware store with a few bicycle related items. Back when I started touring there were small frame touring bicycles with 700c tires, now I think 26" would be used, like Surly does on the smaller framed LHT models. |
#66
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Desperate needs = desperate but workable solution
On Monday, May 7, 2018 at 11:47:48 PM UTC-4, jbeattie wrote:
On Monday, May 7, 2018 at 7:02:00 PM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote: On our coast-to-coast tour, my daughter got a gash over 1/2" in the front tire of her Terry bike. That bike has an odd size front wheel. Late Saturday in South Dakota, there was absolutely no way to get a replacement tire. Ditto Sunday, Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday... The best we could do was to call Terry Inc. on Monday and get it quick-shipped to the next bike shop on our route, which was well over a hundred miles away. On the road, I triple-booted the tire and we ran low pressure the rest of that day. In the motel, I stitched the gash back together as well as I could, re-did the internal boots, and rode the tire all those miles to that bike shop. I guess Joerg would have taken a taxi? No, Joerg's tire would have exploded violently, blowing his body parts all over the road. He would have been mailed home in a giant Ziplock bag. Mundane mechanical failures are catastrophic, life endangering events for Joerg. BTW, you guys sure did go north. I was further south on the Bikecentennial alignment through Colorado, Kansas and then Missery. It was an unremarkable trip from a tire standpoint except that the locals always wanted to know how many tires we had gone through. It was the question right after "where are you from." Yes, we went north. It was mostly because I wanted to follow the Lewis & Clark route. Adventure Cycling had just finished those maps. The Missouri gets surprisingly close to Canada. The northern route was also an attempt to stay out of extreme heat. My wife hates the heat. But that was atotal failure. The heat was brutal that year, all the way west from the Dakotas. The "how many tires" question is still common when people hear about the trip. My daughter's front was the only total failure, from that gash, but we did have problems with sidewall bubbles on our Conti Top Touring tires. And after riding from the Atlantic to our home in Ohio, I switched from 37s to 32s, because to my surprise, the 37s grew a bit in width as I rode - maybe because of the bumpy C&O Towpath? - and ate up their clearance between my chainstays. But no major problems. None of Joerg's cartoon sound effects, like *KABOOM* or *KAPOW*. No metal shrapnel, no fragmented bike parts. - Frank Krygowski |
#67
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Desperate needs = desperate but workable solution
On Tuesday, May 8, 2018 at 10:32:23 AM UTC-4, Joerg wrote:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PUoCSzVmhhQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vnf7VdofZF0 Wait a minute! Why didn't they show the fractured bike parts, the metal shrapnel, the gory dead bodies? Where was the cartoon *KABLOOIE!!!* Heck, the mountain biker didn't even fall down! - Frank Krygowski |
#68
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Desperate needs = desperate but workable solution
On 2018-05-08 11:13, Duane wrote:
On 08/05/2018 1:32 PM, Joerg wrote: On 2018-05-08 10:09, Duane wrote: On 08/05/2018 12:43 PM, Joerg wrote: On 2018-05-08 08:49, jbeattie wrote: On Tuesday, May 8, 2018 at 7:18:39 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote: snip [...] Once again, we're talking about a scuffed road tire and not some epic smashing of a MTB tire on rocks. You're talking about riding a scuffed tire as terribly dangerous, yet every story is about exploding tires on gnarly trails and physical conditions that tax ordinary bicycles. For you, maybe a scuff is fatal. On a normal road bike not so much. Yeah, right. As a kid I had a front blow-out in a tunnel on the way back home from school. Just a normal paved road. Narrow one-lane tunnel and I wanted to beat the traffic light that guided direction. The long descent before the tunnel helped me get to speed. I must have hit some sort of pothole in the fairly dark tunnel ... *KAPOW* ... I did come out of that tunnel but separated from my road bike and the school pack came rolling out last according to the first driver waiting at the light on the other side. The front tire had popped. For a few days I had to sleep on one side because the other hurt a lot. So what? You blew a tire in a pot hole. I'm not getting how this illustrates anything except how lucky you were that you didn't go OTB -- the usual consequence of hitting a pot hole at high speed. What are you suggesting here -- solid tires? Tires with proper side walls. That's what blew out in the tunnel. Again, I don't care whether you, Doug or others use Gatorskins with compromised side walls. It's your lives. Here at our house they are banned and will no longer be purchased. Yeah but your evidence seems flawed. You're saying that you careem downhill at speed on a road bike into a dark tunnel, hit a pothole blowing a tire and crash and it's the tire's fault? It wasn't a major pothole and I expect from any road vehicle that it is able to handle ... roads. Don't try driving on Quebec roads then. Hitting a pothole around here can bust a tie rod. Been there, done that. There's even a law that excludes the municipality from liability in that case. What world do you live in where equipment can take any abuse you throw at it? I didn't say "any", I said "road". It was in Germany where municipalities were responsible to a non-fixed major hole if negligence could be proven. At least back then. Anyway, what you described is reckless behavior, even if you now say that it wasn't a big pothole. Going through a tunnel on a road bike is not reckless, it is called riding. The road isn't very steep but enough to get to a good speed. ... Maybe the hill wasn't that steep and the tunnel not that dark. Stick with your Chinese import tires if you like but quick complaining about it. Not Chinese, I tried CST and it's thumbs down. Thailand makes better tires IMO. On the MTB they have proven themselves very well. Got one on the road bike now and a few more are coming. So far I am impressed. Despite some gravel road exposure no side wall damage at all. [...] -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ |
#69
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Desperate needs = desperate but workable solution
On Tuesday, May 8, 2018 at 10:32:47 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-05-08 10:09, Duane wrote: On 08/05/2018 12:43 PM, Joerg wrote: On 2018-05-08 08:49, jbeattie wrote: On Tuesday, May 8, 2018 at 7:18:39 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote: snip That tire belongs on the trash heep and that's where mine went. I didn't see the first one, but I'm still not concerned. It's not bulging, and if I were worried and didn't want to trash the tire (they're not cheap), I'd put a patch behind the scuff and throw some Shoe Goo on it. I know people who even think about their car tires that way. Some threads showing? Aw, heck! Quit crab-walking. We're not talking about cars. We're not talking about MTBs. We're not talking about a fox in a box. We're talking about a scuff on a Gatorskin -- a road tire on a rear wheel. It's not a runaway truck filled with nitroglycerin. It's similar. Also, a road bike has two wheels, not just a rear wheel. [...] Once again, we're talking about a scuffed road tire and not some epic smashing of a MTB tire on rocks. You're talking about riding a scuffed tire as terribly dangerous, yet every story is about exploding tires on gnarly trails and physical conditions that tax ordinary bicycles. For you, maybe a scuff is fatal. On a normal road bike not so much. Yeah, right. As a kid I had a front blow-out in a tunnel on the way back home from school. Just a normal paved road. Narrow one-lane tunnel and I wanted to beat the traffic light that guided direction. The long descent before the tunnel helped me get to speed. I must have hit some sort of pothole in the fairly dark tunnel ... *KAPOW* ... I did come out of that tunnel but separated from my road bike and the school pack came rolling out last according to the first driver waiting at the light on the other side. The front tire had popped. For a few days I had to sleep on one side because the other hurt a lot. So what? You blew a tire in a pot hole. I'm not getting how this illustrates anything except how lucky you were that you didn't go OTB -- the usual consequence of hitting a pot hole at high speed. What are you suggesting here -- solid tires? Tires with proper side walls. That's what blew out in the tunnel. Again, I don't care whether you, Doug or others use Gatorskins with compromised side walls. It's your lives. Here at our house they are banned and will no longer be purchased. Yeah but your evidence seems flawed. You're saying that you careem downhill at speed on a road bike into a dark tunnel, hit a pothole blowing a tire and crash and it's the tire's fault? It wasn't a major pothole and I expect from any road vehicle that it is able to handle ... roads. You know the manufacturers are so stupid. That fat Michelin man. I call him sad Michelin man -- a failing tire company. If they did like I suggested in 1982 and made solid tires, they would be great again. Losers. BTW, I've never crashed because of an equipment failure. I've broken three pedals, snapped six or more cranks (at least three while out of the saddle sprinting), broken handle bars, seat posts. No fork failures or wheel collapses, which I would expect to cause a crash. Never crashed because of a blown tire. Oh, I take it back, I picked up a thorn riding over to the Alpenrose velodrome and ultimately flatted in a bank and slid down -- but that's only because I stopped pedaling. http://hubalabike.com/wp-content/upl...me_43_bank.jpg That's the same kind of "logic" as saying that grandpa tooled around in the old Studebaker which didn't have seat belts and he lived to ripe old age, so seat belts are "not needed". No, I think what he means is **** happens more to you than to most people. But you seem to blame the equipment. I use my equipment for what it was intended to be used. Pffffff (spitting out coffee). You have a Euro sport bike with Mod E-ish rims and 600EX museum piece equipment, 23mm tires (?) and you've saddle it with all sorts of racks and then ride it on super-gnarly death-trails. You are taking a mid-fi club racing bike and using it as an adventure bike. Can you even get a 28mm Gatorskin under the fork crown or brake bridge? My commuter has 28mm Gatorskins. They're not the best rolling tires in the world, but they last O.K. No sidewall problems. I had sidewall problems with UltraSports and Panasonic Paselas. The Vittoria Zaffiros were flat-magnets, and wet traction was just O.K. -- Jay Beattie. |
#70
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Desperate needs = desperate but workable solution
On 08/05/2018 3:34 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-05-08 11:13, Duane wrote: On 08/05/2018 1:32 PM, Joerg wrote: On 2018-05-08 10:09, Duane wrote: On 08/05/2018 12:43 PM, Joerg wrote: On 2018-05-08 08:49, jbeattie wrote: On Tuesday, May 8, 2018 at 7:18:39 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote: snip [...] Once again, we're talking about a scuffed road tire and not some epic smashing of a MTB tire on rocks.Â* You're talking about riding a scuffed tire as terribly dangerous, yet every story is about exploding tires on gnarly trails and physical conditions that tax ordinary bicycles.Â* For you, maybe a scuff is fatal.Â* On a normal road bike not so much. Yeah, right. As a kid I had a front blow-out in a tunnel on the way back home from school. Just a normal paved road. Narrow one-lane tunnel and I wanted to beat the traffic light that guided direction. The long descent before the tunnel helped me get to speed. I must have hit some sort of pothole in the fairly dark tunnel ... *KAPOW* ... I did come out of that tunnel but separated from my road bike and the school pack came rolling out last according to the first driver waiting at the light on the other side. The front tire had popped. For a few days I had to sleep on one side because the other hurt a lot. So what? You blew a tire in a pot hole. I'm not getting how this illustrates anything except how lucky you were that you didn't go OTB -- the usual consequence of hitting a pot hole at high speed. What are you suggesting here -- solid tires? Tires with proper side walls. That's what blew out in the tunnel. Again, I don't care whether you, Doug or others use Gatorskins with compromised side walls. It's your lives. Here at our house they are banned and will no longer be purchased. Yeah but your evidence seems flawed.Â* You're saying that you careem downhill at speed on a road bike into a dark tunnel, hit a pothole blowing a tire and crash and it's the tire's fault? It wasn't a major pothole and I expect from any road vehicle that it is able to handle ... roads. Don't try driving on Quebec roads then.Â* Hitting a pothole around here can bust a tie rod.Â* Been there, done that.Â* There's even a law that excludes the municipality from liability in that case.Â* What world do you live in where equipment can take any abuse you throw at it? I didn't say "any", I said "road". It was in Germany where municipalities were responsible to a non-fixed major hole if negligence could be proven. At least back then. Well they are responsible here if you can prove that they knew about it and failed to repair it. Good luck with that. So you are saying you think a car should not be damaged by hitting potholes on a road? Anyway, what you described is reckless behavior, even if you now say that it wasn't a big pothole. Going through a tunnel on a road bike is not reckless, it is called riding. The road isn't very steep but enough to get to a good speed. You said you were going through a dark tunnel at speed and hit a pothole you didn't see: direction. The long descent before the tunnel helped me get to speed. I must have hit some sort of pothole in the fairly dark tunnel ... *KAPOW* ... I did come out of that tunnel but Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* ... Maybe the hill wasn't that steep and the tunnel not that dark.Â* Stick with your Chinese import tires if you like but quick complaining about it. Not Chinese, I tried CST and it's thumbs down. Thailand makes better tires IMO. On the MTB they have proven themselves very well. Got one on the road bike now and a few more are coming. So far I am impressed. Despite some gravel road exposure no side wall damage at all. So if you're happy about your tires why do you keep complaining? |
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