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Old November 26th 20, 12:18 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Andre Jute[_2_]
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Default Not Lance

On Wednesday, November 25, 2020 at 10:00:48 PM UTC, AMuzi wrote:
On 11/25/2020 9:24 AM, Ralph Barone wrote:
John B. wrote:
On Tue, 24 Nov 2020 20:40:10 -0800, "Mark J."
wrote:

On 11/24/2020 5:02 PM, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 24 Nov 2020 13:13:08 -0800 (PST), "
wrote:

On Monday, November 23, 2020 at 11:31:59 PM UTC-6, wrote:
On Monday, November 23, 2020 at 4:10:41 PM UTC-8, Andre Jute wrote:
On Monday, November 23, 2020 at 9:38:15 PM UTC, wrote:
I have never doped and my marathon PR is 3:06. I think possible
under perfect conditions and a group not necessarily even drafting I
might be able to do a 5 hour century? My guess is that probably many
60 year old cyclists can do that but I just never have yet. My best
with no rest and completely solo 5:15 a few years ago.

What dope will get me there?

Deacon Mark
.
I think you have this the wrong way round, Mark. First you train and
bring your body AND your skills to perfection, same as the other
competitors are doing, THEN you dope for the extra edge. This is why
total body blood doping -- the exchange of all the blood in the body
for fresh blood -- which allows the body to burn more oxygen for
greater output is so effective. But even such an extreme measure
will do nothing against professionals for an overweight old guy who,
let us say, gave up cycling twenty years ago and anyway wasn't a top
class athlete even twenty years before that. All it will do for the
latter guy is help him beat fat old guys who had developed similar
amateur skills way back in their day.

Sorry to disappoint you.
Well, they were exchanging blood. As you work very hard red blood
cells get worn out and are excreted. Blood doping was merely adding
additional transfusions so that you recovered to your natural state.
Testosterone would make you more aggressive but NO drugs can allow
you to extent past your bodies capacity. Pain killers would allow you
to ride harder for longer but the damage to your body would be the
same with or without the pain killers. I forgot the doctor's name now
but he knew what was going on very well and the programs he developed
for cyclists caused them the least hard compared to what those fools
were doing before he came along.

Blood transfusions were effective because they added extra red blood
cells to your body. Your body only makes so many red blood cells.
Red blood cells are not like hair or fingernails which grow forever
and continuously. Your body only makes so many red blood cells.
Enough to get enough oxygen to all your cells during exercise. The
blood transfusions would add extra red blood cells. So your blood
could carry extra oxygen and you could do harder exercise exertions..
But after awhile, few weeks probably, your body recognizes it has
extra red blood cells in the blood and cuts down, stops making new
ones. And your body returns to having the normal amount of red blood
cells. And then you have to blood dope again by shooting more stored
blood back into your body.

I seem to remember that the U.S. teams pioneered the technique at the
1968 Olympics. It was not illegal at the time and the story was that
they needed the extra oxygen carrying potential because of the
altitude. The U.S. also won some 107 medals.


Blood doping at the Mexico City Olympics? Really? I thought the first
major (US, Olympic) blood doping incident was the 1984 LA Olympics.
Still not illegal, but the altitude wasn't there, unlike Mexico City.

If you have a reference for Mexico City, I'd really like to know.

Thanks,
Mark J.

No I don't have a reference specifically stating U.S. but you might
look at https://bjsm.bmj.com/content/38/1/99 which says it was used at
the 1968 Olympics and U.S. athletes won 170 medals. I also found an
article stating that, "the LA Olympics in 1984 was the watershed
event. There was extensive use of blood transfusions, including by
several members of the highly successful US cycling team."

Some years ago I read a book written by a doctor that was involved in
drug testing for the 1956 Summer Olympics in Australia and he wrote
that "drugging" in some form has been a part of the Olympics from the
earliest Greek days. Apparently early Greek athlete ate bull's
testicles as it was said to enhance strength. Testicles? Testosterone?
Steroid? Big Muscles?


The book “Spitting in the Soup†provides a fairly balanced history of
doping in sport.


Anquetil was quite open about his use of cocaine, champagne
and morphine on his way to FIVE TdF jerseys; 1957, 1961, 62,
63, 64. Effective pre-EPO technique.

Saint Tommy (1967) is a less stellar example for methedrine.
http://www.yellowjersey.org/photosfr...t/st_tommy.jpg
--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


And these weren't even early adopters. Between the wars when indoors endurance races were popular, drug use was common and openly practised. -- AJ
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