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Bianchi are appaling and last 365 days



 
 
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  #1  
Old September 17th 03, 07:04 AM
Justin Lewis
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Default Bianchi are appaling and last 365 days

Please read the information below and make your own conclusion as to
why you must never buy a frame from Bianchi! Would Bianchi still act
in this way if the defects had resulted in personal injury?



Dear Sir,

On 1 December 2001 I purchased a Bianchi Boron Frame Size 58 cm from
Van Herwerden Wielersport in the Netherlands. I have used this frame
during the Summer months (March to October) resulting in a total of 13
or 14 months use. Recently (end of August ) the dealer from whom I
bought the frame established that it had cracked in at least two
places.



The frame was returned to Italy via the Dutch importer. After several
weeks I received notice that Bianchi is not prepared to replace the
frame simply saying that it is outside the one year guarantee period.



I am naturally highly dissatisfied with this response: you may chose
only to provide a one year guarantee (which suggests that Bianchi has
no confidence in its own products) but that does no exclude you from
the responsibility of providing a product which satisfies what can be
reasonably expected of it. It can reasonably be expected that a frame
of this supposed quality will last 5 years.



As this particular frame has lasted about 20% of that period your
responsibility is to refund 80% of its value or, as a gesture of
goodwill, to provide a replacement frame of similar quality. Your
abject failure to even discuss this possibility suggests that you
consider that a frame which lasts 366 days has fulfilled Bianchi’s
obligations to its client. I can assure you that this is not the case
under Dutch law.



I expect better from Bianchi: your lack of preparedness to replace
this frame or provide an adequate refund is a complete desertion of
your responsibility and has left the Dutch dealer (who has been more
than reasonable) out of pocket.



May I suggest that you include a statement in your publicity campaign
in the Netherlands (To be faster you only need an extra gear) to the
effect that you expect certain models of your range to last 365 days
only.

I feel it only pertinent to add to the message below that the dealer
from whom I bought the frame has previously had poor experiences with
the service from Bianchi in these sort of cases and has decided no
longer to stock or sell Bianchi frames. He strongly advises against
the purchase of your products: as the largest dealer in our region
this will surely influence your image in the whole of the Benelux. In
the light of this I suggest that it really is time for your company to
revise its position regarding service (or as it currently is, lack of
service).




I expect the courtesy of a reply containing an adequate proposal,



Yours faithfully,





Justin Lewis.

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  #2  
Old September 17th 03, 07:17 AM
Kurgan Gringioni
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Default Bianchi are appaling and last 365 days


"Justin Lewis" wrote in message
news
Please read the information below and make your own conclusion as to
why you must never buy a frame from Bianchi!


snip




Dumbass -


We don't give a **** about your bike warranty problems.

Plus, we like Bianchi. Jan Ullrich wouldn't have been in the TdF this year
when Coast blew it, but Bianchi stepped in and saved the day. Probably with
the $$$ they made from Dumbasses like you.

Please post your bike purchase problems to a group where someone cares.

Thank you very much for your cooperation and have a nice day.


  #4  
Old September 17th 03, 01:08 PM
Ewoud Dronkert
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Default Bianchi are appaling and last 365 days

On Wed, 17 Sep 2003 09:58:50 +0200, Justin Lewis wrote:
Kurgan perhaps you should have the decency to
substitute the pronoun "we" at the beginning of your vitriol with the
pronoun "I".


No need, two already makes a we.
  #5  
Old September 17th 03, 02:13 PM
Qui si parla Campagnolo
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Default Bianchi are appaling and last 365 days

justin- Please read the information below and make your own conclusion as to
why you must never buy a frame from Bianchi! Would Bianchi still act
in this way if the defects had resulted in personal injury? BRBR

One year warrantry, like a lot of bicycle and other 'stuff'. Why are ya
surprised??

frame broke outside of warranty..sorry- Guy shouldn't buy a bicycle with this
rep.

Dutch guy It can reasonably be expected that a frame
of this supposed quality will last 5 years. BRBR


Even that is low but with very thin and light aluminum framesets, this is
standard...

Dutch guy Your
abject failure to even discuss this possibility suggests that you
consider that a frame which lasts 366 days has fulfilled Bianchi’s
obligations to its client. I can assure you that this is not the case
under Dutch law. BRBR

Absurd. 5 year time frame is arbitrary and no court anywhere would uphold this
guys figures. did the gebt know the warrranty was one year? I'll guess he did
and then caveat emptor.

Bianchi and others build to the lowest common denominator. That is, they assume
a certain amount of use. If exceeded, the stuff often breaks but it is cheaper
to replace in the one year period than to make the framesets stronger. It's
just business.

Peter Chisholm
Vecchio's Bicicletteria
1833 Pearl St.
Boulder, CO, 80302
(303)440-3535
http://www.vecchios.com
"Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"
  #6  
Old September 17th 03, 02:16 PM
Qui si parla Campagnolo
external usenet poster
 
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Default Bianchi are appaling and last 365 days

xxx- The problem
probably lies with new light steel used in the 'next generation' steel
bikes, although if the OP posted this to rbt he'd probably have been
told to get an oversized lugged steel frame that weights 5 lbs. BRBR

Or a better made steel frameset that weighs about 3.6 pounds. No steel frameset
we see these days, lugged or not weighs 5 pounds. Mine is lugged and weighs 3.8
pounds. Another misrepresentation of modern steel.

Peter Chisholm
Vecchio's Bicicletteria
1833 Pearl St.
Boulder, CO, 80302
(303)440-3535
http://www.vecchios.com
"Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"
  #7  
Old September 17th 03, 04:08 PM
Justin Lewis
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Posts: n/a
Default Bianchi are appaling and last 365 days

On 17 Sep 2003 13:13:08 GMT, (Qui si parla
Campagnolo) wrote:

justin- Please read the information below and make your own conclusion as to
why you must never buy a frame from Bianchi! Would Bianchi still act
in this way if the defects had resulted in personal injury? BRBR

One year warrantry, like a lot of bicycle and other 'stuff'. Why are ya
surprised??


I am surpprised because most manufactures give between one and three
years guarantee and Cannondale give a lifelong guarantee on the CAD 5
which I have just looked at.

frame broke outside of warranty..sorry- Guy shouldn't buy a bicycle with this
rep.


It may be acceptable in the USA (surely not in such a litigious
society) but it is not in Europe. Does Bianchi have such a poor
reputation?
Dutch guy It can reasonably be expected that a frame
of this supposed quality will last 5 years. BRBR


Even that is low but with very thin and light aluminum framesets, this is
standard...

Dutch guy Your
abject failure to even discuss this possibility suggests that you
consider that a frame which lasts 366 days has fulfilled Bianchi’s
obligations to its client. I can assure you that this is not the case
under Dutch law. BRBR

Absurd. 5 year time frame is arbitrary and no court anywhere would uphold this
guys figures. did the gebt know the warrranty was one year? I'll guess he did
and then caveat emptor.


Not only would a court uphold this but it actually has: that is a
fact, ask Eddy Merckx!

Bianchi and others build to the lowest common denominator. That is, they assume
a certain amount of use. If exceeded, the stuff often breaks but it is cheaper
to replace in the one year period than to make the framesets stronger. It's
just business.


It certainly will not be cheaper to replace the frame as standard
practice when the defect leads to serious personal injury or death, as
the court ruled in the Eddy Merckx case.
Peter Chisholm
Vecchio's Bicicletteria
1833 Pearl St.
Boulder, CO, 80302
(303)440-3535
http://www.vecchios.com
"Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"


  #8  
Old September 17th 03, 04:36 PM
Mike Jacoubowsky
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Default Bianchi are appaling and last 365 days

Actually the Boron is a 2.8lb steel frame. My Aluminium Bianchi has
already lasted 3 years and is about to be downgraded to being my 2nd
training bike when I get my new (Orbea Starship) frame. The problem
probably lies with new light steel used in the 'next generation' steel
bikes, although if the OP posted this to rbt he'd probably have been
told to get an oversized lugged steel frame that weights 5 lbs.


Thanks for the clarification. I've said before that 3.5 lbs represents an
acceptable floor for durable steel frames, just over 3 pounds for Ti, and
perhaps 2.6 or slightly-higher for aluminum. Still not sure what the
minimum safe weight is for carbon-fiber, which is just fine with me.... I'd
rather have them on the conservative side!

--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
http://www.ChainReactionBicycles.com


"Donald Munro" wrote in message
news
Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:

If you felt Bianchi misrepresented the durability aspects of the frame,
that's one thing. But such ultra-light frames sacrifice durability in a
quest for the ultimate in light weight, no question about it. There's

no
magical way you can build an aluminum frame at near 2 pounds without it
having an extremely limited lifespan.


Actually the Boron is a 2.8lb steel frame. My Aluminium Bianchi has
already lasted 3 years and is about to be downgraded to being my 2nd
training bike when I get my new (Orbea Starship) frame. The problem
probably lies with new light steel used in the 'next generation' steel
bikes, although if the OP posted this to rbt he'd probably have been
told to get an oversized lugged steel frame that weights 5 lbs.



  #9  
Old September 17th 03, 05:13 PM
Kurgan Gringioni
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Posts: n/a
Default Bianchi are appaling and last 365 days


"Justin Lewis" wrote in message
...


snip


Thanks for the replies: Kurgan perhaps you should have the decency



Dumbass -

First of all, what the **** are you doing replying to your own bleating post
and not snipping out all that crap?

Second of all, even someone as dense as yourself would realize that using
"Kurgan" and "decency" in the same sentence is an oxymoron if you lurked here
for at least 1 day before posting.



it is certainly a good reason not to buy the product. I would disagree
about the company not owing me anything after the warranty period:





Goddamm, you're an idiot.

If you want a lifetime warranty, buy products that have that feature.
Otherwise, shut up. We don't care.


  #10  
Old September 17th 03, 05:25 PM
William Belaforous Kelly
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Posts: n/a
Default Bianchi are appaling and last 365 days


"Qui si parla Campagnolo" wrote in message
...
xxx- The problem
probably lies with new light steel used in the 'next generation' steel
bikes, although if the OP posted this to rbt he'd probably have been
told to get an oversized lugged steel frame that weights 5 lbs. BRBR

Or a better made steel frameset that weighs about 3.6 pounds. No steel

frameset
we see these days, lugged or not weighs 5 pounds. Mine is lugged and weighs

3.8
pounds. Another misrepresentation of modern steel.





I make furniture. The only material I use is stainless steel. Despite its
expense and difficulty to machine, it's the best material for this
application (appearance and durability).

When it comes to road bikes, I'd put cro-moly steel 4th behind aluminum,
titanium and carbon (in no particular order). From a physics perspective it
just doesn't have the stiffness to weight ratio the other materials have.
Running finite element analysis programs (Cosmos) on Solidworks models
repeatedly confirms this.

Steel does have one advantage: it's cheap. It does have the best combination
of machinability and weldability. And I suppose some old farts like the feel.
That's fine, it's only a pound (or less) difference.

Saying that it performs just as well in less subjective measures (stiffness
to weight ratio) would not be an accurate representation.


HC

ps. Yes, I know how to weld aluminum and titanium, no I've never worked with
carbon (although it's simple, just mold and heat).


 




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