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  #51  
Old September 2nd 17, 08:37 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,345
Default Jobst

On Saturday, September 2, 2017 at 8:14:10 AM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/2/2017 9:47 AM, wrote:
On Saturday, September 2, 2017 at 6:16:36 AM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/1/2017 9:30 PM, John B. wrote:
On Fri, 1 Sep 2017 10:10:59 -0700 (PDT),
wrote:

On Friday, September 1, 2017 at 9:13:45 AM UTC-7, jbeattie wrote:
On Friday, September 1, 2017 at 7:15:19 AM UTC-7, wrote:
On Thursday, August 31, 2017 at 7:39:26 PM UTC-7, John B. wrote:

Are you telling me that a Thai can go to a clinic and have a $500,000 panoramic x-ray taken of his jaw? How many of these clinics are there? How many doctors trained in doing a sinus lift that requires donated bone material to achieve? That requires three different medications before and afterwards top stave off infections?

Yup. Anything that the doctor orders. Specifically a panoramic x-ray I
do not know but if the government hospitals have the device then yes.
free.

You don't seem to be following me John. The numbers and costs of spectacular medical instruments in the USA is staggering. And these will often be in a private doctor's office. These are not available in Thailand any more than they are in European villages or even in Great Britain outside of the major cities.

The weakness of socialized medicine is that it cannot afford the advancements.

Hmmm. Seems like Thailand has a thriving MRI medical tourism business.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_c...&v=-nt4-tavqXU

MRI units are more common in Japan than the US.
https://www.statista.com/statistics/...ts-by-country/ Note that Japan has "socialized insurance" and the cost of medical care is regulated. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Health...ystem_in_Japan

Panoramic x-ray machines are mundane. You can buy on on the internet. Get a cheap one for home: https://www.dentalplanet.com/x-ray-e...CABEgLdvPD_BwE

Amazingly, people in other countries -- almost all of which have socialized medicine and/or socialized insurance with highly regulated medicine -- live long and useful lives. https://www.forbes.com/sites/danmunr.../#7a03c90e576f http://www.commonwealthfund.org/publ.../mirror-mirror We're dead last compared to a dozen commie-socialist countries.

Jay - does looking at the seating capacity of the waiting area for that MRI clinic not ring a very loud bell? And exactly what do you think that MRI's do? They were developed to display interior muscle composition and they really aren't very effective without contrast material injected into the proper area.

There are two and a half times as many doctors per 100,000 people in the US as in Japan. Three times what Great Britain has. Twenty times the doctors per 100,000 in Thailand.

What in God's name makes you think that people go through years and years of training to make almost nothing under socialized medicine?

No matter HOW cheap it is, if you cannot find a competent doctor to treat you you have nothing.

Life expectancy in the world's nations seems to be the highest in
Japan with a (combined male/female) life expectancy of 83.7 years.
Switzerland is next with 83.4 years, then Singapore with 83.1.

The U.K. is #20 with 81.2 years and the U.S. is #31 with 79.3, which
is between Costa Rica with 70.6 and Cuba with 79.1.

Life expectancy at birth (2015) looks even bleaker:
Hong Kong #1 with 83.74 years, than Japan with 83.31, and Italy with
82.84 while the U.S. is #43 with 78.88.


Tell us more about the competent doctors.



We USAians drive more (miles/hours per year), drive faster,
do more drugs with or without alcohol and engage in other
oft-fatal behaviors more than many populations.

We lose roughly 20,000 more people to ODs than to car wrecks
the last few years. Oh, you want to bring in health care? We
also kill more people in hospital-acquired infection than
car wrecks, too. Not 'infection' but _hospital acquired_
infection. They're pros!

And we wouldn't have it any other way!


Absolutely every hospital everywhere is a den of infection. To pretend that there isn't a strong chance of getting a hospital acquired infection quite easily is dreaming. This is why they are pumping everyone full of antibiotics all the time.


Oh, hospital-acquired infection is roughly 2 million people
per year in USA. It's the 90,00 actual deaths which raise
one's eyebrow.

At any rate, lower overall age at death does not necessarily
indicate an insurance problem because the populations and
their behaviors are not controlled for huge variables.

One might actually posit that the screwy insurance system
("I paid something, so we're going to the ER for every
sniffle and scrape" even though services dwarf premiums)
increases the problem.


I worked on many medical instruments and the company managers didn't want us to even go into hospitals during tests. Every possible bacteria is floating around ANY hospital. High numbers of deaths from hospital acquired infections really only tells you that the general population is not very healthy..

And in the USA that is primarily from a large illegal and legal immigrant population that has arrived from countries that do not have particularly good health.
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  #52  
Old September 2nd 17, 09:02 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
AMuzi
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 13,447
Default Jobst

On 9/2/2017 2:37 PM, wrote:
On Saturday, September 2, 2017 at 8:14:10 AM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/2/2017 9:47 AM,
wrote:
On Saturday, September 2, 2017 at 6:16:36 AM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/1/2017 9:30 PM, John B. wrote:
On Fri, 1 Sep 2017 10:10:59 -0700 (PDT),
wrote:

On Friday, September 1, 2017 at 9:13:45 AM UTC-7, jbeattie wrote:
On Friday, September 1, 2017 at 7:15:19 AM UTC-7, wrote:
On Thursday, August 31, 2017 at 7:39:26 PM UTC-7, John B. wrote:

Are you telling me that a Thai can go to a clinic and have a $500,000 panoramic x-ray taken of his jaw? How many of these clinics are there? How many doctors trained in doing a sinus lift that requires donated bone material to achieve? That requires three different medications before and afterwards top stave off infections?

Yup. Anything that the doctor orders. Specifically a panoramic x-ray I
do not know but if the government hospitals have the device then yes.
free.

You don't seem to be following me John. The numbers and costs of spectacular medical instruments in the USA is staggering. And these will often be in a private doctor's office. These are not available in Thailand any more than they are in European villages or even in Great Britain outside of the major cities.

The weakness of socialized medicine is that it cannot afford the advancements.

Hmmm. Seems like Thailand has a thriving MRI medical tourism business.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_c...&v=-nt4-tavqXU

MRI units are more common in Japan than the US.
https://www.statista.com/statistics/...ts-by-country/ Note that Japan has "socialized insurance" and the cost of medical care is regulated. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Health...ystem_in_Japan

Panoramic x-ray machines are mundane. You can buy on on the internet. Get a cheap one for home: https://www.dentalplanet.com/x-ray-e...CABEgLdvPD_BwE

Amazingly, people in other countries -- almost all of which have socialized medicine and/or socialized insurance with highly regulated medicine -- live long and useful lives. https://www.forbes.com/sites/danmunr.../#7a03c90e576f http://www.commonwealthfund.org/publ.../mirror-mirror We're dead last compared to a dozen commie-socialist countries.

Jay - does looking at the seating capacity of the waiting area for that MRI clinic not ring a very loud bell? And exactly what do you think that MRI's do? They were developed to display interior muscle composition and they really aren't very effective without contrast material injected into the proper area.

There are two and a half times as many doctors per 100,000 people in the US as in Japan. Three times what Great Britain has. Twenty times the doctors per 100,000 in Thailand.

What in God's name makes you think that people go through years and years of training to make almost nothing under socialized medicine?

No matter HOW cheap it is, if you cannot find a competent doctor to treat you you have nothing.

Life expectancy in the world's nations seems to be the highest in
Japan with a (combined male/female) life expectancy of 83.7 years.
Switzerland is next with 83.4 years, then Singapore with 83.1.

The U.K. is #20 with 81.2 years and the U.S. is #31 with 79.3, which
is between Costa Rica with 70.6 and Cuba with 79.1.

Life expectancy at birth (2015) looks even bleaker:
Hong Kong #1 with 83.74 years, than Japan with 83.31, and Italy with
82.84 while the U.S. is #43 with 78.88.


Tell us more about the competent doctors.



We USAians drive more (miles/hours per year), drive faster,
do more drugs with or without alcohol and engage in other
oft-fatal behaviors more than many populations.

We lose roughly 20,000 more people to ODs than to car wrecks
the last few years. Oh, you want to bring in health care? We
also kill more people in hospital-acquired infection than
car wrecks, too. Not 'infection' but _hospital acquired_
infection. They're pros!

And we wouldn't have it any other way!

Absolutely every hospital everywhere is a den of infection. To pretend that there isn't a strong chance of getting a hospital acquired infection quite easily is dreaming. This is why they are pumping everyone full of antibiotics all the time.


Oh, hospital-acquired infection is roughly 2 million people
per year in USA. It's the 90,00 actual deaths which raise
one's eyebrow.

At any rate, lower overall age at death does not necessarily
indicate an insurance problem because the populations and
their behaviors are not controlled for huge variables.

One might actually posit that the screwy insurance system
("I paid something, so we're going to the ER for every
sniffle and scrape" even though services dwarf premiums)
increases the problem.


I worked on many medical instruments and the company managers didn't want us to even go into hospitals during tests. Every possible bacteria is floating around ANY hospital. High numbers of deaths from hospital acquired infections really only tells you that the general population is not very healthy.

And in the USA that is primarily from a large illegal and legal immigrant population that has arrived from countries that do not have particularly good health.


That's true, and historically very high at the moment.

The last time foreign-born people living here were at this
high a proportion, we ended up with The Chinese Exclusion
Act as a reaction and much similar legislation through to
the Johnson Reed Act after which immigration was minimal for
the next 30 years.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


  #54  
Old September 3rd 17, 12:16 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,538
Default Jobst

On 9/2/2017 12:12 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/2/2017 10:34 AM, Frank Krygowski wrote:


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/carol-...b_5266944.html


OK, there's that.
But roughly 90,000 people went into a hospital last year and were killed
there by hospital acquired infection.

Unlike Black Helicopters, that cannot be mitigated by a tinfoil hat.


I've mentioned this before, but some years ago I read a book dealing
with risks and corporate cultures. It was recommended to me by an
engineering colleague. Sorry, I can't recall the title.

I remember chapters devoted to the tremendous increase in safety of air
travel, beginning during World War II but continuing into commercial
aviation. Supposedly a big contributor was instituting a system by which
pilots could anonymously report things like near misses, near mistakes
(like grabbing the control for flaps instead of landing gear), or just
good ideas for making things better. Crucial was a high-ranking team
that evaluated all those reports and acted on most of them. Anonymity
was also crucial, since no pilot wanted to risk his career by admitting
that he'd nearly killed a planeload of people.

The book had a chapter on hospitals, and pointed out that a few
hospitals have somewhat similar programs, and they have much better
outcomes because of them. But the book claimed most hospitals have a
very different culture, in which surgeons are treated like demigods. In
those, a nurse or anesthesiologist would never report that a surgeon
didn't scrub properly before an operation, or otherwise violated
procedures or made mistakes.

This was confirmed for me just yesterday. My physician (who's very
friendly with me) said he'd initially planned to be an anesthesiologist.
He gave up the idea after seeing how the surgeons he'd have to work with
abused other staff members and absolutely never admitted to mistakes.

The summary, I guess, is that it's possible to fix the problem of
hospital-acquired infections. But it's not going to come from posters
saying "Try to do better," which is as far as things go in most
hospitals. It's going to take some institutional changes - changes that
I'm sure lots of people would decry as just more bureaucracy.

--
- Frank Krygowski
  #57  
Old September 3rd 17, 03:03 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
John B.[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 5,697
Default Jobst

On Sat, 02 Sep 2017 08:17:03 -0500, AMuzi wrote:

On 9/1/2017 9:30 PM, John B. wrote:
On Fri, 1 Sep 2017 10:10:59 -0700 (PDT), wrote:

On Friday, September 1, 2017 at 9:13:45 AM UTC-7, jbeattie wrote:
On Friday, September 1, 2017 at 7:15:19 AM UTC-7, wrote:
On Thursday, August 31, 2017 at 7:39:26 PM UTC-7, John B. wrote:

Are you telling me that a Thai can go to a clinic and have a $500,000 panoramic x-ray taken of his jaw? How many of these clinics are there? How many doctors trained in doing a sinus lift that requires donated bone material to achieve? That requires three different medications before and afterwards top stave off infections?

Yup. Anything that the doctor orders. Specifically a panoramic x-ray I
do not know but if the government hospitals have the device then yes.
free.

You don't seem to be following me John. The numbers and costs of spectacular medical instruments in the USA is staggering. And these will often be in a private doctor's office. These are not available in Thailand any more than they are in European villages or even in Great Britain outside of the major cities.

The weakness of socialized medicine is that it cannot afford the advancements.

Hmmm. Seems like Thailand has a thriving MRI medical tourism business.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_c...&v=-nt4-tavqXU

MRI units are more common in Japan than the US.
https://www.statista.com/statistics/...ts-by-country/ Note that Japan has "socialized insurance" and the cost of medical care is regulated. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Health...ystem_in_Japan

Panoramic x-ray machines are mundane. You can buy on on the internet. Get a cheap one for home: https://www.dentalplanet.com/x-ray-e...CABEgLdvPD_BwE

Amazingly, people in other countries -- almost all of which have socialized medicine and/or socialized insurance with highly regulated medicine -- live long and useful lives. https://www.forbes.com/sites/danmunr.../#7a03c90e576f http://www.commonwealthfund.org/publ.../mirror-mirror We're dead last compared to a dozen commie-socialist countries.

Jay - does looking at the seating capacity of the waiting area for that MRI clinic not ring a very loud bell? And exactly what do you think that MRI's do? They were developed to display interior muscle composition and they really aren't very effective without contrast material injected into the proper area.

There are two and a half times as many doctors per 100,000 people in the US as in Japan. Three times what Great Britain has. Twenty times the doctors per 100,000 in Thailand.

What in God's name makes you think that people go through years and years of training to make almost nothing under socialized medicine?

No matter HOW cheap it is, if you cannot find a competent doctor to treat you you have nothing.


Life expectancy in the world's nations seems to be the highest in
Japan with a (combined male/female) life expectancy of 83.7 years.
Switzerland is next with 83.4 years, then Singapore with 83.1.

The U.K. is #20 with 81.2 years and the U.S. is #31 with 79.3, which
is between Costa Rica with 70.6 and Cuba with 79.1.

Life expectancy at birth (2015) looks even bleaker:
Hong Kong #1 with 83.74 years, than Japan with 83.31, and Italy with
82.84 while the U.S. is #43 with 78.88.


Tell us more about the competent doctors.


We USAians drive more (miles/hours per year), drive faster,
do more drugs with or without alcohol and engage in other
oft-fatal behaviors more than many populations.


More miles (kilometers) yes but highway fatalities? I believe that
Thailand is one of the front runners in that race with 74.6 fatalities
per 100,000 autos. Per capita it is 36.2/100,000 residents.

As for drug use I'm just not sure but we probably average 3 - 4 news
reports a month about "X million Ya Ba pills found in pickup truck"
(Ya Ba (crazy medicine) is the local name for tablets containing a
mixture of methamphetamine and caffeine.

We lose roughly 20,000 more people to ODs than to car wrecks
the last few years. Oh, you want to bring in health care? We
also kill more people in hospital-acquired infection than
car wrecks, too. Not 'infection' but _hospital acquired_
infection. They're pros!

And we wouldn't have it any other way!


:-) And your nation's expenditure for "defense" is higher then the
next eight nations in the entire world, combined. Nearly 3 times that
of China.

Didn't President Eisenhower once say something about that?

"In the councils of government, we must guard against the acquisition
of unwarranted influence, whether sought or unsought, by the
military-industrial complex. The potential for the disastrous rise of
misplaced power exists and will persist. We must never let the weight
of this combination endanger our liberties or democratic processes. We
should take nothing for granted. Only an alert and knowledgeable
citizenry can compel the proper meshing of the huge industrial and
military machinery of defense with our peaceful methods and goals, so
that security and liberty may prosper together."

He also said :
"As we peer into society's future, we, you and I, and our government,
must avoid the impulse to live only for today, plundering for our own
ease and convenience the precious resources of tomorrow. We cannot
mortgage the material assets of our grandchildren without risking the
loss also of their political and spiritual heritage. We want democracy
to survive for all generations to come, not to become the insolvent
phantom of tomorrow.

Ah, but of course he was an old fashioned sort of fellow and not "New
Age" at all, why he never even had a hand phone to peer at. What did
he know?
--
Cheers,

John B.

  #58  
Old September 3rd 17, 03:10 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
John B.[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 5,697
Default Jobst

On Sat, 02 Sep 2017 10:14:34 -0500, AMuzi wrote:

On 9/2/2017 9:47 AM, wrote:
On Saturday, September 2, 2017 at 6:16:36 AM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/1/2017 9:30 PM, John B. wrote:
On Fri, 1 Sep 2017 10:10:59 -0700 (PDT),
wrote:

On Friday, September 1, 2017 at 9:13:45 AM UTC-7, jbeattie wrote:
On Friday, September 1, 2017 at 7:15:19 AM UTC-7, wrote:
On Thursday, August 31, 2017 at 7:39:26 PM UTC-7, John B. wrote:

Are you telling me that a Thai can go to a clinic and have a $500,000 panoramic x-ray taken of his jaw? How many of these clinics are there? How many doctors trained in doing a sinus lift that requires donated bone material to achieve? That requires three different medications before and afterwards top stave off infections?

Yup. Anything that the doctor orders. Specifically a panoramic x-ray I
do not know but if the government hospitals have the device then yes.
free.

You don't seem to be following me John. The numbers and costs of spectacular medical instruments in the USA is staggering. And these will often be in a private doctor's office. These are not available in Thailand any more than they are in European villages or even in Great Britain outside of the major cities.

The weakness of socialized medicine is that it cannot afford the advancements.

Hmmm. Seems like Thailand has a thriving MRI medical tourism business.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_c...&v=-nt4-tavqXU

MRI units are more common in Japan than the US.
https://www.statista.com/statistics/...ts-by-country/ Note that Japan has "socialized insurance" and the cost of medical care is regulated. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Health...ystem_in_Japan

Panoramic x-ray machines are mundane. You can buy on on the internet. Get a cheap one for home: https://www.dentalplanet.com/x-ray-e...CABEgLdvPD_BwE

Amazingly, people in other countries -- almost all of which have socialized medicine and/or socialized insurance with highly regulated medicine -- live long and useful lives. https://www.forbes.com/sites/danmunr.../#7a03c90e576f http://www.commonwealthfund.org/publ.../mirror-mirror We're dead last compared to a dozen commie-socialist countries.

Jay - does looking at the seating capacity of the waiting area for that MRI clinic not ring a very loud bell? And exactly what do you think that MRI's do? They were developed to display interior muscle composition and they really aren't very effective without contrast material injected into the proper area.

There are two and a half times as many doctors per 100,000 people in the US as in Japan. Three times what Great Britain has. Twenty times the doctors per 100,000 in Thailand.

What in God's name makes you think that people go through years and years of training to make almost nothing under socialized medicine?

No matter HOW cheap it is, if you cannot find a competent doctor to treat you you have nothing.

Life expectancy in the world's nations seems to be the highest in
Japan with a (combined male/female) life expectancy of 83.7 years.
Switzerland is next with 83.4 years, then Singapore with 83.1.

The U.K. is #20 with 81.2 years and the U.S. is #31 with 79.3, which
is between Costa Rica with 70.6 and Cuba with 79.1.

Life expectancy at birth (2015) looks even bleaker:
Hong Kong #1 with 83.74 years, than Japan with 83.31, and Italy with
82.84 while the U.S. is #43 with 78.88.


Tell us more about the competent doctors.



We USAians drive more (miles/hours per year), drive faster,
do more drugs with or without alcohol and engage in other
oft-fatal behaviors more than many populations.

We lose roughly 20,000 more people to ODs than to car wrecks
the last few years. Oh, you want to bring in health care? We
also kill more people in hospital-acquired infection than
car wrecks, too. Not 'infection' but _hospital acquired_
infection. They're pros!

And we wouldn't have it any other way!


Absolutely every hospital everywhere is a den of infection. To pretend that there isn't a strong chance of getting a hospital acquired infection quite easily is dreaming. This is why they are pumping everyone full of antibiotics all the time.


Oh, hospital-acquired infection is roughly 2 million people
per year in USA. It's the 90,00 actual deaths which raise
one's eyebrow.

At any rate, lower overall age at death does not necessarily
indicate an insurance problem because the populations and
their behaviors are not controlled for huge variables.

One might actually posit that the screwy insurance system
("I paid something, so we're going to the ER for every
sniffle and scrape" even though services dwarf premiums)
increases the problem.


That is a side effect of any/all cheap medical care systems. the
Military, that essentially consists of young, 18 - 40 years, healthy,
people. averages far higher attendance at "sick call" than any other
group.

But I suppose that is human nature. A large announcement of "BIG SALE
ON WENSDAY ( everything as much as 200% cheaper)" will ensure a packed
store. As soon as the doors open :-)
--
Cheers,

John B.

  #59  
Old September 3rd 17, 03:26 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
John B.[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 5,697
Default Jobst

On Sat, 2 Sep 2017 19:16:43 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 9/2/2017 12:12 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/2/2017 10:34 AM, Frank Krygowski wrote:


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/carol-...b_5266944.html


OK, there's that.
But roughly 90,000 people went into a hospital last year and were killed
there by hospital acquired infection.

Unlike Black Helicopters, that cannot be mitigated by a tinfoil hat.


I've mentioned this before, but some years ago I read a book dealing
with risks and corporate cultures. It was recommended to me by an
engineering colleague. Sorry, I can't recall the title.

I remember chapters devoted to the tremendous increase in safety of air
travel, beginning during World War II but continuing into commercial
aviation. Supposedly a big contributor was instituting a system by which
pilots could anonymously report things like near misses, near mistakes
(like grabbing the control for flaps instead of landing gear), or just
good ideas for making things better. Crucial was a high-ranking team
that evaluated all those reports and acted on most of them. Anonymity
was also crucial, since no pilot wanted to risk his career by admitting
that he'd nearly killed a planeload of people.

The book had a chapter on hospitals, and pointed out that a few
hospitals have somewhat similar programs, and they have much better
outcomes because of them. But the book claimed most hospitals have a
very different culture, in which surgeons are treated like demigods. In
those, a nurse or anesthesiologist would never report that a surgeon
didn't scrub properly before an operation, or otherwise violated
procedures or made mistakes.

This was confirmed for me just yesterday. My physician (who's very
friendly with me) said he'd initially planned to be an anesthesiologist.
He gave up the idea after seeing how the surgeons he'd have to work with
abused other staff members and absolutely never admitted to mistakes.

The summary, I guess, is that it's possible to fix the problem of
hospital-acquired infections. But it's not going to come from posters
saying "Try to do better," which is as far as things go in most
hospitals. It's going to take some institutional changes - changes that
I'm sure lots of people would decry as just more bureaucracy.


Not to argue with the overall concept but I believe that all hospitals
do attempt to manage the doctor's "failure rate". I distinctly
remember a Thai doctor, trained and qualified in the U.S., saying
something to the effect that if as many of his patients died when he
was practicing in the U.S. as did in Thailand he would have been
"disbarred". The discussion was in regards to "Country Thais" only
seeking medical attention when they were about to die.
--
Cheers,

John B.

  #60  
Old September 3rd 17, 04:07 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
John B.[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 5,697
Default Jobst

On Sat, 2 Sep 2017 07:33:13 -0700 (PDT), wrote:

On Friday, September 1, 2017 at 6:41:42 PM UTC-7, John B. wrote:

That may have been true many years ago but is no longer true today.
(and all you had to do is look)

See:
http://www.whatclinic.com/dentists/t...dental-x-rayst
or
http://www.bangkokdentalcenter.com/t...logy-xray.html
or
https://www.samitivejhospitals.com/e...dental-clinic/
or
https://www.gracedentalclinic.com/technology-eng.html

Note: the first site quotes a price for panoramic x-rays, in English
aimed at foreigners, as US$1,000. The Thai price is traditionally
about 50%

I might add that Thailand seems to be quite well known for cosmetic
surgery. It is said that one can fly from America, stay in a posh
hotel, have the operation(s) and fly home cheaper then the surgery
costs alone in the U.S.

I have also read that Thailand is far and away the most experienced in
penis re-attachments. See:
http://www.glorysurgery.com/surgery-...nis-video-240/
http://tinyurl.com/yc6tgqk2
Or even
http://tinyurl.com/yc6tgqk2


John - remember that I developed medical instruments for years. Your invention of advanced medical treatment because one of the instruments I mentioned is available at one clinic is reaching so far that you aren't even on the same Earth.


If you want to believe that please do so. After all, some people
apparently believe that the moon is blue cheese.

But, I suggest, that as I have resided in Thailand for more then forty
years and you, as far as can be told from your posts here, have never
visited the country I am probably far more qualified to describe
medical care in Thailand than you.

Or have you made secret visits that you haven't told us about?
--
Cheers,

John B.

 




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