California's Fires

On Thu, 19 Oct 2017 15:20:58 -0500, AMuzi wrote:

Peshtigo Wisconsin Fi 1.5 million acres 2400 dead.

I had family living in Marinette when I was a kid and have been through
Peshtigo many times. The Peshtigo Fire Museum was quite interesting,
although I'd bet it's been 40 years since I was there. Don't even know
if it's a going concern any more.

The theory at the time was that it was sparked by embers drifting from
the Chicago Fire.

That part of Wisconsin is a nice area. Marinette was a calm, nice town.
I still have property in the Chain of Lakes area that I hope to put a
cabin on and retire.

Gotta get the hell out of the Twin Cities, which are aiming to go the
way of LA and NYC over the next 30 years. Used to be great places to
live but have been going downhill due to relentless pro-expansion
policies pushing sprawl out farther and farther. It's a minimum of an
hour's ride in any direction (a couple hours going west) to get out of
town and onto rural roads. Not all "growth" is good.

Cal cut 'ALL' trees down ...

Firewood railroad ties golf n silver steam machinery cooking wood heat ...no coal. No oil tech.

So the topsoil formed during the last ice age washed away leaving hard ground dirt rock. Tourists look at coastal pasture vista unaware the eco was 150' redwoods n MIST. MIST ! I'be spoken on that n it's trip. A cranial nerve response produces brief facial n body shock ttremors.

What grows back is herbaceous brush tinder.

I know Santa Rosa n environs n there was no effort at fire prevention landscaping I saw. The green coastal burn area surrounded by miles of semi arid brush

I followed the tour over Trinidad.

GO GEORGE !

Thus... another glass of red, a grape ? Slip into the pool with Lisa Fred Ted Alice n the Yoakum Bro ....

The fireplace chimney photos are mockery of this attitude. The burning of Atlanta fir inexcusable sins against nature.

I hike n study this area n frankly intelligent analysis of what you see n what you should do n not do is historically un available. The entire west is a catastrophic eco disaster caused by eco pigs n opportunists.

May they all developeople lung disease from particulate. Bicycling n jogging will continue downwind deputes 'that odor' but kill you fersure. Like DOWNWIND

I looked revisiting Joshua Tree fir this week but NWS posted the particulate smog to a few miles away. Joshua but a 100 miles from Yuma area of silver mini deserts from lower to upper interstate. Arid meadow to hard dirt n creosote bush practicing eco discipline

IHS

On Thu, 19 Oct 2017 10:59:33 -0700 (PDT), wrote:

On Wednesday, October 18, 2017 at 4:28:42 PM UTC-7, John B. wrote:
On Wed, 18 Oct 2017 08:41:24 -0700 (PDT), jbeattie
wrote:

On Wednesday, October 18, 2017 at 7:30:03 AM UTC-7, wrote:
On Tuesday, October 17, 2017 at 10:25:28 AM UTC-7, jbeattie wrote:
On Tuesday, October 17, 2017 at 7:52:39 AM UTC-7, wrote:
Unfortunately in the Santa Rosa fire Levi Leipheimer's house was burned to the ground. I can only hope that he is solvent enough to repair since I suspect that the insurance companies are going to play the "mass destruction" card and not pay on their policies.

Why would you say that? Assuming any insurer went insolvent, there is the California Insurance Guaranty Association. http://www.caiga.org/ But I doubt that any admitted California insurer is going to go insolvent because of the fires. Most insurers retain only part of the risk anyway, placing the rest with reinsurers. Adjusting claims will be slowed by the number, but anyone insured by a legitimate, admitted insurer probably has nothing to fear.

My sister lives in Santa Rosa and my brother owns property there. I was getting real-time reporting over the weekend. It seems to be improving, although living in the smoke is hard on the lungs.

-- Jay Beattie.

Jay, a long time ago I remember reading my insurance policy and there was a clause in it that said if a high percentage (don't remember what) where destroyed in an area that the insurance policies were null and void.

Fire insurance is the most basic coverage there is, and in most states, the policy form is dictated by statute. I've never seen any policy purporting to cancel retroactively if there were too many losses in a geographic area. There are some assessable policies issued by mutual insurers that allow the insurer to demand additional premiums if reserves are wiped out by large losses. Otherwise, large losses wipe out reserve, trigger reinsurance and/or catastrophe bonds and a lot of other risk-spreading devices.

IMO, the worry is not really the fire loss in wine country but that loss combined with all the storm damage for large P&C carriers like Ace or AIG, although most of those guys left the Florida market or issued policies with the usual exclusions for flood, wind-driven rain, etc. Anyway, its the national loss picture that really matters this year on top of the fire losses. Global warming is going to drive up premium big time.

-- Jay Beattie.

Out of curiosity, do U.S. insurance policies contain "Act of God" or
"Force Majeure" clauses?

THAT is what I read in that insurance contract. It was designed to free insurance companies from very large - possibly bankrupting expenses: Force Majeure.

In the contracts we worked under, mostly international oil companies,
they usually included a short interpretation of what the term meant,
like "tidal wave, tsunami, war, insurrection, etc."
--
Cheers,

John B.

Yup Lotta variance in language from A to B


The word processor in this S5 eg

On Thu, 19 Oct 2017 11:34:06 -0700 (PDT), wrote:

On Wednesday, October 18, 2017 at 4:54:27 PM UTC-7, jbeattie wrote:

Hmmmm. http://www.wri.org/blog/2017/10/cali...g-worst-record

Funny you didn't feel the need to look further.

While the total amount of fires this year is about 170,000 acres inb a total of 17 wildfires, those of the Laguna fire in 1970 was 175,000 acres and 382 homes.

Those of 1889 called the Santiago Canyon Fire covered 300,000 acres.

New York had a wild fire covering a half million acres. New Brunswick had one in 1825 that covered three million acres.

But when you can demonstrate a legal mind I suppose you needn't actually know anything.

NASA seems to disagree with you. https://climate.nasa.gov/scientific-consensus/ I'll put my money on NASA. They had to be super-smart to fake that whole moon landing thing.

Supersmart indeed:

https://stevengoddard.wordpress.com/...erature-fraud/

NASA reports 3.2 mm of sea level rise per year.

Over a 50 year period the tidal gauge on the Battery in New York showed the sea level presently lower than it was in 1940.

In San Francisco Bay the tidal gauges used since the 1880's show no sea level changes.

In Seattle again the sea levels are below what they were in 1940.

In Baltimore the sea level is 1 mm below what it was in 1950.

"Every single thing NASA says about sea level is fraudulent. NASA’s own data says that Antarctica ice growth is reducing sea level."

https://stevengoddard.wordpress.com/...-climate-data/

So you stick with NASA because they're really looking out for you.

You are quoting an individual who may or may not know what he is
talking about and you are presenting it as though the guy just carried
it down from the mountain, carved on tablets of stone.

So if I get a web site, call it www.johnbslocomb.org and post
something like "that old boy, "Cyclin Tom". Good Lord! He is under
treatment for Alzheimer's and most days he can't even remember his
own name."

Will you accept my data with the same enthusiasm that you accept
Steven Goddard's? My guess is that they both have about the same
degree of fact.
--
Cheers,

John B.

On 10/19/2017 11:50 PM, Tim McNamara wrote:

Gotta get the hell out of the Twin Cities, which are aiming to go the
way of LA and NYC over the next 30 years. Used to be great places to
live but have been going downhill due to relentless pro-expansion
policies pushing sprawl out farther and farther. It's a minimum of an
hour's ride in any direction (a couple hours going west) to get out of
town and onto rural roads. Not all "growth" is good.

Way back in 1976 we did our first overseas bike tour, in Britain. One
thing I loved was the city limits really did seem to limit the cities.
It seemed that with most towns, as soon as you passed the border, you
were in rural farm country.

Of course, that was a long time ago. It may be different now.

--
- Frank Krygowski

On Friday, October 20, 2017 at 6:44:36 AM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 10/19/2017 11:50 PM, Tim McNamara wrote:

Gotta get the hell out of the Twin Cities, which are aiming to go the
way of LA and NYC over the next 30 years. Used to be great places to
live but have been going downhill due to relentless pro-expansion
policies pushing sprawl out farther and farther. It's a minimum of an
hour's ride in any direction (a couple hours going west) to get out of
town and onto rural roads. Not all "growth" is good.

Way back in 1976 we did our first overseas bike tour, in Britain. One
thing I loved was the city limits really did seem to limit the cities.
It seemed that with most towns, as soon as you passed the border, you
were in rural farm country.

Of course, that was a long time ago. It may be different now.

--
- Frank Krygowski



https://www.google.com/search?biw=13...=1508507497452

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...l_ population

global warning. Electric cars. The sale of farm land to developers missed Ohio ?

the farm house could be in Lancaster County PA 1970 still there but surounde by split levels not 19C hayfields.TAXES supporting as JB

the split levelers. PONZI PONZI

On Thursday, October 19, 2017 at 11:36:50 AM UTC-7, jbeattie wrote:

Read up. http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-me...-paid-what-yo/ Your current benefits -- SS and Medicare -- are being paid by current wage earners, i.e., me. I'm supporting you. You are not supporting me. You are a drag on society. I am paying a staggering amount of taxes to support the efforts of the Trump administration because I am a team player! Go Team America! Do you hate the Team?

You certainly show yourself to be both a child of the 80's and financially incompetent as usual. Not to mention either your ability to bluff or absence of understanding what you read.

In all likelihood even under the inflated currency you will never earn half of what I did in your entire lifespan. And presently I'm considering a couple of jobs at very large firms that will again put me in the top 5%. And perhaps what is a more interesting position at a smaller start-up that is more in line with actually making breakthroughs.

What's in your future? Arguing for gun grabber laws before the Supreme Court?

On Friday, October 20, 2017 at 7:07:07 AM UTC-7, wrote:
On Thursday, October 19, 2017 at 11:36:50 AM UTC-7, jbeattie wrote:

Read up. http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-me...-paid-what-yo/ Your current benefits -- SS and Medicare -- are being paid by current wage earners, i.e., me. I'm supporting you. You are not supporting me. You are a drag on society. I am paying a staggering amount of taxes to support the efforts of the Trump administration because I am a team player! Go Team America! Do you hate the Team?

You certainly show yourself to be both a child of the 80's and financially incompetent as usual. Not to mention either your ability to bluff or absence of understanding what you read.

In all likelihood even under the inflated currency you will never earn half of what I did in your entire lifespan. And presently I'm considering a couple of jobs at very large firms that will again put me in the top 5%. And perhaps what is a more interesting position at a smaller start-up that is more in line with actually making breakthroughs.

Pffffff (blowing out coffee). Who is the one complaining about being broke and living in a **** hole? Not me. If you've out earned me, you made some staggering f***-ups. You should be retired in style.

What's in your future? Arguing for gun grabber laws before the Supreme Court?

Yes! My future is subjugating gun owners, liberal conspiracies, walks on the beach and fine wines. If I can find time after my pedicure, I might start a race war. I'm already working with your illegal next-door neighbors to occupy your back yard.

-- Jay Beattie.

On Thursday, October 19, 2017 at 1:41:59 PM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 10/19/2017 4:20 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 10/19/2017 1:34 PM, wrote:
On Wednesday, October 18, 2017 at 4:54:27 PM UTC-7, jbeattie wrote:

Hmmmm.
http://www.wri.org/blog/2017/10/cali...g-worst-record


Funny you didn't feel the need to look further.

While the total amount of fires this year is about 170,000 acres inb a
total of 17 wildfires, those of the Laguna fire in 1970 was 175,000
acres and 382 homes.

Those of 1889 called the Santiago Canyon Fire covered 300,000 acres.

New York had a wild fire covering a half million acres. New Brunswick
had one in 1825 that covered three million acres.

But when you can demonstrate a legal mind I suppose you needn't
actually know anything.

NASA seems to disagree with you.
https://climate.nasa.gov/scientific-consensus/ I'll put my money on
NASA.Â* They had to be super-smart to fake that whole moon landing thing.

Supersmart indeed:

https://stevengoddard.wordpress.com/...erature-fraud/

NASA reports 3.2 mm of sea level rise per year.

Over a 50 year period the tidal gauge on the Battery in New York
showed the sea level presently lower than it was in 1940.

In San Francisco Bay the tidal gauges used since the 1880's show no
sea level changes.

In Seattle again the sea levels are below what they were in 1940.

In Baltimore the sea level is 1 mm below what it was in 1950.

"Every single thing NASA says about sea level is fraudulent. NASA’s
own data says that Antarctica ice growth is reducing sea level."

https://stevengoddard.wordpress.com/...-climate-data/

So you stick with NASA because they're really looking out for you.


Peshtigo Wisconsin Fi 1.5 million acres 2400 dead.

Jay's "worst fires on record in California" may have meant to exclude
Wisconsin.

And Jay was given a couple of examples of California fires that were MANY times larger. The 300,000 acre fire was one single fire while the loss of what will be 170,000 acres is 17 fires. There were just five in the wine country and surrounds.

From the Pall Mall Gazette 1971: "We have often noticed that in the tabular statements of those compilers of weather records who write to the Times, useful and welcome as their communications are, every season is sure to be “extraordinary,� almost every month one of the driest or wettest, or windiest, coldest or hottest, ever known. Much observation, which ought to correct a tendency to exaggerate, seems in some minds to have rather a tendency to increase it"

An absolutely PERFECT example of this mindset is Jay. He's cold today so it's the coldest day in history. He's hot today so he believes in the discredited theory of man-made global warming.

This was based upon a theory of Arrenhius from the last quarter of the 19th century and was seized upon by environmentalists from the 1980's. They made many claims about how the scientist had proven this and that through direct experiment.

I searched out his paper and it was written in German so I had to do a great deal of searching to find a translation. Guess what - he made NONE of the claims attributed to him. He made not one single experiment as he said he did not have the money nor space to do so. Instead his work was based upon another paper about the light reflected from the moon. He made well thought out observations but not one of them would support the man-made global warming theory. This was generated firstly by Dr. Michael Mann. Mann's work ("known as the hockey stick") counterfeited data so blatantly that a Canadian scientist called him on it. Mann made the stupid mistake of suing that scientist in a Canadian court for defamation of character. Apparently he thought that Canadian would withdraw. Suddenly faced with court Mann's legal staff asked for additional time to prepare their case since the Canadian scientist had ALL his ducks in a row. The Canadian's advisers agreed ONLY on the grounds that Mann supply the data he had in totality. The court so ordered..

Mann did not turn his records over. Ask Jay how the court will take this when they reconvene.

And the public documents Mann had been bandying about did not show two extreme climate events - the Medieval Warm Period which was warmer than today -significantly so - and the little ice age. By taking these ghastly events out of the data he was free to predict these horrible climate events without anything to compare them with.

Since this time NASA and NOAA have been forcing most of their scientific staff to agree with Mann's papers in public. But the worm has long since turned. Scientists from all over the world are plainly saying that these two government entities have counterfeited data.

https://stevengoddard.wordpress.com/...-climate-data/

The article here shows how NASA has changed the data sets. Not a great deal mind you, but no change is legitimate unless they carefully explain why. And they have not.

If you read https://stevengoddard.wordpress.com/...-at-ushcngiss/

You can see the extraordinary changes in the data from NASA.

While Jay is taking Seattle's "word for sea level rise" check this out:
https://realclimatescience.com/wp-co...6-04-22-54.png

Slightly down the page is a picture of a rock outcrop in La Jolla, CA near San Diego. It shows high tide in 1871 and today. You will note that there is maybe a slight REDUCTION in sea levels. Now of course this could easily be manipulated by not showing the same moon generated tide levels, but that is unlikely since the date of both pictures is public knowledge.

As a sailor I could go into the science of tides in depth but it is significant that Jay is willing to make comments outside his area of expertise with such frequency.

The one outstanding feature of man-made global warming is that those who know the least science are those that speak of it the most.