Newbie wheelbuilding questions

Dan Lenski wrote:
....I was able to build the wheel up fine,
but the spokes are quite short. I would say that only about 1/2 of
the threaded portion of the spoke is engaged in the nipple. Probably
about 5 threads are engaged. Is this too little?

Assuming your nipps are 12mm, 4.5 more threads will be engaged if you swap
over to 16mm nipples. I've found DT brass 16mm nipples have 2mm more
thread than the 12mm versions.

~PB

"Dan Lenski" wrote in message
oups.com...
So I decided to try 4X. I was able to build the wheel up fine, but the
spokes are quite short. I would say that only about 1/2 of the
threaded portion of the spoke is engaged in the nipple. Probably about
5 threads are engaged. Is this too little?


Dan



http://www.engineersedge.com/thread_...engagement.htm

--
DTW .../\.../\.../\...

I've spent most of my money on mountain biking and windsurfing.
The rest, I've just wasted.

Dan Lenski writes:

Last night I attempted to build my third wheel, a 32 spoke zero-dish
fixed gear wheel. I wanted to reuse the spokes and rim, since they
appeared to be in very good condition.

Unfortunately, the spokes were a little too long for 3X since they
were meant for a low-flange hub, and they stuck out too far into the
rim. So I decided to try 4X. I was able to build the wheel up
fine, but the spokes are quite short. I would say that only about
1/2 of the threaded portion of the spoke is engaged in the nipple.
Probably about 5 threads are engaged. Is this too little?

The other issue is that each spoke crosses the head of a neighboring
spoke, due to the very low angle at which it leaves the hub flange.
I pushed the spokes with my thumb so that they all lie flat on top
of the neighboring spoke head, so I don't think it will lose its
true. But I wonder if having the spokes pressed against the spoke
heads weakens them in any way.

That's the problem. Maximum cross pattern is INT(N/9) before spoke
heads interfere. INT (32/9) = 3X... so that should work although it
may be close. I've had good fits with low and high flange hubs. Are
you sure you didn't a 4X pattern?

36-4X is too tight on some (old Campagnolo Record) low flange front
hubs though, the smaller ones having too small a hole circle.

All right, any of you expert wheelbuilders want to give me some
advice? I know I oughta get the proper length spokes, but wouldn't
mind saving myself the $20 if it's safe to do so.

You didn't say what spoke pattern they had in the previous small
flange hub, however, you can use any number of spoke-calc online
programs to hunt and peck to see how close your components are to
compatibility. 1mm or so sticking out of the nipple head is acceptable
with a good rim strip (Rolf or Kool-Stop)... not so good with Velox.

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/rinard/spocalc.htm

Jobst Brandt

wrote: (clip) 1mm or so sticking out of
the nipple head is acceptable with a good rim strip (clip)
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Would there be anything wrong with using a Dremel type tool to knock down
the protruding thread ends? Seems like it could be done in about 20
minutes, leaving the spoke ends flush with the nipple heads.

Leo Lichtman writes:

... 1mm or so sticking out of the nipple head is acceptable with a
good rim strip ...

Would there be anything wrong with using a Dremel type tool to knock
down the protruding thread ends? Seems like it could be done in
about 20 minutes, leaving the spoke ends flush with the nipple
heads.

I wouldn't do that because that would result in all sorts of spoke
lengths with botched threads. I know people have done that, but I
prefer to leave that alone. The next time you change rims, you'll be
glad you didn't do that. I rode many years with spokes extending
beyond the spoke nipple with tubulars, where it made little difference
and then with clinchers on MA-2's where a good rim strip was adequate.

Jobst Brandt

Dan Lenski wrote:
Last night I attempted to build my third wheel, a 32 spoke zero-dish
fixed gear wheel. I wanted to reuse the spokes and rim, since they
appeared to be in very good condition.

Unfortunately, the spokes were a little too long for 3X since they were
meant for a low-flange hub, and they stuck out too far into the rim.
So I decided to try 4X. I was able to build the wheel up fine, but the
spokes are quite short. I would say that only about 1/2 of the
threaded portion of the spoke is engaged in the nipple. Probably about
5 threads are engaged. Is this too little?


In my opinion, yes.

The other issue is that each spoke crosses the head of a neighboring
spoke, due to the very low angle at which it leaves the hub flange. I
pushed the spokes with my thumb so that they all lie flat on top of the
neighboring spoke head, so I don't think it will lose its true. But I
wonder if having the spokes pressed against the spoke heads weakens
them in any way.

All right, any of you expert wheelbuilders want to give me some advice?
I know I oughta get the proper length spokes, but wouldn't mind saving
myself the $20 if it's safe to do so.

Ya said it all. Buulding wheels is not diffuclt but it can be 'hard'.
use the proper length spokes and you will more easily build a proper
wheel, get spokes for 3 cross, start over.

In article ,
says...

1mm or so sticking out of the nipple head is acceptable
with a good rim strip (Rolf or Kool-Stop)... not so good with Velox.

What's wrong with velox rim tape? I've used it on the 2 dozen or so sets of
wheels I have built and never had any prolbems with it.
-------------
Alex

Alex Rodriguez writes:

1mm or so sticking out of the nipple head is acceptable with a good
rim strip (Rolf or Kool-Stop)... not so good with Velox.

What's wrong with Velox rim tape? I've used it on the 2 dozen or so
sets of wheels I have built and never had any problems with it.

If spokes protrude from the tops of spoke nipples, Velox will not
protect the tube over time. It either gets penetrated or gets a
perfect replica of the protruding spoke on its surface. Besides, it's
sticky tape and doesn't readily lift off the rim in the event that a
spoke nipple needs replacement such as when a spoke breaks in the
threads.

Jobst Brandt

wrote in message
...

Here's a cross section of a nipple from Andrew Muzi's Yellow
Jersey, which shows the cosmetic section:

http://www.yellowjersey.org/photosfr...st/NIPPLES.JPG

Amazingly, the firewall at work let me look at that picture.

-HW

On Wed, 10 Aug 2005 13:23:18 -0700, "Hank Wirtz"
wrote:


wrote in message
.. .

Here's a cross section of a nipple from Andrew Muzi's Yellow
Jersey, which shows the cosmetic section:

http://www.yellowjersey.org/photosfr...st/NIPPLES.JPG

Amazingly, the firewall at work let me look at that picture.

-HW

Dear Hank,

Possibly your firewall detected the U.S. flag background and
felt reassured?

See if your firewall chokes on this file:

http://home.comcast.net/~carlfogel/d...d/pumpkins.jpg

If it can't stop such Canadian pornography, you need to
upgrade before Halloween.

Carl Fogel