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50.4 BCD TA vs. VO



 
 
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  #1  
Old August 28th 19, 04:29 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Chris Collins
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Posts: 9
Default 50.4 BCD TA vs. VO

Andrew let me know the Phil Wood #2, ISO 116mm R+6, is the correct bottom bracket for TA Pro Vis 5.

The Velo Orange Grand Cru 50.4 BCD knockoff is listed as needing a 116mm symmetric (minimum) bottom bracket.

If custom ordering a PW, what to ask for? A JIS 116mm R+6??

Something else?
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  #2  
Old August 28th 19, 02:37 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
AMuzi
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Posts: 10,772
Default 50.4 BCD TA vs. VO

On 8/27/2019 10:29 PM, Chris Collins wrote:
Andrew let me know the Phil Wood #2, ISO 116mm R+6, is the correct bottom bracket for TA Pro Vis 5.

The Velo Orange Grand Cru 50.4 BCD knockoff is listed as needing a 116mm symmetric (minimum) bottom bracket.

If custom ordering a PW, what to ask for? A JIS 116mm R+6??

Something else?


Those are two very different cranks. I don't know who makes
the modern copy.

Classic TA single takes Phil #2 or current 116+5.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


  #3  
Old August 28th 19, 03:12 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Chris Collins
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Posts: 9
Default 50.4 BCD TA vs. VO

On Wednesday, August 28, 2019 at 6:37:34 AM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 8/27/2019 10:29 PM, Chris Collins wrote:


The Velo Orange Grand Cru 50.4 BCD knockoff is listed as needing a 116mm symmetric (minimum) bottom bracket.


If custom ordering a PW, what to ask for? A JIS 116mm R+6??


Classic TA single takes Phil #2 or current 116+5.


I stand corrected on my details. My question:

Classic TA - Phil Wood ISO 116mm R+5
Velo Orange - Phil Wood JIS ???mm ???


--Chris
  #4  
Old August 29th 19, 09:32 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Tim McNamara
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Posts: 6,863
Default 50.4 BCD TA vs. VO

On Wed, 28 Aug 2019 07:12:48 -0700 (PDT), Chris Collins
wrote:
On Wednesday, August 28, 2019 at 6:37:34 AM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 8/27/2019 10:29 PM, Chris Collins wrote:


The Velo Orange Grand Cru 50.4 BCD knockoff is listed as needing a
116mm symmetric (minimum) bottom bracket.


If custom ordering a PW, what to ask for? A JIS 116mm R+6??


Classic TA single takes Phil #2 or current 116+5.


I stand corrected on my details. My question:

Classic TA - Phil Wood ISO 116mm R+5 Velo Orange - Phil Wood JIS ???mm
???


Chris, I'd ask the VO folks directly, they ought to know. The VO web
site says JIS 188 mm BB for that crank.

https://velo-orange.com/collections/...-crankset-mkii

If you're getting a Phil, you
can tweak the left-right bias if needed by backing in or out the
retaining rings on either side by 1-2 mm.
  #5  
Old August 30th 19, 01:41 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Chris Collins
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Posts: 9
Default 50.4 BCD TA vs. VO

Thanks Tim...by email the said 116mm, I don't know where you got 118mm (not doubting, just don't know).

Why can't I get a R+2 instead if trying to crank it over 2mm, what if a great fit is +3 or +4?
  #6  
Old August 30th 19, 02:34 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
AMuzi
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Posts: 10,772
Default 50.4 BCD TA vs. VO

On 8/29/2019 7:41 PM, Chris Collins wrote:
Thanks Tim...by email the said 116mm, I don't know where you got 118mm (not doubting, just don't know).

Why can't I get a R+2 instead if trying to crank it over 2mm, what if a great fit is +3 or +4?


Because it's utterly different.
If the manufacturer says JIS 116mm symmetric, use that.

The crank you're using has absolutely no similarities to a
classic TA crank, technically. If you think it looks
something like a TA crank, fine. But it just isn't.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


  #7  
Old August 31st 19, 03:07 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Don Gillies[_2_]
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Posts: 7
Default 50.4 BCD TA vs. VO

If a vintage crank needs an offset on one side, you can just add the offset to the other side and substitute a symmetric crankset, so a 116 R+5 bottom bracket can be substituted with a 121 symmetric bottom bracket (120 or 122 would work fine.)

- Don Gillies
Palo Alto, CA, USA
  #8  
Old August 31st 19, 03:49 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
AMuzi
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Posts: 10,772
Default 50.4 BCD TA vs. VO

On 8/30/2019 9:07 PM, Don Gillies wrote:
If a vintage crank needs an offset on one side, you can just add the offset to the other side and substitute a symmetric crankset, so a 116 R+5 bottom bracket can be substituted with a 121 symmetric bottom bracket (120 or 122 would work fine.)

- Don Gillies
Palo Alto, CA, USA


Which makes your tread ( aka "Q") wider.
Deal breaker for some riders.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


  #9  
Old September 2nd 19, 02:12 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Tom Kunich[_5_]
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Posts: 908
Default 50.4 BCD TA vs. VO

On Friday, August 30, 2019 at 7:49:45 PM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 8/30/2019 9:07 PM, Don Gillies wrote:
If a vintage crank needs an offset on one side, you can just add the offset to the other side and substitute a symmetric crankset, so a 116 R+5 bottom bracket can be substituted with a 121 symmetric bottom bracket (120 or 122 would work fine.)

- Don Gillies
Palo Alto, CA, USA


Which makes your tread ( aka "Q") wider.
Deal breaker for some riders.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


The iliac width is why the BB50 has become so common. People's legs do not have to spread so wide and the length of the BB shaft is narrower and consequently stiffer. Average hip breadth is 13" or 33 cm. So the narrower the BB the more angularly correct a pedal spacing would be.

Time for Frank to tell us all that I don't know what I'm talking about.
  #10  
Old September 2nd 19, 02:21 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
JBeattie
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Posts: 4,230
Default 50.4 BCD TA vs. VO

On Sunday, September 1, 2019 at 6:12:14 PM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Friday, August 30, 2019 at 7:49:45 PM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 8/30/2019 9:07 PM, Don Gillies wrote:
If a vintage crank needs an offset on one side, you can just add the offset to the other side and substitute a symmetric crankset, so a 116 R+5 bottom bracket can be substituted with a 121 symmetric bottom bracket (120 or 122 would work fine.)

- Don Gillies
Palo Alto, CA, USA


Which makes your tread ( aka "Q") wider.
Deal breaker for some riders.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


The iliac width is why the BB50 has become so common. People's legs do not have to spread so wide and the length of the BB shaft is narrower and consequently stiffer. Average hip breadth is 13" or 33 cm. So the narrower the BB the more angularly correct a pedal spacing would be.

Time for Frank to tell us all that I don't know what I'm talking about.


BB50? What's that? My BB30, BB86 and BB90 bikes all have Shimano cranks with the identical tread or Q-factor. Same Q-factor as my threaded BB/outboard bearing Shimano equipped bikes.

-- Jay Beattie.

-- Jay Beattie.
 




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