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#21
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Flat Bar Road Bikes with Low Step-Over, i.e Mixte
On 4/25/2015 10:14 AM, jbeattie wrote:
On Friday, April 24, 2015 at 7:18:22 PM UTC-7, Andre Jute wrote: On Friday, April 24, 2015 at 9:57:51 PM UTC+1, Sir Ridesalot wrote: On Friday, April 24, 2015 at 4:26:57 PM UTC-4, Andre Jute wrote: On Friday, April 24, 2015 at 7:15:35 PM UTC+1, sms wrote: The closest thing I could find at an LBS in a non-boutique are is the Fuji Stagger series at Performance, the only one they actually stock is the "Fuji Absolute 1.7 Stagger Women's Flat Bar Road Bike - 2014" http://www.performancebike.com/bikes...74_-1___000000 That bike will cost you more to make it habitable than you save on not buying a proper bike in the first instance. Here's an incomplete list of just some of the larger items you will have to buy extra, that you get on a proper bike like a Gazelle, which doesn't cost all that much mo Mudguards Rack Chain guard Ergonomic handlebars Front Lamp Rear Lamp Wheel with hub dynamo to drive lamps Pump Flatproof tyres Emergency toolkit Bag for tools [SOON] New transmission because the Alivio set is pretty bargain basement and won't last long That thing is an incomplete project, not a bike! I'd still change to a bar like the Velo Orange Tourist http://store.velo-orange.com/index.php/components/handlebars/vo-tourist-handlebar-22-2-dia.html That's a North Road Bar by any other name, with a boutique price. It's very likely made for VO by Kalloy, whose North Road bars I have on all my bikes; I buy them cheap when the local LBSs throw them off when they sell total cycling novices buying a bike on a government scheme an unsuitable bike and then persuade them to fit even more unsuitble "sporting" drop bars. Those bikes end up permanently parked in the garden shed within a week or a fortnight. Kalloy bars are cheap enough and very good; they're found on plenty of upmarket bikes from German and Swiss and Dutch baukasten; my Swiss n'lock came optioned up with a Kalloy North Road bar http://www.thorncycles.co.uk/forums/...26347#msg26347 with a cable inside the handlebar that locks into the n'lock, so it is is a bar of high integrity. Andre Jute El Toro Poo Poo! Many of those items are not needed for casual riding in the daytime. Those items include: Rack Chain guard Ergonomic handlebars Front Lamp Rear Lamp Wheel with hub dynamo to drive lamps Flatproof tyres Some are nice to have but are not neccesities: Pump Emergency toolkit Bag for tools Bicycling does not need to cost a fortune. What's wrong with getting a nice Mixte frame and then building it up with the components you prefer? Seems like a lot of bicyclists should be building bicycles since there's nothing available to suit them. Cheers I think you're several gross short of a full information set, Rideablot. Mrs Scharf commutes to work on that bike, so she needs mudguard and a chainguard so as not to arrive wet, bedraggled and oily. How is she supposed to attacher her briefcase to the bike if there is no rack? How are drivers in cars supposed to see her on winter days if she has no lamps? Etc, etc, point by point. In any event, I wasn't so much making a shopping list for Scharfie as listing the essential facilities you get as standard fittings with a nice Dutch bike for not very much more money, and that cost a tremendous amount of money if you have to buy them piecemeal in the overpriced aftermarket. There's nothing wrong with the bike Scharfie showed us, except if you resent being ripped too much money for too little bike. I'm surprised to find you taking the side of the greedbags who rip unsuspecting cyclists. Andre, it's $350 USD for this: http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/...ed_xi_2100.jpg I agree that it's a little sketchy buying based on a picture (and some specs), but unless its a miniature desk-top model and not a real bike, then he can't go terribly wrong at that price. It will be heavy -- and the parts will not be terribly durable and some may even die an early death, but I'm sure SMS has enough stuff sitting around he house to fix anything that breaks. BTW, the whole bike-culture thing in PDX drives up prices for old bikes. https://portland.craigslist.org/mlt/bik/4991766444.html $245 for an old Raleigh mixte bike -- 12 speed with idiot brakes. You can get an old U08 mixte boat-anchor for less, but not a lot -- and none have a triple. $350 seems like quite a deal. Seems to me there's a lot of over-thinking going on here, based on a dearth of information. We don't know anything much about Mrs. Scharf's commuting. But we were told her previous bike was a "Townie" with a suspension fork. Was that an Electra Townie, or is "townie" used generically? In either case, that hints that she doesn't need anything close to the ultimate commuting machine. There are lots of folks whose commuting is only a couple miles, only in fair weather, never with a load, etc. Almost any bike can handle that. Even if that's not Mrs. Scharf's case, ISTM the choice won't be based on bike capabilities so much as on personal taste and quirks. And in this case, those will be filtered through the personal taste and quirks of Mr. Scharf. Regarding quirks: We all have them. Personally, I enjoy tailoring a bike to my particular tastes, and I enjoy even more doing the same for my ladies. I'd have thought most denizens of r.b.tech would feel the same. So something like the Motobecane might be wonderful, if Scharf were willing to devote a few hours to tailoring it. Heck, even switching to flat bars isn't _that_ hard. (BTW, I believe that most anti-drop-bar opinions come from using drop bars set far too low. If they're raised up and have "interrupter" auxiliary brake levers added, they're as comfortable as flat bars, but more versatile - as on 50 mile rides with headwinds.) -- - Frank Krygowski |
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#22
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Flat Bar Road Bikes with Low Step-Over, i.e Mixte
Frank Krygowski wrote:
(BTW, I believe that most anti-drop-bar opinions come from using drop bars set far too low. If they're raised up and have "interrupter" auxiliary brake levers added, they're as comfortable as flat bars, but more versatile - as on 50 mile rides with headwinds.) Indeed. Put drop bars at a comfortable height and they are way more comfortable than flatbars also for commuting. Flatbars are the work of the devil as Sheldon would say. -- Lou |
#23
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Flat Bar Road Bikes with Low Step-Over, i.e Mixte
On Saturday, April 25, 2015 at 8:40:56 AM UTC-7, Lou Holtman wrote:
Frank Krygowski wrote: (BTW, I believe that most anti-drop-bar opinions come from using drop bars set far too low. If they're raised up and have "interrupter" auxiliary brake levers added, they're as comfortable as flat bars, but more versatile - as on 50 mile rides with headwinds.) Indeed. Put drop bars at a comfortable height and they are way more comfortable than flatbars also for commuting. Flatbars are the work of the devil as Sheldon would say. Gads, coming from a Netherlander! Prepare for the pitch-forks and torches! I had a flat-bar bike for a really short time and didn't like the fixed hand position. I can tolerate it on a mountain bike but not a road bike. It's a personal thing. What makes a good commute bike is very personal and depends on how comfortable a person wants to be, how much maintenance a person wants to do and how much a person wants to spend. My minimum bike must have fenders, pump, patch-kit and room for larger tires during the slippery time of the year. I use a back pack, but if I were commuting with a computer or anything remotely heavy, I'd use a rack and waterproof panniers. I'm not that happy with my current backpack because it soaks through too fast. Also, my commute distances are not that far unless I throw in elective miles, but if I had to ride 10-15 miles each way, I would go with a rack just to let my back vent. -- Jay Beattie. |
#24
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Flat Bar Road Bikes with Low Step-Over, i.e Mixte
On 4/25/2015 7:14 AM, jbeattie wrote:
Andre, it's $350 USD for this: http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/...ed_xi_2100.jpg I agree that it's a little sketchy buying based on a picture (and some specs), but unless its a miniature desk-top model and not a real bike, then he can't go terribly wrong at that price. It will be heavy -- and the parts will not be terribly durable and some may even die an early death, but I'm sure SMS has enough stuff sitting around he house to fix anything that breaks. BTW, the whole bike-culture thing in PDX drives up prices for old bikes. https://portland.craigslist.org/mlt/bik/4991766444.html $245 for an old Raleigh mixte bike -- 12 speed with idiot brakes. You can get an old U08 mixte boat-anchor for less, but not a lot -- and none have a triple. $350 seems like quite a deal. After looking at "Stagger" models from Fuji and Trek, which use lower quality components than the Mirage Sport, but at a higher price, I think this bike will do. 1. She doesn't ride to work in the rain, and we have little rain anyway 2. A chain guard would be nice but I'd have to order one from Europe as they don't sell them in the U.S. 3. Dynamo lights don't cut in on the route she uses to work 4. Fenders are unnecessary 5. Even though it will be heavier than a comparable diamond frame, it will still be much lighter than what she's been riding, a Townie with a ridiculous suspension fork. The Townie was way too heavy for the recreational rides we do, generally only 30-60 miles but often with some hills where even the 8-10# weight reduction will make a big difference. The only modification is a change to upright bars and the appropriate brifters (which apparently I have to order from Chain Reaction in the U.K.). The flat bar brifters for Shimano Sora 3 x 8 are the ST-R225 or ST-R243. The only place I saw them was he http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/us/en/shimano-claris-r243-8sp-brake-gear-shifter/rp-prod112069. Since the Mirage Sport does have the second brake levers on the top it may be okay with the current bars http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/motobecane/images/mirage_sport_mixte_xi/images/IMG_4619.jpg I would have been willing to spring for the Soma Buena Vista but it probably is no lighter than the Motobecane, actually it's probably heavier. One question I have is that I've seen some posts of people using the drop bar brifters on bars like this one http://store.velo-orange.com/index.php/vo-porteur-handlebar-23-8-dia-blk.html which is 23.8mm. How awkward would it be to use drop bar road brifters on this type of handlebar? The brake levers would be okay, but the shifters would end up on the bottom. |
#25
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Flat Bar Road Bikes with Low Step-Over, i.e Mixte
jbeattie wrote:
On Saturday, April 25, 2015 at 8:40:56 AM UTC-7, Lou Holtman wrote: Frank Krygowski wrote: (BTW, I believe that most anti-drop-bar opinions come from using drop bars set far too low. If they're raised up and have "interrupter" auxiliary brake levers added, they're as comfortable as flat bars, but more versatile - as on 50 mile rides with headwinds.) Indeed. Put drop bars at a comfortable height and they are way more comfortable than flatbars also for commuting. Flatbars are the work of the devil as Sheldon would say. Gads, coming from a Netherlander! Prepare for the pitch-forks and torches! I had a flat-bar bike for a really short time and didn't like the fixed hand position. I can tolerate it on a mountain bike but not a road bike. It's a personal thing. What makes a good commute bike is very personal and depends on how comfortable a person wants to be, how much maintenance a person wants to do and how much a person wants to spend. My minimum bike must have fenders, pump, patch-kit and room for larger tires during the slippery time of the year. I use a back pack, but if I were commuting with a computer or anything remotely heavy, I'd use a rack and waterproof panniers. I'm not that happy with my current backpack because it soaks through too fast. Also, my commute distances are not that far unless I throw in elective miles, but if I had to ride 10-15 miles each way, I would go with a rack just to let my back vent. For the back pack I have a Deuter Compact 12 EXP. It has a rain cover but I have only used it once when it rained hard enough that I was worried about infiltration. It seems to have worked. But coming from where you are YMMV. -- duane |
#26
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Flat Bar Road Bikes with Low Step-Over, i.e Mixte
On 4/25/2015 9:11 AM, jbeattie wrote:
On Saturday, April 25, 2015 at 8:40:56 AM UTC-7, Lou Holtman wrote: Frank Krygowski wrote: (BTW, I believe that most anti-drop-bar opinions come from using drop bars set far too low. If they're raised up and have "interrupter" auxiliary brake levers added, they're as comfortable as flat bars, but more versatile - as on 50 mile rides with headwinds.) Indeed. Put drop bars at a comfortable height and they are way more comfortable than flatbars also for commuting. Flatbars are the work of the devil as Sheldon would say. Gads, coming from a Netherlander! Prepare for the pitch-forks and torches! I had a flat-bar bike for a really short time and didn't like the fixed hand position. I can tolerate it on a mountain bike but not a road bike. It's a personal thing. What makes a good commute bike is very personal and depends on how comfortable a person wants to be, how much maintenance a person wants to do and how much a person wants to spend. My minimum bike must have fenders, pump, patch-kit and room for larger tires during the slippery time of the year. I use a back pack, but if I were commuting with a computer or anything remotely heavy, I'd use a rack and waterproof panniers. I'm not that happy with my current backpack because it soaks through too fast. Also, my commute distances are not that far unless I throw in elective miles, but if I had to ride 10-15 miles each way, I would go with a rack just to let my back vent. I am going to encourage her to try the drop bars before I spend the money on the conversion to other bars. But I should point out that "flat bars" is not really what I meant. What I will get if the drop bars don't fly is something like one of these: http://store.velo-orange.com/index.php/components/handlebars/vo-tourist-handlebar-22-2-dia.html http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/us/en/nc-17-trekking-4-5-super-riser-bar/rp-prod15446 |
#27
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Flat Bar Road Bikes with Low Step-Over, i.e Mixte
On 4/25/2015 9:11 AM, jbeattie wrote:
On Saturday, April 25, 2015 at 8:40:56 AM UTC-7, Lou Holtman wrote: Frank Krygowski wrote: (BTW, I believe that most anti-drop-bar opinions come from using drop bars set far too low. If they're raised up and have "interrupter" auxiliary brake levers added, they're as comfortable as flat bars, but more versatile - as on 50 mile rides with headwinds.) Indeed. Put drop bars at a comfortable height and they are way more comfortable than flatbars also for commuting. Flatbars are the work of the devil as Sheldon would say. Gads, coming from a Netherlander! Prepare for the pitch-forks and torches! I had a flat-bar bike for a really short time and didn't like the fixed hand position. I can tolerate it on a mountain bike but not a road bike. It's a personal thing. What makes a good commute bike is very personal and depends on how comfortable a person wants to be, how much maintenance a person wants to do and how much a person wants to spend. My minimum bike must have fenders, pump, patch-kit and room for larger tires during the slippery time of the year. I use a back pack, but if I were commuting with a computer or anything remotely heavy, I'd use a rack and waterproof panniers. I'm not that happy with my current backpack because it soaks through too fast. Also, my commute distances are not that far unless I throw in elective miles, but if I had to ride 10-15 miles each way, I would go with a rack just to let my back vent. Her commute is 8-9 miles about half of which is on a multi-use paved trail with no lighting. Everything she needs fits in a rack-top bag, a pack on the back is not happening. So that means a rear rack. But on the recreational rides we go on we carry enough stuff to make it necessary as well since sometimes there are no convenient places to stop for food, though I try to plan rides with restaurants or stores about half way. I think that a stem that allows more height/reach adjustment so that the drop bars are not too low may be all that is necessary. |
#28
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Flat Bar Road Bikes with Low Step-Over, i.e Mixte
On Saturday, April 25, 2015 at 3:14:36 PM UTC+1, jbeattie wrote:
On Friday, April 24, 2015 at 7:18:22 PM UTC-7, Andre Jute wrote: On Friday, April 24, 2015 at 9:57:51 PM UTC+1, Sir Ridesalot wrote: On Friday, April 24, 2015 at 4:26:57 PM UTC-4, Andre Jute wrote: On Friday, April 24, 2015 at 7:15:35 PM UTC+1, sms wrote: The closest thing I could find at an LBS in a non-boutique are is the Fuji Stagger series at Performance, the only one they actually stock is the "Fuji Absolute 1.7 Stagger Women's Flat Bar Road Bike - 2014" http://www.performancebike.com/bikes...74_-1___000000 That bike will cost you more to make it habitable than you save on not buying a proper bike in the first instance. Here's an incomplete list of just some of the larger items you will have to buy extra, that you get on a proper bike like a Gazelle, which doesn't cost all that much mo Mudguards Rack Chain guard Ergonomic handlebars Front Lamp Rear Lamp Wheel with hub dynamo to drive lamps Pump Flatproof tyres Emergency toolkit Bag for tools [SOON] New transmission because the Alivio set is pretty bargain basement and won't last long That thing is an incomplete project, not a bike! I'd still change to a bar like the Velo Orange Tourist http://store.velo-orange.com/index.php/components/handlebars/vo-tourist-handlebar-22-2-dia.html That's a North Road Bar by any other name, with a boutique price. It's very likely made for VO by Kalloy, whose North Road bars I have on all my bikes; I buy them cheap when the local LBSs throw them off when they sell total cycling novices buying a bike on a government scheme an unsuitable bike and then persuade them to fit even more unsuitble "sporting" drop bars.. Those bikes end up permanently parked in the garden shed within a week or a fortnight. Kalloy bars are cheap enough and very good; they're found on plenty of upmarket bikes from German and Swiss and Dutch baukasten; my Swiss n'lock came optioned up with a Kalloy North Road bar http://www.thorncycles.co.uk/forums/...26347#msg26347 with a cable inside the handlebar that locks into the n'lock, so it is is a bar of high integrity. Andre Jute El Toro Poo Poo! Many of those items are not needed for casual riding in the daytime. Those items include: Rack Chain guard Ergonomic handlebars Front Lamp Rear Lamp Wheel with hub dynamo to drive lamps Flatproof tyres Some are nice to have but are not neccesities: Pump Emergency toolkit Bag for tools Bicycling does not need to cost a fortune. What's wrong with getting a nice Mixte frame and then building it up with the components you prefer? Seems like a lot of bicyclists should be building bicycles since there's nothing available to suit them. Cheers I think you're several gross short of a full information set, Rideablot.. Mrs Scharf commutes to work on that bike, so she needs mudguard and a chainguard so as not to arrive wet, bedraggled and oily. How is she supposed to attacher her briefcase to the bike if there is no rack? How are drivers in cars supposed to see her on winter days if she has no lamps? Etc, etc, point by point. In any event, I wasn't so much making a shopping list for Scharfie as listing the essential facilities you get as standard fittings with a nice Dutch bike for not very much more money, and that cost a tremendous amount of money if you have to buy them piecemeal in the overpriced aftermarket. There's nothing wrong with the bike Scharfie showed us, except if you resent being ripped too much money for too little bike. I'm surprised to find you taking the side of the greedbags who rip unsuspecting cyclists. Andre, it's $350 USD for this: http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/...ed_xi_2100.jpg I agree that it's a little sketchy buying based on a picture (and some specs), but unless its a miniature desk-top model and not a real bike, then he can't go terribly wrong at that price. It will be heavy -- and the parts will not be terribly durable and some may even die an early death, but I'm sure SMS has enough stuff sitting around he house to fix anything that breaks. I was just pointing out that the "nice price" attitude usually ends up costing more than buying a fully-equipped bike in the first instance. Scharfie's always going on about how OEM stuff costs pennies when fitted at the factory but $$$$ when bought in the aftermarket, and it seemed strange that he was falling into that pit to save a few initial bucks. BTW, the whole bike-culture thing in PDX drives up prices for old bikes. https://portland.craigslist.org/mlt/bik/4991766444.html $245 for an old Raleigh mixte bike -- 12 speed with idiot brakes. You can get an old U08 mixte boat-anchor for less, but not a lot -- and none have a triple. $350 seems like quite a deal. Egads! Couple of my pedal pals make a habit of buying garage bikes, which is what we call bikes people buy because it's trendy, ride a few times, and then park in the garage forever. They pay fifty euro a time and the bikes are usually pretty good. When they need replacements or repairs, they just find a new one to buy rather than pay more for parts and labour. Andre Jute |
#29
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Flat Bar Road Bikes with Low Step-Over, i.e Mixte
On Saturday, April 25, 2015 at 1:26:25 PM UTC+1, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
A light-weight rainsuit and a small backpack can turn any bicycle into a great commuter and without the hassle oOn Friday, April 24, 2015 at 10:18:22 PM UTC-4, Andre Jute wrote: On Friday, April 24, 2015 at 9:57:51 PM UTC+1, Sir Ridesalot wrote: On Friday, April 24, 2015 at 4:26:57 PM UTC-4, Andre Jute wrote: On Friday, April 24, 2015 at 7:15:35 PM UTC+1, sms wrote: The closest thing I could find at an LBS in a non-boutique are is the Fuji Stagger series at Performance, the only one they actually stock is the "Fuji Absolute 1.7 Stagger Women's Flat Bar Road Bike - 2014" http://www.performancebike.com/bikes...74_-1___000000 That bike will cost you more to make it habitable than you save on not buying a proper bike in the first instance. Here's an incomplete list of just some of the larger items you will have to buy extra, that you get on a proper bike like a Gazelle, which doesn't cost all that much mo Mudguards Rack Chain guard Ergonomic handlebars Front Lamp Rear Lamp Wheel with hub dynamo to drive lamps Pump Flatproof tyres Emergency toolkit Bag for tools [SOON] New transmission because the Alivio set is pretty bargain basement and won't last long That thing is an incomplete project, not a bike! I'd still change to a bar like the Velo Orange Tourist http://store.velo-orange.com/index.php/components/handlebars/vo-tourist-handlebar-22-2-dia.html That's a North Road Bar by any other name, with a boutique price. It's very likely made for VO by Kalloy, whose North Road bars I have on all my bikes; I buy them cheap when the local LBSs throw them off when they sell total cycling novices buying a bike on a government scheme an unsuitable bike and then persuade them to fit even more unsuitble "sporting" drop bars.. Those bikes end up permanently parked in the garden shed within a week or a fortnight. Kalloy bars are cheap enough and very good; they're found on plenty of upmarket bikes from German and Swiss and Dutch baukasten; my Swiss n'lock came optioned up with a Kalloy North Road bar http://www.thorncycles.co.uk/forums/...26347#msg26347 with a cable inside the handlebar that locks into the n'lock, so it is is a bar of high integrity. Andre Jute El Toro Poo Poo! Many of those items are not needed for casual riding in the daytime. Those items include: Rack Chain guard Ergonomic handlebars Front Lamp Rear Lamp Wheel with hub dynamo to drive lamps Flatproof tyres Some are nice to have but are not neccesities: Pump Emergency toolkit Bag for tools Bicycling does not need to cost a fortune. What's wrong with getting a nice Mixte frame and then building it up with the components you prefer? Seems like a lot of bicyclists should be building bicycles since there's nothing available to suit them. Cheers I think you're several gross short of a full information set, Rideablot.. Mrs Scharf commutes to work on that bike, so she needs mudguard and a chainguard so as not to arrive wet, bedraggled and oily. How is she supposed to attacher her briefcase to the bike if there is no rack? How are drivers in cars supposed to see her on winter days if she has no lamps? Etc, etc, point by point. In any event, I wasn't so much making a shopping list for Scharfie as listing the essential facilities you get as standard fittings with a nice Dutch bike for not very much more money, and that cost a tremendous amount of money if you have to buy them piecemeal in the overpriced aftermarket. There's nothing wrong with the bike Scharfie showed us, except if you resent being ripped too much money for too little bike. I'm surprised to find you taking the side of the greedbags who rip unsuspecting cyclists. Andre Jute A light-weight rainsuit plus a small pack turns ANY bicycle into a commuter and has the advantage of being instantly ready to go or come as you don't need to fiddle with stuff on a rack. I commuted for many years with just such a rig and was happy that all I had to do at my destinations was lock the bike and walk away. Not everyone wants or even needs all those items you listed as neccessities in order to commute by bicycle. Having to get all that stuff or having to spend $ on a bicycle with it mounted already is something that turns a lot of people away from commuting/transportational bicycling. Cheers Rainsuits and backpacks are sweaty and antisocial. Andre Jute |
#30
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Flat Bar Road Bikes with Low Step-Over, i.e Mixte
On Saturday, April 25, 2015 at 1:33:04 PM UTC-4, Duane wrote:
jbeattie wrote: On Saturday, April 25, 2015 at 8:40:56 AM UTC-7, Lou Holtman wrote: Frank Krygowski wrote: (BTW, I believe that most anti-drop-bar opinions come from using drop bars set far too low. If they're raised up and have "interrupter" auxiliary brake levers added, they're as comfortable as flat bars, but more versatile - as on 50 mile rides with headwinds.) Indeed. Put drop bars at a comfortable height and they are way more comfortable than flatbars also for commuting. Flatbars are the work of the devil as Sheldon would say. Gads, coming from a Netherlander! Prepare for the pitch-forks and torches! I had a flat-bar bike for a really short time and didn't like the fixed hand position. I can tolerate it on a mountain bike but not a road bike. It's a personal thing. What makes a good commute bike is very personal and depends on how comfortable a person wants to be, how much maintenance a person wants to do and how much a person wants to spend. My minimum bike must have fenders, pump, patch-kit and room for larger tires during the slippery time of the year. I use a back pack, but if I were commuting with a computer or anything remotely heavy, I'd use a rack and waterproof panniers. I'm not that happy with my current backpack because it soaks through too fast. Also, my commute distances are not that far unless I throw in elective miles, but if I had to ride 10-15 miles each way, I would go with a rack just to let my back vent. For the back pack I have a Deuter Compact 12 EXP. It has a rain cover but I have only used it once when it rained hard enough that I was worried about infiltration. It seems to have worked. But coming from where you are YMMV. -- duane waterproofing the backpack upgrade from garbage bag http://www.seattlefabrics.com/nylons.html best IMHO is a modded pancho covering rider and bag in one throw...a breathable urethane front head and shoulder with a non breathable over the backpack |
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