Bike for 500lb Person?

"Badger_South" wrote in message

On Tue, 26 Oct 2004 18:49:23 -0800,
(Dennis P. Harris) wrote:

On 25 Oct 2004 19:25:39 -0700 in rec.bicycles.misc,
(Chalo) wrote:

That's some ugly sizeist crap there, homie.

no, just the unvarnished truth. obese people need to lose
weight, and most of them eat far too much, in part because their
endocrine system has been screwed up since they were children,
usually by parents overfeeding them.

i have a number of friends who had very successful outcomes from
stapling, and one who died from complications. his family (two
siblings had already been stapled) and his docs all said that if
he hadn't had the operation, he would have died anyway from
diabetes and heart failure within a year or two.

and get off that "sizeist" crap. obese people are sick, and need
to either slow or stop their eating as well as exercise to get
their disease under control.


I'm not exactly obese, 34" waist, 225lbs, but as a scientist, here's
what I think of your comment.

-pl0nk-

In what way is what he said wrong, much less deserving of plonking?

--

A: Top-posters.
Q: What is the most annoying thing on Usenet?

On Wed, 27 Oct 2004 14:01:20 +1000, "DRS"
wrote:

and get off that "sizeist" crap. obese people are sick, and need
to either slow or stop their eating as well as exercise to get
their disease under control.


I'm not exactly obese, 34" waist, 225lbs, but as a scientist, here's
what I think of your comment.

-pl0nk-

In what way is what he said wrong, much less deserving of plonking?

That's not a real plonk. Used with a zero. ;-p

Actually I may have mis-read his 'Obese people are sick', as in well,
they're sick in the head, or pathological in every way.

I thought as someone knows one of the real reason some ppl are obese is
gubmit, sugar lobby pushing various types of sugar, messing up the
'american' diet by insisting upon three meals a day of...uh, sugar?

Breakfast: Sugar pops, or wheaties with two tblspn of sugar.
Lunch: Cocacola moon pie.
Dinner: Ice tea with four heaping tsp of sugar. potato, slather w/gravy,
everything with gravy.
Halloween: huge bag of candy.

My diet from the 50s, 60s.

IOW, if you don't know you're a carb addict, you hate yourself and blame
yourself. I lost this need to 'blame' and my disease was cured. I lost
about 70lbs and regained my girlish figure, thankyou. ;-)

Maybe it was the 'crap'. right before the 'are sick' that seemed
inflammatory.

My bad.

You?

-B

"Badger_South" wrote in message

On Wed, 27 Oct 2004 14:01:20 +1000, "DRS"
wrote:

and get off that "sizeist" crap. obese people are sick, and need
to either slow or stop their eating as well as exercise to get
their disease under control.

I'm not exactly obese, 34" waist, 225lbs, but as a scientist, here's
what I think of your comment.

-pl0nk-

In what way is what he said wrong, much less deserving of plonking?

That's not a real plonk. Used with a zero. ;-p

Actually I may have mis-read his 'Obese people are sick', as in well,
they're sick in the head, or pathological in every way.

Sometimes that's true. Some people are obese because of comfort eating, for
example. But that's not what he said.

[...]

IOW, if you don't know you're a carb addict, you hate yourself and
blame yourself. I lost this need to 'blame' and my disease was cured.
I lost about 70lbs and regained my girlish figure, thankyou. ;-)

Maybe it was the 'crap'. right before the 'are sick' that seemed
inflammatory.

My bad.

You?

I've said in this and other groups before that most people who are fat have
no-one but themselves to blame and I have not the slightest sympathy for
them. They live in denial and only divert sympathy from the minority with
genuine metabolic problems.

--

A: Top-posters.
Q: What is the most annoying thing on Usenet?

On Wed, 27 Oct 2004 14:28:06 +1000, "DRS"
wrote:

I've said in this and other groups before that most people who are fat have
no-one but themselves to blame and I have not the slightest sympathy for
them.

Not to belabor this, but who is this 'most people' of which you speak?

Did you not feel like you were a dumb fsk in denial at any time in your
past? Maybe with no control of your eating? Glad realized the real reason
that you get/got fat was insulin, insulin resistance and NOT that you were
a bad person with no will power? Or that you needed a low fat diet? Or just
told, eat less calories. But you had a craving. Just askin' Maybe you
became a LC expert being naturally fit an trim all the time?

What do you feel about the person in your immediate family that has a
weight problem. Do you ostracize and despiise them, or just hae no sympathy
for them?

Forget this mythical/sweeping generalization, 'most fat ppl', and I say it
not as a FFID, you've seen my pic.

I learned it's about myself, and my loved ones and not all the other FFID
in the world. That's their problem, though I try to cousel when asked about
how I did it, or about sugar and insulin.

Thus, I don't need to hear this guy's 'informed, or uninformed' comments
causing him to make a comment I described.

Do you think he's up on the IR biochem and saying essentially butch up, as
informed as you are, or just spewing, thinking that them sick fatties
should just quit eating all that fat. LOL.

I'm eager to hear his success story and how he treats his overweight
mother, aunt, neice, etc. so forget plonk, then.

-B

(Fx199) wrote:

Pat in Tx wrote:

This is another example that is misleading. On your figurative bike with 4
riders, their combined weight is not centralized over the crank. Spreading
out the weight changes the dynamics of their weight on the frame. If you
have to resort to idiotic examples like these two, you are not adding
anything to the problem---just trying to attack everybody else who IS trying
to help. Why don't you put forth something positive instead?

Pat in TX

Dear "no-archive" Pat in Tx,

If you were less oblivious, you'd have noticed that an identical
original post was placed in the rec.bicycles.tech forum-- and that the
most comprehensive, detailed, and contextually informed advice came
from me. But you clearly didn't bother to look into it. If you go
read my postings there, you'll see that your arguments about me not
contributing in this matter are mistaken.

My replies here in r.b.misc were to posters who were being insulting
and demeaning, not helpful as you suggest. If somebody were to post
to a shoe newsgroup saying "I have size 17 feet and I can't find any
shoes that fit", and he got replies saying that he shouldn't wear
shoes, that his feet were simply too big and posed a hazard to himself
and others, I hope you could see that those replies would be
unhelpful. Furthermore, I expect that you could see that those who
posted such replies were being jerks.

That is what is happening here, but since the person in question is
assumed to be obese, ordinary principles of civility do not apply.
Fatness is so widely and ignorantly reviled that even people who
recognize and refrain from expressions of racism, misogyny,
homophobia, classism, etc., feel completely entitled to be rude and
hateful to fat people.

For all anybody here knows, the 500-pound fellow in question may be
built like the late Serge Reding, who would have weighed a similar
amount had he been 6'2" tall like the person in question:

http://users.pandora.be/tom.goegebue...ing%20C%20.jpg

or http://tinyurl.com/6slvk

Yet their deeply-ingrained categorical hatred of fat people allows
them to be nasty and inconsiderate despite their ignorance, and even
feel self-righteous about it. I have done nothing besides taking
exception to their arrogance and presumption, and pointing it out to
them. If this looks like "attack" to you, I must question whether you
have the capacity to see unwarranted derogation of fat folks for what
it is.

Chalo's self loathing surfaces itself in everything he writes.

On the contrary, Fx199, I take no small amount of pride in being more
than twice the size and strength of a mundane man, though this is a
lucky accident of nature rather than a result of my own efforts.

I can take a more direct sort of satisfaction in the fact that unlike
you, I possess a useful amount of mental and physical courage, and
that I am in possession of my wits to a degree that you most likely
lack even the capacity to recognize. However, this by itself is no
special accomplishment, because it is plain (and fortunate) that
practcally anybody has sufficient virtue and intellect to outclass
you!

I am confident enough that I will not embarass myself with any
Fx199-type flatulations that I post under my very own name. I even
allow my postings to be archived for future reference, as opposed to,
say, an anonymous "Pat" in Texas.

Chalo Colina

(Fx199) wrote:

I was gonna say the exact same thing. You'd have a heart atack before you'd get
close enough to catch me, and I'd put a bullet in your head before i'd let you
lay a hand on me.

A characteristically astounding display of rhetorical mastery by Fx199! Bravo!

Chalo Colina

On 26 Oct 2004 22:21:23 -0700, (Chalo) wrote:

(Fx199) wrote:

I was gonna say the exact same thing. You'd have a heart atack before you'd get
close enough to catch me, and I'd put a bullet in your head before i'd let you
lay a hand on me.

A characteristically astounding display of rhetorical mastery by Fx199! Bravo!

Chalo Colina

Gawd, glad I plonked this FX moron a long time ago. Let's quote him less
why don't we, so uh, don' t have to see homicidal threats...

-B
;-)

"Badger_South" wrote in message

On Wed, 27 Oct 2004 14:28:06 +1000, "DRS"
wrote:

I've said in this and other groups before that most people who are
fat have no-one but themselves to blame and I have not the
slightest sympathy for them.

Not to belabor this, but who is this 'most people' of which you speak?

Um, most fat people?

Did you not feel like you were a dumb fsk in denial at any time in
your past? Maybe with no control of your eating? Glad realized the
real reason that you get/got fat was insulin, insulin resistance and
NOT that you were a bad person with no will power? Or that you needed
a low fat diet? Or just told, eat less calories. But you had a
craving. Just askin' Maybe you became a LC expert being naturally fit
an trim all the time?

I control my weight through diet and exercise. I have never allowed myself
to become obese.

What do you feel about the person in your immediate family that has a
weight problem. Do you ostracize and despiise them, or just hae no
sympathy for them?

Forget this mythical/sweeping generalization, 'most fat ppl', and I
say it not as a FFID, you've seen my pic.

No, most fat people are fat because they eat too much and exercise too
little. All the rest is just detail.

I learned it's about myself, and my loved ones and not all the other
FFID in the world. That's their problem, though I try to cousel when
asked about how I did it, or about sugar and insulin.

But it's not just their problem. If it was maybe we could just leave them
to it but it simply isn't so. Obesity is a direct cause of many health
problems and that impacts on the whole community.

Thus, I don't need to hear this guy's 'informed, or uninformed'
comments causing him to make a comment I described.

Do you think he's up on the IR biochem and saying essentially butch
up, as informed as you are, or just spewing, thinking that them sick
fatties should just quit eating all that fat. LOL.

I think you should go back and reread what he actually said. I think you're
over-reacting to it.

--

A: Top-posters.
Q: What is the most annoying thing on Usenet?

(Dennis P. Harris) wrote:

(Chalo) wrote:

That's some ugly sizeist crap there, homie.

no, just the unvarnished truth. obese people need to lose
weight, and most of them eat far too much, in part because their
endocrine system has been screwed up since they were children,
usually by parents overfeeding them.

For the moment I'll put aside the fact that many "morbidly obese"
people are in fact reasonably healthy, and focus on the unhealthy
people you're talking about.

I question your assumption that their obesity is the root cause of
their problems and is the part that should receive treatment first.
If the relevant health issues are diabetes and heart disease, then the
success of treatment should be evaluated by its effect on those
things, not the patient's BMI.

Exercise will help both those maladies independently of any associated
weight loss. Weight-loss surgery by itself can only cause a
deterioration of a fat person's health even if it succeeds in reducing
his or her body weight.

i have a number of friends who had very successful outcomes from
stapling, and one who died from complications. his family (two
siblings had already been stapled) and his docs all said that if
he hadn't had the operation, he would have died anyway from
diabetes and heart failure within a year or two.

Better that he went to the doctor to be "put down"? One would think
this would be enough to convince you of your folly. Damaging vital
organs is not a means to effect general health. _That_ is the truth
that's so effectively illustrated by weight-loss surgery's death toll.

and get off that "sizeist" crap. obese people are sick, and need
to either slow or stop their eating as well as exercise to get
their disease under control.

According to the BMI, I am "morbidly obese". But in fact there's
nothing morbid about me. I have a healthy vegetarian + fish diet, I
ride bike frequently, I have a job requiring me to use my strength,
and nobody who knows me thinks I look unhealthy. In fact, most folks
who venture a guess (including the last doctor I saw) think I'm 100
lbs. lighter than I am, simply because they don't understand that
someone who weighs almost 400 lbs. can look quite normal and lead an
active life. Admittedly I don't cut a fashionable figure, but being
unfashionable is not the same as being afflicted with a
life-threatening illness for which I should consider elective
disembowelment.

You seem to credit obesity with causing health problems. I believe
that the relevant data show otherwise-- that obesity by itself is
benign, but it can be one of the many symptoms of an unhealthy
lifestyle or a serious metabolic disorder. _The Obesity Myth_ by Paul
Campos cites an abundance of scientific data to the effect that
obesity is not a noteworthy health risk in its own right.

It seems clear to me that treating a genuine illness like diabetes or
atherosclerosis should not require rearranging one's entrails to
permanently malfunction. Bariatric surgery goes along with
AIDS-related complex, metastatic carcinoma, and lethal doses of
ionizing radiation-- all things that _will_ cause you to lose weight,
but are in themselves harmful to your health.

Chalo Colina

On Wed, 27 Oct 2004 17:28:43 +1000, "DRS"
wrote:


I control my weight through diet and exercise. I have never allowed myself
to become obese.

Oh, you've never been overfat and met the clinical defo of 'obese'? I
thought you were a LC fan because of a weight problem in the past and
corrected it with the LC ketogenic diet, and lost a lot of weight.

Sorry for my confusion or mixup..

-B