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Racks is racks, right?
(# 47 in our continuing series of dumb questions)
The lovely and talented Mrs Squirrel has requested that I buy for her one of Nashbar's Toto Quick Release Front Basket http://www.nashbar.com/profile.cfm?sku=15232 for her cruiser. I reckon that while I'm ordering from them I might as well get a rear rack for the low-gear cruiser I'm building up from my old Specialized Sirrus. Nashbar lists eight or so aluminum rear bike racks from the likes of Blackburn, Delta, Bor Yeuh, Sunlight, and Ascent. Near as I can determine from my lifetime of LBS visits and online catalog viewings is that these things are pretty about the same to the fellow that's only going to strap on a small parcel of stuff gotten from the farmer's market. IOW, hardly a life or death matter -- just toss a dart? -- Mike "Rocket J Squirrel" |
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#2
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Racks is racks, right?
"Mike Rocket J Squirrel" wrote in message
... (# 47 in our continuing series of dumb questions) The lovely and talented Mrs Squirrel has requested that I buy for her one of Nashbar's Toto Quick Release Front Basket http://www.nashbar.com/profile.cfm?sku=15232 for her cruiser. I reckon that while I'm ordering from them I might as well get a rear rack for the low-gear cruiser I'm building up from my old Specialized Sirrus. Nashbar lists eight or so aluminum rear bike racks from the likes of Blackburn, Delta, Bor Yeuh, Sunlight, and Ascent. Near as I can determine from my lifetime of LBS visits and online catalog viewings is that these things are pretty about the same to the fellow that's only going to strap on a small parcel of stuff gotten from the farmer's market. IOW, hardly a life or death matter -- just toss a dart? There are some crap ones about, so you need to apply a little caution. Our Bor Yeuh blackburn clones have been fine - decent cheap racks, but all that says is that it's not a brand to run away from. Need to look at the actual rack to see if it suits. Things to consider: Triangulation - blackburn got this one right. One of the sets of stays comes in closer to the middle of the rack than the rest, making it a much more rigid structure. Having the stays all in a line isn't as good - I think the ascent basic rack may have that problem. Pannier falling in wheel - putting a bend in the rearmost stay to help hold floppy panniers from the back wheel can be very useful - eg as on the bor yeuh urban rear rack or the ascent basic one. Rear light mount - the plate with the 50 or 80mm holes gives an excellent mount for a light. See eg the sunlight or the ascent. (blimey, they're cheap - 10 quid for a rack is nothing). If I were going posh for long touring, something steel would probably get fitted. But for around-town hack work, the cheap ones will do. Pity can only seem to get 2 out of the 3 things in the ones I can see there :-( I'd look at the sunlight first, then probably just get the one I've got already. cheers, clive |
#3
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Racks is racks, right?
Mike Rocket J Squirrel wrote:
(# 47 in our continuing series of dumb questions) The lovely and talented Mrs Squirrel has requested that I buy for her one of Nashbar's Toto Quick Release Front Basket http://www.nashbar.com/profile.cfm?sku=15232 for her cruiser. I reckon that while I'm ordering from them I might as well get a rear rack for the low-gear cruiser I'm building up from my old Specialized Sirrus. Nashbar lists eight or so aluminum rear bike racks from the likes of Blackburn, Delta, Bor Yeuh, Sunlight, and Ascent. Near as I can determine from my lifetime of LBS visits and online catalog viewings is that these things are pretty about the same to the fellow that's only going to strap on a small parcel of stuff gotten from the farmer's market. IOW, hardly a life or death matter -- just toss a dart? Wrong. There are a bunch of considerations in rear racks that you don't realize until you try to mount it and use it. Fortunately, there's a great web page that examines these issues. Go over to "http://www.bicycleluggageracks.com/". Wow that guy knows a lot about racks! The Bor Yueh that Nashbar currently offers doesn't have a light bracket (the older model they offered does have one, see "http://www.nashbar.com/profile.cfm?category=&subcategory=&brand=5278&sku= 17030"). It also doesn't support brake bolt mounting, which doesn't matter if you have braze-ons for a rack mount, and long enough brackets. I made brackets to use a Bor Yueh on one bike, see "http://nordicgroup.us/rearracks/rackimages/IMG_0271.JPG". The Sunlight lacks the dog leg strut, though if you're not ever using panniers then it's no problem. The Ascent isn't adjustable height, though this may not be an issue to you. It does have the dogleg strut. The Blackburn lacks a dogleg strut and a reflector bracket. Always get a rack that's triple strut. Never buy one without a light/reflector bracket. If you have disc brakes then you need to get a rack designed to work with disc brakes. If you have rear suspension then you need to get a rack designed to work with rear suspension. Ensure that it actually can be mounted on the bike in question. which unfortunately isn't a given. I tried three racks I had in storage on my wife's new bike and none would work. The Bor Yueh was too far forward and the seat hit it when the suspension kicked in, no matter how low I mounted it. An REI rack didn't have long enough brackets, though I could have ordered some longer brackets from a third party and made it work. There was some problem with a Delta rack, I think it was too high, and the height wasn't adjustable. I'm waiting for a Nashbar order with the Sunlite rack that may work with brake bolt mounting. Hybrid bikes can be especially problematic because usually the brackets supplied with the rack are too short. I end up fabricating a brake bolt mounting bracket from aluminum to mount the rack level. There are photos on that web site. Here's an excerpt from "http://www.bicycleluggageracks.com/": Rack Design Considerations Materials --------- As with bicycle frames, the best material for racks is chromium-molybdenum steel tubing (aka "Cro-Mo"). Unfortunately, as with bicycle frames, the trend is to use much less expensive aluminum. There are still some high end racks made out of 4130 Cro-Mo, including ones from Tubus and Robert Beckman, but you'll pay a high price for these racks. For the ultimate in long term durability without paint damage, a couple of manufacturers offer stainless steel racks. For heavily loaded touring the Cro-Mo racks represent a worthwhile expenditure. Mounting System to Seat Stays ----------------------------- The better racks have a seat stay mounting system that doesn't require bending of flat brackets to match the seat stays. The brackets should be adjustable in width (to match different widths of seat stays) as well as pivoting up and down (to match different heights of seat stays) and rotating (to match different angles of seat stays). Seat Stay Bracket Length ------------------------ The brackets that come with many (or most) racks are too short for a lot of hybrid bicycles. See Extended Seat Stay Brackets for information on how to solve this problem. Platform Length --------------- The longer the platform length, the further back panniers can be positioned, increasing heel clearance. However some racks with 33 cm platforms, such as the REI rack, are positioned further back from the seat stays, so the shorter platform is sufficient. Reflector/Light Bracket ----------------------- Many racks have a mount for a reflector or tail light, though many lack this feature. It can be quite a pain in the butt to add a reflector/light bracket so if you need to be mounting a light to the rack don't buy a rack without this feature. Triangulation ------------- Long struts on a rack increase the side-to-side sway when fully loaded. On a rack with triangulation, one or more of the pairs of struts angle inward. This makes the rack more stable in terms of side to side sway. Struts that cross each other and are welded together also provide triangulation of sorts to reduce sway. Strut Design ------------ For use with panniers, the "dog leg" rear strut is essential as it prevents the pannier from knocking into the rear wheel when the pannier is mounted toward the rear of the rack. Also, avoid single strut racks. Three struts are preferable for heavy loads (i.e. touring with panniers), while two struts are sufficient for lighter loads. Side Rail Design ---------------- The side rails should never be stacked where the support struts are welded (or bolted) to the top platform. Double rails make it difficult or impossible to mount certain types of panniers. It's especially important that there be no double rails near the rear of the rack. Capacity -------- The amount of weight that the rack is designed to carry. A fully loaded tourist could easily be carrying 50 pounds (22kg) of gear. Some of these racks can carry considerably more than this. Weight ------ The sturdier racks have extra struts which can increase the weight by a couple of hundred grams. The racks that use Cro-Mo are lighter because they are able to use smaller diameter tubing which more than makes up for the difference between the weight of steel and aluminum. Hope this helps, Steve "http://www.bicycleluggageracks.com/" |
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Racks is racks, right?
"SMS" wrote in message
... Couple of issues with your web page - mostly sane, but: As with bicycle frames, the best material for racks is chromium-molybdenum steel tubing (aka "Cro-Mo"). cough Ping jim beam. Al racks are fine. The nice steel ones are sturdy and repairable, but you pay for that. Cheap Al racks can last an awfully long time... Many racks have a mount for a reflector or tail light, though many lack this feature. It can be quite a pain in the butt to add a reflector/light bracket so if you need to be mounting a light to the rack don't buy a rack without this feature. Not necessarily as important as that - lights can be mounted, though the proper one is rather nicer than a bodge. For use with panniers, the "dog leg" rear strut is essential as it prevents the pannier from knocking into the rear wheel when the pannier is mounted toward the rear of the rack. Again, not necessarily essential. Pannier design is relevant here - some can flop, others won't. The sturdier racks have extra struts which can increase the weight by a couple of hundred grams. The racks that use Cro-Mo are lighter because they are able to use smaller diameter tubing which more than makes up for the difference between the weight of steel and aluminum. Posh steel racks typically use larger diameter tubing than eg blackburn racks. Cheap steel racks don't, but they're nasty anyway. |
#5
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Racks is racks, right?
On Sep 17, 3:50*pm, Mike Rocket J Squirrel
wrote: (# 47 in our continuing series of dumb questions) The lovely and talented Mrs Squirrel has requested that I buy for her one of Nashbar's Toto Quick Release Front Baskethttp://www.nashbar.com/profile.cfm?sku=15232for her cruiser. I reckon that while I'm ordering from them I might as well get a rear rack for the low-gear cruiser I'm building up from my old Specialized Sirrus. Nashbar lists eight or so aluminum rear bike racks from the likes of Blackburn, Delta, Bor Yeuh, Sunlight, and Ascent. Near as I can determine from my lifetime of LBS visits and online catalog viewings is that these things are pretty about the same to the fellow that's only going to strap on a small parcel of stuff gotten from the farmer's market. *IOW, hardly a life or death matter -- just toss a dart? -- Mike "Rocket J Squirrel" For just pottering around with a rack pack and maybe some groceries, a light alloy rack will do just fine; I got high-quality ones as original equipment with both my current bikes and neither shows any wear after c3kKm. Just inspect the structure (triangulation is good!) and the fixings of the cheaper ones as best you can in the photographs. For heavier duty, like touring, get a steel rack or an alloy rack from a recognized maker like Blackburn; Blackburn appears to be the second choice for the Thorn touring bikes (after their own more expensive rack) and I'm always impressed with the good sense of Andy Blance's component selections. I had a Blackburn rack, particular model lost in the mists of time (or never noted -- I just took what the LBS insisted on "because if I let you take something cheaper, you'll bitch about it forever"), for more than a decade; fit and and forget for the rest of the bike's life or your life, probably. It took a lot of abuse, like having a six-foot bookcase lashed to it. For serious touring, buy a big, heavy Tubus rack; for show down at the latte shoppe buy a stainless steel flyweight Tubus Luna; I bought a Luna (a stainless Fly) for my experiments with the geribike and was pleasantly surprised at how capable something so light and lacey was but I like the "proper" alloy racks on my other bikes (from the design probably made by Tortec for the bike manufacturers) so much better that I've already given the Fly to a young lady for her bike. Problem with Tubus is that it is expensive; I don't have wide enough experience of the other brands to judge whether the extra expense is justified. (Carriage is so expensive here that sometimes I buy stuff much more expensive than I need because I'm already ordering something essential from the vendor, and then the carriage hit already necessitated makes extravagances like the Luna cheap enough not to look quite so stupid, even when it proves nice but not a keeper.) A note on the use of a rack: I, and almost everyone I see on the road with a rack, use a rack pack either permanently or semi-permanently attached to the rack. Thus the "lacey" Tubus Fly/Luna are perfectly good enough because the rackback provides a base. If you think about the above par, I am really surprised that no one offers a hard rackbox with a couple of legs attached at each side for fixing to the eyelets and keeping panniers off the wheels. The whole assembly could easily be lighter than a separate rack and a soft bag (those racktop bags are *heavy* even when empty), and the hard sides of the racktop case would stiffen it enough to make the pannier sides/ support struts much lighter and/or fewer. Nor is there any reason the rear mudguard (fender) needs separate struts to the rack. The modern bicycle is in an awful, ununified mess. It isn't so much built of discrete components as thrown together by a rack of parts that fell over. Andre Jute Open-eyed wonder http://members.lycos.co.uk/fiultra/B...20CYCLING.html |
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Racks is racks, right?
On Sep 17, 7:50 am, Mike Rocket J Squirrel
wrote: (# 47 in our continuing series of dumb questions) I reckon that while I'm ordering from them I might as well get a rear rack for the low-gear cruiser I'm building up from my old Specialized Sirrus. Nashbar lists eight or so aluminum rear bike racks from the likes of Blackburn, Delta, Bor Yeuh, Sunlight, and Ascent. Near as I can determine from my lifetime of LBS visits and online catalog viewings is that these things are pretty about the same to the fellow that's only going to strap on a small parcel of stuff gotten from the farmer's market. IOW, hardly a life or death matter -- just toss a dart? My beer bike came with a cheap-o rack (one of those racks with the integral spring-loaded clamp) from the previous owner. The first time I swung my leg over the bike, the spring on that rack tore clear through my pants and scratched my leg (that hurt!) Considering this, it is at least remotely possible that the choice of rack could conceivably be a matter of life or death (and this wasn't even a crash). Needless to say, I removed that rack straightaway (and all other extraneous garbage). I have an old (non-adjustable) Blackburn on my commuter (also came with bike as above). The mechanic at LBS said it isn't the right one for the bike (not level), but the mounts fit and it works okay with the Nashbar Trunk Bag that I got this summer. |
#7
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Racks is racks, right?
Clive George wrote:
"SMS" wrote in message ... Couple of issues with your web page - mostly sane, but: As with bicycle frames, the best material for racks is chromium-molybdenum steel tubing (aka "Cro-Mo"). cough Ping jim beam. LOL. I'd have to un-filter him first, and that would affect my current campaign to eliminate clueless people from my Usenet groups. Al racks are fine. The nice steel ones are sturdy and repairable, but you pay for that. Cheap Al racks can last an awfully long time... Yeah, maybe I didn't make that clear. I fixed it. Many racks have a mount for a reflector or tail light, though many lack this feature. It can be quite a pain in the butt to add a reflector/light bracket so if you need to be mounting a light to the rack don't buy a rack without this feature. Not necessarily as important as that - lights can be mounted, though the proper one is rather nicer than a bodge. I've made light brackets and they really are a kludge. It's usually not just a simple L bracket. Since the bends are sharp, you can't use aluminum flat bar. It end up being bolted on through the top plate, if there is a top plate, or bend around the rear rail if there is no top plate. Something so simple to include on a rack should be included. And of course not many people want to make everything such a big project. I did find a source for light brackets for racks with top plates, and a source for racks without top plates and I added them to the web site. Unfortunately the latter is not sold in the U.S.. For use with panniers, the "dog leg" rear strut is essential as it prevents the pannier from knocking into the rear wheel when the pannier is mounted toward the rear of the rack. Again, not necessarily essential. Pannier design is relevant here - some can flop, others won't. Well even panniers with solid inserts can be a problem. The whole pannier rotates into the back of the back wheel if the pannier is mounted far back. That's the problem I have even with some allegedly high end panniers. If I mount the pannier so it's centered over the center strut then it's okay in terms of flopping, but my foot hits it. If I adjust the top rail mounts, and move it back, then it flops into the wheel. Fortunately, there are a lot more dogleg racks on the market these days. |
#8
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Racks is racks, right?
Mike Rocket J Squirrel wrote:
(# 47 in our continuing series of dumb questions) The lovely and talented Mrs Squirrel has requested that I buy for her one of Nashbar's Toto Quick Release Front Basket http://www.nashbar.com/profile.cfm?sku=15232 for her cruiser. I reckon that while I'm ordering from them I might as well get a rear rack for the low-gear cruiser I'm building up from my old Specialized Sirrus. Nashbar lists eight or so aluminum rear bike racks from the likes of Blackburn, Delta, Bor Yeuh, Sunlight, and Ascent. Is this the old drop bar road bike Sirrus ("http://bicyclecoffeesystems.com/") or the newer flat-bar Sirrus which is completely different? I received the Nashbar Sunlite rack today, and I added the missing specs to my web site. It looks pretty good for $17 (and it just went up to $17, I paid $15 minus 15% discount so they were around $12.25 each). The wholesale cost to the distributor was probably about $3 FOB. There's no reason that racks should be costing $50 or more. My spousal unit just demanded a QR basket as well, but she didn't like the wicker, preferring a more modern style, "http://www.amazon.com/Topeak-TB2001-Front-Bicycle-Basket/dp/B000FIAU3E". I couldn't find it locally. There seems to be a huge bicycle basket shortage to go with the bicycle shortage. Steve "http://www.bicycleluggageracks.com/" |
#9
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Racks is racks, right?
On Sep 17, 10:50 pm, Mike Rocket J Squirrel
wrote: (# 47 in our continuing series of dumb questions) The lovely and talented Mrs Squirrel has requested that I buy for her one of Nashbar's Toto Quick Release Front Baskethttp://www.nashbar.com/profile.cfm?sku=15232for her cruiser. I reckon that while I'm ordering from them I might as well get a rear rack for the low-gear cruiser I'm building up from my old Specialized Sirrus. Nashbar lists eight or so aluminum rear bike racks from the likes of Blackburn, Delta, Bor Yeuh, Sunlight, and Ascent. Near as I can determine from my lifetime of LBS visits and online catalog viewings is that these things are pretty about the same to the fellow that's only going to strap on a small parcel of stuff gotten from the farmer's market. IOW, hardly a life or death matter -- just toss a dart? The Bor Yeuh rack is strong and rigid. I've had three of 'em. I've hauled stuff on them way past their capacity, had a car clip one of them, bent it back--and continued to abuse it, with no problems. They're sorta the Alex rims of racks--no respect, but good stuff. If I was going into the Hindu Kush--I'd get a cromo rack--but till then, I'm a Bor Yeuh man, through and through. Especially for $18. |
#10
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Racks is racks, right?
landotter wrote:
If I was going into the Hindu Kush--I'd get a cromo rack--but till then, I'm a Bor Yeuh man, through and through. Especially for $18. I've had no problems with Bor Yueh, but Nashbar dropped the rack with a light/reflector bracket "http://www.nashbar.com/profile.cfm?category=&subcategory=&brand=5278&sku= 17030" and now only has one without the bracket. "http://www.nashbar.com/profile.cfm?category=&subcategory=&brand=60005278& sku=17025" I think that I was a Bor Yueh man, but that I decided to switch rather than fight. |
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