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#21
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Octalink ES25 replacement?
On 2017-08-12 06:54, Tosspot wrote:
On 11/08/17 22:04, Joerg wrote: On 2017-08-11 12:39, AMuzi wrote: On 8/11/2017 1:00 PM, Joerg wrote: The BB on my MTB makes a ticking sound when warmed up, sounds similar to a hot car engine after it is turned off. It has also develoved an ever so slight play, just a few mils. It is an Shimano ES25 Octalink. How long do you guys let that go before replacing? Can anyone recommend a better quality BB for this that lasts longer than 5k miles and doesn't cost an arm and a leg? Ensure the arms are not loose on the spindle first. They are on tight. The play is also a bit sideways. If I keep riding will it just become gradually worse or can it fail catastrophically in the middle of nowhere? On my last Shimano 600 BB I rode until it had about 0.1" play in the largest chain ring and shifting trim became iffy (old friction shifter bike). But that was an ajustable BB where I could milk out a second life by mounting the cranks 180 degrees rotated. What I don't like on these newfangled BBs is the left side plastic cup. For the road bike I got a UN-55, only aluminum on the left but at least not plastic. The UN-55 is the Canine Wobblers of BBs imho. Cottered, Octalink, Outboard, have all failed me over the years, but never a UN-55. I researched a bit on durability and also came up with the UN-55 which I have now installed in my 1982 road bike. However, the UN-55 is square taper and my MTB has Deore M522 cranks which are Octalink. ... Ok, they do eventually wear out with year long commuting, but I reckon on 10-15k miles. That said, the last was on the 10K side of things. Bit disappointed tbh, but the Shimano outboard ones I used to change annually and I had stability issues with the Octalink. That said, I still do have one Octalink, and it seems ok and 3k miles, but them's is dry miles... My rides are mostly also dry but lots of dust, rock hits into the cranks, pedals and my feet, plus the occasional creek crossing and rainy ride. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ |
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#23
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Octalink ES25 replacement?
On 12/08/17 16:14, Joerg wrote:
snip I might be able to live with a 3mm chain line offset (have to check the M591 front derailer though) but the other issue is that they supposedly only fit older Shimano crank sets because of the 9mm splines: https://www.excelsports.com/main.asp...or=1&minor= 6 The cranks have to go on super-snug because I am a low cadence masher and often ride with a substantial load on the bike. I would be very wary of 3mm. It may work with a dérailleur setup but on my hub gears it needs to be the right side of 2mm or aggro ensues. |
#24
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Octalink ES25 replacement?
On 2017-08-12 08:21, Tosspot wrote:
On 12/08/17 16:14, Joerg wrote: snip I might be able to live with a 3mm chain line offset (have to check the M591 front derailer though) but the other issue is that they supposedly only fit older Shimano crank sets because of the 9mm splines: https://www.excelsports.com/main.asp...or=1&minor= 6 The cranks have to go on super-snug because I am a low cadence masher and often ride with a substantial load on the bike. I would be very wary of 3mm. It may work with a dérailleur setup but on my hub gears it needs to be the right side of 2mm or aggro ensues. Yes, I'd also prefer an exact match. Those 10-speed deals are really fickle but the more serious MTBs in 2014 weren't available with the good old 7-speed anymore. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ |
#25
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Octalink ES25 replacement?
On Saturday, August 12, 2017 at 7:14:21 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-08-12 07:03, wrote: On Friday, August 11, 2017 at 11:56:37 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote: On 2017-08-11 11:48, wrote: On Friday, August 11, 2017 at 11:00:27 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote: The BB on my MTB makes a ticking sound when warmed up, sounds similar to a hot car engine after it is turned off. It has also develoved an ever so slight play, just a few mils. It is an Shimano ES25 Octalink. How long do you guys let that go before replacing? Can anyone recommend a better quality BB for this that lasts longer than 5k miles and doesn't cost an arm and a leg? http://www.ebay.com/itm/Shimano-BB-5....c100506.m3226 Cost three times what the ES25 does and I've never had one fail. $40 is perfectly ok. Unfortunately their available spindle lengths do not fit the ES25. ES300 has very close to the same spindle lengths, I just don't know whether they are any better than ES25. I believe that the widest available in the ES-25 is 121. The 5500 is available in a 118 and it's my guess that it would fit right on. I might be able to live with a 3mm chain line offset (have to check the M591 front derailer though) but the other issue is that they supposedly only fit older Shimano crank sets because of the 9mm splines: https://www.excelsports.com/main.asp...or=1&minor= 6 The cranks have to go on super-snug because I am a low cadence masher and often ride with a substantial load on the bike. Since this is a road bike BB it's likely that half of the difference is on the left side. |
#26
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Octalink ES25 replacement?
On Saturday, August 12, 2017 at 11:50:32 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-08-12 08:21, Tosspot wrote: On 12/08/17 16:14, Joerg wrote: snip I might be able to live with a 3mm chain line offset (have to check the M591 front derailer though) but the other issue is that they supposedly only fit older Shimano crank sets because of the 9mm splines: https://www.excelsports.com/main.asp...or=1&minor= 6 The cranks have to go on super-snug because I am a low cadence masher and often ride with a substantial load on the bike. I would be very wary of 3mm. It may work with a dérailleur setup but on my hub gears it needs to be the right side of 2mm or aggro ensues. Yes, I'd also prefer an exact match. Those 10-speed deals are really fickle but the more serious MTBs in 2014 weren't available with the good old 7-speed anymore. To tell you the truth, if it were up to me I'd still be riding 8 speeds. Hell, you always shift twice on a 10 speed so it's really a waste of time to have it. But you can't get any new parts such as cassettes in good ratios so I'm stuck with 10 speeds. They did the same damn thing with me with 9 speed parts. |
#27
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Octalink ES25 replacement?
On 2017-08-12 12:14, wrote:
On Saturday, August 12, 2017 at 11:50:32 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote: On 2017-08-12 08:21, Tosspot wrote: On 12/08/17 16:14, Joerg wrote: snip I might be able to live with a 3mm chain line offset (have to check the M591 front derailer though) but the other issue is that they supposedly only fit older Shimano crank sets because of the 9mm splines: https://www.excelsports.com/main.asp...or=1&minor= 6 The cranks have to go on super-snug because I am a low cadence masher and often ride with a substantial load on the bike. I would be very wary of 3mm. It may work with a dérailleur setup but on my hub gears it needs to be the right side of 2mm or aggro ensues. Yes, I'd also prefer an exact match. Those 10-speed deals are really fickle but the more serious MTBs in 2014 weren't available with the good old 7-speed anymore. To tell you the truth, if it were up to me I'd still be riding 8 speeds. Hell, you always shift twice on a 10 speed so it's really a waste of time to have it. But you can't get any new parts such as cassettes in good ratios so I'm stuck with 10 speeds. They did the same damn thing with me with 9 speed parts. Same here. I'd like to ratchet the MTB back from 10-speed to 7-speed or 8-speed. However, the largest cog you can get in a reasonably priced 7-speed or 8-speed cassette is 32T. On a 29" bike an older guy like me needs 36T, especially when schlepping a load along. I converted the road bike from 6-speed to 7-speed and there a 32T is ok. Well, for now. I don't want a 10-speed road bike cassette. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ |
#28
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Octalink ES25 replacement?
On Sat, 12 Aug 2017 12:14:31 -0700 (PDT), wrote:
On Saturday, August 12, 2017 at 11:50:32 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote: On 2017-08-12 08:21, Tosspot wrote: On 12/08/17 16:14, Joerg wrote: snip I might be able to live with a 3mm chain line offset (have to check the M591 front derailer though) but the other issue is that they supposedly only fit older Shimano crank sets because of the 9mm splines: https://www.excelsports.com/main.asp...or=1&minor= 6 The cranks have to go on super-snug because I am a low cadence masher and often ride with a substantial load on the bike. I would be very wary of 3mm. It may work with a dérailleur setup but on my hub gears it needs to be the right side of 2mm or aggro ensues. Yes, I'd also prefer an exact match. Those 10-speed deals are really fickle but the more serious MTBs in 2014 weren't available with the good old 7-speed anymore. To tell you the truth, if it were up to me I'd still be riding 8 speeds. Hell, you always shift twice on a 10 speed so it's really a waste of time to have it. But you can't get any new parts such as cassettes in good ratios so I'm stuck with 10 speeds. They did the same damn thing with me with 9 speed parts. In Bangkok, which is very flat, I still ride with down tube shifters :-) and don't miss not having indexed shifters at all. Today I took a new route - about 55 Km out and back and other then two bridges over canals I shifted 3 times. And one of those was because it was hot and I was getting tired :-) I can still get 9 speed stuff here, in fact you can still buy 7 speed stuff although it is the low end Shimano models. I see a lot of new low end bikes with 7 speed derailers and often twist grip shifters. -- Cheers, John B. |
#29
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Octalink ES25 replacement?
On Sat, 12 Aug 2017 07:03:54 -0700, Joerg
wrote: On 2017-08-11 19:59, John B. wrote: On Fri, 11 Aug 2017 16:59:50 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2017-08-11 16:52, John B. wrote: On Fri, 11 Aug 2017 11:00:32 -0700, Joerg wrote: The BB on my MTB makes a ticking sound when warmed up, sounds similar to a hot car engine after it is turned off. It has also develoved an ever so slight play, just a few mils. It is an Shimano ES25 Octalink. How long do you guys let that go before replacing? Can anyone recommend a better quality BB for this that lasts longer than 5k miles and doesn't cost an arm and a leg? I see Octalink bottom brackets for sale for four British pounds :-) http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/c...t/rp-prod34653 About $5.00. I saw that as well. It's a clearance item in an odd diameter. $6.99 when clicking the link in the US. I guess in new-speak that's called "target group pricing" or something similar :-) I believe in the grocery store marketing it is called a "loss Leader". I meant different prices for different regions or people. One big player recently got into trouble for that which netted them a not-so-honorary mention in the Wall Street Journal. Why ever not different prices for different people. My bike shop certainly does it. If you come in they will charge you one price. If I come in they charge me 15% less. My guess is that it is not uncommon. In fact, if we go to an open market, where bargaining is the norm, my wife will always be quoted a cheaper price then I would. (foreigners are all rich!) Then there is dynamic pricing where if you click too often on an item its price suddenly ratchets up. I immediately head to a competitor if any store does that to me. Although I also notice that Amazon wants 20-odd dollars for one and e-bay has them for about $18.00 Yep. No problem to just buy one but considering the paltry service life I would like to know whether there is something better than ES25 at reasonable cost. Meaning not necessarily a $200+ Phil Woods BB. Well, Chain Reaction has the ES25 BB for sterling 3.99 and the ES51 for 23.49 so you can change five ES25 BB's for the price of one ES51 :-) I don't care if it's $10, $20 or $30. As long as it fits and I don't have to change those things like underwear. I also see an ES300 for $16.68 and there are also Shimano Dura-Ace Octalink BB's and although I don't know whether they fit, Dura-Ace is usually considered as very high quality. It may be time to write to Shimano, hoping they'll answer. To me this flurry of model numbers is confusing and not all are 100% compatible. The cranks have to fit and the chain line should remain roughly the same. Take it to a good bike shop :-) I have a shop in Bangkok and another in Phuket where they seem to know what they're doing.... as long as I know enough to ask the right questions, that is. I was hoping that someone had the same issue with paltry ES25 lifetime and could tell me "Here, buy that one, lasts a lot longer" (and where it fits well). [...] I wonder how popular the Octalink pedals were? I can't remember ever seeing one on the road, or maybe I didn't look :-) Perhaps they weren't that common that people talk about them. -- Cheers, John B. |
#30
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Octalink ES25 replacement?
John B. wrote:
:I can still get 9 speed stuff here, in fact you can still buy 7 speed :stuff although it is the low end Shimano models. I see a lot of new :low end bikes with 7 speed derailers and often twist grip shifters. Seven speed stuff is still available to OEMS (I don't know how much is available to someone like AMuzi) because it's cheap. Freewheels, not freehubs, and super low-end everything. All the tooling is paid for years ago, and they crank it out for the $100 bike market. Its going to be around for a while, because it's about as complicated as can be made to work on bikes put together by nimwits. (A cow-orker bought one from somewhere that had the fork on backwards.) -- sig 50 |
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