Build it and they won't come

On 10/10/2017 6:53 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-10-07 07:37, wrote:

After all there are about 50,000 miles of interstate highways in
the U.S. which were apparently built with no thought to bicycles
and pedestrians.


That is fine. If it cuts off an existing bike or foot path that is not
fine and the builders should be obliged to provide an under- or
overpass. If it turns a formerly "all vehicles ok" road into a "motor
vehicles only" road they must build MUPs or similar. _Not_ on the
cyclist's dime.

Here, I strongly agree with Joerg.

Can someone write that down somewhere? ;-)


--
- Frank Krygowski

John B. wrote:
On Tue, 10 Oct 2017 15:36:54 -0400, Duane
wrote:

On 10/10/2017 3:22 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Tuesday, October 10, 2017 at 9:13:39 AM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 10/10/2017 11:15 AM, wrote:
On Tuesday, October 10, 2017 at 5:25:31 AM UTC-7, duane wrote:

That's what I thought you meant. The world according to slow johnny.

What is that supposed to mean? Frank is showing nothing more than his
fear of guns. He tells us that even though more people were killed
with one single truck than in Las Vegas that ~"cars are useful and guns are not".

Now you appear to be saying that you could win the Tour de France or
that someone that is 60 would at least have a chance.

To each his own and if you want to ride a super-light CF bike that's
fine. And if you're crippled from it coming apart don't look for any sympathy here.

Is Tom showing nothing more than his fear of carbon fiber? ;-)

If I were Tom, I wouldn't buy CF either -- or at least not Colnagos.
Crashing sucks more the older you get. Today is the one-year
anniversary of getting a plate in my hand after cartwheeling over my
son, who got scratches. I still have a numb spot on my quad from a
blood clot in my back muscles (and nerve compression) following that
incident. My CF bike, however, came out without significant injury --
until the roof-rack incident, and even then it didn't visibly break. I
had it looked at by Ruckus who found internal problems and gave me a
big repair quote -- so it went into the sh** heap. Actually it went to
Western Bikeworks and back to Cannondale as part of its crash
replacement program (20% off a new bike).

CF can be really tough, but purely from a PTSD standpoint, I'd switch
materials if I were Tom.


John's comment has nothing to do with the sturdiness of CF. He seems to
be calling people my age posers or something for riding racing bikes and
his justification is only that they can't win the ultimate bike race in
the world. I do performance cycling and I still race some though not a
lot anymore.

John's comment is both dumb and insulting.

Insulting? How so? Do you actually believe that you can win the TdeF?



Do you really believe that CF bikes are only good for the Tour de France or
are you just being annoying? That’s the dumb part.

You’re basically calling everyone with racing bikes that can’t win the tour
idiots. That’s the insulting part.


Tom's comment is Tom's. I have no idea what his point is.
--
Cheers,

John B.





--
duane

jbeattie wrote:
On Tuesday, October 10, 2017 at 4:12:59 PM UTC-7, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 10 Oct 2017 15:36:54 -0400, Duane
wrote:

On 10/10/2017 3:22 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Tuesday, October 10, 2017 at 9:13:39 AM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 10/10/2017 11:15 AM, wrote:
On Tuesday, October 10, 2017 at 5:25:31 AM UTC-7, duane wrote:

That's what I thought you meant. The world according to slow johnny.

What is that supposed to mean? Frank is showing nothing more than
his fear of guns. He tells us that even though more people were
killed with one single truck than in Las Vegas that ~"cars are
useful and guns are not".

Now you appear to be saying that you could win the Tour de France or
that someone that is 60 would at least have a chance.

To each his own and if you want to ride a super-light CF bike that's
fine. And if you're crippled from it coming apart don't look for any sympathy here.

Is Tom showing nothing more than his fear of carbon fiber? ;-)

If I were Tom, I wouldn't buy CF either -- or at least not Colnagos.
Crashing sucks more the older you get. Today is the one-year
anniversary of getting a plate in my hand after cartwheeling over my
son, who got scratches. I still have a numb spot on my quad from a
blood clot in my back muscles (and nerve compression) following that
incident. My CF bike, however, came out without significant injury --
until the roof-rack incident, and even then it didn't visibly break.
I had it looked at by Ruckus who found internal problems and gave me a
big repair quote -- so it went into the sh** heap. Actually it went
to Western Bikeworks and back to Cannondale as part of its crash
replacement program (20% off a new bike).

CF can be really tough, but purely from a PTSD standpoint, I'd switch
materials if I were Tom.


John's comment has nothing to do with the sturdiness of CF. He seems to
be calling people my age posers or something for riding racing bikes and
his justification is only that they can't win the ultimate bike race in
the world. I do performance cycling and I still race some though not a
lot anymore.

John's comment is both dumb and insulting.

Insulting? How so? Do you actually believe that you can win the TdeF?

No, but I may go back to racing, apart from the ad hoc racing that occurs
every weekend -- and on some work days. Being capable of winning the TdF
has never been a requirement for owning a racing bike. If it were, Cat 5
races would be run on three-speed, balloon tire bikes.

You should go see what amateurs are riding, including old men who are
still competing. In fact, masters racers are some of the most competitive
packs. The masters are so competitive that doping has become a problem
in some cities -- in Salt Lake, believe it or not. Those old guys are
animals with speeds up the canyons that would blow your socks off,
probably drug assisted. I need to get some drugs!

I was at one of my son's races in Salt Lake and was staggered by the
bikes the old guys were riding. Cost is no object, which is good -- it
keeps the shops in business. Do you think the broke Bohemians are buying S-Work Tarmacs?

I was also amazed that even the gooniors and Cat 1/2/3s were riding bikes
with 28t cassettes. Spin is in. Most everyone was on CF, although there
were a few Ti frames. All of the bikes were Tour worthy. None of the
riders were Tour worthy, except Francisco Mancebo -- the man with the
backward resume who is now riding for a pro-am team in Salt Lake. It's so sad.


John apparently thinks all CF bikes are S-Works Tarmacs. After all they’re
only necessary for the tour. Or maybe he does those crits on a 40lb iron
bike like a real man. Or maybe he just doesn’t know what he’s talking
about.

--
duane

On Wed, 11 Oct 2017 02:27:24 -0000 (UTC), Duane
wrote:

jbeattie wrote:
On Tuesday, October 10, 2017 at 4:12:59 PM UTC-7, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 10 Oct 2017 15:36:54 -0400, Duane
wrote:

On 10/10/2017 3:22 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Tuesday, October 10, 2017 at 9:13:39 AM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 10/10/2017 11:15 AM, wrote:
On Tuesday, October 10, 2017 at 5:25:31 AM UTC-7, duane wrote:

That's what I thought you meant. The world according to slow johnny.

What is that supposed to mean? Frank is showing nothing more than
his fear of guns. He tells us that even though more people were
killed with one single truck than in Las Vegas that ~"cars are
useful and guns are not".

Now you appear to be saying that you could win the Tour de France or
that someone that is 60 would at least have a chance.

To each his own and if you want to ride a super-light CF bike that's
fine. And if you're crippled from it coming apart don't look for any sympathy here.

Is Tom showing nothing more than his fear of carbon fiber? ;-)

If I were Tom, I wouldn't buy CF either -- or at least not Colnagos.
Crashing sucks more the older you get. Today is the one-year
anniversary of getting a plate in my hand after cartwheeling over my
son, who got scratches. I still have a numb spot on my quad from a
blood clot in my back muscles (and nerve compression) following that
incident. My CF bike, however, came out without significant injury --
until the roof-rack incident, and even then it didn't visibly break.
I had it looked at by Ruckus who found internal problems and gave me a
big repair quote -- so it went into the sh** heap. Actually it went
to Western Bikeworks and back to Cannondale as part of its crash
replacement program (20% off a new bike).

CF can be really tough, but purely from a PTSD standpoint, I'd switch
materials if I were Tom.


John's comment has nothing to do with the sturdiness of CF. He seems to
be calling people my age posers or something for riding racing bikes and
his justification is only that they can't win the ultimate bike race in
the world. I do performance cycling and I still race some though not a
lot anymore.

John's comment is both dumb and insulting.

Insulting? How so? Do you actually believe that you can win the TdeF?

No, but I may go back to racing, apart from the ad hoc racing that occurs
every weekend -- and on some work days. Being capable of winning the TdF
has never been a requirement for owning a racing bike. If it were, Cat 5
races would be run on three-speed, balloon tire bikes.

You should go see what amateurs are riding, including old men who are
still competing. In fact, masters racers are some of the most competitive
packs. The masters are so competitive that doping has become a problem
in some cities -- in Salt Lake, believe it or not. Those old guys are
animals with speeds up the canyons that would blow your socks off,
probably drug assisted. I need to get some drugs!

I was at one of my son's races in Salt Lake and was staggered by the
bikes the old guys were riding. Cost is no object, which is good -- it
keeps the shops in business. Do you think the broke Bohemians are buying S-Work Tarmacs?

I was also amazed that even the gooniors and Cat 1/2/3s were riding bikes
with 28t cassettes. Spin is in. Most everyone was on CF, although there
were a few Ti frames. All of the bikes were Tour worthy. None of the
riders were Tour worthy, except Francisco Mancebo -- the man with the
backward resume who is now riding for a pro-am team in Salt Lake. It's so sad.


John apparently thinks all CF bikes are S-Works Tarmacs. After all they’re
only necessary for the tour. Or maybe he does those crits on a 40lb iron
bike like a real man. Or maybe he just doesn’t know what he’s talking
about.

Oh? I thought I was pretty specific when I said "11 speed CF racing
bike".

--
Cheers,

John B.

WJohn B. wrote:
On Wed, 11 Oct 2017 02:27:24 -0000 (UTC), Duane
wrote:

jbeattie wrote:
On Tuesday, October 10, 2017 at 4:12:59 PM UTC-7, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 10 Oct 2017 15:36:54 -0400, Duane
wrote:

On 10/10/2017 3:22 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Tuesday, October 10, 2017 at 9:13:39 AM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 10/10/2017 11:15 AM, wrote:
On Tuesday, October 10, 2017 at 5:25:31 AM UTC-7, duane wrote:

That's what I thought you meant. The world according to slow johnny.

What is that supposed to mean? Frank is showing nothing more than
his fear of guns. He tells us that even though more people were
killed with one single truck than in Las Vegas that ~"cars are
useful and guns are not".

Now you appear to be saying that you could win the Tour de France or
that someone that is 60 would at least have a chance.

To each his own and if you want to ride a super-light CF bike that's
fine. And if you're crippled from it coming apart don't look for any sympathy here.

Is Tom showing nothing more than his fear of carbon fiber? ;-)

If I were Tom, I wouldn't buy CF either -- or at least not Colnagos.
Crashing sucks more the older you get. Today is the one-year
anniversary of getting a plate in my hand after cartwheeling over my
son, who got scratches. I still have a numb spot on my quad from a
blood clot in my back muscles (and nerve compression) following that
incident. My CF bike, however, came out without significant injury --
until the roof-rack incident, and even then it didn't visibly break.
I had it looked at by Ruckus who found internal problems and gave me a
big repair quote -- so it went into the sh** heap. Actually it went
to Western Bikeworks and back to Cannondale as part of its crash
replacement program (20% off a new bike).

CF can be really tough, but purely from a PTSD standpoint, I'd switch
materials if I were Tom.


John's comment has nothing to do with the sturdiness of CF. He seems to
be calling people my age posers or something for riding racing bikes and
his justification is only that they can't win the ultimate bike race in
the world. I do performance cycling and I still race some though not a
lot anymore.

John's comment is both dumb and insulting.

Insulting? How so? Do you actually believe that you can win the TdeF?

No, but I may go back to racing, apart from the ad hoc racing that occurs
every weekend -- and on some work days. Being capable of winning the TdF
has never been a requirement for owning a racing bike. If it were, Cat 5
races would be run on three-speed, balloon tire bikes.

You should go see what amateurs are riding, including old men who are
still competing. In fact, masters racers are some of the most competitive
packs. The masters are so competitive that doping has become a problem
in some cities -- in Salt Lake, believe it or not. Those old guys are
animals with speeds up the canyons that would blow your socks off,
probably drug assisted. I need to get some drugs!

I was at one of my son's races in Salt Lake and was staggered by the
bikes the old guys were riding. Cost is no object, which is good -- it
keeps the shops in business. Do you think the broke Bohemians are buying S-Work Tarmacs?

I was also amazed that even the gooniors and Cat 1/2/3s were riding bikes
with 28t cassettes. Spin is in. Most everyone was on CF, although there
were a few Ti frames. All of the bikes were Tour worthy. None of the
riders were Tour worthy, except Francisco Mancebo -- the man with the
backward resume who is now riding for a pro-am team in Salt Lake. It's so sad.


John apparently thinks all CF bikes are S-Works Tarmacs. After all theyÂ’re
only necessary for the tour. Or maybe he does those crits on a 40lb iron
bike like a real man. Or maybe he just doesnÂ’t know what heÂ’s talking
about.

Oh? I thought I was pretty specific when I said "11 speed CF racing
bike".

--
Cheers,


Yeah I was giving you the benefit of the doubt. Nobody is stupid enough to
think all 11 speed CF bikes are useful only for TDF riders. Both 11 speed
and CF frames are pretty much the standard offering at most bike shops
around here. I guess I was wrong to think you were simply mistaken.

Well my 11 speed CF road bike is not going to be in the Tour de France
though I would love to ride some of the routes and plan to when I retire.
A lot of people race and ride for performance and like decent bikes whether
you approve or not.

Sounds to me like you’re just trolling and it was my mistake to feed your
troll. Won’t happen again.

--
duane

On Wed, 11 Oct 2017 10:23:32 -0000 (UTC), Duane
wrote:

WJohn B. wrote:
On Wed, 11 Oct 2017 02:27:24 -0000 (UTC), Duane
wrote:

jbeattie wrote:
On Tuesday, October 10, 2017 at 4:12:59 PM UTC-7, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 10 Oct 2017 15:36:54 -0400, Duane
wrote:

On 10/10/2017 3:22 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Tuesday, October 10, 2017 at 9:13:39 AM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 10/10/2017 11:15 AM, wrote:
On Tuesday, October 10, 2017 at 5:25:31 AM UTC-7, duane wrote:

That's what I thought you meant. The world according to slow johnny.

What is that supposed to mean? Frank is showing nothing more than
his fear of guns. He tells us that even though more people were
killed with one single truck than in Las Vegas that ~"cars are
useful and guns are not".

Now you appear to be saying that you could win the Tour de France or
that someone that is 60 would at least have a chance.

To each his own and if you want to ride a super-light CF bike that's
fine. And if you're crippled from it coming apart don't look for any sympathy here.

Is Tom showing nothing more than his fear of carbon fiber? ;-)

If I were Tom, I wouldn't buy CF either -- or at least not Colnagos.
Crashing sucks more the older you get. Today is the one-year
anniversary of getting a plate in my hand after cartwheeling over my
son, who got scratches. I still have a numb spot on my quad from a
blood clot in my back muscles (and nerve compression) following that
incident. My CF bike, however, came out without significant injury --
until the roof-rack incident, and even then it didn't visibly break.
I had it looked at by Ruckus who found internal problems and gave me a
big repair quote -- so it went into the sh** heap. Actually it went
to Western Bikeworks and back to Cannondale as part of its crash
replacement program (20% off a new bike).

CF can be really tough, but purely from a PTSD standpoint, I'd switch
materials if I were Tom.


John's comment has nothing to do with the sturdiness of CF. He seems to
be calling people my age posers or something for riding racing bikes and
his justification is only that they can't win the ultimate bike race in
the world. I do performance cycling and I still race some though not a
lot anymore.

John's comment is both dumb and insulting.

Insulting? How so? Do you actually believe that you can win the TdeF?

No, but I may go back to racing, apart from the ad hoc racing that occurs
every weekend -- and on some work days. Being capable of winning the TdF
has never been a requirement for owning a racing bike. If it were, Cat 5
races would be run on three-speed, balloon tire bikes.

You should go see what amateurs are riding, including old men who are
still competing. In fact, masters racers are some of the most competitive
packs. The masters are so competitive that doping has become a problem
in some cities -- in Salt Lake, believe it or not. Those old guys are
animals with speeds up the canyons that would blow your socks off,
probably drug assisted. I need to get some drugs!

I was at one of my son's races in Salt Lake and was staggered by the
bikes the old guys were riding. Cost is no object, which is good -- it
keeps the shops in business. Do you think the broke Bohemians are buying S-Work Tarmacs?

I was also amazed that even the gooniors and Cat 1/2/3s were riding bikes
with 28t cassettes. Spin is in. Most everyone was on CF, although there
were a few Ti frames. All of the bikes were Tour worthy. None of the
riders were Tour worthy, except Francisco Mancebo -- the man with the
backward resume who is now riding for a pro-am team in Salt Lake. It's so sad.


John apparently thinks all CF bikes are S-Works Tarmacs. After all they?re
only necessary for the tour. Or maybe he does those crits on a 40lb iron
bike like a real man. Or maybe he just doesn?t know what he?s talking
about.

Oh? I thought I was pretty specific when I said "11 speed CF racing
bike".

--
Cheers,


Yeah I was giving you the benefit of the doubt. Nobody is stupid enough to
think all 11 speed CF bikes are useful only for TDF riders. Both 11 speed
and CF frames are pretty much the standard offering at most bike shops
around here. I guess I was wrong to think you were simply mistaken.

Well my 11 speed CF road bike is not going to be in the Tour de France
though I would love to ride some of the routes and plan to when I retire.
A lot of people race and ride for performance and like decent bikes whether
you approve or not.

Sounds to me like you’re just trolling and it was my mistake to feed your
troll. Won’t happen again.

It seems unlikely, at best, to believe that you didn't understand the
content of the original posts between Frank and I where he commented
that punching holes in a paper target with a gun and thinking you were
a big, bad, man was childish.

I then replied "like a 60 year old guy on a CF racing bike".

I can only assume that you are interjecting your off topic remarks
deliberately. So yes, goodbye.

--
Cheers,

John B.

On Tuesday, October 10, 2017 at 4:57:40 PM UTC-7, Mark J. wrote:

Fargo Street in Los Angeles (across from Dodger Stadium). The Los
Angeles Wheelmen have an annual "contest" consisting mostly of "can you
do it." Advertised as 30%, and lots of people ride up it.

http://www.lawheelmen.org/fargo-street-2017/

The wife and I got the tandem up it in the 80s (through the agressive
use of paperboy-ing technique and near track stands to rest). They have
volunteer spotters to make sure people don't fall sideways/downslope
while paperboying.

There's a street in Novato, CA, that is about that steep that I've ridden straight up. It's only about half that apparent length though. And my heart rate and blood pressure was through the roof. That was when I was a mere slip of a lad at 69.

On Tuesday, October 10, 2017 at 7:27:26 PM UTC-7, Duane wrote:
jbeattie wrote:
On Tuesday, October 10, 2017 at 4:12:59 PM UTC-7, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 10 Oct 2017 15:36:54 -0400, Duane
wrote:

On 10/10/2017 3:22 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Tuesday, October 10, 2017 at 9:13:39 AM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 10/10/2017 11:15 AM, wrote:
On Tuesday, October 10, 2017 at 5:25:31 AM UTC-7, duane wrote:

That's what I thought you meant. The world according to slow johnny.

What is that supposed to mean? Frank is showing nothing more than
his fear of guns. He tells us that even though more people were
killed with one single truck than in Las Vegas that ~"cars are
useful and guns are not".

Now you appear to be saying that you could win the Tour de France or
that someone that is 60 would at least have a chance.

To each his own and if you want to ride a super-light CF bike that's
fine. And if you're crippled from it coming apart don't look for any sympathy here.

Is Tom showing nothing more than his fear of carbon fiber? ;-)

If I were Tom, I wouldn't buy CF either -- or at least not Colnagos.
Crashing sucks more the older you get. Today is the one-year
anniversary of getting a plate in my hand after cartwheeling over my
son, who got scratches. I still have a numb spot on my quad from a
blood clot in my back muscles (and nerve compression) following that
incident. My CF bike, however, came out without significant injury --
until the roof-rack incident, and even then it didn't visibly break.
I had it looked at by Ruckus who found internal problems and gave me a
big repair quote -- so it went into the sh** heap. Actually it went
to Western Bikeworks and back to Cannondale as part of its crash
replacement program (20% off a new bike).

CF can be really tough, but purely from a PTSD standpoint, I'd switch
materials if I were Tom.


John's comment has nothing to do with the sturdiness of CF. He seems to
be calling people my age posers or something for riding racing bikes and
his justification is only that they can't win the ultimate bike race in
the world. I do performance cycling and I still race some though not a
lot anymore.

John's comment is both dumb and insulting.

Insulting? How so? Do you actually believe that you can win the TdeF?

No, but I may go back to racing, apart from the ad hoc racing that occurs
every weekend -- and on some work days. Being capable of winning the TdF
has never been a requirement for owning a racing bike. If it were, Cat 5
races would be run on three-speed, balloon tire bikes.

You should go see what amateurs are riding, including old men who are
still competing. In fact, masters racers are some of the most competitive
packs. The masters are so competitive that doping has become a problem
in some cities -- in Salt Lake, believe it or not. Those old guys are
animals with speeds up the canyons that would blow your socks off,
probably drug assisted. I need to get some drugs!

I was at one of my son's races in Salt Lake and was staggered by the
bikes the old guys were riding. Cost is no object, which is good -- it
keeps the shops in business. Do you think the broke Bohemians are buying S-Work Tarmacs?

I was also amazed that even the gooniors and Cat 1/2/3s were riding bikes
with 28t cassettes. Spin is in. Most everyone was on CF, although there
were a few Ti frames. All of the bikes were Tour worthy. None of the
riders were Tour worthy, except Francisco Mancebo -- the man with the
backward resume who is now riding for a pro-am team in Salt Lake. It's so sad.


John apparently thinks all CF bikes are S-Works Tarmacs. After all they’re
only necessary for the tour. Or maybe he does those crits on a 40lb iron
bike like a real man. Or maybe he just doesn’t know what he’s talking
about.

Probably the later. The Team mechanic said that each bike is custom made for each tour rider making them different than the over-the-counter bikes.

Remember when I said that CF bikes would break at the bottom bracket joint?

https://www.specialized.com/us/en/me...-acedi2/134255

It would appear that I wasn't the only one having those experiences.

On Wednesday, October 11, 2017 at 4:54:17 AM UTC-7, John B. wrote:

It seems unlikely, at best, to believe that you didn't understand the
content of the original posts between Frank and I where he commented
that punching holes in a paper target with a gun and thinking you were
a big, bad, man was childish.

I then replied "like a 60 year old guy on a CF racing bike".

I can only assume that you are interjecting your off topic remarks
deliberately. So yes, goodbye.

Walking off in a snit again John? Really, get over yourself. You're beginning to sound like Frank who denies that where the strongest guns laws are we have the highest rates of gun crimes and where the least gun laws are in effect the murder rates are insignificant.

On Wednesday, October 11, 2017 at 6:38:14 AM UTC-7, wrote:

snip

The link is just a product page on the Specialized site. Is there a report of the S-Works McLaren Di2s breaking at the bottom bracket? Sure glad I didn't buy one -- at $11,500.

-- Jay Beattie.