My latest whinge...

"Treadly" wrote in message
...

Resound Wrote:
See, I don't get that either. I can quite happily visualise three
sinusoidal waves oriented 120° to each other, but in what space? I was
under the impression that we had pos/neg and time to play with, so 2D
only. Where does the depth come from?It's not in space, it's in time.
Think of the physical construction of a
generator, there's a magnet that spins around at 50 times a second which
is inside three sets of coils that generate the current. The coils are
physically placed at 120 degrees to each other. As the magnetic field
rotates towards one set of coils it's moving away from another set of
coils, hence the current in one is increasing and the other is
decreasing. So that's where you get your three sine waves from and why
they are out of sequence by a third of a wave.


Off topic AGAIN


--
Treadly


So how do you "extract" one 240V phase for household use?

Hmmm... "And life is intensely competitive"... mine's not, so shouldn't
that be "MY life is intensely competitive?"

I have found, with competitive people, that yours is a common view - that
life itself is competitive rather than (IMO) thinking that THEY are the
source of competitiveness.

A good example - my boss has been asking what I want from my work. He
can't
understand that I'm not after promotions, career path or anything else. I
just want to finish my PhD and get out. He has nothing to offer me as all
he's offering is a competitive advantage to someone who's not competing.
He
just doesn't get it. To him, working is very much about competing and he
doesn't understand another outlook.

So, how is life itself competitive? If I'm not competing, does that
automatically make me a loser because there are only winners and losers,
nothing between? Or is competition in the eye of the beholder? Would it
give
you a competitive thrill to pass me on the road even though I'm not
competing?

Again, not having a go - just trying to understand an alternative view to
my
own.

Cheers,

Frank



This is something I've noticed as well. A great many things seem to be set
up with an assumption of competitiveness. It usually seems to be about
having more and being somehow "better" than the next person. It's an
attitude that perpetually ****es me off becuase I usually just want to *do*
something rather than worry about whether someone else is somehow doing it
faster or more prettily or more productively than me. It's one of the things
I like about cycling; I can just do it without having to deal with other
people doing the "I'm faster than you" dance at me.

On 2006-05-13, Resound sacredchao@ wrote:
So how do you "extract" one 240V phase for household use?

Each set of magnets on the generator is connected to a common neutral
line, and its own active line. To extract a single phase, you just hook
up to one of those active lines, and the common neutral. To extract the
415 V power, you hook up to two of the active lines. If you have a three
phase motor, you connect each of its phases up in exactly the same way
that the generator has each of *its* three phases connected.

Three phases. Three separate circuits. How you connect to those circuits
determines how much power you get from them. Simple.

--
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In aus.bicycle on Sat, 13 May 2006 06:31:24 +0800
Plodder wrote:
So, how is life itself competitive? If I'm not competing, does that
automatically make me a loser because there are only winners and losers,
nothing between? Or is competition in the eye of the beholder? Would it give
you a competitive thrill to pass me on the road even though I'm not
competing?

I think that does happen - that people see things as competition and
it doesn't matter if the other person does.

So cycling up a Bloody Big Hill can be seen as competing against the
hill. The hill doesn't care, and it won't get any medals....

I am competitive in that I can't help measuring myself against others.
I haven't been able to stop doing that, so you can imagine my blood
pressure

One reason I don't have up to date sporty bikes, powered or
unpowered. I don't want to even try to buy into that. I just want to
ride and have fun. The minute I start worrying about horsepower or
weight, that's the time I set myself up to lose and be unhappy.
Always someone better than I am, cos it ain't hard!

If I go out riding with someone I want to focus on the enjoyment of
the day, of the talk, of the physical feeling of sun and exercise. I
don't want to lose that in the "I gotta be faster". Takes some mental
work to focus on the right thing...

Zebee

Resound Wrote:


This is something I've noticed as well. A great many things seem to be
set
up with an assumption of competitiveness. It usually seems to be about
having more and being somehow "better" than the next person. It's an
attitude that perpetually ****es me off becuase I usually just want to
*do*
something rather than worry about whether someone else is somehow doing
it
faster or more prettily or more productively than me. It's one of the
things
I like about cycling; I can just do it without having to deal with
other
people doing the "I'm faster than you" dance at me.
*do* ing is good...

just let the testosterone driven egoheads charge to an early grave

*do* ..*smell the roses*...* love life* ...we are long time dead and
that race to prove something to one's ego often brings that outcome a
little sooner for some than others...

sure some are lost at the cause of the egoheads too...so we remember
them and celebrate their lives with us... and for those here who *do*
...Live well..love well...ride and *do* it again and again


--
rooman

"Stuart Lamble" wrote in message
...
On 2006-05-13, Resound sacredchao@ wrote:
So how do you "extract" one 240V phase for household use?

Each set of magnets on the generator is connected to a common neutral
line, and its own active line. To extract a single phase, you just hook
up to one of those active lines, and the common neutral. To extract the
415 V power, you hook up to two of the active lines. If you have a three
phase motor, you connect each of its phases up in exactly the same way
that the generator has each of *its* three phases connected.

Three phases. Three separate circuits. How you connect to those circuits
determines how much power you get from them. Simple.

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Ah, so there's four separate cables then.

On 2006-05-13, Stuart Lamble (aka Bruce)
was almost, but not quite, entirely unlike tea:
If you then plot the difference between any two of those phases, you'll
get another sine wave, this one being a 415 V RMS amplitude. No, I can't
derive this result easily; just break out a mathematical graphing
application, and you'll see it well enough.

240*sqrt(3)=415

I can't be bothered working out why sqrt(3) though


As to why the generators produce three phases: it means that the load on
the generator is pretty much constant. If you add the phases together,
and plot the result, you'll get yet another sine wave, but the amplitude
of it will be miniscule,

0 actually, assuming perfect alignment and perfect sine wave
generation and perfect equal resistive load on all phases. Which, of
course, would not be the case.

--
TimC
load "linux",8,1

On 2006-05-13, Vincent Patrick (aka Bruce)
was almost, but not quite, entirely unlike tea:
* Bicycle technical types. The idea of extracting a crank scares me, but I
like to learn from their mechanical knowledge. Now I know that a chain whip
is not some kinky perversion.

But it can be, baybe!

* Political types. Without wanting to upset people, riding my bicycle has
nothing to do with voting Labor
^^^^^ Be careful with that axe, Eugene.
We don't vote Labor around here, and we don't like the types that do
Haven't you heard? We're all communists!

* There's another class of "competitors", too: cyclists who enjoy competing
against themselves and noticing their gradual increase in strength or
speed. It's not my main reason for cycling, but I plead guilty to enjoying
going a little faster than I could before. Not always: sometimes my
commute is a slow slog into a headwind, and sometimes I just enjoy
freewheeling along at a leisurely pace. Speed is not just to be enjoyed by
competitive athletes. There is a point well before any feeling of athletic
exertion when you can enjoy a bicycle's speed. As a young boy I liked
to 'race along' by myself on my single speed bike. Certainly, it is not
the same as "smelling the roses", but it is still enjoying the special
nature of cycling.

And admit it. Flying down a hill faster than the speed limit is kinda
exhilarating.

Now, like Frank, I am as inclusive as the next guy, but will all you
pain-training and weirdo-supplement freaks relax and have a nice cup of
tea?

twitches neckGimme coffee!

It is really annoying when you zoom by so effortlessly. :-)

pokes tongue out. And gimme cake.

--
TimC
I admit that X is the second worst windowing system in the world,
but all the others I've used are tied for first. -- Paul Tomblin

On Sat, 13 May 2006 06:33:34 +0000, TimC wrote:

240*sqrt(3)=415

Erm. WTF?

I can't be bothered working out why sqrt(3) though

hint Maybe sqrt(2), and try integrating sin from 0 to 2pi. /hint

(I just wrote a lesson plan for yr 11 physics on this stuff)
--
Dave Hughes |
"When all you've got is a nailgun, every problem looks like a messiah..."
- Iain Chalmers

On 2006-05-13, Resound sacredchao@ wrote:
[three phase power]
Ah, so there's four separate cables then.

Yup. Next time you see one of those transmission lines, look closely at
it. You'll see that there are a couple (anywhere from 1 to 4, in my
experience) of very thin cables at the top, and a great many more
thicker cables below. The thicker cables carry the phases; the thin
cables are the neutral return.

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