Daytime running lights seem more common.....

John B. wrote:
On Tue, 6 Oct 2020 13:11:52 -0700, sms
wrote:

On 10/5/2020 3:56 PM, John B. wrote:

snip

And beware of those with pre-conceived notions that deny reality.

You don't live here so you should not be talking trash about either
Donald Trump or Frank.

Why ever not? I'm a citizen of the U.S. I served my country for 20
years in the military and fought in two wars that the U.S. started.

I think that I'm as qualified as some obese politician to comment on
U.S. fallacies.

When Americans stop talking trash about anything outside their own borders,
I’ll consider not commenting on what goes on inside their borders.

Radey Shouman wrote:
Ralph Barone writes:

Lou Holtman wrote:
Op dinsdag 6 oktober 2020 om 17:26:27 UTC+2 schreef Frank Krygowski:
On 10/5/2020 11:30 PM, John B. wrote:
On Mon, 5 Oct 2020 21:34:03 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 10/5/2020 4:18 PM, Ted Heise wrote:
On Mon, 5 Oct 2020 13:37:19 -0400,
Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 10/4/2020 10:37 PM, John B. wrote:
On Sun, 4 Oct 2020 21:45:07 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:
On 10/4/2020 8:49 PM, John B. wrote:
On Sun, 4 Oct 2020 23:56:08 -0000 (UTC), bob prohaska
wrote:

In the past year or so it seems to me that riders using
daytime running lights are considerably more numerous. Has
anybody else noticed the same thing? Last year at this time
I think maybe one bike in ten had them, now it seems close
to one in three or four, at least on some days.

Over here I don't think I've ever seeing anyone with a white
front light but red "tail lights" seem to have become the
norm.

But I do believe that anything that makes the bicyclist more
noticeable would be a good thing.

Yes, I've noticed more DRLs. For one thing, every e-bike I
encounter seems to be running with its headlight on. But I
see a few roadies running daytime headlights, and more of
them running taillights.

But I disagree with John's final sentence. A guy running a
headlight when out on a lonely country road in bright
daylight? That's a "good thing" only for the companies
involved in the light sale. It does no real good for the
cyclist.

You missed the part about "makes the bicyclist more noticeable
would be a good thing"? Obviously if the cyclist is "more
noticeable" there must be those who would notice him/her/it.

Noticing a cyclist who is two blocks away confers no benefit.

Well, "two blocks" is covered pretty darn quickly at highway
speeds, so perhaps there is some benefit in being seen at greater
distance.

If the cyclist is two blocks (say, 1000 ft) away and moving just 12 mph
in the same direction as a 55 mph car, it takes over 15 seconds for the
car to reach the cyclist. 15 seconds is quite a long time in driving.
Count it out to visualize it.

But, but...The discussion was about a white light on the front of a
bicycle so your figures are not correct, it is actually closer to 10
seconds and for someone talking, reading a message or texting, on a
phone that isn't a very long time. And... some 26% of traffic
accidents are a result of hand phone use while driving.
Better double check your math, John. 1000 ft divided by 43 miles per
hour (= closing speed) times 3600 seconds per hour divided by 5280 feet
per mile.


--
- Frank Krygowski

Ah, I love those units...

Lou


There’s still a 3.6 conversion factor if you do it in metric.

France did try to implement decimal time, shortly after the revolution.
For some reason it never took off, and we've been stuck on base 60 since
Sumer was a leading capital.


Those Sumerians knew a good thing when they saw it.

On Tue, 6 Oct 2020 15:30:02 -0700 (PDT), Lou Holtman
wrote:

Op dinsdag 6 oktober 2020 om 23:26:53 UTC+2 schreef Radey Shouman:
Ralph Barone writes:

Lou Holtman wrote:
Op dinsdag 6 oktober 2020 om 17:26:27 UTC+2 schreef Frank Krygowski:
On 10/5/2020 11:30 PM, John B. wrote:
On Mon, 5 Oct 2020 21:34:03 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 10/5/2020 4:18 PM, Ted Heise wrote:
On Mon, 5 Oct 2020 13:37:19 -0400,
Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 10/4/2020 10:37 PM, John B. wrote:
On Sun, 4 Oct 2020 21:45:07 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:
On 10/4/2020 8:49 PM, John B. wrote:
On Sun, 4 Oct 2020 23:56:08 -0000 (UTC), bob prohaska
wrote:

In the past year or so it seems to me that riders using
daytime running lights are considerably more numerous. Has
anybody else noticed the same thing? Last year at this time
I think maybe one bike in ten had them, now it seems close
to one in three or four, at least on some days.

Over here I don't think I've ever seeing anyone with a white
front light but red "tail lights" seem to have become the
norm.

But I do believe that anything that makes the bicyclist more
noticeable would be a good thing.

Yes, I've noticed more DRLs. For one thing, every e-bike I
encounter seems to be running with its headlight on. But I
see a few roadies running daytime headlights, and more of
them running taillights.

But I disagree with John's final sentence. A guy running a
headlight when out on a lonely country road in bright
daylight? That's a "good thing" only for the companies
involved in the light sale. It does no real good for the
cyclist.

You missed the part about "makes the bicyclist more noticeable
would be a good thing"? Obviously if the cyclist is "more
noticeable" there must be those who would notice him/her/it.

Noticing a cyclist who is two blocks away confers no benefit.

Well, "two blocks" is covered pretty darn quickly at highway
speeds, so perhaps there is some benefit in being seen at greater
distance.

If the cyclist is two blocks (say, 1000 ft) away and moving just 12 mph
in the same direction as a 55 mph car, it takes over 15 seconds for the
car to reach the cyclist. 15 seconds is quite a long time in driving.
Count it out to visualize it.

But, but...The discussion was about a white light on the front of a
bicycle so your figures are not correct, it is actually closer to 10
seconds and for someone talking, reading a message or texting, on a
phone that isn't a very long time. And... some 26% of traffic
accidents are a result of hand phone use while driving.
Better double check your math, John. 1000 ft divided by 43 miles per
hour (= closing speed) times 3600 seconds per hour divided by 5280 feet
per mile.


--
- Frank Krygowski

Ah, I love those units...

Lou


There’s still a 3.6 conversion factor if you do it in metric.
France did try to implement decimal time, shortly after the revolution.
For some reason it never took off, and we've been stuck on base 60 since
Sumer was a leading capital.


If they proposed it today I would be in favor. Rode 86 km in 2hr45min36sec. Average speed on my RPN calculator:
2 enter 45 enter 60 / + 36 enter 60 / 60 /+ 1/x 86 * tada 31.16 km/hr..... pfff.
It could have been 86 enter 2.76 /

Lou

Or (85/(120+45+.6)) X 60 :-)
--
Cheers,

John B.

On Wed, 7 Oct 2020 00:16:02 +0000 (UTC), Ralph Barone
wrote:

John B. wrote:
On Tue, 6 Oct 2020 13:11:52 -0700, sms
wrote:

On 10/5/2020 3:56 PM, John B. wrote:

snip

And beware of those with pre-conceived notions that deny reality.

You don't live here so you should not be talking trash about either
Donald Trump or Frank.

Why ever not? I'm a citizen of the U.S. I served my country for 20
years in the military and fought in two wars that the U.S. started.

I think that I'm as qualified as some obese politician to comment on
U.S. fallacies.

When Americans stop talking trash about anything outside their own borders,
I’ll consider not commenting on what goes on inside their borders.

Good Lord! Are you telling us that you think that the news agencies
are telling lies?

But more seriously, USians are rather famous for ignorance about
things outside their borders, sometimes outside their state (province)
borders :-)
--
Cheers,

John B.

sms wrote:
On 10/4/2020 4:56 PM, bob prohaska wrote:
In the past year or so it seems to me that riders using daytime running lights
are considerably more numerous. Has anybody else noticed the same thing? Last
year at this time I think maybe one bike in ten had them, now it seems close
to one in three or four, at least on some days.

Thanks for reading,

bob prohaska

In my area (SF Bay Area, I'd estimate that more than 50% of commuters
and more serious recreational cyclists use DRLs.


That's a considerably higher percentage than I'm seeing, but my sample isn't
commuters. It's mostly folks riding for exercise, with varying levels of zeal.
Some appear to be training for a race, some are just out for a pleasant jaunt,
a few are trying to keep their doctors quiet. The crowd seems to have grown a
lot in the last six months and I _think_ that's where the DRLs are coming from.

But I'd say that it's not so much that they bought a DRL specifically,
it's more that they have a light that includes a DRL mode and they just
turn it on whenever on the bike.

That's an active choice, not a passive one. There must be _some_ percieved
benefit....right or wrong 8-) It takes thought and effort to flip the switch
and charge the battery.

The DRLs that have a "breathe" mode for the DRL are really nice as they
are less harsh than a strobe because it's a lower intensity and not
flashing all the way on and off. It's similar to what motorcycles do
with a modulated headlight in the daytime.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4001009456851.html is the battery
powered light I'm using the most. I also have dynamo wheels on two
bicycle so for short rides I can always be ready to go.

For my mountain bike/gravel bike I'm using a 26650 single cell
flashlight https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07MP9RTHM but no breathe mode. I
use it on low-power steady mode because the strobe is too annoying. I
built a mount for it out of two conduit clamps and heat-shrink tubing,
and it's super secure on the handlebars, much better than often flimsy
plastic mounts.

As a driver I really appreciate cyclists that use DRLs, it makes a big
difference in their visibility in most situations. Which is of course
why most states have had laws requiring DRLs for motorcycles for many
decades.

It's safe to say that anyone riding a bicycle but not using a DRL is
standing in the way of human progress :-7 .


I wouldn't go quite that far....More a case of it can't hurt, and might help.

Thanks for replying,

bob prohaska

John B. wrote:
On Wed, 7 Oct 2020 00:16:02 +0000 (UTC), Ralph Barone
wrote:

John B. wrote:
On Tue, 6 Oct 2020 13:11:52 -0700, sms
wrote:

On 10/5/2020 3:56 PM, John B. wrote:

snip

And beware of those with pre-conceived notions that deny reality.

You don't live here so you should not be talking trash about either
Donald Trump or Frank.

Why ever not? I'm a citizen of the U.S. I served my country for 20
years in the military and fought in two wars that the U.S. started.

I think that I'm as qualified as some obese politician to comment on
U.S. fallacies.

When Americans stop talking trash about anything outside their own borders,
I’ll consider not commenting on what goes on inside their borders.

Good Lord! Are you telling us that you think that the news agencies
are telling lies?

But more seriously, USians are rather famous for ignorance about
things outside their borders, sometimes outside their state (province)
borders :-)

Just asserting my First Amendment rights :-)

On Tuesday, October 6, 2020 at 5:26:53 PM UTC-4, Radey Shouman wrote:

France did try to implement decimal time, shortly after the revolution.
For some reason it never took off, and we've been stuck on base 60 since
Sumer was a leading capital.

That's a point that's been of interest to me. I decided the effort might have failed just because units of
time are probably the units most used in daily life and communication. And I may be wrong, but I suspect
that the base 60 system was default throughout most of the civilized world, unlike (say) units of distance.
So changing units of time may have been just too difficult to pull off.

- Frank Krygowski

On 10/6/2020 3:03 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Tuesday, October 6, 2020 at 10:34:23 AM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 10/6/2020 12:06 PM, Lou Holtman wrote:
Op dinsdag 6 oktober 2020 om 17:55:14 UTC+2 schreef Frank Krygowski:
On 10/6/2020 11:37 AM, Lou Holtman wrote:
Op dinsdag 6 oktober 2020 om 17:26:27 UTC+2 schreef Frank Krygowski:
On 10/5/2020 11:30 PM, John B. wrote:
On Mon, 5 Oct 2020 21:34:03 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 10/5/2020 4:18 PM, Ted Heise wrote:
On Mon, 5 Oct 2020 13:37:19 -0400,
Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 10/4/2020 10:37 PM, John B. wrote:
On Sun, 4 Oct 2020 21:45:07 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:
On 10/4/2020 8:49 PM, John B. wrote:
On Sun, 4 Oct 2020 23:56:08 -0000 (UTC), bob prohaska
wrote:

In the past year or so it seems to me that riders using
daytime running lights are considerably more numerous. Has
anybody else noticed the same thing? Last year at this time
I think maybe one bike in ten had them, now it seems close
to one in three or four, at least on some days.

Over here I don't think I've ever seeing anyone with a white
front light but red "tail lights" seem to have become the
norm.

But I do believe that anything that makes the bicyclist more
noticeable would be a good thing.

Yes, I've noticed more DRLs. For one thing, every e-bike I
encounter seems to be running with its headlight on. But I
see a few roadies running daytime headlights, and more of
them running taillights.

But I disagree with John's final sentence. A guy running a
headlight when out on a lonely country road in bright
daylight? That's a "good thing" only for the companies
involved in the light sale. It does no real good for the
cyclist.

You missed the part about "makes the bicyclist more noticeable
would be a good thing"? Obviously if the cyclist is "more
noticeable" there must be those who would notice him/her/it.

Noticing a cyclist who is two blocks away confers no benefit.

Well, "two blocks" is covered pretty darn quickly at highway
speeds, so perhaps there is some benefit in being seen at greater
distance.

If the cyclist is two blocks (say, 1000 ft) away and moving just 12 mph
in the same direction as a 55 mph car, it takes over 15 seconds for the
car to reach the cyclist. 15 seconds is quite a long time in driving.
Count it out to visualize it.

But, but...The discussion was about a white light on the front of a
bicycle so your figures are not correct, it is actually closer to 10
seconds and for someone talking, reading a message or texting, on a
phone that isn't a very long time. And... some 26% of traffic
accidents are a result of hand phone use while driving.
Better double check your math, John. 1000 ft divided by 43 miles per
hour (= closing speed) times 3600 seconds per hour divided by 5280 feet
per mile.


--
- Frank Krygowski

Ah, I love those units...
Yes, we have barnyards full of them. Hogsheads and barrels and chains
and furlongs and candles...

I was noted for spending quite a bit of time teaching about unit
conversions within calculations. I imagine that's a much shorter topic
in your schools.

Well we had to learn what kilo, milli, micro, deci, hecto, pico, nano etc means.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metric_prefix

Don't underestimate that ;-)

Lou



Sometimes a few magnitudes make no difference at all:

https://nypost.com/2020/10/05/biden-...m-coronavirus/

But when The President says, 'Nice day', there's a crowd
lined up to call him a liar because it rained somewhere.

Or they're lined up because Trump lies a lot. I mean really, putting aside partisanship -- which I CAN do when it comes to taking Trump out of context or giving weight to his ill-advised riffing or just being wrong -- Trump just lies a lot. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Veraci...y_Donald_Trump Demonstrable, provable lies. The guy is pathological, which I totally expect from a NY real estate developer. Lying is the first language of these guys. Biden may lie, but the alt-right media goes after him for just bumbling or being wrong. If he actually lies, go get him. Liars should be called out.

Even if you like Trump's policies (who doesn't like a tax break and hate immigrants), at some point, you just have to say enough is enough. I've dumped high paying clients because I couldn't take the lying and drama. I'll take a revenue hit to get some peace and quiet. I'd vote for a normal Republican if there were one left, say Eisenhower. I'd even vote for Hoover, who was actually a great humanitarian, although a little late with stimulus when it came to the great depression.

+1.

I'm intensely disappointed that so many Republicans have bludgeoned
their consciences into submission to defend and even join his lying
hypocrisy.

--
- Frank Krygowski

On 10/6/2020 9:41 PM, bob prohaska wrote:
sms wrote:
On 10/4/2020 4:56 PM, bob prohaska wrote:
In the past year or so it seems to me that riders using daytime running lights
are considerably more numerous. Has anybody else noticed the same thing? Last
year at this time I think maybe one bike in ten had them, now it seems close
to one in three or four, at least on some days.

Thanks for reading,

bob prohaska

In my area (SF Bay Area, I'd estimate that more than 50% of commuters
and more serious recreational cyclists use DRLs.


That's a considerably higher percentage than I'm seeing, but my sample isn't
commuters. It's mostly folks riding for exercise, with varying levels of zeal.
Some appear to be training for a race, some are just out for a pleasant jaunt,
a few are trying to keep their doctors quiet. The crowd seems to have grown a
lot in the last six months and I _think_ that's where the DRLs are coming from.

Around here, I'd estimate fewer than 5% of cyclists run DRLs. Fewer than
2% run daytime headlights. Of those that run the headlights, most seem
to be e-bike users (do they turn on by default?). Next most are roadies,
but again most roadies do not.

This area tends to be late jumping onto trends.


--
- Frank Krygowski

Lou Holtman writes:

Op dinsdag 6 oktober 2020 om 23:26:53 UTC+2 schreef Radey Shouman:
Ralph Barone writes:

Lou Holtman wrote:
Op dinsdag 6 oktober 2020 om 17:26:27 UTC+2 schreef Frank Krygowski:
On 10/5/2020 11:30 PM, John B. wrote:
On Mon, 5 Oct 2020 21:34:03 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 10/5/2020 4:18 PM, Ted Heise wrote:
On Mon, 5 Oct 2020 13:37:19 -0400,
Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 10/4/2020 10:37 PM, John B. wrote:
On Sun, 4 Oct 2020 21:45:07 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:
On 10/4/2020 8:49 PM, John B. wrote:
On Sun, 4 Oct 2020 23:56:08 -0000 (UTC), bob prohaska
wrote:

In the past year or so it seems to me that riders using
daytime running lights are considerably more numerous. Has
anybody else noticed the same thing? Last year at this time
I think maybe one bike in ten had them, now it seems close
to one in three or four, at least on some days.

Over here I don't think I've ever seeing anyone with a white
front light but red "tail lights" seem to have become the
norm.

But I do believe that anything that makes the bicyclist more
noticeable would be a good thing.

Yes, I've noticed more DRLs. For one thing, every e-bike I
encounter seems to be running with its headlight on. But I
see a few roadies running daytime headlights, and more of
them running taillights.

But I disagree with John's final sentence. A guy running a
headlight when out on a lonely country road in bright
daylight? That's a "good thing" only for the companies
involved in the light sale. It does no real good for the
cyclist.

You missed the part about "makes the bicyclist more noticeable
would be a good thing"? Obviously if the cyclist is "more
noticeable" there must be those who would notice him/her/it.

Noticing a cyclist who is two blocks away confers no benefit.

Well, "two blocks" is covered pretty darn quickly at highway
speeds, so perhaps there is some benefit in being seen at greater
distance.

If the cyclist is two blocks (say, 1000 ft) away and moving just 12 mph
in the same direction as a 55 mph car, it takes over 15 seconds for the
car to reach the cyclist. 15 seconds is quite a long time in driving.
Count it out to visualize it.

But, but...The discussion was about a white light on the front of a
bicycle so your figures are not correct, it is actually closer to 10
seconds and for someone talking, reading a message or texting, on a
phone that isn't a very long time. And... some 26% of traffic
accidents are a result of hand phone use while driving.
Better double check your math, John. 1000 ft divided by 43 miles per
hour (= closing speed) times 3600 seconds per hour divided by 5280 feet
per mile.


--
- Frank Krygowski

Ah, I love those units...

Lou


There’s still a 3.6 conversion factor if you do it in metric.
France did try to implement decimal time, shortly after the revolution.
For some reason it never took off, and we've been stuck on base 60 since
Sumer was a leading capital.


If they proposed it today I would be in favor. Rode 86 km in
2hr45min36sec. Average speed on my RPN calculator:
2 enter 45 enter 60 / + 36 enter 60 / 60 /+ 1/x 86 * tada 31.16 km/hr..... pfff.
It could have been 86 enter 2.76 /

I have a Neandertal bike computer, which shows decimal miles (miles and
feet or yards or rods would be insane), and, naturally, sexagesimal elapsed
time. Sometimes there is something in my head that wants time to roll
over at 99, or miles at 59.

On the other hand, even converting 24 hour time to 12 hour time requires
some mental effort -- I know exactly what 8:00pm is, but 20:00 requires,
for me, a bit of thought. Converting to decimal hours, much less
decimal months, would be a struggle.