Anyone Seen Tom K???

Tom Kunich wrote:
"SLAVE of THE STATE" wrote in message
...

"Fiscal Responsibility" -- those words don't mean what Jesus Budda
Obama thinks they mean.

You mean that they don't mean that he can spend trillions of money we
don't have putting our great grandchildren under debt?



"Reagan proved deficits don't matter, we won the midterms. This is our
due."

- Dick Cheney

On Feb 26, 10:35*am, Fred Fredburger
wrote:
Tom Kunich wrote:
"SLAVE of THE STATE" wrote in message
...

"Fiscal Responsibility" -- those words don't mean what Jesus Budda
Obama thinks they mean.

You mean that they don't mean that he can spend trillions of money we
don't have putting our great grandchildren under debt?

"Reagan proved deficits don't matter, we won the midterms. This is our
due."

- Dick Cheney

I really want to know what the fear mongering and demand that we all
accept the disatser that's falling over all of us when we have finally
reacheived the glory of the end of the Carter utopia but without the
massive runaway inflation and I keep hearing what a great President
our Georgia boy was these days. How'd dismantling the intelligence
services work out in the long run too?:

http://www.cnbc.com/id/29031085

Bushy fear mongered over terrorists, Obama is massively fear
mongering over the economy and both are wildy overblown in the long
term threat, or depth of current threat to push their agendas. I
thought that was supposed to end when Bush left office.
We can only hope that Obama doesn't decide that "Hey Roosevelt used a
world war to get the economy moving again, so that'll work for us."
Had enough of that **** the last 8 years.
What happened to "all you have to fear is fear itself" and " ask not
what your Country can do for you, but what you can do for your
Country".
Both are as dead as sacrifice, any real understanding of what is
actually NEEDED to make ends meet, and what a real economic disaster
looks like. The folks who survived the great depression, sacrificed
for, and fought ww2 truly were our greatest generation, and didn't
believe the were owed the whole entitlement culture. We are so friggin
spoiled it's ridiculous, and yes that includes me too. A horrible day
today is massively better for the vast majority of Americans than a
good day in 1932 was, let alone during the war with everything being
rationed, people using their scarce resources to buy war bonds to
support the troops and Country etc...
We are soft as ****, spoiled, whiny, manhugging, bromancing, brats
who have totally tossd personal responsibility, and individualism out
the window, and Obama is fear mongering like hell to move us massively
farther in that direction.
The other side of the coin is the idiots on the other side of the
aisle who think the only thing Madoff and the others did wrong was get
caught. Their solution was to reduce the oversight, and we just need
more of that now to fix the problem. Oh yeah I forgot their other
argument that "It's all Barney Frank's fault!" had nothing to do with
their do whatever the hell you can get away with, and grab everything
you can in the short term, screw the long term good I gotta get mine
NOW attitude they promoted, lauded, and are still defending.
I can't believe that Americans are lining up believing that Obama can
give them everything, from the government, take care of all their
needs, and still, after handing all that out still cut the deficit in
half in the next 3 1/2 years too, but it's impossible to overestimate
the power of human greed and stupidity.

It's as much our fault as the scum who just took advantage of our
total lack of self reliance, responsibility, greed, and feelings of
entitlement.

Let Fear Ring out to go with the hands out!

Bill C


“Only Thing We Have to Fear Is Fear Itself”: FDR’s First Inaugural
Address

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VB6hLg3PRbY

On Feb 26, 9:03*am, Bill C wrote:
On Feb 26, 10:35*am, Fred Fredburger

wrote:
Tom Kunich wrote:
"SLAVE of THE STATE" wrote in message
....

"Fiscal Responsibility" -- those words don't mean what Jesus Budda
Obama thinks they mean.

You mean that they don't mean that he can spend trillions of money we
don't have putting our great grandchildren under debt?

"Reagan proved deficits don't matter, we won the midterms. This is our
due."

- Dick Cheney

I really want to know what the fear mongering and demand that we all
accept the disatser that's falling over all of us when we have finally
reacheived the glory of the end of the Carter utopia but without the
massive runaway inflation and I keep hearing what a great President
our Georgia boy was these days. How'd dismantling the intelligence
services work out in the long run too?:

http://www.cnbc.com/id/29031085

*Bushy fear mongered over terrorists, Obama is massively fear
mongering over the economy


snip



Dumbass -


Obama is not fear mongering on the economy.

If anything, the problems with the financial system are being
understated. They're not going to tell the public the extent of the
problem because the psychology of it might result in a self-
reinforcing feedback loop resulting in a total collapse of the global
economy.

There are over $20 trillion in mortgage related deriavatives out
there.


thanks,

K. Gringioni.

"Bill C" wrote in message
...

Bushy fear mongered over terrorists, Obama is massively fear
mongering over the economy and both are wildy overblown in the long
term threat, or depth of current threat to push their agendas. I
thought that was supposed to end when Bush left office.

Oh sure. After all, it's done that every election year since I was born.

We can only hope that Obama doesn't decide that "Hey Roosevelt used a
world war to get the economy moving again, so that'll work for us."
Had enough of that **** the last 8 years.

What exactly do you think is going to happen when Obama pulls us out of
Iraq, turning it over to the radicals in essence, and Israel finally has to
take actions against the nuclear weapons being built in Iran?

Everyone that thinks that the USA won't be dragged into a nuclear war raise
your hands.

"K. Gringioni" wrote in message
...

Obama is not fear mongering on the economy.

Ahh, yes, the financial guru speaketh.

There are over $20 trillion in mortgage related deriavatives out
there.

Of course over 90% of them are perfectly good loans but let's not worry
about that now. Let's let a complete and utter fool fear monger about it
here.

On Feb 26, 1:47*pm, "K. Gringioni" wrote:


Dumbass -

Obama is not fear mongering on the economy.

If anything, the problems with the financial system are being
understated. They're not going to tell the public the extent of the
problem because the psychology of it might result in a self-
reinforcing feedback loop *resulting in a total collapse of the global
economy.

There are over $20 trillion in mortgage related deriavatives out
there.

thanks,

K. Gringioni.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Dumbass there aren't massive numbers of folks diving off buildings.
It's a mess, but the worst case scenario here in the US would still be
better than the conditions huge portions of the globe live in daily.
It's not a good situation by any means but it sure as hell isn't
anything close to the thirties, or anything that requires totally
uprooting 200 years of American independence and replacing it all with
the governments controlling hand, because whoever controls the food
and shelter controls the people.
Tell me what people NEED other than liveable basic shelter, food that
meets the basic nutrition requirements, basic health care, the ability
to be safe while attempting to live your life, and I'll toss in
education for the long haul, though the mass of illegals willing to
risk their lives coming here to take jobs spoiled Americans scorn, and
who don't have American "education" put that one on shaky ground.
Little to none of those things were available in the thirties until
FDR started to provide them, but he also required folks to work for
them in the various work camps, and people were glad to be able to
help themselves. Not any more, they demand what we owe them because
they were born here, and nothing more.
I really thought of you and TK's total lack of understanding when I
was reading this the other day:

http://edition.cnn.com/2009/US/02/23....parents.ohio/

Chinese mothers lose children, livelihoods in fatal wreck

I can't even begin to explain how much respect and sympathy for them,
and the cultural approach I have for them. It really goes well with
what I was exposed to by my Grandparents who raised me on a day to day
basis until I was about 12 when I was old enough to be "productive"
working at the farm for my father which is when I started spending
summers there instead of just occasional weekends.
Maybe it's having been raised by with rock solid values by people who
never had much money, but family helped each other, and neighbors,
even if they didn't have much to give. Didn't want to "owe", or "take
handouts" from the government when others were worse off and they
could meet their basic needs, and give the kids more than they had.
I really wish those women, and their families, and their priorities
were Americans, would be proud to have them, and desperately hope that
the community there can come together and raise money to help them
out. There's almost never a time that you can't, no matter how bad
things are in your life, do something to help out others. That's
pretty much gone here in America.
I guess the difference we see is that I set the bar massively lower
on what is needed to have a good life from the material standpoint and
where even an almost complete meltdown would put that bar here in what
is still and incredibly rich land in resources, skills, agriculture,
and people. What's missing is the drive, ethic, appreciation, and
willingness to work, sacrifice, and do what it takes to help others
in a community and the Country get better, and be a better place.
Since the early 60s it's been more about ME, and what I want to do.
The previous ethic was, and still is brutally attacked, as has been
the concept of America as something good by the "progressive" folks
who can't find much of anything good to say about us. Combine that
with the comeback, and enabling of the get rich at all costs, get
mine, do anything it takes greed is a virtue "conservative" crowd and
we are in the mess we are in.
The whole mess is easily summed up in the catchphrase "He who dies
with the most toys wins.", "Status symbols" and the NEED for them to
be seen as a success and what people will do to get them are another
great example of the skewed values that are important. Noone NEEDS
Ball's jeans, or other designer **** but kids will be bullied and
harrassed for not having Levis or the current "in" sneaker, how ****ed
up is that? When we were butying **** at Salvation Army the question I
was always asked was "Will these cover your ass as well as any of
those others?" when I objected. The reality is many were better from a
practical viewpoint and I'd occasionally get a pair of those Levis,
and they were already "pre-washed" without having to pay a premium for
it.
Americans need a HUGE reality check, and lots of folks can see it
coming in the long run. I liked this article and another I can't find
now that takes into account the greying of the country, the debt
service, long term prospects for employing most Americans, health care
costs, etc...:

http://economistsview.typepad.com/ec...ke_will_w.html

No matter how you slice it I can't see any reasons at all for optimism
a couple of generations from now here. Once the baby boom generation
die off and the population becomes younger overall, hopefully
healthier, etc...then the cycle could go positive again, but setting
that up is going to require a spirit of, and a willingness to make the
hard sacrifices for the long term good and I just don't see that in
the culture here today. There's nowhere near the respect for America
as a concept today that people are willing to sacrifice for it since
huge portions of the US have no agenda other than convincing us, and
the kids how bad the US sucks, and how historically we are tyhe most
evil Country ever. Unfortunately lots of these folks are running US
education both primary and higher. If the concept sucks why should
anyone sacrifice for it? Combine that with the miniscule attention
span, entitlement culture, short term thinking, and selfishness that
are the core of the Country today how the hell can you be optimistic.
The problem is the core cultural values we've morphed into, whereas
other Countries have caught up, and integrated respect for society,
education, work ethic, pride in craftsmanship, in varying degrees
while we've gone the other direction.
Bill C

On Feb 26, 11:51*am, "Tom Kunich" cyclintom@yahoo. com wrote:
"K. Gringioni" wrote in message

...



Obama is not fear mongering on the economy.

Ahh, yes, the financial guru speaketh.

There are over $20 trillion in mortgage related deriavatives out
there.

Of course over 90% of them are perfectly good loans but let's not worry
about that now. Let's let a complete and utter fool fear monger about it
here.



Dumbass -


The number of homes in foreclosure in some areas like Las Vegas is 7%.
That doesn't count the percentage which *will* be in foreclosure. Here
in San Diego the median price last month was slightly below $300,000.
That is down from a high of $550,000. There will be more and more
homes being let go by their owners.

There is a problem with attempting to analyze the extent of the
problem and that is: no one knows how many homes will foreclose in the
future. If it were possible, the banks would do the risk calculation
and begin cooperating with each other again.

They're not doing that because they don't know.

What the Obama Administration and the Bush Administration were/are
attempting to do is prevent the psychology of the situation from
entering the downward feedback loop. The stimulus package is aimed at
people's psyches.

If any administration, Democrat or Republican, did nothing right now,
the entire thing would go down the drain. They're not fear mongering.
What they aren't doing is avoiding telling the public just how bad the
situation really is.


thanks,

K. Gringioni.

On Feb 26, 12:49*pm, Bill C wrote:
On Feb 26, 1:47*pm, "K. Gringioni" wrote:







Dumbass -

Obama is not fear mongering on the economy.

If anything, the problems with the financial system are being
understated. They're not going to tell the public the extent of the
problem because the psychology of it might result in a self-
reinforcing feedback loop *resulting in a total collapse of the global
economy.

There are over $20 trillion in mortgage related deriavatives out
there.

thanks,

K. Gringioni.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Dumbass there aren't massive numbers of folks diving off buildings.
It's a mess, but the worst case scenario here in the US would still be
better than the conditions huge portions of the globe live in daily.
It's not a good situation by any means but it sure as hell isn't
anything close to the thirties, or anything that requires totally
uprooting 200 years of American independence and replacing it all with
the governments controlling hand, because whoever controls the food
and shelter controls the people.




Dumbass -


You're not understanding.

It's not the thirties yet. That's what they're trying to prevent. If
people knew the true extent of the structural problems with the banks,
there's the danger they "hunker down" and stop spending entirely,
except on necessities. Then the contracting economy becomes a self
fulfilling prophecy and it contracts more and more, then people hunker
down more and more, etc.

The banks understand the structural problems. That's why they aren't
loaning to each other.

If the stimulus package doesn't break the logjam in the financial
system, then the economy will contract this year, contract the next
year, and there's the danger of the mass psychology totally
deteriorating.

It's happened many times throughout history. Our country has been
through 3-4 major economic contractions (depending upon how you define
it). The thirties were only the latest.

Economies are run by human beings. The only difference between the
economies back then and the one now is the one now is more
complicated. But: it's still run by Human Beings and mass human
psychology is sill the same.

They might be able to prevent it. If they did nothing, there would be
a major contraction, just like the thirties.

Once again, the thirties were not an anomaly. It happens periodically.
The historical cycle has been 60-70 years. Maybe they can prevent it,
but history is against it.


thanks,

K. Gringioni.

Tom Kunich wrote:
"K. Gringioni" wrote in message
...

Obama is not fear mongering on the economy.

Ahh, yes, the financial guru speaketh.

There are over $20 trillion in mortgage related deriavatives out
there.

Of course over 90% of them are perfectly good loans but let's not worry
about that now. Let's let a complete and utter fool fear monger about it
here.


The Bush and the Obama administrations were in agreement over the
financial disasters.

Both the Republican and Democratic parties agree that a large deficit is
needed now, although they quibble over the particulars to please their
supporters.

This bipartisan agreement indicates that something novel is going on.

"Fred Fredburger" wrote in message
...

This bipartisan agreement indicates that something novel is going on.

Yes, it means that socialism has taken over the entire political system.