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Campy B.B. compatibility



 
 
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  #1  
Old August 18th 19, 06:21 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
daleb
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Posts: 3
Default Campy B.B. compatibility

I currently have a Campy centaur 115.5mm bottom bracket on my ride that is built from slightly oversized titanium tubing (Habanero) with Centaur double cranks. Would a Phil 110.5mm work on this bike? 115.5mm PW's are hard to come by.
Thanks.
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  #2  
Old August 18th 19, 06:43 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
AMuzi
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Posts: 10,700
Default Campy B.B. compatibility

On 8/18/2019 12:21 PM, daleb wrote:
I currently have a Campy centaur 115.5mm bottom bracket on my ride that is built from slightly oversized titanium tubing (Habanero) with Centaur double cranks. Would a Phil 110.5mm work on this bike? 115.5mm PW's are hard to come by.
Thanks.


Centaur double spec is 111mm, the alternate wide chainline
option was 115.5.

You might measure the chainline and check that your front
changer is able to move 2mm+ farther inside before buying
that 110. Front changer adjustment range is your likely
sticking point in that application and the most likely
reason the builder used the 115.5 spindle.

Yes, Phil can be shifted laterally but buying the right part
is so much better than fudging later since they all cost the
same.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


  #3  
Old August 18th 19, 07:19 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
daleb
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Posts: 3
Default Campy B.B. compatibility

On Sunday, August 18, 2019 at 12:43:51 PM UTC-5, AMuzi wrote:
On 8/18/2019 12:21 PM, daleb wrote:
I currently have a Campy centaur 115.5mm bottom bracket on my ride that is built from slightly oversized titanium tubing (Habanero) with Centaur double cranks. Would a Phil 110.5mm work on this bike? 115.5mm PW's are hard to come by.
Thanks.


Centaur double spec is 111mm, the alternate wide chainline
option was 115.5.

You might measure the chainline and check that your front
changer is able to move 2mm+ farther inside before buying
that 110. Front changer adjustment range is your likely
sticking point in that application and the most likely
reason the builder used the 115.5 spindle.

Yes, Phil can be shifted laterally but buying the right part
is so much better than fudging later since they all cost the
same.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


By backing off the low limit screw and reducing the tension on the derailleur cable, I can make the chain drop off the small chain ring onto the BB, so I should have enough movement to use the shorter BB.

BTW, as I recall, I had the bike built up at your old location in Madison in the early 2000s. Has worked great but am planning to rebuild the entire bike this winter with NOS parts I've collected over the years.
Thanks.
  #4  
Old August 18th 19, 08:02 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
[email protected]
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Posts: 1,524
Default Campy B.B. compatibility

On Sunday, August 18, 2019 at 12:21:53 PM UTC-5, daleb wrote:
I currently have a Campy centaur 115.5mm bottom bracket on my ride that is built from slightly oversized titanium tubing (Habanero) with Centaur double cranks. Would a Phil 110.5mm work on this bike? 115.5mm PW's are hard to come by.
Thanks.


I'd take Andy's comments into consideration. But, if you have a 115.5mm Campagnolo bottom bracket, why not just put another one in if you want. Why F around with Phil Wood. I know some people worship their crap. I'm not one of them. See links below. Just use Campagnolo bottom brackets with Campagnolo cranksets. Life is easier and better if you don't make up and imagine fictitious problems.

https://planetcyclery.com/campagnolo...SABEgL2DPD_BwE
$23.95 for Veloce 115.5mm. This seems real simple doesn't it.


https://www.chainreactioncycles.com/us/en/campagnolo-centaur-tapered-bottom-bracket/rp-prod165441?gs=1&sku=sku611166&pgrid=54137515364&pt aid=pla-431312527100&utm_source=google&utm_term=&utm_campa ign=PLA+All+Products&utm_medium=base&utm_content=m kwid|sVYur0OM1_dc|pcrid|253659801802|pkw||pmt||prd |611166US&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI04Dqo4uN5AIVlR-tBh18SgduEAQYAyABEgJG_fD_BwE
Both Centaur lengths. 111 and 115. Get whatever size you want. Same length, or shorter if you want to reduce Q factor. Campagnolo brand, so you know it works right.
  #5  
Old August 18th 19, 08:07 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
[email protected]
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Posts: 1,524
Default Campy B.B. compatibility

On Sunday, August 18, 2019 at 2:02:07 PM UTC-5, wrote:
On Sunday, August 18, 2019 at 12:21:53 PM UTC-5, daleb wrote:
I currently have a Campy centaur 115.5mm bottom bracket on my ride that is built from slightly oversized titanium tubing (Habanero) with Centaur double cranks. Would a Phil 110.5mm work on this bike? 115.5mm PW's are hard to come by.
Thanks.


I'd take Andy's comments into consideration. But, if you have a 115.5mm Campagnolo bottom bracket, why not just put another one in if you want. Why F around with Phil Wood. I know some people worship their crap. I'm not one of them. See links below. Just use Campagnolo bottom brackets with Campagnolo cranksets. Life is easier and better if you don't make up and imagine fictitious problems.

https://planetcyclery.com/campagnolo...SABEgL2DPD_BwE
$23.95 for Veloce 115.5mm. This seems real simple doesn't it.


https://www.chainreactioncycles.com/us/en/campagnolo-centaur-tapered-bottom-bracket/rp-prod165441?gs=1&sku=sku611166&pgrid=54137515364&pt aid=pla-431312527100&utm_source=google&utm_term=&utm_campa ign=PLA+All+Products&utm_medium=base&utm_content=m kwid|sVYur0OM1_dc|pcrid|253659801802|pkw||pmt||prd |611166US&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI04Dqo4uN5AIVlR-tBh18SgduEAQYAyABEgJG_fD_BwE
Both Centaur lengths. 111 and 115. Get whatever size you want. Same length, or shorter if you want to reduce Q factor. Campagnolo brand, so you know it works right.




https://www.wiggle.com/campagnolo-ce...ottom-bracket/
Here is another link to both Centaur lengths. 111 and 115mm.
  #6  
Old August 18th 19, 08:12 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,524
Default Campy B.B. compatibility

On Sunday, August 18, 2019 at 2:07:18 PM UTC-5, wrote:
On Sunday, August 18, 2019 at 2:02:07 PM UTC-5, wrote:
On Sunday, August 18, 2019 at 12:21:53 PM UTC-5, daleb wrote:
I currently have a Campy centaur 115.5mm bottom bracket on my ride that is built from slightly oversized titanium tubing (Habanero) with Centaur double cranks. Would a Phil 110.5mm work on this bike? 115.5mm PW's are hard to come by.
Thanks.


I'd take Andy's comments into consideration. But, if you have a 115.5mm Campagnolo bottom bracket, why not just put another one in if you want. Why F around with Phil Wood. I know some people worship their crap. I'm not one of them. See links below. Just use Campagnolo bottom brackets with Campagnolo cranksets. Life is easier and better if you don't make up and imagine fictitious problems.

https://planetcyclery.com/campagnolo...SABEgL2DPD_BwE
$23.95 for Veloce 115.5mm. This seems real simple doesn't it.


https://www.chainreactioncycles.com/us/en/campagnolo-centaur-tapered-bottom-bracket/rp-prod165441?gs=1&sku=sku611166&pgrid=54137515364&pt aid=pla-431312527100&utm_source=google&utm_term=&utm_campa ign=PLA+All+Products&utm_medium=base&utm_content=m kwid|sVYur0OM1_dc|pcrid|253659801802|pkw||pmt||prd |611166US&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI04Dqo4uN5AIVlR-tBh18SgduEAQYAyABEgJG_fD_BwE
Both Centaur lengths. 111 and 115. Get whatever size you want. Same length, or shorter if you want to reduce Q factor. Campagnolo brand, so you know it works right.




https://www.wiggle.com/campagnolo-ce...ottom-bracket/
Here is another link to both Centaur lengths. 111 and 115mm.



https://www.sigmasports.com/item/Cam...m-Bracket/20PY
And another link to both Centaur lengths. 111 and 115mm.


https://www.modernbike.com/campagnol...bottom-bracket
115mm Centaur.

https://www.modernbike.com/campagnol...bottom-bracket
111mm Centaur.
  #7  
Old August 18th 19, 08:37 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Tom Kunich[_5_]
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Posts: 778
Default Campy B.B. compatibility

On Sunday, August 18, 2019 at 10:43:51 AM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 8/18/2019 12:21 PM, daleb wrote:
I currently have a Campy centaur 115.5mm bottom bracket on my ride that is built from slightly oversized titanium tubing (Habanero) with Centaur double cranks. Would a Phil 110.5mm work on this bike? 115.5mm PW's are hard to come by.
Thanks.


Centaur double spec is 111mm, the alternate wide chainline
option was 115.5.

You might measure the chainline and check that your front
changer is able to move 2mm+ farther inside before buying
that 110. Front changer adjustment range is your likely
sticking point in that application and the most likely
reason the builder used the 115.5 spindle.

Yes, Phil can be shifted laterally but buying the right part
is so much better than fudging later since they all cost the
same.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


The 115 BB was for the Campy Triple. The narrower version was for the double. But the Campy Taper was unique. I suppose he could be talking about the ISO BB which is a toothed arrangement but that wasn't clear.
  #8  
Old August 18th 19, 08:40 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Tom Kunich[_5_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 778
Default Campy B.B. compatibility

On Sunday, August 18, 2019 at 12:02:07 PM UTC-7, wrote:
On Sunday, August 18, 2019 at 12:21:53 PM UTC-5, daleb wrote:
I currently have a Campy centaur 115.5mm bottom bracket on my ride that is built from slightly oversized titanium tubing (Habanero) with Centaur double cranks. Would a Phil 110.5mm work on this bike? 115.5mm PW's are hard to come by.
Thanks.


I'd take Andy's comments into consideration. But, if you have a 115.5mm Campagnolo bottom bracket, why not just put another one in if you want. Why F around with Phil Wood. I know some people worship their crap. I'm not one of them. See links below. Just use Campagnolo bottom brackets with Campagnolo cranksets. Life is easier and better if you don't make up and imagine fictitious problems.

https://planetcyclery.com/campagnolo...SABEgL2DPD_BwE
$23.95 for Veloce 115.5mm. This seems real simple doesn't it.


https://www.chainreactioncycles.com/us/en/campagnolo-centaur-tapered-bottom-bracket/rp-prod165441?gs=1&sku=sku611166&pgrid=54137515364&pt aid=pla-431312527100&utm_source=google&utm_term=&utm_campa ign=PLA+All+Products&utm_medium=base&utm_content=m kwid|sVYur0OM1_dc|pcrid|253659801802|pkw||pmt||prd |611166US&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI04Dqo4uN5AIVlR-tBh18SgduEAQYAyABEgJG_fD_BwE
Both Centaur lengths. 111 and 115. Get whatever size you want. Same length, or shorter if you want to reduce Q factor. Campagnolo brand, so you know it works right.


I agree with you one Phil Wood. I have never seen a single advantage of them. Take the headset for example - you could buy a half dozen FSA's or the like for the same price and while the Phil Wood would last five lifetimes of the bike the FSA's would last just one lifetime. Isn't that enough?
  #9  
Old August 18th 19, 10:08 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
AMuzi
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,700
Default Campy B.B. compatibility

On 8/18/2019 2:37 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Sunday, August 18, 2019 at 10:43:51 AM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 8/18/2019 12:21 PM, daleb wrote:
I currently have a Campy centaur 115.5mm bottom bracket on my ride that is built from slightly oversized titanium tubing (Habanero) with Centaur double cranks. Would a Phil 110.5mm work on this bike? 115.5mm PW's are hard to come by.
Thanks.


Centaur double spec is 111mm, the alternate wide chainline
option was 115.5.

You might measure the chainline and check that your front
changer is able to move 2mm+ farther inside before buying
that 110. Front changer adjustment range is your likely
sticking point in that application and the most likely
reason the builder used the 115.5 spindle.

Yes, Phil can be shifted laterally but buying the right part
is so much better than fudging later since they all cost the
same.


The 115 BB was for the Campy Triple. The narrower version was for the double. But the Campy Taper was unique. I suppose he could be talking about the ISO BB which is a toothed arrangement but that wasn't clear.


That's not right.

Both double and triple MIR, VEL DAY and CEN arms run on the
same ACS/ACH spindle length, viz., 111mm with optional
115.5mm for fat frame tubes.

(Record Triple was a completely different and unrelated
forging with 109mm spindle vs 103mm for the Record and
Chorus doubles)

Crank arm designers in the modern world have amazing
latitude in arm shape to keep constant chainline with
shorter and shorter spindles:
http://www.yellowjersey.org/photosfromthepast/curve.jpg

In The Olden Days arms were flat-faced and a typical triple
spindle was 123~125mm.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


  #10  
Old August 18th 19, 10:48 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
AMuzi
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,700
Default Campy B.B. compatibility

On 8/18/2019 2:40 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Sunday, August 18, 2019 at 12:02:07 PM UTC-7, wrote:
On Sunday, August 18, 2019 at 12:21:53 PM UTC-5, daleb wrote:
I currently have a Campy centaur 115.5mm bottom bracket on my ride that is built from slightly oversized titanium tubing (Habanero) with Centaur double cranks. Would a Phil 110.5mm work on this bike? 115.5mm PW's are hard to come by.
Thanks.


I'd take Andy's comments into consideration. But, if you have a 115.5mm Campagnolo bottom bracket, why not just put another one in if you want. Why F around with Phil Wood. I know some people worship their crap. I'm not one of them. See links below. Just use Campagnolo bottom brackets with Campagnolo cranksets. Life is easier and better if you don't make up and imagine fictitious problems.

https://planetcyclery.com/campagnolo...SABEgL2DPD_BwE
$23.95 for Veloce 115.5mm. This seems real simple doesn't it.


https://www.chainreactioncycles.com/us/en/campagnolo-centaur-tapered-bottom-bracket/rp-prod165441?gs=1&sku=sku611166&pgrid=54137515364&pt aid=pla-431312527100&utm_source=google&utm_term=&utm_campa ign=PLA+All+Products&utm_medium=base&utm_content=m kwid|sVYur0OM1_dc|pcrid|253659801802|pkw||pmt||prd |611166US&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI04Dqo4uN5AIVlR-tBh18SgduEAQYAyABEgJG_fD_BwE
Both Centaur lengths. 111 and 115. Get whatever size you want. Same length, or shorter if you want to reduce Q factor. Campagnolo brand, so you know it works right.


I agree with you one Phil Wood. I have never seen a single advantage of them. Take the headset for example - you could buy a half dozen FSA's or the like for the same price and while the Phil Wood would last five lifetimes of the bike the FSA's would last just one lifetime. Isn't that enough?


p.s. spindle section for square taper :
http://www.yellowjersey.org/photosfr...t/3SPINDLE.JPG

The rightmost section is the original format for the first
French aluminum cranks before the war. Campagnolo adopted
that section (with shorter spindle length) to their first
Record aluminum crank, c.1960. It was the standard format
for almost all quality cranks[1] including Shimano Dura Ace,
Suntour and Sugino products until just a few years ago.

The same angle, same taper, different section[2] shown
center (smaller at the end) dominated melt-forged cranks
such as Sugino Maxy and Suntour VX starting around 1970. It
became the dominant inexpensive crank spindle format but was
never used for premium product (Campagnolo, Dura Ace, Sugino
75 etc).

For curious readers, the leftmost spindle in image is a
different steeper angle taper used for obsolete sandcast
aluminum crank arms which were a brief effort before
thixoform became ubiquitously inexpensive.

[1] The list is long. The original TA, then Stronglight,
Williams, Zeus, Favorit, Saavedra, GPM, Ofmega, SR Royal,
Nervar and private labels of many of those as well.

[2] variously with nut or with bolt, same fit.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


 




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