2 second rule on motorways

Andrew Marshall spoke:
Like that PPI-ambulance chasing firm that keeps ringing me? I've never
had PPI, my number is ex-directory and we're on the TPS list - that
means anyone ringing me is automatically a black-hat - but they just
don't seem to grasp this.

I got a text from one of those nefrubyrf yesterday. I've never had PPI
NAAW.

Not only that but they are rip-off skum of the first degree!
I had PPI on a credit card - something I wouldn't normally do but it was
pressure selling and I was EKS earning obscene amounts at the time, so
gave in.

Hard times in the recession brought a supply of tuits to look at
unnecessary expenditure and the PPI came to light. The FOS site gives
clear and easy destructions, which I followed, and it eventually went to
the FOS to adjudicate - they are very helpfull and easy to talk to, their
phone lines are land line numbers and you don't get to listen to aeons of
on-hold-muzak, and they got me several killoZu back.

It cost me nothing but a little time.

--
Rab C. Nesbit
The secret of life is honesty and fair dealing.
If you can fake that, you've got it made

On Feb 15, 9:34*am, R C Nesbit wrote:
Alex Heney spoke:

I was in a very dense, quite slow moving line of traffic passing the
results of a minor accident that was on the hard shoulder (with police
in attendance), Because I *was* looking further ahead, I saw something
"puff out" from ahead towards the central reservation , and had my
brakes on before the car in front of me. He was the in fact still
quick enough to be the first not to hit the one in front. It finished
up with SEVEN cars all piled into one another, and we hadn't been
doing more than about 40 to start with.

Forward observation can back-fire though.

M1 southbound one summer in 1980's. Lane 3 'making progress' 80mph-ish,
spotted trouble ahead, brake lights and much swerving, so slowed a
little and dropped into lane 2 and the cause of the cerfuffle became
apparent - and complete ring of a shed truck tyre sitting in the middle
of lane 3 - which the car still in lane 3 ahead of me completely failed
to notice, he hit it and flipped it neatly into the middle of lane 2
just ahead of me!

I had no choice or time to do anything other than drive straight over
it.

It took the bottom half of the radiator and most of the exhaust away!

--
Rab C. Nesbit
The secret of life is honesty and fair dealing.
If you can fake that, you've got it made

Yes, that is a situation where the OP's two second rule would be
inadequate, even at about 60mph.

I unforget an occasion when a general haulage artic was overtaking my
low loader coming down Shap southbound on the M6 one dark evening. I
was carrying an RB 28 crane with gib over the cab. I was in one gear
down from top, using the engine exhaust brake to control speed to save
my wheel brakes on the long decline. In the dipped beam headlights I
noticed something large, dark and static ahead in the middle lane a
fraction before the overtaking truck driver saw it too. I hit the
brakes and flashed my lights to give the overtaking truck room to get
into the nearside lane ahead of me to avoid it. He did so. The car
behind, unable to move into the third lane due to faster overtaking
traffic hacking down the incline as they do, ands with no room to get
into the nearside lane because of our waggons, with his eyes on his
mirror I guess, accelerated impatiently...... straight into a 45
gallon drum of oil standing upright in the middle carriageway.

It made a mess.

Tone

On Tue, 14 Feb 2012 23:01:22 +0000, Nightjar
wrote:

On 14/02/2012 21:46, Alex Heney wrote:
On Tue, 14 Feb 2012 09:07:22 +0000, Nightjar
snip



But again, it feels like one, particularly on a short journey.

As I was taught when first learning to drive, better late in this world
than early in the next.


Or as my father-in-law used to phrase it:

Better to be late than "the late".
--
Alex Heney, Global Villager
If a fly has no wings would you call him a walk?
To reply by email, my address is alexDOTheneyATgmailDOTcom

Tony Haynes wrote:
I unforget an occasion when a general haulage artic was overtaking my
low loader coming down Shap southbound on the M6 one dark evening.

I missed the turning off the M9 to get to the A1, so came down the
A74/M74/M6 last January in pelting rain and hurricaine winds.
With floodlights on I could bearly see more than a couple of car
lengths ahead of me, and was carefully trotting along at about 50MPH,
keeping everything at the far edge of visibility, with almost
everybody else powering past me at 70+ spewing up sheets of water as
they passed me.

JGH

On Wed, 15 Feb 2012 22:15:14 +0000, Alex Heney
wrote in :

Or as my father-in-law used to phrase it:

Better to be late than "the late".

A slogan they used in Queensland in the 50s:
"Better to be late than dead on time!"

--
Ivan Reid, School of Engineering & Design, _____________ CMS Collaboration,
Brunel University. ] Room 40-1-B12, CERN
KotPT -- "for stupidity above and beyond the call of duty".

On Feb 14, 9:07*am, Nightjar
wrote:
On 14/02/2012 07:36, Doug wrote:









On Feb 13, 9:30 am,
wrote:
On 13/02/2012 06:20, Doug wrote:

On Feb 13, 2:26 am,
wrote:
On 13/02/2012 00:40, Mr. Bean wrote:

I feel that that at 70mph, the 2 sec rule between cars is an inadequate
time to avoid a pile up.I would say more like 4 secs.

Two seconds is a pessimistic estimate of the perception and reaction
time of the average driver and is intended to ensure that you don't
drive into the back of the vehicle in front before you realise it is
doing something other than continuing along the road at the same speed.
It is not intended as a stopping distance, which would actually be close
to a three second gap, using the Highway Code's average stopping
distance table (stopping distance from 70mph = 315 feet : 70mph = 102
feet per second).

If you prefer a larger gap, there is nothing to stop you leaving one..

Except when your gap is taken by another impatient and dangerous
motorist.

That will happen with a two second gap as well. You simply drop back and
leave the same gap behind that one. It doesn't make any significant
difference to the journey time.

Agreed but it can add to the frustration as more and more drivers get
in front of you.

As I said, it makes no significant difference to the journey time, so
why should it create any frustration?

Maybe too it can make all the difference at red
lights where you can be further delayed....

Not many red lights on motorways and, in any case, the maximum
recommended red period for any light is 120 seconds - hardly a major delay.

I know most delays are usually short but there are still loads of
frustrated and angry motorists out there, revving their engines and
hooting.

My experiences with Critical Mass is that many motorists cannot
tolerate even short delays and become angry as a result.

Doug.

On 16/02/2012 06:00, Doug wrote:
On Feb 14, 9:07 am,
wrote:
On 14/02/2012 07:36, Doug wrote:
....
Not many red lights on motorways and, in any case, the maximum
recommended red period for any light is 120 seconds - hardly a major delay.

I know most delays are usually short but there are still loads of
frustrated and angry motorists out there, revving their engines and
hooting.

My experiences with Critical Mass is that many motorists cannot
tolerate even short delays and become angry as a result.

In that case, the annoyance is almost certainly not at the delay, but at
the people who are deliberately creating it.

Colin Bignell

"Doug" wrote in message
...
On Feb 14, 9:07 am, Nightjar
wrote:
On 14/02/2012 07:36, Doug wrote:









On Feb 13, 9:30 am,
wrote:
On 13/02/2012 06:20, Doug wrote:

On Feb 13, 2:26 am,
wrote:
On 13/02/2012 00:40, Mr. Bean wrote:

I feel that that at 70mph, the 2 sec rule between cars is an
inadequate
time to avoid a pile up.I would say more like 4 secs.

Two seconds is a pessimistic estimate of the perception and reaction
time of the average driver and is intended to ensure that you don't
drive into the back of the vehicle in front before you realise it is
doing something other than continuing along the road at the same
speed.
It is not intended as a stopping distance, which would actually be
close
to a three second gap, using the Highway Code's average stopping
distance table (stopping distance from 70mph = 315 feet : 70mph = 102
feet per second).

If you prefer a larger gap, there is nothing to stop you leaving one.

Except when your gap is taken by another impatient and dangerous
motorist.

That will happen with a two second gap as well. You simply drop back
and
leave the same gap behind that one. It doesn't make any significant
difference to the journey time.

Agreed but it can add to the frustration as more and more drivers get
in front of you.

As I said, it makes no significant difference to the journey time, so
why should it create any frustration?

Maybe too it can make all the difference at red
lights where you can be further delayed....

Not many red lights on motorways and, in any case, the maximum
recommended red period for any light is 120 seconds - hardly a major
delay.

I know most delays are usually short but there are still loads of
frustrated and angry motorists out there, revving their engines and
hooting.

My experiences with Critical Mass is that many motorists cannot
tolerate even short delays and become angry as a result.

And our experience with cyclists is that they cannot tolerate ANY delay at
all.

Aren't you dead, yet , Doug.?

Ian wrote:

"Doug" wrote in message
...
On Feb 14, 9:07 am, Nightjar
wrote:
On 14/02/2012 07:36, Doug wrote:









On Feb 13, 9:30 am,
wrote:
On 13/02/2012 06:20, Doug wrote:

On Feb 13, 2:26 am,
wrote:
On 13/02/2012 00:40, Mr. Bean wrote:

I feel that that at 70mph, the 2 sec rule between cars is an
inadequate
time to avoid a pile up.I would say more like 4 secs.

Two seconds is a pessimistic estimate of the perception and reaction
time of the average driver and is intended to ensure that you don't
drive into the back of the vehicle in front before you realise it is
doing something other than continuing along the road at the same
speed.
It is not intended as a stopping distance, which would actually be
close
to a three second gap, using the Highway Code's average stopping
distance table (stopping distance from 70mph = 315 feet : 70mph = 102
feet per second).

If you prefer a larger gap, there is nothing to stop you leaving one.

Except when your gap is taken by another impatient and dangerous
motorist.

That will happen with a two second gap as well. You simply drop back
and
leave the same gap behind that one. It doesn't make any significant
difference to the journey time.

Agreed but it can add to the frustration as more and more drivers get
in front of you.

As I said, it makes no significant difference to the journey time, so
why should it create any frustration?

Maybe too it can make all the difference at red
lights where you can be further delayed....

Not many red lights on motorways and, in any case, the maximum
recommended red period for any light is 120 seconds - hardly a major
delay.

I know most delays are usually short but there are still loads of
frustrated and angry motorists out there, revving their engines and
hooting.

Some motorists want to be in front at all costs, especially white box vans.
You can test this by e.g. driving up to the the speed limit on a 40mph road,
they will they overtake you at 50mph and slow down for the speed camera
further up. Maybe they're bored and this gives them something to do?

On Feb 15, 11:47*am, Tony Haynes wrote:
On Feb 15, 9:34*am, R C Nesbit wrote:





Alex Heney spoke:

I was in a very dense, quite slow moving line of traffic passing the
results of a minor accident that was on the hard shoulder (with police
in attendance), Because I *was* looking further ahead, I saw something
"puff out" from ahead towards the central reservation , and had my
brakes on before the car in front of me. He was the in fact still
quick enough to be the first not to hit the one in front. It finished
up with SEVEN cars all piled into one another, and we hadn't been
doing more than about 40 to start with.

Forward observation can back-fire though.

M1 southbound one summer in 1980's. Lane 3 'making progress' 80mph-ish,
spotted trouble ahead, brake lights and much swerving, so slowed a
little and dropped into lane 2 and the cause of the cerfuffle became
apparent - and complete ring of a shed truck tyre sitting in the middle
of lane 3 - which the car still in lane 3 ahead of me completely failed
to notice, he hit it and flipped it neatly into the middle of lane 2
just ahead of me!

I had no choice or time to do anything other than drive straight over
it.

It took the bottom half of the radiator and most of the exhaust away!

--
Rab C. Nesbit
The secret of life is honesty and fair dealing.
If you can fake that, you've got it made

Yes, that is a situation where the OP's two second rule would be
inadequate, even at about 60mph.

I unforget an occasion when a general haulage artic was overtaking my
low loader coming down Shap southbound on the M6 one dark evening. I
was carrying an RB 28 crane with gib over the cab. *I was in one gear
down from top, using the engine exhaust brake to control speed to save
my wheel brakes on the long decline. In the dipped beam headlights I
noticed something large, dark and static ahead in the middle lane a
fraction before the overtaking truck driver saw it too. *I hit the
brakes and flashed my lights to give the overtaking truck room to get
into the nearside lane ahead of me to avoid it. He did so. The car
behind, unable to move into the third lane due to faster overtaking
traffic hacking down the incline as they do, ands with no room to get
into the nearside lane because of our waggons, with his eyes on his
mirror I guess, *accelerated impatiently...... straight into a 45
gallon drum of oil standing upright in the middle carriageway.

It made a mess.

Lol!