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"Fuentes disputes positive" or How the USCF promotes doping...



 
 
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  #41  
Old August 7th 04, 02:54 AM
hold my beer and watch this...
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Default "Fuentes disputes positive" or How the USCF promotes doping...


"Amit" wrote in message

they should combine the samples from each rider with their teamates
and just test those. if a team fails they're DQ'd.


That's typically referred to as a composite sample and, for sensitive tests,
represents a good way to get more bang for your testing buck. There are
trade-offs with this approach, though: You if you get a positive, you don't
know who actually provided the 'hot' sample. Your limit of detection for
any single assay/analyte is also raised by a factor equal to the number of
samples used to make the composite. Plus, I doubt that the proper
authorities allow you to composite samples from multiple athletes.



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  #43  
Old August 7th 04, 04:31 AM
Sam
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"Donald Munro" wrote in message
news
Andy Coggan wrote:
So $4.4 million to conduct 6890 tests - that's about $650 per test,
which is
pretty steep in the medical realm but may not be unreasonable
considering
all the ancillary costs.


Bill Laudien wrote:
well US PRO charges US domestic teams almost $10,000 for UCI

registration and provides virtually no service for that fee. It would
be nice to see some of that money allocated for testing. Beyond that,
I'd be willing to pay an additional $1000-$2000 to that team fee if I
could be assured that the money would go directly to the testing of
cyclists in and out of competition. With a dozen teams or so, that
would be 20-40 additional cycling tests.


Unlike Andy I'm no expert on the subject, but I wonder if increasing the
number of tests would also decrease the cost per test ie a kind of mass
production effect ?


Probably not, the staffing is still pretty costly for the doping control
folks.

40 tests out of how many races? A drop in the bucket really.


  #44  
Old August 7th 04, 04:32 AM
Sam
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"burt hoovis" wrote in message
om...
Donald Munro wrote in message

. ..

Unlike Andy I'm no expert on the subject, but I wonder if increasing the
number of tests would also decrease the cost per test ie a kind of mass
production effect ?



Well I'm sure that if you wrote up a request for quote for a
laboratory to do a whole bunch of drug tests as apposed to a few,
you'd get a much better price per test.


But labs must be certified and accredited. It would be great to have more
labs, but it is not worth the added expense to most of them.


  #45  
Old August 7th 04, 12:49 PM
hold my beer and watch this...
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Default "Fuentes disputes positive" or How the USCF promotes doping...


"Sam" wrote in message

But labs must be certified and accredited.


Yeah so? People who drive taxis have to have driver's licenses, too. If
you increase the number of people who need rides from the airport, you'll
get more taxi drivers offering to do it for money.

It would be great to have more
labs, but it is not worth the added expense to most of them.


Yeah, so? You only need a few competing to make the price go down.

Do you have any ****ing idea how supply/demand works?



  #46  
Old August 7th 04, 01:49 PM
Curtis L. Russell
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Default "Fuentes disputes positive" or How the USCF promotes doping...

On Sat, 7 Aug 2004 06:49:22 -0500, "hold my beer and watch this..."
wrote:


But labs must be certified and accredited.


Yeah so? People who drive taxis have to have driver's licenses, too. If
you increase the number of people who need rides from the airport, you'll
get more taxi drivers offering to do it for money.


Depends on the rules. Some places you get little trinkets that cost
tens of thousands of dollars in order to drive a taxi and no more
taxis than before. Certification can be a barrier to entry and in
those cases can do not much more than increase prices as volumes go
up.

With JCAHO maybe being taken out of the business of certifying labs,
certification isn't a slam dunk that it will be a smooth process.

My understanding of accreditation is that it is usually a process done
by private groups that hold members to certain published standards.
Usually the purpose is to promise some degree of standards in a
specialty or profession, but is only occasionally used to limit
service by the accredited. Not sure if that is relevant, but I guess
it could be.

Curtis L. Russell
Odenton, MD (USA)
Just someone on two wheels...
  #47  
Old August 8th 04, 01:52 AM
Mike Murray
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Default "Fuentes disputes positive" or How the USCF promotes doping...


"Richard Adams" wrote:
How many laboratories in the US do you suppose are capable of doing
these tests, particularly en masse.


Many could be capable but currently, for all practical purposes, all these
tests are only done in the US through USADA.

Mike Murray


  #48  
Old August 8th 04, 02:24 AM
Roadie_scum
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hold my beer and watch this... Wrote:
Do you have any ****ing idea how supply/demand works?


You obviously don't.


--
Roadie_scum

  #49  
Old August 8th 04, 12:52 PM
hold my beer and watch this...
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Default "Fuentes disputes positive" or How the USCF promotes doping...


"Roadie_scum" wrote in
message ...

hold my beer and watch this... Wrote:
Do you have any ****ing idea how supply/demand works?


You obviously don't.


Sure I do. Your mom gives me bulk rates on anal.

Thanks,
Hold my





  #50  
Old August 9th 04, 07:41 PM
gwhite
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Default "Fuentes disputes positive" or How the USCF promotes doping...



Bob Schwartz wrote:

Andy Coggan wrote:
In any case, though, I can't help but wonder where
the people who call for a huge increase in testing expect the money to come
from...for example, would they be willing to pay an extra $50 for their
annual license to help support expanded testing? I bet that most would not.


Currently two thirds of the budget comes from the federal government.
Nothing comes from the participants or governing bodies.

At the risk of launching tangential threads on the role of government
and taxation I suggest that the money come from the same place it
comes from now, just more of it.



You'll need to compete for the cops time. Since we now need to protect
the fatso ephedrine junkies from themselves, cops have less time to
enforce criminal fraud in sport. (I don't know if there is such a thing
in the USA.) Of course we can assume the usual high efficiency in an
industry that is monopolized.

Is there any problem that higher taxation cannot solve? LOL
 




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