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Carbon Frame Reliability



 
 
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  #71  
Old July 15th 19, 12:52 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Tom Kunich[_5_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 621
Default Carbon Frame Reliability

On Saturday, July 13, 2019 at 8:13:08 PM UTC-7, John B. wrote:
On Sat, 13 Jul 2019 13:40:13 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
wrote:

On Friday, July 12, 2019 at 4:30:00 PM UTC-7, John B. wrote:
On Fri, 12 Jul 2019 11:20:32 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
wrote:

On Thursday, July 11, 2019 at 12:14:33 AM UTC-7, wrote:
On Wednesday, July 10, 2019 at 7:18:09 PM UTC-5, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Wed, 10 Jul 2019 12:45:24 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
wrote:

On Tuesday, July 9, 2019 at 12:09:12 AM UTC-7, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Mon, 8 Jul 2019 15:43:54 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
wrote:

On Monday, July 8, 2019 at 1:02:36 PM UTC-7, jbeattie wrote:
On Monday, July 8, 2019 at 8:34:20 AM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Sunday, July 7, 2019 at 4:50:52 PM UTC-7, wrote:
On Friday, July 5, 2019 at 4:33:54 PM UTC-5, Tom Kunich wrote:
My friend just returned from Italy on a tour up the entire length of the east coast.

He visited the factory that built his and his wife's custom steel frames.

They also build carbon fiber frames and sponsor a Pro team. When Mike asked them about their reliability the company official that was showing them around said that he would not recommend ANYONE buying a carbon fiber frameset.

He said that pro teams replace their framesets generally each race because they cannot take the chance injuring a rider with a failure. This is a famous Italian marque that has made bicycles since 1957. So the opinion of the factory should bear some weight.


Tommasini began making bicycles in 1957. And they still make steel bikes. And offer custom frames. So we will assume your friend and his wife were riding Tommasini bikes and stopped at their factory in Grosseto, Italy. Grosseto is on the WEST coast of Italy 100 miles north of Rome. But you said their tour was on the EAST coast of Italy. Seems your story already has some facts wrong. But I understand wrong facts do not deter you folks.

I am sure Tommasini has sponsored pro teams in the past.. So that part of your story is believable. And as pointed out by others, your story has a lot of pieces in it. Your friend told you what he heard from the tour guide at the Tommasini factory. Generally truth is best if it comes directly from the source. Not two or three interpreters in between.. And of course how knowledgeable a tour guide is about the quality of carbon bikes is a question. I worked for a utility company. But I do not know how good our gas and electric repairmen were at their jobs. Are you going to ask the GM factory worker how accurate and credible the financial statements are?

Now I am assuming you have never ever worked for anyone in your entire life. I say that because most, all, people with current jobs, do not denigrate their own company during working hours. Yet you tell us that the company tour guide denigrated his own company's carbon bikes during a guided tour. That would be very similar to Andy Muzi's employees telling customers that Andy is an A Hole and is the worst bike mechanic in Madison or Wisconsin. And they had better run away from Andy's shop. Maybe that happens, but I doubt it.

Are you telling us that touring the east coast of Italy doesn't allow one to take a detour to visit Rome and Grossetto before returning to the east coast to see Venice?

At what point in reality do you start designing the tour plan for other people? As I stated - this man spent 30 years as a detective.. Explain to us all how many years were you a federal detective? The level of ignorance of people like you is grossly understated even by me.

What factory? Why all the intrigue? Just tell us where he had his bike made. Any proud owner of a custom frame will tell you where it was made, assuming the decals aren't enough. What name is on his frame? I can tell you the names on all my friends' frames. Isn't this NCIS guy your friend?

-- Jay Beattie.

The comments in which a company said that the products they made were not considered by them to be the most reliable were told to me in confidence and that last person in the world I would tell that to is a lawyer.


An interesting "out" for someone caught lying. Just say, "Oh! that is
classified", and everything will be O.K.

I don't know about civilian life but in the USAF to even admit to
knowing that certain classified information existed could be deemed a
violation of the regulations.

--

Cheers,

John B.

Now you going to tell us that you were in the Air Force? Or that you have even an idea of what security protocols are in the military?

Well yes, I was in the A.F. for twenty years. Why do you not believe
it? After all you at 75 are certainly old enough to remember all those
cowards that fled to Canada to avoid having to go in the service.
Well, I didn't.
--

Cheers,

John B.

Bone spurs!!! And four student draft deferments. Patriotic, Bible thumping, flag waving, Ivy League Wharton graduates don't scamper off to Canada to shirk serving in their country's military.

What makes you make that cowardly comment? What service were you in Russell?

1. No medical excuse would be acceptable unless verified by a military doctor. What's more, since the prognosis changes over time, if it was accepted at one time if President Trump had been drafted it would have been checked a second time.

2. Bill Clinton said that if he were drafted he would flee to Canada as a conscientious objector and I don't see you making any comments about that.

3. Trump attended a military academy meaning that if he WERE drafted he would have probably received a commission and had a fat cushy stateside job and never have even seen Vietnam.

4. Neither Trump nor Clinton had their numbers called before the war was ended by Nixon.

So tell us slime ball - since Clinton didn't seem to have any conscientious objections to bombing the hell out of Iraq TWICE perhaps you can tell us why you have to speak about Trump who has put us in a position to avoid wars and not involve us in any?

Every single one of you sick minded mentally ill leftists seem to have is a level of cowardice that is almost unbelievable to normal people. I volunteered and I am VFW. I never once complained about people that didn't want to be drafted. If you don't have the courage to stand and fight I wouldn't want anyone like you around me in the first place. You'd be more likely to shoot your sergeant and turn and run that to act like any sort of man.

Veteran of foreign wars? And where did you serve, overseas? I ask as I
remember when we were arguing about skill levels and so on, and you
never mentioned being overseas.
--
cheers,

John B.


Perhaps you'd like to explain how I am VFW without ever having been overseas? You know, like Guam, Okinawa and over Vietnam and Cambodia?


Go back and read what I wrote. " I ask as I remember when we were
arguing about skill levels and so on, and you never mentioned being
overseas."
As I wrote in another post, your grasp of the English language seems
to be rather... well, inadequate .

I asked a question and you complain. why?

From your answer it sounds more like you were TDY to Guam with one or
another of the bomb squadrons that were there TDY. I would have gone
except that my shop chief was having problems with his wife and
elected to get away for a while and so went in my place. So instead of
going to Guam I got to go to Vietnam a few months later :-)

Would you mind explaining how it is that you got a Top Secret clearance for jobs that would normally use a Secret clearance like everyone else did? And while you're at it - how is it that you spend 20 years in the AF and then proclaim yourself an educated engineer?


I had a top secret clearance because I was selected to go to the
atomic tests in support of some aircraft that had top secret equipment
installed, I'd guess.

A bunch of us maintenance guys were ordered to the operations briefing
room at 13:00 one day and when we got there were two Air Police at the
door and after checking us all in the door was closed and locked. Our
commander got up and introduced a full colonel who got up and
announced, "Gentlemen, I'm Colonel whatever-his-name-was and I'm sure
glad to see that you've all volunteered for operation 7.4". When a
couple of guys said, "but I didn't volunteer", the colonel says "Must
have been a mistake then but now you've been briefed there is no way
to un-brief you so you'll have to stay".

And so we all received a top secret clearance and got to spent some
time on a tropical island :-(

By he way, the secret equipment, as far as we could see was a small
porthole in the side of the aircraft aft of the S.B. gunners window
and a big aluminum box padlocked over it on the inside of the fuselage
with some electrical cables running into it. The three airplane
detachment was named "7.4 technical photo".

We were told that the first drop of a thermonuclear device was made
during this test period.
--
cheers,

John B.


My equipment dropped nuclear weapons and I flew Operation Chrome Dome and only required a Secret Clearance. My Uncle BUILT the testing towers and control centers for the bomb tests in the South Pacific and he didn't need any clearance at all.

By the way, I discovered that he caught polio not in the Philippines as I thought but in Thailand. I hope you've been vaccinated.
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  #72  
Old July 15th 19, 03:12 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
jOHN b.
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 763
Default Carbon Frame Reliability

On Sun, 14 Jul 2019 16:52:02 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
wrote:

On Saturday, July 13, 2019 at 8:13:08 PM UTC-7, John B. wrote:
On Sat, 13 Jul 2019 13:40:13 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
wrote:

On Friday, July 12, 2019 at 4:30:00 PM UTC-7, John B. wrote:
On Fri, 12 Jul 2019 11:20:32 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
wrote:

On Thursday, July 11, 2019 at 12:14:33 AM UTC-7, wrote:
On Wednesday, July 10, 2019 at 7:18:09 PM UTC-5, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Wed, 10 Jul 2019 12:45:24 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
wrote:

On Tuesday, July 9, 2019 at 12:09:12 AM UTC-7, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Mon, 8 Jul 2019 15:43:54 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
wrote:

On Monday, July 8, 2019 at 1:02:36 PM UTC-7, jbeattie wrote:
On Monday, July 8, 2019 at 8:34:20 AM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Sunday, July 7, 2019 at 4:50:52 PM UTC-7, wrote:
On Friday, July 5, 2019 at 4:33:54 PM UTC-5, Tom Kunich wrote:
My friend just returned from Italy on a tour up the entire length of the east coast.

He visited the factory that built his and his wife's custom steel frames.

They also build carbon fiber frames and sponsor a Pro team. When Mike asked them about their reliability the company official that was showing them around said that he would not recommend ANYONE buying a carbon fiber frameset.

He said that pro teams replace their framesets generally each race because they cannot take the chance injuring a rider with a failure. This is a famous Italian marque that has made bicycles since 1957. So the opinion of the factory should bear some weight.


Tommasini began making bicycles in 1957. And they still make steel bikes. And offer custom frames. So we will assume your friend and his wife were riding Tommasini bikes and stopped at their factory in Grosseto, Italy. Grosseto is on the WEST coast of Italy 100 miles north of Rome. But you said their tour was on the EAST coast of Italy. Seems your story already has some facts wrong. But I understand wrong facts do not deter you folks.

I am sure Tommasini has sponsored pro teams in the past. So that part of your story is believable. And as pointed out by others, your story has a lot of pieces in it. Your friend told you what he heard from the tour guide at the Tommasini factory. Generally truth is best if it comes directly from the source. Not two or three interpreters in between. And of course how knowledgeable a tour guide is about the quality of carbon bikes is a question. I worked for a utility company. But I do not know how good our gas and electric repairmen were at their jobs. Are you going to ask the GM factory worker how accurate and credible the financial statements are?

Now I am assuming you have never ever worked for anyone in your entire life. I say that because most, all, people with current jobs, do not denigrate their own company during working hours. Yet you tell us that the company tour guide denigrated his own company's carbon bikes during a guided tour. That would be very similar to Andy Muzi's employees telling customers that Andy is an A Hole and is the worst bike mechanic in Madison or Wisconsin. And they had better run away from Andy's shop. Maybe that happens, but I doubt it.

Are you telling us that touring the east coast of Italy doesn't allow one to take a detour to visit Rome and Grossetto before returning to the east coast to see Venice?

At what point in reality do you start designing the tour plan for other people? As I stated - this man spent 30 years as a detective. Explain to us all how many years were you a federal detective? The level of ignorance of people like you is grossly understated even by me.

What factory? Why all the intrigue? Just tell us where he had his bike made. Any proud owner of a custom frame will tell you where it was made, assuming the decals aren't enough. What name is on his frame? I can tell you the names on all my friends' frames. Isn't this NCIS guy your friend?

-- Jay Beattie.

The comments in which a company said that the products they made were not considered by them to be the most reliable were told to me in confidence and that last person in the world I would tell that to is a lawyer.


An interesting "out" for someone caught lying. Just say, "Oh! that is
classified", and everything will be O.K.

I don't know about civilian life but in the USAF to even admit to
knowing that certain classified information existed could be deemed a
violation of the regulations.

--

Cheers,

John B.

Now you going to tell us that you were in the Air Force? Or that you have even an idea of what security protocols are in the military?

Well yes, I was in the A.F. for twenty years. Why do you not believe
it? After all you at 75 are certainly old enough to remember all those
cowards that fled to Canada to avoid having to go in the service.
Well, I didn't.
--

Cheers,

John B.

Bone spurs!!! And four student draft deferments. Patriotic, Bible thumping, flag waving, Ivy League Wharton graduates don't scamper off to Canada to shirk serving in their country's military.

What makes you make that cowardly comment? What service were you in Russell?

1. No medical excuse would be acceptable unless verified by a military doctor. What's more, since the prognosis changes over time, if it was accepted at one time if President Trump had been drafted it would have been checked a second time.

2. Bill Clinton said that if he were drafted he would flee to Canada as a conscientious objector and I don't see you making any comments about that.

3. Trump attended a military academy meaning that if he WERE drafted he would have probably received a commission and had a fat cushy stateside job and never have even seen Vietnam.

4. Neither Trump nor Clinton had their numbers called before the war was ended by Nixon.

So tell us slime ball - since Clinton didn't seem to have any conscientious objections to bombing the hell out of Iraq TWICE perhaps you can tell us why you have to speak about Trump who has put us in a position to avoid wars and not involve us in any?

Every single one of you sick minded mentally ill leftists seem to have is a level of cowardice that is almost unbelievable to normal people. I volunteered and I am VFW. I never once complained about people that didn't want to be drafted. If you don't have the courage to stand and fight I wouldn't want anyone like you around me in the first place. You'd be more likely to shoot your sergeant and turn and run that to act like any sort of man.

Veteran of foreign wars? And where did you serve, overseas? I ask as I
remember when we were arguing about skill levels and so on, and you
never mentioned being overseas.
--
cheers,

John B.

Perhaps you'd like to explain how I am VFW without ever having been overseas? You know, like Guam, Okinawa and over Vietnam and Cambodia?


Go back and read what I wrote. " I ask as I remember when we were
arguing about skill levels and so on, and you never mentioned being
overseas."
As I wrote in another post, your grasp of the English language seems
to be rather... well, inadequate .

I asked a question and you complain. why?

From your answer it sounds more like you were TDY to Guam with one or
another of the bomb squadrons that were there TDY. I would have gone
except that my shop chief was having problems with his wife and
elected to get away for a while and so went in my place. So instead of
going to Guam I got to go to Vietnam a few months later :-)

Would you mind explaining how it is that you got a Top Secret clearance for jobs that would normally use a Secret clearance like everyone else did? And while you're at it - how is it that you spend 20 years in the AF and then proclaim yourself an educated engineer?


I had a top secret clearance because I was selected to go to the
atomic tests in support of some aircraft that had top secret equipment
installed, I'd guess.

A bunch of us maintenance guys were ordered to the operations briefing
room at 13:00 one day and when we got there were two Air Police at the
door and after checking us all in the door was closed and locked. Our
commander got up and introduced a full colonel who got up and
announced, "Gentlemen, I'm Colonel whatever-his-name-was and I'm sure
glad to see that you've all volunteered for operation 7.4". When a
couple of guys said, "but I didn't volunteer", the colonel says "Must
have been a mistake then but now you've been briefed there is no way
to un-brief you so you'll have to stay".

And so we all received a top secret clearance and got to spent some
time on a tropical island :-(

By he way, the secret equipment, as far as we could see was a small
porthole in the side of the aircraft aft of the S.B. gunners window
and a big aluminum box padlocked over it on the inside of the fuselage
with some electrical cables running into it. The three airplane
detachment was named "7.4 technical photo".

We were told that the first drop of a thermonuclear device was made
during this test period.
--
cheers,

John B.


My equipment dropped nuclear weapons and I flew Operation Chrome Dome and only required a Secret Clearance. My Uncle BUILT the testing towers and control centers for the bomb tests in the South Pacific and he didn't need any clearance at all.


I worked with a welder that had worked on a bunch of missile silos. He
had no clearance at all. Probably because there is no classified parts
on a bare missile silos. Or a tower for whatever.

But Chrome Dome. We certainly worked on nuclear bombers, some of which
were loaded when we worked on them and other than the "no lone zone"
rule I don't believe that you needed a clearance to work on a B-52 of
any sort, at least none of my guys had a clearance so I was the one
that had to get up in the middle of the night to work on a U-2 :-( We
also worked on Iron Bomb aircraft and again no clearance.

And I've worked on a B-52 scheduled to take off for a Chrome Dome
mission and nobody asked me for a clearance when I got to the
aircraft.
I got to the aircraft, did the job and the Deputy Commander for
Maintenance "patted me on the back" for doing the job so quickly that
the airplane could still make its scheduled take off time.

By the way, I discovered that he caught polio not in the Philippines as I thought but in Thailand. I hope you've been vaccinated.


I have no idea what the A.F. inoculated me for but I've lived here for
nearly 50 years with no problems.
--
cheers,

John B.

  #73  
Old July 15th 19, 03:12 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Tom Kunich[_5_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 621
Default Carbon Frame Reliability

On Sunday, July 14, 2019 at 7:13:02 PM UTC-7, John B. wrote:
On Sun, 14 Jul 2019 16:52:02 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
wrote:

On Saturday, July 13, 2019 at 8:13:08 PM UTC-7, John B. wrote:
On Sat, 13 Jul 2019 13:40:13 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
wrote:

On Friday, July 12, 2019 at 4:30:00 PM UTC-7, John B. wrote:
On Fri, 12 Jul 2019 11:20:32 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
wrote:

On Thursday, July 11, 2019 at 12:14:33 AM UTC-7, wrote:
On Wednesday, July 10, 2019 at 7:18:09 PM UTC-5, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Wed, 10 Jul 2019 12:45:24 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
wrote:

On Tuesday, July 9, 2019 at 12:09:12 AM UTC-7, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Mon, 8 Jul 2019 15:43:54 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
wrote:

On Monday, July 8, 2019 at 1:02:36 PM UTC-7, jbeattie wrote:
On Monday, July 8, 2019 at 8:34:20 AM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Sunday, July 7, 2019 at 4:50:52 PM UTC-7, wrote:
On Friday, July 5, 2019 at 4:33:54 PM UTC-5, Tom Kunich wrote:
My friend just returned from Italy on a tour up the entire length of the east coast.

He visited the factory that built his and his wife's custom steel frames.

They also build carbon fiber frames and sponsor a Pro team. When Mike asked them about their reliability the company official that was showing them around said that he would not recommend ANYONE buying a carbon fiber frameset.

He said that pro teams replace their framesets generally each race because they cannot take the chance injuring a rider with a failure. This is a famous Italian marque that has made bicycles since 1957. So the opinion of the factory should bear some weight.


Tommasini began making bicycles in 1957. And they still make steel bikes. And offer custom frames. So we will assume your friend and his wife were riding Tommasini bikes and stopped at their factory in Grosseto, Italy. Grosseto is on the WEST coast of Italy 100 miles north of Rome. But you said their tour was on the EAST coast of Italy. Seems your story already has some facts wrong. But I understand wrong facts do not deter you folks.

I am sure Tommasini has sponsored pro teams in the past. So that part of your story is believable. And as pointed out by others, your story has a lot of pieces in it. Your friend told you what he heard from the tour guide at the Tommasini factory. Generally truth is best if it comes directly from the source. Not two or three interpreters in between. And of course how knowledgeable a tour guide is about the quality of carbon bikes is a question. I worked for a utility company. But I do not know how good our gas and electric repairmen were at their jobs. Are you going to ask the GM factory worker how accurate and credible the financial statements are?

Now I am assuming you have never ever worked for anyone in your entire life. I say that because most, all, people with current jobs, do not denigrate their own company during working hours. Yet you tell us that the company tour guide denigrated his own company's carbon bikes during a guided tour. That would be very similar to Andy Muzi's employees telling customers that Andy is an A Hole and is the worst bike mechanic in Madison or Wisconsin. And they had better run away from Andy's shop. Maybe that happens, but I doubt it.

Are you telling us that touring the east coast of Italy doesn't allow one to take a detour to visit Rome and Grossetto before returning to the east coast to see Venice?

At what point in reality do you start designing the tour plan for other people? As I stated - this man spent 30 years as a detective. Explain to us all how many years were you a federal detective? The level of ignorance of people like you is grossly understated even by me.

What factory? Why all the intrigue? Just tell us where he had his bike made. Any proud owner of a custom frame will tell you where it was made, assuming the decals aren't enough. What name is on his frame? I can tell you the names on all my friends' frames. Isn't this NCIS guy your friend?

-- Jay Beattie.

The comments in which a company said that the products they made were not considered by them to be the most reliable were told to me in confidence and that last person in the world I would tell that to is a lawyer.


An interesting "out" for someone caught lying. Just say, "Oh! that is
classified", and everything will be O.K.

I don't know about civilian life but in the USAF to even admit to
knowing that certain classified information existed could be deemed a
violation of the regulations.

--

Cheers,

John B.

Now you going to tell us that you were in the Air Force? Or that you have even an idea of what security protocols are in the military?

Well yes, I was in the A.F. for twenty years. Why do you not believe
it? After all you at 75 are certainly old enough to remember all those
cowards that fled to Canada to avoid having to go in the service.
Well, I didn't.
--

Cheers,

John B.

Bone spurs!!! And four student draft deferments. Patriotic, Bible thumping, flag waving, Ivy League Wharton graduates don't scamper off to Canada to shirk serving in their country's military.

What makes you make that cowardly comment? What service were you in Russell?

1. No medical excuse would be acceptable unless verified by a military doctor. What's more, since the prognosis changes over time, if it was accepted at one time if President Trump had been drafted it would have been checked a second time.

2. Bill Clinton said that if he were drafted he would flee to Canada as a conscientious objector and I don't see you making any comments about that.

3. Trump attended a military academy meaning that if he WERE drafted he would have probably received a commission and had a fat cushy stateside job and never have even seen Vietnam.

4. Neither Trump nor Clinton had their numbers called before the war was ended by Nixon.

So tell us slime ball - since Clinton didn't seem to have any conscientious objections to bombing the hell out of Iraq TWICE perhaps you can tell us why you have to speak about Trump who has put us in a position to avoid wars and not involve us in any?

Every single one of you sick minded mentally ill leftists seem to have is a level of cowardice that is almost unbelievable to normal people. I volunteered and I am VFW. I never once complained about people that didn't want to be drafted. If you don't have the courage to stand and fight I wouldn't want anyone like you around me in the first place. You'd be more likely to shoot your sergeant and turn and run that to act like any sort of man.

  #74  
Old July 16th 19, 01:07 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
jOHN b.
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 763
Default Carbon Frame Reliability

On Mon, 15 Jul 2019 07:12:41 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
wrote:

On Sunday, July 14, 2019 at 7:13:02 PM UTC-7, John B. wrote:
On Sun, 14 Jul 2019 16:52:02 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
wrote:

On Saturday, July 13, 2019 at 8:13:08 PM UTC-7, John B. wrote:
On Sat, 13 Jul 2019 13:40:13 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
wrote:

On Friday, July 12, 2019 at 4:30:00 PM UTC-7, John B. wrote:
On Fri, 12 Jul 2019 11:20:32 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
wrote:

On Thursday, July 11, 2019 at 12:14:33 AM UTC-7, wrote:
On Wednesday, July 10, 2019 at 7:18:09 PM UTC-5, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Wed, 10 Jul 2019 12:45:24 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
wrote:

On Tuesday, July 9, 2019 at 12:09:12 AM UTC-7, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Mon, 8 Jul 2019 15:43:54 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
wrote:

On Monday, July 8, 2019 at 1:02:36 PM UTC-7, jbeattie wrote:
On Monday, July 8, 2019 at 8:34:20 AM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Sunday, July 7, 2019 at 4:50:52 PM UTC-7, wrote:
On Friday, July 5, 2019 at 4:33:54 PM UTC-5, Tom Kunich wrote:
My friend just returned from Italy on a tour up the entire length of the east coast.

He visited the factory that built his and his wife's custom steel frames.

They also build carbon fiber frames and sponsor a Pro team. When Mike asked them about their reliability the company official that was showing them around said that he would not recommend ANYONE buying a carbon fiber frameset.

He said that pro teams replace their framesets generally each race because they cannot take the chance injuring a rider with a failure. This is a famous Italian marque that has made bicycles since 1957. So the opinion of the factory should bear some weight.


Tommasini began making bicycles in 1957. And they still make steel bikes. And offer custom frames. So we will assume your friend and his wife were riding Tommasini bikes and stopped at their factory in Grosseto, Italy. Grosseto is on the WEST coast of Italy 100 miles north of Rome. But you said their tour was on the EAST coast of Italy. Seems your story already has some facts wrong. But I understand wrong facts do not deter you folks.

I am sure Tommasini has sponsored pro teams in the past. So that part of your story is believable. And as pointed out by others, your story has a lot of pieces in it. Your friend told you what he heard from the tour guide at the Tommasini factory. Generally truth is best if it comes directly from the source. Not two or three interpreters in between. And of course how knowledgeable a tour guide is about the quality of carbon bikes is a question. I worked for a utility company. But I do not know how good our gas and electric repairmen were at their jobs. Are you going to ask the GM factory worker how accurate and credible the financial statements are?

Now I am assuming you have never ever worked for anyone in your entire life. I say that because most, all, people with current jobs, do not denigrate their own company during working hours. Yet you tell us that the company tour guide denigrated his own company's carbon bikes during a guided tour. That would be very similar to Andy Muzi's employees telling customers that Andy is an A Hole and is the worst bike mechanic in Madison or Wisconsin. And they had better run away from Andy's shop. Maybe that happens, but I doubt it.

Are you telling us that touring the east coast of Italy doesn't allow one to take a detour to visit Rome and Grossetto before returning to the east coast to see Venice?

At what point in reality do you start designing the tour plan for other people? As I stated - this man spent 30 years as a detective. Explain to us all how many years were you a federal detective? The level of ignorance of people like you is grossly understated even by me.

What factory? Why all the intrigue? Just tell us where he had his bike made. Any proud owner of a custom frame will tell you where it was made, assuming the decals aren't enough. What name is on his frame? I can tell you the names on all my friends' frames. Isn't this NCIS guy your friend?

-- Jay Beattie.

The comments in which a company said that the products they made were not considered by them to be the most reliable were told to me in confidence and that last person in the world I would tell that to is a lawyer.


An interesting "out" for someone caught lying. Just say, "Oh! that is
classified", and everything will be O.K.

I don't know about civilian life but in the USAF to even admit to
knowing that certain classified information existed could be deemed a
violation of the regulations.

--

Cheers,

John B.

Now you going to tell us that you were in the Air Force? Or that you have even an idea of what security protocols are in the military?

Well yes, I was in the A.F. for twenty years. Why do you not believe
it? After all you at 75 are certainly old enough to remember all those
cowards that fled to Canada to avoid having to go in the service.
Well, I didn't.
--

Cheers,

John B.

Bone spurs!!! And four student draft deferments. Patriotic, Bible thumping, flag waving, Ivy League Wharton graduates don't scamper off to Canada to shirk serving in their country's military.

What makes you make that cowardly comment? What service were you in Russell?

1. No medical excuse would be acceptable unless verified by a military doctor. What's more, since the prognosis changes over time, if it was accepted at one time if President Trump had been drafted it would have been checked a second time.

2. Bill Clinton said that if he were drafted he would flee to Canada as a conscientious objector and I don't see you making any comments about that.

3. Trump attended a military academy meaning that if he WERE drafted he would have probably received a commission and had a fat cushy stateside job and never have even seen Vietnam.

4. Neither Trump nor Clinton had their numbers called before the war was ended by Nixon.

So tell us slime ball - since Clinton didn't seem to have any conscientious objections to bombing the hell out of Iraq TWICE perhaps you can tell us why you have to speak about Trump who has put us in a position to avoid wars and not involve us in any?

Every single one of you sick minded mentally ill leftists seem to have is a level of cowardice that is almost unbelievable to normal people. I volunteered and I am VFW. I never once complained about people that didn't want to be drafted. If you don't have the courage to stand and fight I wouldn't want anyone like you around me in the first place. You'd be more likely to shoot your sergeant and turn and run that to act like any sort of man.

Veteran of foreign wars? And where did you serve, overseas? I ask as I
remember when we were arguing about skill levels and so on, and you
never mentioned being overseas.
--
cheers,

John B.

Perhaps you'd like to explain how I am VFW without ever having been overseas? You know, like Guam, Okinawa and over Vietnam and Cambodia?

Go back and read what I wrote. " I ask as I remember when we were
arguing about skill levels and so on, and you never mentioned being
overseas."
As I wrote in another post, your grasp of the English language seems
to be rather... well, inadequate .

I asked a question and you complain. why?

From your answer it sounds more like you were TDY to Guam with one or
another of the bomb squadrons that were there TDY. I would have gone
except that my shop chief was having problems with his wife and
elected to get away for a while and so went in my place. So instead of
going to Guam I got to go to Vietnam a few months later :-)

Would you mind explaining how it is that you got a Top Secret clearance for jobs that would normally use a Secret clearance like everyone else did? And while you're at it - how is it that you spend 20 years in the AF and then proclaim yourself an educated engineer?

I had a top secret clearance because I was selected to go to the
atomic tests in support of some aircraft that had top secret equipment
installed, I'd guess.

A bunch of us maintenance guys were ordered to the operations briefing
room at 13:00 one day and when we got there were two Air Police at the
door and after checking us all in the door was closed and locked. Our
commander got up and introduced a full colonel who got up and
announced, "Gentlemen, I'm Colonel whatever-his-name-was and I'm sure
glad to see that you've all volunteered for operation 7.4". When a
couple of guys said, "but I didn't volunteer", the colonel says "Must
have been a mistake then but now you've been briefed there is no way
to un-brief you so you'll have to stay".

And so we all received a top secret clearance and got to spent some
time on a tropical island :-(

By he way, the secret equipment, as far as we could see was a small
porthole in the side of the aircraft aft of the S.B. gunners window
and a big aluminum box padlocked over it on the inside of the fuselage
with some electrical cables running into it. The three airplane
detachment was named "7.4 technical photo".

We were told that the first drop of a thermonuclear device was made
during this test period.
--
cheers,

John B.

My equipment dropped nuclear weapons and I flew Operation Chrome Dome and only required a Secret Clearance. My Uncle BUILT the testing towers and control centers for the bomb tests in the South Pacific and he didn't need any clearance at all.


I worked with a welder that had worked on a bunch of missile silos. He
had no clearance at all. Probably because there is no classified parts
on a bare missile silos. Or a tower for whatever.

But Chrome Dome. We certainly worked on nuclear bombers, some of which
were loaded when we worked on them and other than the "no lone zone"
rule I don't believe that you needed a clearance to work on a B-52 of
any sort, at least none of my guys had a clearance so I was the one
that had to get up in the middle of the night to work on a U-2 :-( We
also worked on Iron Bomb aircraft and again no clearance.

And I've worked on a B-52 scheduled to take off for a Chrome Dome
mission and nobody asked me for a clearance when I got to the
aircraft.
I got to the aircraft, did the job and the Deputy Commander for
Maintenance "patted me on the back" for doing the job so quickly that
the airplane could still make its scheduled take off time.

By the way, I discovered that he caught polio not in the Philippines as I thought but in Thailand. I hope you've been vaccinated.


I have no idea what the A.F. inoculated me for but I've lived here for
nearly 50 years with no problems.
--
cheers,

John B.


Again we get these curious things from you - why would anyone ask you for a clearance when you needed a clearance just to be assigned to the maintenance squadron? Are you having age related memory problems? How long before you're drooling and your wife puts you in a home?


What Air Force did you serve in. I ran shops in the Fabrication Branch
of Field Maintenance Squadrons for almost 10 years and I can't
remember any of my people ever having a security clearance. None of
them in10 years.

Which is why I got to work on U-2's and SR-71's. Because I was the
only guy in the branch that had a clearance.

In one case I had to make a tech order modification on a tool that was
used on a nuclear weapon - classified top secret.

I had to wait until everybody had gone home, they brought the tool in
wrapped in a tarpaulin than stood guard at the shop door with guns
while I made the modification. Over kill , one might say but that was
the way the nuclear guys did things.
--
cheers,

John B.

 




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