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Canada's most dangerous city for cyclists



 
 
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  #21  
Old May 3rd 13, 10:09 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
(PeteCresswell)
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Posts: 2,790
Default Canada's most dangerous city for cyclists

Per (PeteCresswell):
where their left wheels are


Oops... SHB "right wheels"....
--
Pete Cresswell
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  #22  
Old May 3rd 13, 10:30 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Király
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Posts: 94
Default Canada's most dangerous city for cyclists

Sir Ridesalot wrote:
Whilst the article is interesting it's the comments below it that
really get me thinking. It's amazing how many people think that
bicyclists do NOT belong on the roads. Also interesting how many
bicyclists delight in flaunting the Rules of the Road whenever it
pleases tthem.

http://ca.autos.yahoo.com/news/canad...141704036.html


Ha. Vancouver is at the top with the most collisions. Nowhere in the
article does it say that that's almost certainly because Vancouver has a
lot more year-round cyclists than any other Canadian city. Sure your
city's stats are going to be lower if cyclists aren't out for eight
months of the year.

--
K.

Lang may your lum reek.
  #23  
Old May 3rd 13, 11:20 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Andre Jute[_2_]
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Default Canada's most dangerous city for cyclists

On Friday, May 3, 2013 10:09:18 PM UTC+1, (PeteCresswell) wrote:
Per (PeteCresswell):

where their left wheels are




Oops... SHB "right wheels"....

--

Pete Cresswell


I thought you were sensitively adapting your remarks to my drive on the left circumstances. Disappointed to discover it is only an accident. -- AJ

  #24  
Old May 4th 13, 12:10 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Dan O
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Posts: 6,098
Default Canada's most dangerous city for cyclists

On May 2, 10:08 pm, James wrote:
On 03/05/13 13:55, Dan O wrote:

On May 2, 8:15 pm, wrote:
On Thursday, May 2, 2013 9:29:30 PM UTC-4, James wrote:
On 03/05/13 11:02, Sir Ridesalot wrote:


Whilst the article is interesting it's the comments below it
that


really get me thinking. It's amazing how many people think
that


bicyclists do NOT belong on the roads. Also interesting how
many


bicyclists delight in flaunting the Rules of the Road whenever
it


pleases tthem.


http://ca.autos.yahoo.com/news/canad...city-for-cycli...


Yup. We get that a lot.





I recently admonished one of our bicycling advocacy groups


http://www.bicyclenetwork.com.au/becausealthough their goal is


admirable, their methods are highly questionable.


They reject all notions that any sort of vehicular cycling (which
is


really what I would call defensive riding) has any usefulness,
and say


it has "failed", though it was never taught to or practiced by
many here.


It's been said: "It's not that vehicular cycling has been tried
and found to be difficult. It's that it's been assumed difficult,
and not tried."


It's been said: "krygowski you're a ****ing idiot!"


Aw, c'mon now, Dan. While that made me giggle a little, it wasn't
really called for just there, was it?

I think those of us who regularly mix it with the fossil fuel burners
have learned to ride defensively, which is a lot of what VC is about.

I'm no practitioner of strict VC. I have to say quite a few hail Eddy's
whenever I go to the VC priest for confession, but I do a lot of what
the Godfather of the "one true way" prescribes, though it was learned
from experience.

I suggest that although you take alternate routes, you do some VC stuff
without realising it. I know I do.


Not without realizing it. I absolutely *do* realize it. Moreover, I
well realize that I could *easily* do it quite completely if I wanted
to (but then my riding experience would *suck*) - references available
in the archive.

What irritates me so is Frank's superciliousness about it -
"competency" and all that. In fact I would venture to say that my way
is far more difficult ("don't try this at home, kids"), but I don't go
around criticizing anybody else's way (until they start to berate me
and mine for no good reason but to make themselves feel superior).

Oh, and the derogatory phrase abive is a ~quote from the archives -
something that's "been said" by someone else (the all lowercase is a
hint). It's a bit of a play on the value of "It's been said... "


  #25  
Old May 4th 13, 12:12 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Dan O
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Posts: 6,098
Default Canada's most dangerous city for cyclists

On May 3, 8:54 am, wrote:
On Thursday, May 2, 2013 11:55:09 PM UTC-4, Dan O wrote:
On May 2, 8:14 pm, wrote:


Of _course_ he felt that he was really competent. They all do.


You know what he felt? That's creepy.


He _told_ me what he felt. "I'm 33! I been riding #*%! forever! I know what I'm doing!!!"

But to address the issue head-on: Would you say he was competent, Dan? Coming head-on at a rider who was following the law while being passed by a car?

Will you _really_ take the side of a salmon rider? And argue against a guy riding where the law and decent traffic sense dictate??


No. I didn't mena to post that (clicker must have slipped or
somehting) - it was a hasty reply before I'd read the whole story, at
which point I retracte the thought.

And I never even suggested that he was competent. Try to keep up.


  #26  
Old May 4th 13, 12:13 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Dan O
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Posts: 6,098
Default Canada's most dangerous city for cyclists

On May 3, 10:30 am, Andre Jute wrote:
On Friday, May 3, 2013 5:06:45 PM UTC+1, wrote:
On Thursday, May 2, 2013 11:55:52 PM UTC-4, Dan O wrote:


On May 2, 8:15 pm, wrote:


On Thursday, May 2, 2013 9:29:30 PM UTC-4, James wrote:


On 03/05/13 11:02, Sir Ridesalot wrote:


Whilst the article is interesting it's the comments below it that


really get me thinking. It's amazing how many people think that


bicyclists do NOT belong on the roads. Also interesting how many


bicyclists delight in flaunting the Rules of the Road whenever it


pleases tthem.


http://ca.autos.yahoo.com/news/canad...city-for-cycli...


Yup. We get that a lot.


I recently admonished one of our bicycling advocacy groups


http://www.bicyclenetwork.com.au/becausealthough their goal is


admirable, their methods are highly questionable.


They reject all notions that any sort of vehicular cycling (which is


really what I would call defensive riding) has any usefulness, and say


it has "failed", though it was never taught to or practiced by many here.


It's been said: "It's not that vehicular cycling has been tried and found to be difficult. It's that it's been assumed difficult, and not tried."


It's been said: "krygowski you're a ****ing idiot!"


And you're still behaving like a drunken teenager, in your riding style, your garbage language, your anti-societal attitudes, your mini-minded posts, and probably in other ways we haven't heard about.


Too bad you're not really 15 years old. There would at least be hope of good sense arriving with maturity.


- Frank Krygowski


Aw, Franki-boy, I was just getting ready to feel sorry for you and say something calming to Dan, when you get on your high horse and stick your snot-nozzle in the air. You're your own worst enemy, man.


Yeah, I got a kick out that one, too.

And thanks, Andre - I also *do* realize that I need to calm down.
Thanks.

  #27  
Old May 4th 13, 12:19 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Dan O
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Posts: 6,098
Default Canada's most dangerous city for cyclists

On May 3, 3:49 am, Duane Hébert wrote:
On 5/2/2013 9:02 PM, Sir Ridesalot wrote:

Whilst the article is interesting it's the comments below it that really get me thinking. It's amazing how many people think that bicyclists do NOT belong on the roads. Also interesting how many bicyclists delight in flaunting the Rules of the Road whenever it pleases tthem.


Seems that there is a correlation.


Well then, maybe if we all just do what the ****ing cagers want, then
they'll accept us. Yeah, right.

http://ca.autos.yahoo.com/news/canad...city-for-cycli...


Cheers


  #28  
Old May 4th 13, 12:19 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Dan O
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Posts: 6,098
Default Canada's most dangerous city for cyclists

On May 3, 9:06 am, wrote:
On Thursday, May 2, 2013 11:55:52 PM UTC-4, Dan O wrote:
On May 2, 8:15 pm, wrote:


On Thursday, May 2, 2013 9:29:30 PM UTC-4, James wrote:


On 03/05/13 11:02, Sir Ridesalot wrote:


Whilst the article is interesting it's the comments below it that


really get me thinking. It's amazing how many people think that


bicyclists do NOT belong on the roads. Also interesting how many


bicyclists delight in flaunting the Rules of the Road whenever it


pleases tthem.


http://ca.autos.yahoo.com/news/canad...city-for-cycli...


Yup. We get that a lot.


I recently admonished one of our bicycling advocacy groups


http://www.bicyclenetwork.com.au/becausealthough their goal is


admirable, their methods are highly questionable.


They reject all notions that any sort of vehicular cycling (which is


really what I would call defensive riding) has any usefulness, and say


it has "failed", though it was never taught to or practiced by many here.


It's been said: "It's not that vehicular cycling has been tried and found to be difficult. It's that it's been assumed difficult, and not tried."


It's been said: "krygowski you're a ****ing idiot!"


And you're still behaving like a drunken teenager, in your riding style, your garbage language, your anti-societal attitudes, your mini-minded posts, and probably in other ways we haven't heard about.

Too bad you're not really 15 years old. There would at least be hope of good sense arriving with maturity.


Such sheer contemptuous disdain. Is it any wonder...

  #29  
Old May 4th 13, 12:21 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Dan O
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Posts: 6,098
Default Canada's most dangerous city for cyclists

On May 3, 9:21 am, "(PeteCresswell)" wrote:
Per Sir Ridesalot:

Also interesting how many bicyclists delight in flaunting the Rules of the Road whenever it pleases tthem.


I'd say that "pleases them" is the wrong phrase for some cyclists in
some situations. "survival demands" is closer in certain situations.
Note "certain" situations NOT "all" or even "most" situations.

Where I ride (southeastern Pennsylvania, USA) you can get seriously
killed following to the letter traffic laws that were essentially
written for motor vehicles on roads that where engineered/built with no
thought at all for cyclists or pedestrians.

Not that I'm not saying "all cases"... Not following traffic laws in a
city, for instance is probably a bad idea most of the time.

OTOH riding the wrong way at walking/jogging speed down a one-way alley
that is virtually unused can be perceived as safer than mixing it up
with 45 mph traffic on a parallel street that has no shoulder/fog lines.

Riding on sidewalks is another case in point. Cities? Riding on
pedestrian-populated sidewalks seems just plain dumb to me. Crime
against nature. Case closed.

But out, say, in West Conshocken I ride a route where one section looks
like a class B post-apocalypse movie as the route passes under a series
of superhighway overpasses. But there is a nice wide sidewalk (albeit
littered with trash and the occasional automobile part), but I'll lay
money that it hasn't seen more than one pedestrian per week for years.
In that case the choice is between riding that sidewalk and hoping that
closing traffic at 60+ with no shoulder doesn't ruin you whole day.


Well said.


  #30  
Old May 4th 13, 12:22 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Dan O
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Posts: 6,098
Default Canada's most dangerous city for cyclists

On May 3, 12:36 pm, Duane wrote:
On 5/3/2013 3:25 PM, (PeteCresswell) wrote:

Per :


However, that's not the same as absolving or arguing in favor of riding salmon-style head-on at other cyclists; or riding drunk at night without lights; or blowing through traffic lights at whim. Competent "vehicular cyclists" don't, AFAIK, approve of riding like that. And of course, the dolts who ride like that don't approve of vehicular cycling.


Nice post.


The post gave me a much-improved understanding of "Vehicular Cycling" -
which I had previously take to be soon-to-be-short-lived people trying
to act just like motor vehicles.


That comment would have been just as valid by replacing Vehicular
Cyclists with "competent cyclists" and Vehicular Cycling with "competent
cycling."

You don't have to join the cult to be a competent cyclist.


Well said.
 




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