Holy shatz! Cop stops bicycle!

*Reposted, this time to correct groups*

(Prefatory note to Brent: Yes, I'm aware there are many badly-behaved
motorists. No, I don't think they should get off scot-free, either. Yes,
I'm aware you're vehemently opposed to bicycle and rider registration. No,
I don't buy your putative reasons for it. Yes, I know you have to respond
to this post. No, I won't get in a ****ing contest with you.)

I was walking down Bloor St when I saw a copcycle pull over a cyclist for
running a red light...talk about shock and awe! I've never seen the likes
of this before. The cop ordered the cyclist to dismount, walk his bike to
the corner and park it, then lectured the guy for a few minutes ("Red
lights mean STOP, whether you're in a car or on a bike or on your feet!
It's the same rules of the road for you as for everyone else who uses
it!"). The guy was arguing that he bicycles in this area all the time,
there were no cars coming, etc. The cop (surprise...) told the guy he was
just warning him this time rather than writing a ticket, and eventually
let him ride off.

Now, it did my heart a lot of good to see and hear this. There are way too
many badly-behaved bicyclists in Toronto, as there are in every other
city. "Hey, lookit me! I'm a car! WHUP, now I'm a pedestrian! WHUP! Now
I'm neither! Hey, lookit me riding on the wrong side of the street! After
dark! Without lights or reflectors! Wearing all black! And if you hit me,
it'll be all your fault, neener neener neener! Whoah, sucks to be you, red
lights are only for cars!" etc.

I'd like to see a lot more of this kind of police activity, but pragmatic
questions pretty much scotch the idea. There's no law requiring
registration of bicycles or carrying an operator's license -- or, for that
matter, any form of identification at all -- while riding one. Should be,
but isn't. So what if the cop stops someone who hasn't got ID? What,
exactly, can the cop do? And even if s/he succeeds in writing a ticket,
what's to motivate the recipient to pay it? There'll be no demerit points
on his driver's license (which s/he may not even have). There'll be no
increase in insurance premiums (which s/he's not required to carry).
There'll be no denial of renewed registration (also not required).

Be nice if cops could/would (they probably can) write tickets and impound
bicycles until the ticket is paid.

-Stern (pedestrian/cyclist/driver)

On Sat, 12 Jun 2004 00:11:20 -0400, "Daniel J. Stern"
wrote:

*Reposted, this time to correct groups*

I was walking down Bloor St when I saw...

Now, it did my heart a lot of good to see and hear this. There are way too
many badly-behaved bicyclists in Toronto, as there are in every other
city.

Be nice if cops could/would (they probably can) write tickets and impound
bicycles until the ticket is paid.

-Stern (pedestrian/cyclist/driver)

I hear your momma was picked up on that same corner. Only, not for bad
biking behavior.

-B

In article ch.edu, Daniel J. Stern wrote:

I was walking down Bloor St when I saw a copcycle pull over a cyclist for
running a red light...talk about shock and awe!

Quite different from my experience. I stop and the cop runs the red.

Now, it did my heart a lot of good to see and hear this.

The only times I've been stopped by a cop is when they insisted I
could not use the roadway but had to teeter on the couple inches
of pavement to the right on the while line and left of the gravel.

I'd like to see a lot more of this kind of police activity, but pragmatic
questions pretty much scotch the idea.

I'd like to see for ALL vehicles.

There's no law requiring
registration of bicycles or carrying an operator's license -- or, for that
matter, any form of identification at all -- while riding one.

This doesn't prevent a ticket from being written and legally binding.


Should be,
but isn't. So what if the cop stops someone who hasn't got ID? What,
exactly, can the cop do? And even if s/he succeeds in writing a ticket,
what's to motivate the recipient to pay it? There'll be no demerit points
on his driver's license (which s/he may not even have). There'll be no
increase in insurance premiums (which s/he's not required to carry).
There'll be no denial of renewed registration (also not required).

Because a warrant will be issued for his arrest. This will turn up at
a bad time like when he gets pulled over for driving 70mph on an empty
expressway at 2am.

Be nice if cops could/would (they probably can) write tickets and impound
bicycles until the ticket is paid.

Autos first. It would kill the speeding ticket industry. And btw, cops
are already known to do just that, cept it's with anyone riding a bike
within reach when there is some sort of protest or convention going on.

Daniel J. Stern wrote:
*Reposted, this time to correct groups*

(Prefatory note to Brent: Yes, I'm aware there are many badly-behaved
motorists. No, I don't think they should get off scot-free, either. Yes,
I'm aware you're vehemently opposed to bicycle and rider registration. No,
I don't buy your putative reasons for it. Yes, I know you have to respond
to this post. No, I won't get in a ****ing contest with you.)

I was walking down Bloor St when I saw a copcycle pull over a cyclist for
running a red light...talk about shock and awe! I've never seen the likes
of this before. The cop ordered the cyclist to dismount, walk his bike to
the corner and park it, then lectured the guy for a few minutes ("Red
lights mean STOP, whether you're in a car or on a bike or on your feet!
It's the same rules of the road for you as for everyone else who uses
it!"). The guy was arguing that he bicycles in this area all the time,
there were no cars coming, etc. The cop (surprise...) told the guy he was
just warning him this time rather than writing a ticket, and eventually
let him ride off.

Okay, has anyone ever seen a cop let a driver off after they ran a red
light? Hmmmm??

Unless the driver was a politician or fellow cop, I doubt it.

And I love the argument from the bicyclist: there were no cars coming.
How the frig does he know? Is he psychic? There were no cars coming
because he lived to tell about it. Had there been cars coming, they'd
be scraping him off the street...

....And the gene pool would be 0.000000000000000001% better.



John

--
To reply, remove "die.spammers" from address


Von Herzen, moge es wieder zu Herzen gehen. --Beethoven

Too many to read every reply, I hope this wasn't touched on. We here in
Florida have had police crack downs in the past giving cyclists tickets for
not stopping, as you say "cyclists are subject to the same traffic laws as
anyone else". That is not quite true in this case, cyclists are required to
do more! Simply stopping at a stop sign can still get you a ticket IF you
fail to put one foot fully on the ground. Comments?

Bob

"The Lindbergh Baby" wrote in
message ...
Daniel J. Stern wrote:
*Reposted, this time to correct groups*

(Prefatory note to Brent: Yes, I'm aware there are many badly-behaved
motorists. No, I don't think they should get off scot-free, either.
Yes,
I'm aware you're vehemently opposed to bicycle and rider registration.
No,
I don't buy your putative reasons for it. Yes, I know you have to
respond
to this post. No, I won't get in a ****ing contest with you.)

I was walking down Bloor St when I saw a copcycle pull over a cyclist
for
running a red light...talk about shock and awe! I've never seen the
likes
of this before. The cop ordered the cyclist to dismount, walk his bike
to
the corner and park it, then lectured the guy for a few minutes ("Red
lights mean STOP, whether you're in a car or on a bike or on your feet!
It's the same rules of the road for you as for everyone else who uses
it!"). The guy was arguing that he bicycles in this area all the time,
there were no cars coming, etc. The cop (surprise...) told the guy he
was
just warning him this time rather than writing a ticket, and eventually
let him ride off.

Okay, has anyone ever seen a cop let a driver off after they ran a red
light? Hmmmm??

Unless the driver was a politician or fellow cop, I doubt it.

And I love the argument from the bicyclist: there were no cars coming.
How the frig does he know? Is he psychic? There were no cars coming
because he lived to tell about it. Had there been cars coming, they'd
be scraping him off the street...

...And the gene pool would be 0.000000000000000001% better.



John

--
To reply, remove "die.spammers" from address


Von Herzen, moge es wieder zu Herzen gehen. --Beethoven

"Daniel J. Stern" wrote in message
.umich.edu...

article snipped

Be nice if cops could/would (they probably can) write tickets and impound
bicycles until the ticket is paid.

AMEN to that. It would be espacially nice (for me anyways) if they would do this to
these idiot kids who have no clue of and/or disregard the rules of the road.

--
Paul

Bob Newman wrote:
Too many to read every reply, I hope this wasn't touched on. We here in
Florida have had police crack downs in the past giving cyclists tickets for
not stopping, as you say "cyclists are subject to the same traffic laws as
anyone else". That is not quite true in this case, cyclists are required to
do more! Simply stopping at a stop sign can still get you a ticket IF you
fail to put one foot fully on the ground. Comments?

Sounds like the usual over-enforcement directed at auto drivers, where the
cop says you "didn't stop" if you didn't wait 5 seconds before proceeding.
The law needs to recognize that when your car rocks back on its springs,
you've stopped.

snip. The cop (surprise...) told the guy he was
just warning him this time rather than writing a ticket, and eventually
let him ride off.

Okay, has anyone ever seen a cop let a driver off after they ran a red
light? Hmmmm??

Unless the driver was a politician or fellow cop, I doubt it.
/snip

I'm neither and I've had warnings for that AND speeding while driving a car.

snip
And I love the argument from the bicyclist: there were no cars coming.
How the frig does he know? /snip

A cyclist can see further down the road than drivers in a car coming to a
stop. Also many states have provisions for cyclists, if there is no traffic
at the light the cyclist can proceed due to the fact that bicycles may not
trip the sensor to make the light change.

Just as there are different rules for pedestrians, trucks, busses, and
motorcycles... There are different rules for cyclists. Some need to be
modified with the times but there are differences.

" ]] gun_dog99 [[ " wrote:


stop. Also many states have provisions for cyclists, if there is no traffic
at the light the cyclist can proceed due to the fact that bicycles may not
trip the sensor to make the light change.

Applies to all vehicles. If a signal is not working properly, one may
proceed with caution. A vehicle not tripping a sensor indicates a
siognal not working properly.

On Sat, 12 Jun 2004, Bob Newman wrote:

Florida have had police crack downs in the past giving cyclists tickets for
not stopping, as you say "cyclists are subject to the same traffic laws as
anyone else". That is not quite true in this case, cyclists are required to
do more! Simply stopping at a stop sign can still get you a ticket IF you
fail to put one foot fully on the ground. Comments?

That seems silly and pecksnifian. For a well-balanced rider and bicycle,
It's perfectly possible to come to the kind of complete and adequate stop
that a stop sign requires without putting a foot fully on the ground.

-Stern