ERD ERD ERD

QUESTIONING ERD’S EFFECTIVENESS came about after 3-4 negative wheel
building starts using ERD and Spoke Calcs giving too long measurements
And reading a slew of similar problems in RBT.
SO I DECIDED to **** in the wind in an attempt to redefine ERD
promoting maybe a warning in Spoc Calcs, from JB, Sheldon Brown via
Harris Cyclery as public notices that ERD WAS/IS NOT spoke length.
Suggestions to empirically measure your own via a dishing tool or DIY
wooden dishing beam would be welcome from all concerned at Mail Oder.
“From the following measurement, deduct 1-4 mm depending on rim,
nipple type and personal wheel building preferences.”
And so it was after JB went on about accuracy that I went to the
nipples used for building a 29er finding these nipples were not
threaded to accommodate JB and Spoc Calcs theories on nipple
threading.
Such an elevation of thought purpose and ethics not to mention common
sense isnot forthcoming.
Why beyond the usual “people are stupid.”?
A conspiracy for selling more spokes than x per wheel ?
Or BAU engineering trauma suffered by contractors and mechanics of all
types ?
?
Oddly, tire mounting posed a similar attitude. “my tire’s don’t go on
x rim.” Well, it should right. same size. WHY NOT?
What’s wrong ? Reading all available tire mounting instructions
revealed then current instructions, including the handouts at Palm
Beach Cyclery’s coffee shop, did not suggest the necessary move. Nor
did LBS types I spoke with.
To position the lever under bead, pry and hook to spoke AND THEN pinch
beads together working the bead and tire toward the levered tire tool.

On Nov 17, 2:39 pm, datakoll wrote:
QUESTIONING ERD’S EFFECTIVENESS came about after 3-4 negative wheel
building starts using ERD and Spoke Calcs giving too long measurements
And reading a slew of similar problems in RBT.
SO I DECIDED to **** in the wind in an attempt to redefine ERD
promoting maybe a warning in Spoc Calcs, from JB, Sheldon Brown via
Harris Cyclery as public notices that ERD WAS/IS NOT spoke length.
Suggestions to empirically measure your own via a dishing tool or DIY
wooden dishing beam would be welcome from all concerned at Mail Oder.
“From the following measurement, deduct 1-4 mm depending on rim,
nipple type and personal wheel building preferences.”
And so it was after JB went on about accuracy that I went to the
nipples used for building a 29er finding these nipples were not
threaded to accommodate JB and Spoc Calcs theories on nipple
threading.
Such an elevation of thought purpose and ethics not to mention common
sense isnot forthcoming.
Why beyond the usual “people are stupid.”?
A conspiracy for selling more spokes than x per wheel ?
Or BAU engineering trauma suffered by contractors and mechanics of all
types ?
?


Try he

http://tinyurl.com/5jzhqm

HTH!

On Mon, 17 Nov 2008 12:39:31 -0800, datakoll wrote:

QUESTIONING ERD’S EFFECTIVENESS came about after 3-4 negative wheel
building starts using ERD and Spoke Calcs giving too long measurements
And reading a slew of similar problems in RBT. SO I DECIDED to **** in
the wind in an attempt to redefine ERD promoting maybe a warning in Spoc
Calcs, from JB, Sheldon Brown via Harris Cyclery as public notices that
ERD WAS/IS NOT spoke length. Suggestions to empirically measure your own
via a dishing tool or DIY wooden dishing beam would be welcome from all
concerned at Mail Oder. “From the following measurement, deduct 1-4 mm
depending on rim, nipple type and personal wheel building preferences.�
And so it was after JB went on about accuracy that I went to the nipples
used for building a 29er finding these nipples were not threaded to
accommodate JB and Spoc Calcs theories on nipple threading.
Such an elevation of thought purpose and ethics not to mention common
sense isnot forthcoming.
Why beyond the usual “people are stupid.�? A conspiracy for selling more
spokes than x per wheel ? Or BAU engineering trauma suffered by
contractors and mechanics of all types ?
?
Oddly, tire mounting posed a similar attitude. “my tire’s don’t go on x
rim.� Well, it should right. same size. WHY NOT? What’s wrong ? Reading
all available tire mounting instructions revealed then current
instructions, including the handouts at Palm Beach Cyclery’s coffee
shop, did not suggest the necessary move. Nor did LBS types I spoke
with.
To position the lever under bead, pry and hook to spoke AND THEN pinch
beads together working the bead and tire toward the levered tire tool.


dude, you're a gifted genius in some respects, but in the acceptance of
math as an engineering tool that actually works, you appear to be blind.
simply take the hub/rim data in damon rinard's spoke calculator as
sufficiently accurate, compute your spoke lengths, and bingo, you will be
able to order spokes of exactly the right length every single time.

if you don't like that approach, post the rub/rim details of your
projected wheel here, and we will calculate for you. i unreservedly
guarantee you, unless you second-guess or misinform, you will achieve 100%
reliable results with this method.

On Nov 17, 11:49*pm, jim beam wrote:
On Mon, 17 Nov 2008 12:39:31 -0800, datakoll wrote:
QUESTIONING ERD’S EFFECTIVENESS came about after 3-4 negative wheel
building starts using ERD and Spoke Calcs giving too long measurements
And reading a slew of similar problems in RBT. SO I DECIDED to **** in
the wind in an attempt to redefine ERD promoting maybe a warning in Spoc
Calcs, from JB, Sheldon Brown via Harris Cyclery as public notices that
ERD WAS/IS NOT spoke length. Suggestions to empirically measure your own
via a dishing tool or DIY wooden dishing beam would be welcome from all
concerned at Mail Oder. “From the following measurement, deduct 1-4 mm
depending on rim, nipple type and personal wheel building preferences.”
And so it was after JB went on about accuracy that I went to the nipples
used for building a 29er finding these nipples were not threaded to
accommodate JB and Spoc Calcs theories on nipple threading.
Such an elevation of thought purpose and ethics not to mention common
sense isnot forthcoming.
Why beyond the usual “people are stupid.”? A conspiracy for selling more
spokes than x per wheel ? Or BAU engineering trauma suffered by
contractors and mechanics of all types ?
?
Oddly, tire mounting posed a similar attitude. “my tire’s don’t go on x
rim.” Well, it should right. same size. WHY NOT? What’s wrong ? Reading
all available tire mounting instructions revealed then current
instructions, including the handouts at Palm Beach Cyclery’s coffee
shop, did not suggest the necessary move. Nor did LBS types I spoke
with.
To position the lever under bead, pry and hook to spoke AND THEN pinch
beads together working the bead and tire toward the levered tire tool.

dude, you're a gifted genius in some respects, but in the acceptance of
math as an engineering tool that actually works, you appear to be blind. *
simply take the hub/rim data in damon rinard's spoke calculator as
sufficiently accurate, compute your spoke lengths, and bingo, you will be
able to order spokes of exactly the right length every single time. *

if you don't like that approach, post the rub/rim details of your
projected wheel here, and we will calculate for you. *i unreservedly
guarantee you, unless you second-guess or misinform, you will achieve 100%
reliable results with this method.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

NO NO NO JIM BEAM. For example, the nipples. Brandt's theory assumes
nipples are threadable to the outside surface. Not so! not all nipples
thread to the outside surface.
Not all spoke calc software discerns double wall rims from their
single wall brethren.
Exeprienced mechanics ahve stated herein nthat the calc theory is
deductabile for reality and personal preferences.
That is true. Maybe not true across all spoke clacs but so far it's
100% inaccurate here from LBS, online Calc, wanna be experts at the
MO, and Rinard's spreadsheet.

I was looking for a disclamer to that effect hung on wannabe spoke
math wizardy.

BEEWARE

On Tue, 18 Nov 2008 08:34:34 -0800, datakoll wrote:

On Nov 17, 11:49Â*pm, jim beam wrote:
On Mon, 17 Nov 2008 12:39:31 -0800, datakoll wrote:
QUESTIONING ERD’S EFFECTIVENESS came about after 3-4 negative wheel
building starts using ERD and Spoke Calcs giving too long
measurements And reading a slew of similar problems in RBT. SO I
DECIDED to **** in the wind in an attempt to redefine ERD promoting
maybe a warning in Spoc Calcs, from JB, Sheldon Brown via Harris
Cyclery as public notices that ERD WAS/IS NOT spoke length.
Suggestions to empirically measure your own via a dishing tool or DIY
wooden dishing beam would be welcome from all concerned at Mail Oder.
“From the following measurement, deduct 1-4 mm depending on rim,
nipple type and personal wheel building preferences.� And so it was
after JB went on about accuracy that I went to the nipples used for
building a 29er finding these nipples were not threaded to
accommodate JB and Spoc Calcs theories on nipple threading. Such an
elevation of thought purpose and ethics not to mention common sense
isnot forthcoming.
Why beyond the usual “people are stupid.�? A conspiracy for selling
more spokes than x per wheel ? Or BAU engineering trauma suffered by
contractors and mechanics of all types ? ?
Oddly, tire mounting posed a similar attitude. “my tire’s don’t go on
x rim.� Well, it should right. same size. WHY NOT? What’s wrong ?
Reading all available tire mounting instructions revealed then
current instructions, including the handouts at Palm Beach Cyclery’s
coffee shop, did not suggest the necessary move. Nor did LBS types I
spoke with.
To position the lever under bead, pry and hook to spoke AND THEN
pinch beads together working the bead and tire toward the levered
tire tool.

dude, you're a gifted genius in some respects, but in the acceptance of
math as an engineering tool that actually works, you appear to be
blind. simply take the hub/rim data in damon rinard's spoke calculator
as sufficiently accurate, compute your spoke lengths, and bingo, you
will be able to order spokes of exactly the right length every single
time.

if you don't like that approach, post the rub/rim details of your
projected wheel here, and we will calculate for you. Â*i unreservedly
guarantee you, unless you second-guess or misinform, you will achieve
100% reliable results with this method.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

NO NO NO JIM BEAM. For example, the nipples. Brandt's theory assumes
nipples are threadable to the outside surface. Not so! not all nipples
thread to the outside surface.

1. it's not "brandt's theory", it's simply geometry. and the geometry was
around long before brandt walked this earth.

2. you're not paying attention to the purpose or principle of the
calculation. everything is carefully defined. and everybody else is able
to use it with complete confidence.



Not all spoke calc software discerns double wall rims from their single
wall brethren.
Exeprienced mechanics ahve stated herein nthat the calc theory is
deductabile for reality and personal preferences. That is true. Maybe
not true across all spoke clacs but so far it's 100% inaccurate here
from LBS, online Calc, wanna be experts at the MO, and Rinard's
spreadsheet.

I was looking for a disclamer to that effect hung on wannabe spoke math
wizardy.

BEEWARE

you are the statistical outlier here gene. if people are prepared to
offer you calculation services, and you're not interested in using them,
there's not much more than can be said.

ahhh Beam.
sarcasm fersure.
the passsing offfff, using street, a math construct as SPOKE LENGTH is
reprehensible.
melamine!

On Nov 19, 10:02 am, datakoll wrote:
ahhh Beam.
sarcasm fersure.
the passsing offfff, using street, a math construct as SPOKE LENGTH is
reprehensible.
melamine!

The fault lies not with ERD, dear Datakoll, but with you.

~Will Spokeslength~

On 2008-11-19, wrote:
On Nov 19, 10:02 am, datakoll wrote:
ahhh Beam.
sarcasm fersure.
the passsing offfff, using street, a math construct as SPOKE LENGTH is
reprehensible.
melamine!

The fault lies not with ERD, dear Datakoll, but with you.

No there is a problem with ERD. Not with the math but with the
definition of ERD-- there are basically at least two different
definitions in common use, which result in a 2mm or so difference in
spoke length.

NO NO NO. THE CONCEPT IS uh uh predetermined. The parts are
undetermined. Stretch, despite dislamers to the converse, ARE
undetermined.
I mean like the supporters say and bring forth supporting data (on a
grain shovel) that stretch is ARE limited to .00002 at latitude blah
blah blah near magnetic anomoly #546236627b....
when spoke used here over 3000 miles (not km) are pasta pasta pasta
REI is havinnnnnnnng a (not despret enough yet)pre bankrupcy sale -
SEE CLEARANCE - down at the page bottom.
for example for ERD lovers there's

http://www.rei.com/product/764634

why are these techno freaks opposed to seeing what the wheel requires
in reality ?
too much video game stuck inura.... ?