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Brooks Team Pro - how hard to replace frame?
Long story short, I bent the rails on my year-old Brooks Team Professional
saddle. I got the rails 90% back in shape, but I would like to try to replace the frame. I can figure out how to remove the old frame (keeping the nose piece intact), but I have no idea how to re-rivet a new frame. Do I need a special tool? I imagine that I would place the rivet through the saddle and frame, put the saddle upside-down and pound over the underside of the rivet (????) to flare it out, then hammer the rivet head to conform to the saddle surface. Has anyone tried this out? I figure if I can't do it myself, I might as well buy a new saddle for what I imagine the repair cost to be. On the other hand, the leather is nicely broken in, and is really comfortable, so I would prefer to keep it if it's economical. Any advice would be appreciated. Thanks, Roger |
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Brooks Team Pro - how hard to replace frame?
On Jul 4, 6:05 pm, Roger Sacilotto wrote:
Long story short, I bent the rails on my year-old Brooks Team Professional saddle. I got the rails 90% back in shape, but I would like to try to replace the frame. I can figure out how to remove the old frame (keeping the nose piece intact), but I have no idea how to re-rivet a new frame. Do I need a special tool? I imagine that I would place the rivet through the saddle and frame, put the saddle upside-down and pound over the underside of the rivet (????) to flare it out, then hammer the rivet head to conform to the saddle surface. Has anyone tried this out? I figure if I can't do it myself, I might as well buy a new saddle for what I imagine the repair cost to be. On the other hand, the leather is nicely broken in, and is really comfortable, so I would prefer to keep it if it's economical. Any advice would be appreciated. Thanks, Roger http://www.wallbike.com sells Brooks parts, including frames. I'd get in touch with them. Maybe they could even do the work for you. |
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Brooks Team Pro - how hard to replace frame?
Roger Sacilotto wrote:
Long story short, I bent the rails on my year-old Brooks Team Professional saddle. I got the rails 90% back in shape, but I would like to try to replace the frame. I can figure out how to remove the old frame (keeping the nose piece intact), but I have no idea how to re-rivet a new frame. Do I need a special tool? I imagine that I would place the rivet through the saddle and frame, put the saddle upside-down and pound over the underside of the rivet (????) to flare it out, then hammer the rivet head to conform to the saddle surface. Has anyone tried this out? I figure if I can't do it myself, I might as well buy a new saddle for what I imagine the repair cost to be. On the other hand, the leather is nicely broken in, and is really comfortable, so I would prefer to keep it if it's economical. Any advice would be appreciated. Thanks, Roger I'd get a new saddle. But, if you don't want to do that, why not send it to Brooks? Bet they could do it for ya. http://www.brookssaddles.com/brooksengland.html Downing Street - Smethwick West Midlands B66 2PA England United Kingdom BC has Google |
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Brooks Team Pro - how hard to replace frame?
"BCDrums" wrote in message . .. Roger Sacilotto wrote: Long story short, I bent the rails on my year-old Brooks Team Professional saddle. I got the rails 90% back in shape, but I would like to try to replace the frame. I can figure out how to remove the old frame (keeping the nose piece intact), but I have no idea how to re-rivet a new frame. Do I need a special tool? I imagine that I would place the rivet through the saddle and frame, put the saddle upside-down and pound over the underside of the rivet (????) to flare it out, then hammer the rivet head to conform to the saddle surface. Has anyone tried this out? I figure if I can't do it myself, I might as well buy a new saddle for what I imagine the repair cost to be. On the other hand, the leather is nicely broken in, and is really comfortable, so I would prefer to keep it if it's economical. Any advice would be appreciated. Thanks, Roger I'd get a new saddle. But, if you don't want to do that, why not send it to Brooks? Bet they could do it for ya. http://www.brookssaddles.com/brooksengland.html Downing Street - Smethwick West Midlands B66 2PA England United Kingdom BC has Google The cost of shipping to and from Brooks plus repairs may exceed the price of a new saddle. I've seen at least one person on the internet who does repairs and modifications on Brooks saddles. There are probably more. Chas. |
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Brooks Team Pro - how hard to replace frame?
"still me" wrote in message ... On Wed, 4 Jul 2007 22:24:15 -0700, "* * Chas" wrote: The cost of shipping to and from Brooks plus repairs may exceed the price of a new saddle. I've seen at least one person on the internet who does repairs and modifications on Brooks saddles. There are probably more. Chas. I think it's a total loss, better send it to me and I'll scrap it for you. Actually, it's not hard at all to do but how hard depends on your current rivet style. I've rebuilt a couple of saddles with copper rivets. You might need to do all of them to get a good match. Basically you just remove the old rivets by drilling the back side off, then insert the new rivet from above. Get a vise and some steel rods - 1/2" and 3/4" - clamped in to give you a small anvil surface(s). Place saddle so rivet top side is on top of "anvil" and saddle is upside down. Hammer on the bottom with a large flat end punch to flatten the inner side of the rivet. You need three hands - one to hold the saddle in place, one to hold the punch, and one to hammer. Flip it over, place the rivet so the flat end is on your "anvil" (1/2" or 3/4" as appropriate). Hammer with small metal working hammer to shape top. Use a rough file and shape. Hammer again. Shape again. Work with finer file. Eventually it looks good. If the rivets are the uniform small type, you can dispense with some of the shaping but you need to be more careful in the initial under side flattening. You may want to trim the rivets stem with some cutters before you use them if they will be too long, you want enough poking through that you can get a good expansion but not so much that you end up bending the shaft or can't get it tight. It's a whole lot easier if you are going to refinish the leather as you can sand the leather lightly overall and make the rivets smooth. You'll need to be a lot more careful with the files if you don't intend to refinish. I once kludged a Brooks Pro saddle onto Ideale flat alloy rails. Had an Ideale with trashed leather and a Brooks with broken rails. I cut the Brooks rails off in the rear leaving enough to thread with a hex die. The Ideale was attached to it's rails with nuts. The Brooks front end fit without a problem. The saddle worked fine except for the old style Ideale alloy clamp designed to mount on a straight alloy seat post. I could never get it to stay at the correct angle. Don't remember what ever happened to it. Chas. |
#6
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Brooks Team Pro - how hard to replace frame?
"* * Chas" wrote:
The cost of shipping to and from Brooks plus repairs may exceed the price of a new saddle. I've seen at least one person on the internet who does repairs and modifications on Brooks saddles. There are probably more. "still me" wrote I think it's a total loss, better send it to me and I'll scrap it for you. Actually, it's not hard at all to do but how hard depends on your current rivet style. I've rebuilt a couple of saddles with copper rivets. You might need to do all of them to get a good match. Basically you just remove the old rivets by drilling the back side off, then insert the new rivet from above. Get a vise and some steel rods - 1/2" and 3/4" - clamped in to give you a small anvil surface(s). Place saddle so rivet top side is on top of "anvil" and saddle is upside down. Hammer on the bottom with a large flat end punch to flatten the inner side of the rivet. You need three hands - one to hold the saddle in place, one to hold the punch, and one to hammer. Flip it over, place the rivet so the flat end is on your "anvil" (1/2" or 3/4" as appropriate). Hammer with small metal working hammer to shape top. Use a rough file and shape. Hammer again. Shape again. Work with finer file. Eventually it looks good. If the rivets are the uniform small type, you can dispense with some of the shaping but you need to be more careful in the initial under side flattening. You may want to trim the rivets stem with some cutters before you use them if they will be too long, you want enough poking through that you can get a good expansion but not so much that you end up bending the shaft or can't get it tight. It's a whole lot easier if you are going to refinish the leather as you can sand the leather lightly overall and make the rivets smooth. You'll need to be a lot more careful with the files if you don't intend to refinish. * * Chas wrote: I once kludged a Brooks Pro saddle onto Ideale flat alloy rails. Had an Ideale with trashed leather and a Brooks with broken rails. I cut the Brooks rails off in the rear leaving enough to thread with a hex die. The Ideale was attached to it's rails with nuts. The Brooks front end fit without a problem. The saddle worked fine except for the old style Ideale alloy clamp designed to mount on a straight alloy seat post. I could never get it to stay at the correct angle. Don't remember what ever happened to it. You could have bought the Zeus Idéale seat pin top clips to mount the Rebour 90IR aluminum saddle frame on a Campagnolo #1044 or Zeus copy. I rode that setup for many years, until it was loaned/wrecked. -- Andrew Muzi www.yellowjersey.org Open every day since 1 April, 1971 |
#7
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Brooks Team Pro - how hard to replace frame?
In article ,
Roger Sacilotto wrote: Long story short, I bent the rails on my year-old Brooks Team Professional saddle. I got the rails 90% back in shape, but I would like to try to replace the frame. I can figure out how to remove the old frame (keeping the nose piece intact), but I have no idea how to re-rivet a new frame. Do I need a special tool? I imagine that I would place the rivet through the saddle and frame, put the saddle upside-down and pound over the underside of the rivet (????) to flare it out, then hammer the rivet head to conform to the saddle surface. Has anyone tried this out? I figure if I can't do it myself, I might as well buy a new saddle for what I imagine the repair cost to be. On the other hand, the leather is nicely broken in, and is really comfortable, so I would prefer to keep it if it's economical. If nobody's pointed it out already, you can readily get all the parts you need from Wallingford Bikes in NOLA: http://www.wallbike.com/brooks/partsandaccessories.html For the riveting, looks like a hammer, anvil and drift punch ought to get you through it. |
#8
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Brooks Team Pro - how hard to replace frame?
In article ,
A Muzi wrote: * * Chas wrote: I once kludged a Brooks Pro saddle onto Ideale flat alloy rails. Had an Ideale with trashed leather and a Brooks with broken rails. I cut the Brooks rails off in the rear leaving enough to thread with a hex die. The Ideale was attached to it's rails with nuts. The Brooks front end fit without a problem. The saddle worked fine except for the old style Ideale alloy clamp designed to mount on a straight alloy seat post. I could never get it to stay at the correct angle. Don't remember what ever happened to it. You could have bought the Zeus Idéale seat pin top clips to mount the Rebour 90IR aluminum saddle frame on a Campagnolo #1044 or Zeus copy. I rode that setup for many years, until it was loaned/wrecked. Just when you think you've seen it all, along comes someone to tell you that you haven't. I'd like to have seen a picture of that setup. |
#9
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Brooks Team Pro - how hard to replace frame?
* * Chas wrote:
I once kludged a Brooks Pro saddle onto Ideale flat alloy rails. Had an Ideale with trashed leather and a Brooks with broken rails. I cut the Brooks rails off in the rear leaving enough to thread with a hex die. The Ideale was attached to it's rails with nuts. The Brooks front end fit without a problem. The saddle worked fine except for the old style Ideale alloy clamp designed to mount on a straight alloy seat post. I could never get it to stay at the correct angle. Don't remember what ever happened to it. A Muzi wrote: You could have bought the Zeus Idéale seat pin top clips to mount the Rebour 90IR aluminum saddle frame on a Campagnolo #1044 or Zeus copy. I rode that setup for many years, until it was loaned/wrecked. Tim McNamara wrote: Just when you think you've seen it all, along comes someone to tell you that you haven't. I'd like to have seen a picture of that setup That was an interesting search odyssey. Here's the 1970 Ron Kitching Handbook: http://www.yellowjersey.org/photosfr...t/IDEL4TIM.JPG Note the 'long' versions, matching Campagnolo's #1044 post lengths, are significantly shorter than today's 250mm 'short' posts. c.f. periodic comments on Jobst's fit. -- Andrew Muzi www.yellowjersey.org Open every day since 1 April, 1971 |
#10
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Brooks Team Pro - how hard to replace frame?
"A Muzi" wrote in message ... * * Chas wrote: I once kludged a Brooks Pro saddle onto Ideale flat alloy rails. Had an Ideale with trashed leather and a Brooks with broken rails. I cut the Brooks rails off in the rear leaving enough to thread with a hex die. The Ideale was attached to it's rails with nuts. The Brooks front end fit without a problem. The saddle worked fine except for the old style Ideale alloy clamp designed to mount on a straight alloy seat post. I could never get it to stay at the correct angle. Don't remember what ever happened to it. A Muzi wrote: You could have bought the Zeus Idéale seat pin top clips to mount the Rebour 90IR aluminum saddle frame on a Campagnolo #1044 or Zeus copy. I rode that setup for many years, until it was loaned/wrecked. Tim McNamara wrote: Just when you think you've seen it all, along comes someone to tell you that you haven't. I'd like to have seen a picture of that setup That was an interesting search odyssey. Here's the 1970 Ron Kitching Handbook: http://www.yellowjersey.org/photosfr...t/IDEL4TIM.JPG Note the 'long' versions, matching Campagnolo's #1044 post lengths, are significantly shorter than today's 250mm 'short' posts. c.f. periodic comments on Jobst's fit. -- Andrew Muzi www.yellowjersey.org Open every day since 1 April, 1971 We sold Zeus and I never saw one of those model 53 Ideale seat posts. I'd probably still be riding that saddle if I had. Chas. |
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