Put Interrupter levers on MTB Drop bar bike and drop bar levers nowfeel spongy

On 19/12/2018 11:41 p.m., Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Wednesday, December 19, 2018 at 10:35:36 PM UTC-5, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Thu, 20 Dec 2018 02:16:34 +0000 (UTC), Ralph Barone
wrote:

John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Thu, 20 Dec 2018 01:05:02 +0000 (UTC), Ralph Barone
wrote:

John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Wed, 19 Dec 2018 19:36:22 +0000 (UTC), Ralph Barone
wrote:

Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 12/19/2018 7:39 AM, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Tuesday, December 11, 2018 at 5:54:45 PM UTC-5, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
Hi there.

I put Interupter levers on an MTB Drop bar bike with cantilever brakes
and now drop bar levers feel spongy. The interrupter levers feel fine.
Any ideas why the two different types of brake levers feel so
different? I did NOT have this problem when I did the same thing to my
touring bike also with cantilever brake calipers.

Thanks and cheers.

I think that possibly something was seated properly somewhere. After I
posted the original query I was on another ride and discovered that the
rear brake interrupter lever felt spongy too. I just took up some slack
on the transverse cable on the rear brakes and now everything is fine.
The straddle cable holder could not be any lower because it'd interfere
with the fenders that are going on as soon as I take them off another bike.

Cantilever brakes plus fenders seems to be one area where a V-brake is
easier to set up for optimum braking power.

I agree, although V brakes work well with only a few lever types. And
they don't have the cantilever's adjustability, although I guess there
are a few brake levers with adjustable mechanical advantage.

But then, only we geeks value adjustability in braking force.


After years of fiddling with screechy, ineffective cantis, I'd love to find
an STI compatible V brake.

I've used V brakes with STI levers but it is a bit "fiddely". True the
wheel so there is no appreciable run out and adjust the brakes for
minimum clearance when off. I used that system for a year or so before
I rebuilt the bike to use caliper brakes (when I converted to friction
down tube shifters :-)

The major problem I've found with V brakes is their price. Would one
install a $12.00 brake on a $3,000 bike?

cheers,

John B.

If they work, you bet!

:-) you mean you are going to show up at a group ride where the lads
are all wearing Campagnolo Super Record Dual Pivot Brakes ($389.99 for
one) with your 12 dollar V brakes? :-)

cheers,

John B.

I'm riding a steel framed bike with a Shimano 3x9 drivetrain, fenders, and
26x2" tires. Do I sound like the kind of cyclist who gives a flying
fling-flang or who would even know anybody with a Campy drivetrain?

You did, one hopes, note the Smiley ( :-) at the end of my post?

cheers,

John B.

I don't know if he saw it. I did NOT see a Smiley at the end of your post but I did see the ASCII Smiley at the start of your post.

I really get a charge out of some of the bicyclists I see sitting outside a local coffee shop at times. They ride equipment like you referenced and wear very expensive bicycling gear. However, their "rides" are about 5 miles or so long only.


You must hang out at the wrong coffee shops. The one where we meet is 5
miles from home so after the 100k or so ride I still have 8k to go. g


I have a number of older 1980's vintage bicycles that I've refurbished. Four of them are MIELE road bicycles from when Jim Miele had his factory. Another is also a 1980's vintage MIELE MTB that I've converted to drop bars for gravel road riding, touring and/or some off road riding. My Columbus SLX frameset MIELE was upgraded with a combination of Cmapagnolo Mirage and Veloce 9-speed components because I liked the Campy Ergo shufters better than the Shimano brifters. The Mirage parts are the brake levers and the front derailleur because at the time they worked the exact same as the more expensive Veloce ones. I do prefer the look of silver clear anodized aluminium alloy components but was not willing to spend the substantial difference in order to have an all Veloce equipped bicycle.

Interestingly enough one of my most favoured road bicycles is a 1980's vintage Columbus SL MIELE frameset that I had a professional bicycle builder convert to allow me to use the even older Dura Ace AX components that I really like the looks and function of. I find the Dura Ace AX brake calipers quite sufficient for all my braking needs as well as being the easiest brake caliper I've ever had to center.



I agree, when all things are equal, spending extra doesn't make sense.
But then again my Tarmac Pro came with a pretty expensive set of brakes.
So did my last bike. So far I haven't had to replace them.

Actually I sold my old 90s era Bianchi Volpe with the factory Dia
Compes. I guess I'm just lucky...

On Thursday, December 20, 2018 at 5:33:05 AM UTC-8, duane wrote:
On 19/12/2018 11:41 p.m., Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Wednesday, December 19, 2018 at 10:35:36 PM UTC-5, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Thu, 20 Dec 2018 02:16:34 +0000 (UTC), Ralph Barone
wrote:

John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Thu, 20 Dec 2018 01:05:02 +0000 (UTC), Ralph Barone
wrote:

John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Wed, 19 Dec 2018 19:36:22 +0000 (UTC), Ralph Barone
wrote:

Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 12/19/2018 7:39 AM, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Tuesday, December 11, 2018 at 5:54:45 PM UTC-5, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
Hi there.

I put Interupter levers on an MTB Drop bar bike with cantilever brakes
and now drop bar levers feel spongy. The interrupter levers feel fine.
Any ideas why the two different types of brake levers feel so
different? I did NOT have this problem when I did the same thing to my
touring bike also with cantilever brake calipers.

Thanks and cheers.

I think that possibly something was seated properly somewhere. After I
posted the original query I was on another ride and discovered that the
rear brake interrupter lever felt spongy too. I just took up some slack
on the transverse cable on the rear brakes and now everything is fine.
The straddle cable holder could not be any lower because it'd interfere
with the fenders that are going on as soon as I take them off another bike.

Cantilever brakes plus fenders seems to be one area where a V-brake is
easier to set up for optimum braking power.

I agree, although V brakes work well with only a few lever types.. And
they don't have the cantilever's adjustability, although I guess there
are a few brake levers with adjustable mechanical advantage.

But then, only we geeks value adjustability in braking force.


After years of fiddling with screechy, ineffective cantis, I'd love to find
an STI compatible V brake.

I've used V brakes with STI levers but it is a bit "fiddely". True the
wheel so there is no appreciable run out and adjust the brakes for
minimum clearance when off. I used that system for a year or so before
I rebuilt the bike to use caliper brakes (when I converted to friction
down tube shifters :-)

The major problem I've found with V brakes is their price. Would one
install a $12.00 brake on a $3,000 bike?

cheers,

John B.

If they work, you bet!

:-) you mean you are going to show up at a group ride where the lads
are all wearing Campagnolo Super Record Dual Pivot Brakes ($389.99 for
one) with your 12 dollar V brakes? :-)

cheers,

John B.

I'm riding a steel framed bike with a Shimano 3x9 drivetrain, fenders, and
26x2" tires. Do I sound like the kind of cyclist who gives a flying
fling-flang or who would even know anybody with a Campy drivetrain?

You did, one hopes, note the Smiley ( :-) at the end of my post?

cheers,

John B.

I don't know if he saw it. I did NOT see a Smiley at the end of your post but I did see the ASCII Smiley at the start of your post.

I really get a charge out of some of the bicyclists I see sitting outside a local coffee shop at times. They ride equipment like you referenced and wear very expensive bicycling gear. However, their "rides" are about 5 miles or so long only.


You must hang out at the wrong coffee shops. The one where we meet is 5
miles from home so after the 100k or so ride I still have 8k to go. g

Same here, and its uphill -- but only 6k home. It's also next door to Sellwood Cycles and the meeting spot of its fearsome band of masters racers. The outside of the coffee shop often looks like a bike rack. One of Sellwood Cycles owners, Erik Tonkin, is a Cat 1 CX racer and perpetual race winner/placer. Now and then, their ride falls apart, and the stragglers come with us. Everybody knows everybody from the CX scene. Its a nice mix, but it means I have to work harder. It also means you're taking unplanned excursions over single track on what was supposed to be a road ride.

Sellwood is also closely tied to Kona and works with the company on its new products, so there are a lot of Kona riders -- which is a bang for the buck brand and not pretentious. I like Kona because they have fender mounts on most of their bikes.



I have a number of older 1980's vintage bicycles that I've refurbished. Four of them are MIELE road bicycles from when Jim Miele had his factory. Another is also a 1980's vintage MIELE MTB that I've converted to drop bars for gravel road riding, touring and/or some off road riding. My Columbus SLX frameset MIELE was upgraded with a combination of Cmapagnolo Mirage and Veloce 9-speed components because I liked the Campy Ergo shufters better than the Shimano brifters. The Mirage parts are the brake levers and the front derailleur because at the time they worked the exact same as the more expensive Veloce ones. I do prefer the look of silver clear anodized aluminium alloy components but was not willing to spend the substantial difference in order to have an all Veloce equipped bicycle.

Interestingly enough one of my most favoured road bicycles is a 1980's vintage Columbus SL MIELE frameset that I had a professional bicycle builder convert to allow me to use the even older Dura Ace AX components that I really like the looks and function of. I find the Dura Ace AX brake calipers quite sufficient for all my braking needs as well as being the easiest brake caliper I've ever had to center.



I agree, when all things are equal, spending extra doesn't make sense.
But then again my Tarmac Pro came with a pretty expensive set of brakes.
So did my last bike. So far I haven't had to replace them.

Actually I sold my old 90s era Bianchi Volpe with the factory Dia
Compes. I guess I'm just lucky...

You have to work pretty hard to get a bad set of brakes for dry weather braking. Modolo Kronos maybe -- or a poorly set-up pair of cantilevers. To me, it's all about wet weather braking and rim wear. My dry weather bike has direct mount rim brakes which work well. I prefer the hydraulic discs in wet weather and dirty conditions.

-- Jay Beattie.

On 20/12/2018 10:10 a.m., jbeattie wrote:
On Thursday, December 20, 2018 at 5:33:05 AM UTC-8, duane wrote:
On 19/12/2018 11:41 p.m., Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Wednesday, December 19, 2018 at 10:35:36 PM UTC-5, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Thu, 20 Dec 2018 02:16:34 +0000 (UTC), Ralph Barone
wrote:

John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Thu, 20 Dec 2018 01:05:02 +0000 (UTC), Ralph Barone
wrote:

John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Wed, 19 Dec 2018 19:36:22 +0000 (UTC), Ralph Barone
wrote:

Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 12/19/2018 7:39 AM, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Tuesday, December 11, 2018 at 5:54:45 PM UTC-5, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
Hi there.

I put Interupter levers on an MTB Drop bar bike with cantilever brakes
and now drop bar levers feel spongy. The interrupter levers feel fine.
Any ideas why the two different types of brake levers feel so
different? I did NOT have this problem when I did the same thing to my
touring bike also with cantilever brake calipers.

Thanks and cheers.

I think that possibly something was seated properly somewhere. After I
posted the original query I was on another ride and discovered that the
rear brake interrupter lever felt spongy too. I just took up some slack
on the transverse cable on the rear brakes and now everything is fine.
The straddle cable holder could not be any lower because it'd interfere
with the fenders that are going on as soon as I take them off another bike.

Cantilever brakes plus fenders seems to be one area where a V-brake is
easier to set up for optimum braking power.

I agree, although V brakes work well with only a few lever types. And
they don't have the cantilever's adjustability, although I guess there
are a few brake levers with adjustable mechanical advantage.

But then, only we geeks value adjustability in braking force.


After years of fiddling with screechy, ineffective cantis, I'd love to find
an STI compatible V brake.

I've used V brakes with STI levers but it is a bit "fiddely". True the
wheel so there is no appreciable run out and adjust the brakes for
minimum clearance when off. I used that system for a year or so before
I rebuilt the bike to use caliper brakes (when I converted to friction
down tube shifters :-)

The major problem I've found with V brakes is their price. Would one
install a $12.00 brake on a $3,000 bike?

cheers,

John B.

If they work, you bet!

:-) you mean you are going to show up at a group ride where the lads
are all wearing Campagnolo Super Record Dual Pivot Brakes ($389.99 for
one) with your 12 dollar V brakes? :-)

cheers,

John B.

I'm riding a steel framed bike with a Shimano 3x9 drivetrain, fenders, and
26x2" tires. Do I sound like the kind of cyclist who gives a flying
fling-flang or who would even know anybody with a Campy drivetrain?

You did, one hopes, note the Smiley ( :-) at the end of my post?

cheers,

John B.

I don't know if he saw it. I did NOT see a Smiley at the end of your post but I did see the ASCII Smiley at the start of your post.

I really get a charge out of some of the bicyclists I see sitting outside a local coffee shop at times. They ride equipment like you referenced and wear very expensive bicycling gear. However, their "rides" are about 5 miles or so long only.


You must hang out at the wrong coffee shops. The one where we meet is 5
miles from home so after the 100k or so ride I still have 8k to go. g

Same here, and its uphill -- but only 6k home. It's also next door to Sellwood Cycles and the meeting spot of its fearsome band of masters racers. The outside of the coffee shop often looks like a bike rack. One of Sellwood Cycles owners, Erik Tonkin, is a Cat 1 CX racer and perpetual race winner/placer. Now and then, their ride falls apart, and the stragglers come with us. Everybody knows everybody from the CX scene. Its a nice mix, but it means I have to work harder. It also means you're taking unplanned excursions over single track on what was supposed to be a road ride.

Sellwood is also closely tied to Kona and works with the company on its new products, so there are a lot of Kona riders -- which is a bang for the buck brand and not pretentious. I like Kona because they have fender mounts on most of their bikes.



I have a number of older 1980's vintage bicycles that I've refurbished. Four of them are MIELE road bicycles from when Jim Miele had his factory. Another is also a 1980's vintage MIELE MTB that I've converted to drop bars for gravel road riding, touring and/or some off road riding. My Columbus SLX frameset MIELE was upgraded with a combination of Cmapagnolo Mirage and Veloce 9-speed components because I liked the Campy Ergo shufters better than the Shimano brifters. The Mirage parts are the brake levers and the front derailleur because at the time they worked the exact same as the more expensive Veloce ones. I do prefer the look of silver clear anodized aluminium alloy components but was not willing to spend the substantial difference in order to have an all Veloce equipped bicycle.

Interestingly enough one of my most favoured road bicycles is a 1980's vintage Columbus SL MIELE frameset that I had a professional bicycle builder convert to allow me to use the even older Dura Ace AX components that I really like the looks and function of. I find the Dura Ace AX brake calipers quite sufficient for all my braking needs as well as being the easiest brake caliper I've ever had to center.



I agree, when all things are equal, spending extra doesn't make sense.
But then again my Tarmac Pro came with a pretty expensive set of brakes.
So did my last bike. So far I haven't had to replace them.

Actually I sold my old 90s era Bianchi Volpe with the factory Dia
Compes. I guess I'm just lucky...

You have to work pretty hard to get a bad set of brakes for dry weather braking. Modolo Kronos maybe -- or a poorly set-up pair of cantilevers. To me, it's all about wet weather braking and rim wear. My dry weather bike has direct mount rim brakes which work well. I prefer the hydraulic discs in wet weather and dirty conditions.


I am down to one bike. I guess it's mostly a dry weather bike but ****
happens.

I guess if it rained as much here as where you are I'd have to think
about it. As for rim wear, like I said, I have ~30,000 KM on my wheels
and so far so good. My main concern here is the crappy roads, not the
rain or mud.

On 12/20/2018 10:10 AM, jbeattie wrote:

You have to work pretty hard to get a bad set of brakes for dry weather braking.

I agree.

Modolo Kronos maybe -- or a poorly set-up pair of cantilevers. To me, it's all about wet weather braking and rim wear. My dry weather bike has direct mount rim brakes which work well.

I have either cantilevers or V-brakes on all bikes except one. The
around-town 3 speed has ancient and flexible center pulls. Those are the
least effective brakes in the stable, but still fine for the riding done
with that bike.

I prefer the hydraulic discs in wet weather and dirty conditions.

That's understandable. Yet there must be hundreds of thousands of people
who ride only in clean dry conditions, but who are now convinced that
anything other than a disc brake is a disaster waiting to happen.

Fashion is weird and powerful. So is advertising.

--
- Frank Krygowski

On Thursday, December 20, 2018 at 8:21:04 AM UTC-8, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 12/20/2018 10:10 AM, jbeattie wrote:

You have to work pretty hard to get a bad set of brakes for dry weather braking.

I agree.

Modolo Kronos maybe -- or a poorly set-up pair of cantilevers. To me, it's all about wet weather braking and rim wear. My dry weather bike has direct mount rim brakes which work well.

I have either cantilevers or V-brakes on all bikes except one. The
around-town 3 speed has ancient and flexible center pulls. Those are the
least effective brakes in the stable, but still fine for the riding done
with that bike.

I prefer the hydraulic discs in wet weather and dirty conditions.

That's understandable. Yet there must be hundreds of thousands of people
who ride only in clean dry conditions, but who are now convinced that
anything other than a disc brake is a disaster waiting to happen.

Fashion is weird and powerful. So is advertising.

Yes, I commuted daily for a good fifteen years in the PNW before getting cable discs on my commuter. I could still use rim brakes, but I prefer discs -- and its not a fashion thing or because of advertising. I'm not even aware of advertising for disc brakes or any other bicycle thing. The brakes just stop better in wet weather. It's not even a close call.

Another good thing about discs is tire clearance and not having to wrestle with straddle cables on the cantis when I switched to studs or big tires. They don't pack-up with crap, including leaves and snow -- at least on my commuter and gravel bike which have tons of clearance between the fender and wheel (no fenders currently on the gravel bike). Discs aren't mandatory on a road bike, but they are nice.

-- Jay Beattie.

John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Thu, 20 Dec 2018 02:16:34 +0000 (UTC), Ralph Barone
wrote:

John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Thu, 20 Dec 2018 01:05:02 +0000 (UTC), Ralph Barone
wrote:

John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Wed, 19 Dec 2018 19:36:22 +0000 (UTC), Ralph Barone
wrote:

Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 12/19/2018 7:39 AM, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Tuesday, December 11, 2018 at 5:54:45 PM UTC-5, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
Hi there.

I put Interupter levers on an MTB Drop bar bike with cantilever brakes
and now drop bar levers feel spongy. The interrupter levers feel fine.
Any ideas why the two different types of brake levers feel so
different? I did NOT have this problem when I did the same thing to my
touring bike also with cantilever brake calipers.

Thanks and cheers.

I think that possibly something was seated properly somewhere. After I
posted the original query I was on another ride and discovered that the
rear brake interrupter lever felt spongy too. I just took up some slack
on the transverse cable on the rear brakes and now everything is fine.
The straddle cable holder could not be any lower because it'd interfere
with the fenders that are going on as soon as I take them off another bike.

Cantilever brakes plus fenders seems to be one area where a V-brake is
easier to set up for optimum braking power.

I agree, although V brakes work well with only a few lever types. And
they don't have the cantilever's adjustability, although I guess there
are a few brake levers with adjustable mechanical advantage.

But then, only we geeks value adjustability in braking force.


After years of fiddling with screechy, ineffective cantis, I'd love to find
an STI compatible V brake.

I've used V brakes with STI levers but it is a bit "fiddely". True the
wheel so there is no appreciable run out and adjust the brakes for
minimum clearance when off. I used that system for a year or so before
I rebuilt the bike to use caliper brakes (when I converted to friction
down tube shifters :-)

The major problem I've found with V brakes is their price. Would one
install a $12.00 brake on a $3,000 bike?

cheers,

John B.

If they work, you bet!

:-) you mean you are going to show up at a group ride where the lads
are all wearing Campagnolo Super Record Dual Pivot Brakes ($389.99 for
one) with your 12 dollar V brakes? :-)

cheers,

John B.

I'm riding a steel framed bike with a Shimano 3x9 drivetrain, fenders, and
26x2" tires. Do I sound like the kind of cyclist who gives a flying
fling-flang or who would even know anybody with a Campy drivetrain?

You did, one hopes, note the Smiley ( :-) at the end of my post?

cheers,

John B.


Yes I did. I really should have put a smiley at the end of my reply.

On Thu, 20 Dec 2018 11:20:58 -0500, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 12/20/2018 10:10 AM, jbeattie wrote:

You have to work pretty hard to get a bad set of brakes for dry weather braking.

I agree.

Modolo Kronos maybe -- or a poorly set-up pair of cantilevers. To me, it's all about wet weather braking and rim wear. My dry weather bike has direct mount rim brakes which work well.

I have either cantilevers or V-brakes on all bikes except one. The
around-town 3 speed has ancient and flexible center pulls. Those are the
least effective brakes in the stable, but still fine for the riding done
with that bike.

I prefer the hydraulic discs in wet weather and dirty conditions.

That's understandable. Yet there must be hundreds of thousands of people
who ride only in clean dry conditions, but who are now convinced that
anything other than a disc brake is a disaster waiting to happen.

Fashion is weird and powerful. So is advertising.

The old adage "build a better mousetrap and the world will beat a path
to your door" is true only if you tell people about it :-)

cheers,

John B.

On Thu, 20 Dec 2018 15:05:12 +0700, John B. Slocomb
wrote:

What I didn't tell them was how long it took :-)

I went on a four-hour ride the day before yesterday.

Google Maps tells me that I went 8.8 miles (14 kilometers), and that
was probably an over-estimate -- I decline to tell Google my exact
location.

I could have used some padded shorts on that ride.


--
Joy Beeson
joy beeson at comcast dot net
http://wlweather.net/PAGEJOY/

On Fri, 21 Dec 2018 00:09:39 -0500, Joy Beeson
wrote:

On Thu, 20 Dec 2018 15:05:12 +0700, John B. Slocomb
wrote:

What I didn't tell them was how long it took :-)

I went on a four-hour ride the day before yesterday.

Google Maps tells me that I went 8.8 miles (14 kilometers), and that
was probably an over-estimate -- I decline to tell Google my exact
location.

I could have used some padded shorts on that ride.

I assume that you stopped along the way as 14 Km in four hours is 3.5
Km/h, 2.17 mph, which is a slow walk.

I have a (what would you call it? bike meter?) on my bikes which
records speed, distance traveled, average time, etc.

cheers,

John B.

On 12/21/2018 12:09 AM, Joy Beeson wrote:
On Thu, 20 Dec 2018 15:05:12 +0700, John B. Slocomb
wrote:

What I didn't tell them was how long it took :-)

I went on a four-hour ride the day before yesterday.

Google Maps tells me that I went 8.8 miles (14 kilometers), and that
was probably an over-estimate -- I decline to tell Google my exact
location.

I could have used some padded shorts on that ride.

So what's the difference between padding in shorts and padding in a saddle?

I suspect that for most people who use them, the main benefit of cycling
shorts is the lack of seams (as present in some underwear and some
pants). Beyond that, I think the "padding" acts more as stiffening, to
ensure that the shorts fabric doesn't fold and wrinkle between the bike
seat and one's butt. Likewise, I think the benefit of lycra is mostly
that it stretches to reduce the possibility of wrinkles.

Although I've never tried it, I suspect that tight lycra shorts without
padding, plus the proper amount of padding in the saddle itself, would
work as well as the oddball "chamois" things in most bike shorts.


--
- Frank Krygowski