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How long each week can I train in HR zone 4



 
 
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  #1  
Old June 11th 06, 04:53 AM posted to rec.bicycles.racing
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Default How long each week can I train in HR zone 4

First, my zone 4 is 83-86% of max. 86% being where I am at LT.
I have been told that 45 min to an hour is max. However, I have just
recently upgraded to cat3 and could use a bit more power at LT. Also,
most of my racing is crit and TT.

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  #2  
Old June 11th 06, 05:01 PM posted to rec.bicycles.racing
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Default How long each week can I train in HR zone 4


velosprinter wrote:
First, my zone 4 is 83-86% of max. 86% being where I am at LT.
I have been told that 45 min to an hour is max. However, I have just
recently upgraded to cat3 and could use a bit more power at LT. Also,
most of my racing is crit and TT.



If you race enough you should be able to figure this out from analyzing
changes you are forced to make. Depending on where you are competing,
pay attention to real differences rather than those you assume will be
different. Some regions start to add distance for Cat 3 others don't
until 2/1/Pro. If you already figured that out and have the start of
what you know to be your new requirements, then my suggestion is to use
"titration" which means to add time and intensity in measured
increments while paying careful attention to how you tolerate it.
Moving too fast can make the difference between acceptable adaptation
(some improvement with little or not trade-offs) and over-training.
Since you have no "control" group for yourself you need to take extra
care since failure provides much less information about where you go
next than some measure of positive adaptation(s). IOW, go with small
increments and if there is any doubt, reduce those increments. It is
better to go slower and wait for your body to adapt than to fail (which
is defined not by race results but by only having negative changes to
your performance). If you need to race more conservatively than do that
until you start to feel aggressive again while competing. Remember that
many upgrading athletes who move up during this time of the season make
no changes to training because racing provides the changes your body
needs at this point. If that will work for you then you can just start
prep. for 2007 with those changes that you assess based on your results
in adapting this way.

To answer your specific question about time in specific zones, only you
can answer that after you make the changes as I have suggested. It may
go down because you may still be experiencing increasing efficiency to
your cardio-vascular system and for that reason it is ideal to measure
your loads with power, calculated with an device or by measuring
reduced times over specific courses (hills are more accurate and linear
in power requirements but are not always ideal) either for all of your
interval work or at least enough to track changes in what "zone 4" is
for you. The whole concept behind training by zones originally was
designed to allow you to keep your work loads the same according to HR
because continuous improvements hopefully means that each time you do
your workouts, you can use the same template and allow your CV
adaptations to be your guidelines for increasing intensity in a
structured way that is very easy to follow. The higher the intensity
and your overall fitness becomes makes this training concept less and
less useful. That is why measuring results via power directly or
through performance becomes more useful and at one point almost a
requirement. You might consider using at least one or two simulated
ITTs per month if you can't compete that frequently and use results
from those performances to keep your HR zones relevant for you.

Good luck, enjoy yourself.

  #3  
Old June 11th 06, 10:28 PM posted to rec.bicycles.racing
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Default How long each week can I train in HR zone 4

velosprinter wrote:
First, my zone 4 is 83-86% of max. 86% being where I am at LT.
I have been told that 45 min to an hour is max.


Robert Chung wrote:
Who told you that?


A little bird told me I could improve my LT if I drank enough orange juice.

  #4  
Old June 12th 06, 01:28 AM posted to rec.bicycles.racing
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Default How long each week can I train in HR zone 4

A little bird told me I could improve my LT if I drank enough orange juice.

And it's as safe as EPO...

  #5  
Old June 12th 06, 02:30 PM posted to rec.bicycles.racing
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Default How long each week can I train in HR zone 4

On 11 Jun 2006 17:28:26 -0700, "
wrote:

A little bird told me I could improve my LT if I drank enough orange juice.


And it's as safe as EPO...


If you cut the pulp with vodka.

Livedrunk and don't choke on pulp. That's our motto. We have a lot of
them.

Curtis L. Russell
Odenton, MD (USA)
Just someone on two wheels...
  #6  
Old June 12th 06, 06:54 PM posted to rec.bicycles.racing
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Default How long each week can I train in HR zone 4

Chris,
Thank you for the advise. I guess my worry is that I would go into
those negative results if I spent to much time training. Right now I
can not afford a Power meter so I measure time on a specific clime with
HR at a set value. Really what I was wondering is what the pros do as
far as the ratio of time spent at different exertion levels.

Others,
By the way, the time in LT was from an ex pro who is now drinking
chocolate milk I will try the suggested OJ.

  #7  
Old June 12th 06, 07:06 PM posted to rec.bicycles.racing
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Default How long each week can I train in HR zone 4

velosprinter wrote:
Really what I was wondering is what the pros do as
far as the ratio of time spent at different exertion levels.


http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q..._uids=16394967



  #8  
Old June 12th 06, 07:45 PM posted to rec.bicycles.racing
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Default How long each week can I train in HR zone 4

Robert Chung wrote:
velosprinter wrote:
Really what I was wondering is what the pros do as
far as the ratio of time spent at different exertion levels.


http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q..._uids=16394967


Robert, did you get the entire article? I wonder if that
over-estimation of LT time was merely the delay of the heart and the
heart rate monitoring to catch up.

  #9  
Old June 12th 06, 08:41 PM posted to rec.bicycles.racing
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Default How long each week can I train in HR zone 4

Tom Kunich wrote:

I wonder if that
over-estimation of LT time was merely the delay of the heart and the
heart rate monitoring to catch up.


The paper gave two reasons:
1. HR drift
2. HR lag

One of the interesting things in that paper is the table that shows
average power output for each of the stages of what appears to be this
race:
http://www.cyclingnews.com/results/2.../regio00.shtml

Stage 1: 167km, 650m altitude gain, 2.7 W/kg
Stage 2: 164km, 1500m altitude gain, 2.9 W/kg
Stage 3: 84km 700m altitude gain, 3.8 W/kg
Stage 4 uphill TT: 13km, 450m altitude gain, 5.5 W/kg
Stage 5: 170km, 400m altitude gain, 3.2 W/kg
Stage 6: 160km, 200m altitude gain, 3.4 W/kg

Note the overall GC winner of that race.


  #10  
Old June 12th 06, 10:31 PM posted to rec.bicycles.racing
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Default How long each week can I train in HR zone 4

Just found HR data from last year's tour graphed with alt. and time.
http://www.polardreamteam.com/flash/?c=11


Robert Chung wrote:
Tom Kunich wrote:

I wonder if that
over-estimation of LT time was merely the delay of the heart and the
heart rate monitoring to catch up.


The paper gave two reasons:
1. HR drift
2. HR lag

One of the interesting things in that paper is the table that shows
average power output for each of the stages of what appears to be this
race:
http://www.cyclingnews.com/results/2.../regio00.shtml

Stage 1: 167km, 650m altitude gain, 2.7 W/kg
Stage 2: 164km, 1500m altitude gain, 2.9 W/kg
Stage 3: 84km 700m altitude gain, 3.8 W/kg
Stage 4 uphill TT: 13km, 450m altitude gain, 5.5 W/kg
Stage 5: 170km, 400m altitude gain, 3.2 W/kg
Stage 6: 160km, 200m altitude gain, 3.4 W/kg

Note the overall GC winner of that race.


 




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