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TdF and recumbents



 
 
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  #31  
Old July 29th 08, 03:03 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech,alt.rec.bicycles.recumbent
Tom Kunich
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Default TdF and recumbents

"Tom Sherman" wrote in message
...

Whats up with bringing off-road cycling into the discussion?


Lost track of which thread I was in. Nevertheless it is perfectly fine in my
book to try to race the Tour de France with a recumbent. Just try to ride
down those Alps roads fast enough to make up for the time lost on the climb.


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  #32  
Old July 29th 08, 03:06 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech,alt.rec.bicycles.recumbent
Edward Dolan
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Default TdF and recumbents


"Tom Sherman" wrote in message
...
Edward Dolan wrote:
"Tom Sherman" wrote in message
...
Edward Dolan wrote:

[...]
Surely there are near professional type races in the mountains which
pit uprights against recumbents. Find out the results of such races and
report back to me.
Go to the article on page 14 about the Trondheim-Oslo event:
http://www.bhpc.org.uk/oldnews/Issue51.pdf.


An interesting pdf, but too much of that British HPV stuff will rot your
brain.

I will admit that a recumbent with a full body fairing can be amazingly
fast. I still don't think they can be all that fast going up a steep hill
though.

I remember a tour I was on (BRAN I think) and there was this rather
chubby guy who had a RANS Tailwind with a full body fairing (home made).


Anyone with a RANS Tailwind and a homemade full-fairing is beyond the
pale.

Oops, http://www.ransbikes.com/Gallery/Archive/Sherman.htm .


His fairing appeared to be made out of some kind of cardboard. It looked
clunky, but he was damn fast.

No one could catch him once he got going. He was also fast going up hills
provided they were not too steep.

With the body-sock fairing on my Tailwind, I was faster up grades less
than about 4% due to the aerodynamic advantage, despite the extra 10
pounds of weight.

I think to be fair about this, you would have to pit a faired recumbent
against a faired upright in a largely mountainous terrain. Otherwise, you
are comparing apples to oranges and not getting to the heart of the
question, which is - can recumbents climb hills as well as uprights? I
say no.

The faired upright would get blown of the road by the first wind gust.


Faired uprights are rare to nonexistent - and for good reason. However,
recumbents with fairings can also get blown all over the road in strong
winds. In certain situations, it is extremely dangerous to ride a recumbent
with a fairing.

I recall on a tour in Wyoming in the mountains that those who had fairings
on their recumbents had to remove them for fear of being blown off the road
into the canyon below.

Regards,

Ed Dolan the Great - Minnesota
aka
Saint Edward the Great - Order of the Perpetual Sorrows - Minnesota


  #33  
Old July 29th 08, 03:15 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech,alt.rec.bicycles.recumbent
Tom Sherman[_2_]
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Posts: 9,890
Default TdF and recumbents

Tom Kunich wrote:
"Tom Sherman" wrote in message
...

Whats up with bringing off-road cycling into the discussion?


Lost track of which thread I was in. Nevertheless it is perfectly fine
in my book to try to race the Tour de France with a recumbent. Just try
to ride down those Alps roads fast enough to make up for the time lost
on the climb.

Note: Opinion stated as fact.

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
“Mary had a little lamb / And when she saw it sicken /
She shipped it off to Packingtown / And now it’s labeled chicken.”
  #34  
Old July 29th 08, 03:18 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech,alt.rec.bicycles.recumbent
Tom Sherman[_2_]
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Posts: 9,890
Default TdF and recumbents

Edward Dolan wrote:
"Tom Sherman" wrote in message
...
Edward Dolan wrote:
"Tom Sherman" wrote in message
...
Edward Dolan wrote:
[...]
Surely there are near professional type races in the mountains which
pit uprights against recumbents. Find out the results of such races and
report back to me.
Go to the article on page 14 about the Trondheim-Oslo event:
http://www.bhpc.org.uk/oldnews/Issue51.pdf.
An interesting pdf, but too much of that British HPV stuff will rot your
brain.

I will admit that a recumbent with a full body fairing can be amazingly
fast. I still don't think they can be all that fast going up a steep hill
though.

I remember a tour I was on (BRAN I think) and there was this rather
chubby guy who had a RANS Tailwind with a full body fairing (home made).

Anyone with a RANS Tailwind and a homemade full-fairing is beyond the
pale.

Oops, http://www.ransbikes.com/Gallery/Archive/Sherman.htm .


His fairing appeared to be made out of some kind of cardboard. It looked
clunky, but he was damn fast.

Most likely the material was Coroplast® (corrugated polymer sheeting).

No one could catch him once he got going. He was also fast going up hills
provided they were not too steep.

With the body-sock fairing on my Tailwind, I was faster up grades less
than about 4% due to the aerodynamic advantage, despite the extra 10
pounds of weight.

I think to be fair about this, you would have to pit a faired recumbent
against a faired upright in a largely mountainous terrain. Otherwise, you
are comparing apples to oranges and not getting to the heart of the
question, which is - can recumbents climb hills as well as uprights? I
say no.

The faired upright would get blown of the road by the first wind gust.


Faired uprights are rare to nonexistent - and for good reason. However,
recumbents with fairings can also get blown all over the road in strong
winds. In certain situations, it is extremely dangerous to ride a recumbent
with a fairing.

The most wind I ever rode in with a body sock was 30 mph with gusts to
45 mph.

I recall on a tour in Wyoming in the mountains that those who had fairings
on their recumbents had to remove them for fear of being blown off the road
into the canyon below.

"The only thing we have to fear is fear itself" - FDR

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
“Mary had a little lamb / And when she saw it sicken /
She shipped it off to Packingtown / And now it’s labeled chicken.”
  #35  
Old July 29th 08, 03:49 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech,alt.rec.bicycles.recumbent
Edward Dolan
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Posts: 14,212
Default TdF and recumbents


"Tom Sherman" wrote in message
...
Tom Kunich wrote:
"Tom Sherman" wrote in message
...

Whats up with bringing off-road cycling into the discussion?


Lost track of which thread I was in. Nevertheless it is perfectly fine in
my book to try to race the Tour de France with a recumbent. Just try to
ride down those Alps roads fast enough to make up for the time lost on
the climb.

Note: Opinion stated as fact.


Here is Tom Sherman sounding like JimmyMac. He should find a different way
of saying it. But Mr. Kunich is right. No way you can make up going down
what you lose going up. This is as true of small hills as it is of mountain
passes.

Regards,

Ed Dolan the Great - Minnesota
aka
Saint Edward the Great - Order of the Perpetual Sorrows - Minnesota


  #36  
Old July 29th 08, 04:02 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech,alt.rec.bicycles.recumbent
Tom Sherman[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 9,890
Default TdF and recumbents

Edward Dolan wrote:
"Tom Sherman" wrote in message
...
Tom Kunich wrote:
"Tom Sherman" wrote in message
...
Whats up with bringing off-road cycling into the discussion?
Lost track of which thread I was in. Nevertheless it is perfectly fine in
my book to try to race the Tour de France with a recumbent. Just try to
ride down those Alps roads fast enough to make up for the time lost on
the climb.

Note: Opinion stated as fact.


Here is Tom Sherman sounding like JimmyMac. He should find a different way
of saying it. But Mr. Kunich is right. No way you can make up going down
what you lose going up. This is as true of small hills as it is of mountain
passes.

Hey Ed,

Jim McNamara picked up the phrase from me, not the other way around.

Ever see a race stage that was all climbing and descending - no, I have
not either. The assumption that the speed penalty climbing would be
equal to speed advantage descending is overly simplistic and unrealistic.

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
“Mary had a little lamb / And when she saw it sicken /
She shipped it off to Packingtown / And now it’s labeled chicken.”
  #38  
Old July 29th 08, 08:52 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech,alt.rec.bicycles.recumbent
Ben C
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Posts: 3,084
Default TdF and recumbents

On 2008-07-29, Tom Kunich [email protected] wrote:
"Tom Sherman" wrote in message
...

Whats up with bringing off-road cycling into the discussion?


Lost track of which thread I was in. Nevertheless it is perfectly fine in my
book to try to race the Tour de France with a recumbent. Just try to ride
down those Alps roads fast enough to make up for the time lost on the climb.


If recumbents weren't better why would they be banned?
  #39  
Old July 29th 08, 09:12 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech,alt.rec.bicycles.recumbent
Jon Bendtsen
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Posts: 168
Default TdF and recumbents

Ben C wrote:
On 2008-07-29, Tom Kunich [email protected] wrote:
"Tom Sherman" wrote in message
...
Whats up with bringing off-road cycling into the discussion?

Lost track of which thread I was in. Nevertheless it is perfectly fine in my
book to try to race the Tour de France with a recumbent. Just try to ride
down those Alps roads fast enough to make up for the time lost on the climb.


If recumbents weren't better why would they be banned?


To level the playing field? so it is the rider and not the
bike that decides who wins? F1 racing also bans some technology.


JonB
  #40  
Old July 29th 08, 09:22 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech,alt.rec.bicycles.recumbent
Zebee Johnstone
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Posts: 1,960
Default TdF and recumbents

In alt.rec.bicycles.recumbent on Tue, 29 Jul 2008 10:12:51 +0200
Jon Bendtsen wrote:
Ben C wrote:

If recumbents weren't better why would they be banned?


To level the playing field? so it is the rider and not the
bike that decides who wins? F1 racing also bans some technology.


Doesn't make sense.

If the bikes aren't good enough then no one would choose them.

Zebee
 




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