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UK puts National Park Rangers on Mountain Bikes--U.S. Needs to Dothe Same!



 
 
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  #1  
Old June 6th 13, 05:56 PM posted to alt.mountain-bike
SMS
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Default UK puts National Park Rangers on Mountain Bikes--U.S. Needs to Dothe Same!

http://www.grough.co.uk/magazine/2013/06/03/peak-district-rangers-take-to-mountain-bikes-in-first-for-national-park

In Yosemite you rarely see rangers on some trails anymore, there's just
no way with reduced funding that the rangers can cover the area they
used to. Horses are very destructive to the trails and very expensive to
maintain. Mountain bike patrols would be ideal, especially now that
mountain biking is expanding in National Parks.
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  #2  
Old June 7th 13, 03:41 AM posted to alt.mountain-bike
Mike Vandeman[_4_]
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Default UK puts National Park Rangers on Mountain Bikes--U.S. Needs to Dothe Same!

On Thursday, June 6, 2013 9:56:55 AM UTC-7, sms wrote:
http://www.grough.co.uk/magazine/2013/06/03/peak-district-rangers-take-to-mountain-bikes-in-first-for-national-park



In Yosemite you rarely see rangers on some trails anymore, there's just

no way with reduced funding that the rangers can cover the area they

used to. Horses are very destructive to the trails and very expensive to

maintain. Mountain bike patrols would be ideal, especially now that

mountain biking is expanding in National Parks.


Oh, sure, if they want to end up DEAD! Park rangers are supposed to be role models, so exhibiting behavior that is destructive to the parks wouldn't be appropriate. I guess that reasoning is over your head....
  #3  
Old June 7th 13, 01:00 PM posted to alt.mountain-bike
Blackblade
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Default UK puts National Park Rangers on Mountain Bikes--U.S. Needs to Dothe Same!

On Thursday, June 6, 2013 5:56:55 PM UTC+1, sms wrote:
http://www.grough.co.uk/magazine/2013/06/03/peak-district-rangers-take-to-mountain-bikes-in-first-for-national-park



In Yosemite you rarely see rangers on some trails anymore, there's just

no way with reduced funding that the rangers can cover the area they

used to. Horses are very destructive to the trails and very expensive to

maintain. Mountain bike patrols would be ideal, especially now that

mountain biking is expanding in National Parks.


That's a very good idea. We already have that in some UK national parks and it works very well.
  #4  
Old June 7th 13, 01:02 PM posted to alt.mountain-bike
Blackblade
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Posts: 274
Default UK puts National Park Rangers on Mountain Bikes--U.S. Needs to Dothe Same!


Oh, sure, if they want to end up DEAD! Park rangers are supposed to be role models, so exhibiting behavior that is destructive to the parks wouldn't be appropriate. I guess that reasoning is over your head....


I guess you forgot the 0.00123 fatalities per million miles statistic we discussed ? Mountain Biking is, statistically, very safe indeed.

And how on earth do you justify preferring a ton or more of horse hitting the trails as opposed to a 25lb mountain bike ? It's way LESS destructive than having them on horses.
  #5  
Old June 7th 13, 05:30 PM posted to alt.mountain-bike
SMS
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Posts: 9,477
Default UK puts National Park Rangers on Mountain Bikes--U.S. Needs toDo the Same!

On 6/7/2013 5:02 AM, Blackblade wrote:

Oh, sure, if they want to end up DEAD! Park rangers are supposed to be role models, so exhibiting behavior that is destructive to the parks wouldn't be appropriate. I guess that reasoning is over your head....


I guess you forgot the 0.00123 fatalities per million miles statistic we discussed ? Mountain Biking is, statistically, very safe indeed.

And how on earth do you justify preferring a ton or more of horse hitting the trails as opposed to a 25lb mountain bike ? It's way LESS destructive than having them on horses.


Remember, the reason that horses are so destructive is not just the
weight of the horse and the trail damage, it's also the waste products.
"BLM (Bureau of Land Management) routinely receives complaints about
horse waste, horse damage to trails, or general equestrian etiquette."
You're already seeing some places ban horses because of trail damage and
horse waste, but the equestrians are a powerful group because they tend
to be wealthy. It's amazing that dog owners are required to pick up
after their animals on trails, but horse owners are not.

Every study that compares trail damage of different users has shown that
hikers and mountain bikers cause about the same amount of trail damage,
while equestrians much more damage. I.e., a 1994 study out of the
University of Vermont concluded "horses produced significantly larger
quantities of sediment compared to hikers, off-road bicycles, and
motorcycles." Of course this was a detailed, scientifically conducted,
peer-reviewed study!

Amusingly, one of Vandeman's supporters, Terri Sweet is an equestrian so
he is unwilling to face the facts regarding the damage horses do to
trails even though all the experts agree that horses are far more
destructive to trails than bicycle tires or Vibram soled boots.

What is also interesting is that "heavily laden hikers" (backpackers)
actually cause _more_ trail damage than bicycles. "Mountain bikers will
exert a downward force through their tyres which comprises the wheel
load divided by the contact area, is likely to be less than that of
heavier motorized vehicles, horses, and heavily laden hikers." This
doesn't mean we should ban backpacking to protect trails, but at least
it does show that continuing to expand mountain bike access to the
wilderness won't have any negative effects if the number of users
doesn't increase.

The issue is that, as it stands now, day users don't need wilderness
permits and mountain bikers are more likely to be day users, while
backpackers are overnight users and need wilderness permits and the
numbers are limited. However this could be solved by requiring day use
permits for all trail users in wilderness areas.

The key thing is education. Personally I was hoping that part of
Vandeman's sentencing for the crimes he was convicted of would have
included some sort of environmental education requirement because he
needs to be educated on issues like wilderness impacts.
  #6  
Old June 7th 13, 06:09 PM posted to alt.mountain-bike
Mike Vandeman[_4_]
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Posts: 1,755
Default UK puts National Park Rangers on Mountain Bikes--U.S. Needs to Dothe Same!

On Friday, June 7, 2013 9:30:19 AM UTC-7, sms wrote:
On 6/7/2013 5:02 AM, Blackblade wrote:



Oh, sure, if they want to end up DEAD! Park rangers are supposed to be role models, so exhibiting behavior that is destructive to the parks wouldn't be appropriate. I guess that reasoning is over your head....




I guess you forgot the 0.00123 fatalities per million miles statistic we discussed ? Mountain Biking is, statistically, very safe indeed.




And how on earth do you justify preferring a ton or more of horse hitting the trails as opposed to a 25lb mountain bike ? It's way LESS destructive than having them on horses.




Remember, the reason that horses are so destructive is not just the

weight of the horse and the trail damage, it's also the waste products.


Horses don't damage nature; they are PART of nature. DUH! Bikes, of course, are not.

"BLM (Bureau of Land Management) routinely receives complaints about

horse waste, horse damage to trails, or general equestrian etiquette."

You're already seeing some places ban horses because of trail damage and

horse waste, but the equestrians are a powerful group because they tend

to be wealthy. It's amazing that dog owners are required to pick up

after their animals on trails, but horse owners are not.


Dogs are an exotic species. Horses are native to North America. In fact, the horse evolved there.

Every study that compares trail damage of different users has shown that

hikers and mountain bikers cause about the same amount of trail damage,


BS. You are referring to junk science written by mountain bikers. No surprise there!

while equestrians much more damage. I.e., a 1994 study out of the

University of Vermont concluded "horses produced significantly larger

quantities of sediment compared to hikers, off-road bicycles, and

motorcycles." Of course this was a detailed, scientifically conducted,

peer-reviewed study!


BS. Junk science. Not worth the paper it was written on.

Amusingly, one of Vandeman's supporters, Terri Sweet is an equestrian so

he is unwilling to face the facts regarding the damage horses do to

trails even though all the experts agree that horses are far more

destructive to trails than bicycle tires or Vibram soled boots.



What is also interesting is that "heavily laden hikers" (backpackers)

actually cause _more_ trail damage than bicycles. "Mountain bikers will

exert a downward force through their tyres which comprises the wheel

load divided by the contact area, is likely to be less than that of

heavier motorized vehicles, horses, and heavily laden hikers." This

doesn't mean we should ban backpacking to protect trails, but at least

it does show that continuing to expand mountain bike access to the

wilderness won't have any negative effects if the number of users

doesn't increase.



The issue is that, as it stands now, day users don't need wilderness

permits and mountain bikers are more likely to be day users, while

backpackers are overnight users and need wilderness permits and the

numbers are limited. However this could be solved by requiring day use

permits for all trail users in wilderness areas.



The key thing is education. Personally I was hoping that part of

Vandeman's sentencing for the crimes he was convicted of would have

included some sort of environmental education requirement because he

needs to be educated on issues like wilderness impacts.


You need to be educated on how to tell the truth (I know, you are uneducable).
  #7  
Old June 8th 13, 07:50 PM posted to alt.mountain-bike
SMS
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Posts: 9,477
Default UK puts National Park Rangers on Mountain Bikes--U.S. Needs toDo the Same!

On 6/7/2013 5:02 AM, Blackblade wrote:

I guess you forgot the 0.00123 fatalities per million miles statistic we discussed ? Mountain Biking is, statistically, very safe indeed.


Per mile, it's one of the safest activities available. Per hour, it's
still pretty good, but less safe than walking. Of course it's not
necessary that everything be perfectly safe for everyone.

I think the key takeaway is that in terms of both safety and
environmental impact, mountain biking is one of the best activities to
encourage.

What would be good is if Vandeman could be educated to direct his
efforts to working against activities that actually do have a negative
impact, including horseback riding and motorized vehicles and motorized
boats. For that to happen he would have to abandon his addiction to junk
science and open his mind to scientifically sound, peer-reviewed,
studies. But since he's a promoter of junk science, that's just not
going to happen.
  #8  
Old June 9th 13, 04:00 AM posted to alt.mountain-bike
Mike Vandeman[_4_]
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Posts: 1,755
Default UK puts National Park Rangers on Mountain Bikes--U.S. Needs to Dothe Same!

On Saturday, June 8, 2013 11:50:35 AM UTC-7, sms wrote:
On 6/7/2013 5:02 AM, Blackblade wrote:



I guess you forgot the 0.00123 fatalities per million miles statistic we discussed ? Mountain Biking is, statistically, very safe indeed.




Per mile, it's one of the safest activities available. Per hour, it's

still pretty good, but less safe than walking. Of course it's not

necessary that everything be perfectly safe for everyone.



I think the key takeaway is that in terms of both safety and

environmental impact, mountain biking is one of the best activities to

encourage.



What would be good is if Vandeman could be educated to direct his

efforts to working against activities that actually do have a negative

impact, including horseback riding and motorized vehicles and motorized

boats. For that to happen he would have to abandon his addiction to junk

science and open his mind to scientifically sound, peer-reviewed,

studies. But since he's a promoter of junk science, that's just not

going to happen.


Mountain biking is by far the most damaging activity allowed in any park. Horses don't "damage" nature, they ARE nature -- just like the deer. I know that's over your head. Have your mommie explain it to you.
  #9  
Old June 10th 13, 06:48 AM posted to alt.mountain-bike
I love Mike
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Posts: 332
Default UK puts National Park Rangers on Mountain Bikes--U.S. Needs to Dothe Same!

Nice try old chap. I have to ask was your Phd in creation science? I wouldn't be surprised if it was. I am sure your views would be welcomed by the flat earth society.
  #10  
Old June 10th 13, 07:27 AM posted to alt.mountain-bike
I love Mike
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Posts: 332
Default UK puts National Park Rangers on Mountain Bikes--U.S. Needs to Dothe Same!

By the way where is your peer reviewed scientific evidence showing mountain biking is the most damaging activity in Any park? This is another example of your ignorance of science. Why? You have clearly reached a conclusion without doing any field research.

Please don't give me that link to your article on your website again old chap. It is hardly a meaningful scholarly contribution to the field of environmental management.
 




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