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Stress Analysis in the Design of Bicycle Infrastructure



 
 
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  #51  
Old August 14th 17, 01:54 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
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Default Stress Analysis in the Design of Bicycle Infrastructure

On Sunday, August 13, 2017 at 6:51:19 PM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:

Some people here complain about frequent close passes. It happens to me
only rarely - I'd say roughly once per 100 miles of riding, which would
be once in at least 1000 cars. And almost none of those include any horn
blaring or yelling.

But then, I tend to ride more toward lane center than many cyclists.


Yesterday was Sunday and without job pressure they drive a lot more relaxed.. But I still got a couple of close passes in 50 miles. But I was flabbergasted at the complete disregard for stop-before-free-right-turn. Even directly in front of the auxiliary police station with a cop right outside they didn't so much as slow up. And at the main police station perhaps three cars drove right through red lights.
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  #53  
Old August 14th 17, 03:14 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Joerg[_2_]
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Default Stress Analysis in the Design of Bicycle Infrastructure

On 2017-08-13 15:29, sms wrote:
On 8/13/2017 7:39 AM, Joerg wrote:

Your probably the only person here who considers a mountain bike trail
to be
a valid transportational facility. Those things have a lower
percentage of
practical (vs. recreational) use than even a farm country rail trail.


Not around here. People in my area know how to handle a mountain bike.
It does not scare them.


In the Bay Area there are several unpaved trails that are used for
transportation. They are commonly referred to as mountain bike trails
even though they aren't difficult trails, but you do want to have
mountain bike type equipment to ride on them since in the summer there's
a lot of sand and in the winter a lot of mud. The one I've been on is
out in the Baylands behind NASA. There's been talk about paving it, but
it hasn't happened. There was another one alongside a creek that went
under 101 over to Intel and beyond, and that one was finally paved.


We have those as well in the valley and we call them flatlander's trails :-)

They are manicured dirt and sand trails next to the regular paved way.
Up here it's different. Every winter some lesser used sections overgrow
and then you have to guess where the heck the trail is. Not without
risk. This spring I plowed through thick overgrowth and then hit a major
wash-out underneath that wasn't there before.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/
  #54  
Old August 14th 17, 03:19 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Joerg[_2_]
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Default Stress Analysis in the Design of Bicycle Infrastructure

On 2017-08-13 15:38, sms wrote:
On 8/12/2017 12:41 PM, Joerg wrote:

Bicycles are not allowed on Hwy 50, that's the key problem. If you want


There's no other road?! I recall when they opened part of I-280 to
bicycles because they build I-280 partially on the old CA35 and there
was no good alternate. Later they built a paved trail that bypassed the
freeway section but they still allow bicycles on that short stretch of
I-280, it was a big battle to get Caltrans to allow bicycles on the
freeway even though it was only one exit and there is a good shoulder.
On I-80 there are some sections between Cisco Grove and US20 to Nevada
City with no frontage road in the Sierras and you had to use I-80--I got
a flat tire on one of those sections.


Around here they don't allow that. Yes, there is another road. It would
mean a major detour and it is a two-lane race track, almost suicidal for
cyclists. Commuters come tearing around uphill corners assuming there is
nobody in the lane. Until there is. Even without cyclists there are some
ghastly accidents, such as high-speed smashes into a slow truck because
there was opposing traffic and they couldn't evade.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/
  #56  
Old August 14th 17, 03:32 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
SMS
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Default Stress Analysis in the Design of Bicycle Infrastructure

On 8/14/2017 5:54 AM, wrote:
On Sunday, August 13, 2017 at 6:51:19 PM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:

Some people here complain about frequent close passes. It happens to me
only rarely - I'd say roughly once per 100 miles of riding, which would
be once in at least 1000 cars. And almost none of those include any horn
blaring or yelling.

But then, I tend to ride more toward lane center than many cyclists.


Yesterday was Sunday and without job pressure they drive a lot more relaxed. But I still got a couple of close passes in 50 miles. But I was flabbergasted at the complete disregard for stop-before-free-right-turn. Even directly in front of the auxiliary police station with a cop right outside they didn't so much as slow up. And at the main police station perhaps three cars drove right through red lights.


In my area a vehicle can make a right on red without stopping directly
in view of a police officer and nothing will happen. I want to scream
"give him a ticket."

Many years ago, walking my kids to school, a vehicle failed to stop for
us in the crosswalk and I yelled at the driver. And there WAS a cop
there, and he DID pull them over. Later, walking home, the cop was still
there but the driver had left. He told me that he let the driver go
without a ticket because I yelled at them.


---
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  #57  
Old August 14th 17, 03:33 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
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Default Stress Analysis in the Design of Bicycle Infrastructure

On Monday, August 14, 2017 at 7:19:20 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-08-13 15:38, sms wrote:
On 8/12/2017 12:41 PM, Joerg wrote:

Bicycles are not allowed on Hwy 50, that's the key problem. If you want


There's no other road?! I recall when they opened part of I-280 to
bicycles because they build I-280 partially on the old CA35 and there
was no good alternate. Later they built a paved trail that bypassed the
freeway section but they still allow bicycles on that short stretch of
I-280, it was a big battle to get Caltrans to allow bicycles on the
freeway even though it was only one exit and there is a good shoulder.
On I-80 there are some sections between Cisco Grove and US20 to Nevada
City with no frontage road in the Sierras and you had to use I-80--I got
a flat tire on one of those sections.


Around here they don't allow that. Yes, there is another road. It would
mean a major detour and it is a two-lane race track, almost suicidal for
cyclists. Commuters come tearing around uphill corners assuming there is
nobody in the lane. Until there is. Even without cyclists there are some
ghastly accidents, such as high-speed smashes into a slow truck because
there was opposing traffic and they couldn't evade.


Presently we have two local hill roads closed for repairs because of the rains during the winter that tore the roads apart because of the drought. When those roads were open they would often be used as "short cuts" if traffic backed up on the freeways. Cars would drive like Isle of Man racers and without the slightest thought would pass on blind turns. And not just somewhat blind turns but turns that were more than 90 degrees around a cliff heavily shaded by trees. Every single time I was shocked that we didn't have major accidents on that road. I guess that shows that the reason we don't have a lot more people killed in auto accidents is merely the luck of the draw.
  #58  
Old August 14th 17, 03:36 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
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Default Stress Analysis in the Design of Bicycle Infrastructure

On Monday, August 14, 2017 at 7:32:37 AM UTC-7, sms wrote:
On 8/14/2017 5:54 AM, wrote:
On Sunday, August 13, 2017 at 6:51:19 PM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:

Some people here complain about frequent close passes. It happens to me
only rarely - I'd say roughly once per 100 miles of riding, which would
be once in at least 1000 cars. And almost none of those include any horn
blaring or yelling.

But then, I tend to ride more toward lane center than many cyclists.


Yesterday was Sunday and without job pressure they drive a lot more relaxed. But I still got a couple of close passes in 50 miles. But I was flabbergasted at the complete disregard for stop-before-free-right-turn. Even directly in front of the auxiliary police station with a cop right outside they didn't so much as slow up. And at the main police station perhaps three cars drove right through red lights.


In my area a vehicle can make a right on red without stopping directly
in view of a police officer and nothing will happen. I want to scream
"give him a ticket."

Many years ago, walking my kids to school, a vehicle failed to stop for
us in the crosswalk and I yelled at the driver. And there WAS a cop
there, and he DID pull them over. Later, walking home, the cop was still
there but the driver had left. He told me that he let the driver go
without a ticket because I yelled at them.


You should have reported that cop to his superiors. When I had a serious run in with the local cops I reported it to the police chief, the mayor and the city council. Of course locally the only thing that matters is protecting illegal aliens who are felons.
  #59  
Old August 14th 17, 03:38 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Joerg[_2_]
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Default Stress Analysis in the Design of Bicycle Infrastructure

On 2017-08-14 05:48, wrote:
On Sunday, August 13, 2017 at 6:42:16 PM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski
wrote:
On 8/13/2017 12:16 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-08-12 23:45, John B. wrote:


[...]


The point that you, and others, seems to be missing was that
Holland started their bicycle transportation planning just
after WW I ended. In the 1920's bicycles were used in 80% of
the distance of all trips made. By the 1950's there were 400
bicycle parking facilities in Amsterdam - some 70,000 parking
spaces.

The first comprehensive bicycle census in Amsterdam was held in
1930. 250 intersections were monitored on a single day from
6.30 am until 6.30 pm. On the section from Leidsestraat to
Leidseplein 30,000 cyclists passed during the period and some
1100 of whom passed by between 8.45 and 9.00 am!

Now compare that data with the U.S.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lHdbIhL0eso

This is about 50mi from here. So yes, it is possible.


sigh That's a video taken at a college campus that actively
dissuades the use of cars on campus.



They do not. I drove there by car a lot because I needed to schlepp a
compressor and other gear. Very easy car access, nice circular roads
that get you everywhere, plenty of parking.


... Anyone can read about U.C.
Davis and its bike-related history.


Don't read, go there and see for yourself.


As I've said, the key element is dissuading car traffic. Without
that, bike infrastructure is almost never capable of generating
more than 3% bike mode share.

Auto's were relatively cheap even before WW I. In 1910 Ford
produced 12,000 cars. In 1914 Ford built more automobiles then
all other car makers combined. A Ford cost $900 1910 and $390
in 1915. My father, who came from a normal (i.e., not wealthy)
New England farming family, had a Ford when he went to collage
in 1926.


We have to stop lamenting "Oh, we didn't start on the correct
foot 100 years ago so to heck with it, let's just throw in the
towel". We ought to learn from other countries and that goes
vice-versa as well.


That's a good idea only if you somehow learn to turn the United
States into a nation smaller than West Virginia, but almost dead
flat.

Also, give it at least four times higher population density to
equal Denmark's, or twelve times higher to equal Netherlands'.
Somehow give it a long history of high utility bike mode share long
before bike facilities. Make sure the average trip distance is just
a couple miles as well. Do away with most of the hot weather, too.
And as mentioned, do whatever you can to dissuade use of private
cars.

That's what's behind Netherlands' and Denmark's current bike mode
share.


Frank - most major cities in the US have the population and the
density.



Frank really doesn't have a clue about the Netherlands yet always voices
an opinion anyhow. I lived in Zuid Limburg Province and that is largely
rural plus hilly. Lots of bike paths, lots of cyclists. So far for
Frank's great theory.


... A really good local bike shop is giving it up after five
years of trying because they just can't sell enough bikes or outsell
the Internet on components.


That is strange. We had two new bike shops open up over the last five
yeas, in a village of around pop 16,000. At one of them I bought my MTB
in 2014. I could have bought it for $100 less online but I wanted to
support a local business. He also handled a few warranty claims I had
(which was bound to happen ...).

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/
  #60  
Old August 14th 17, 03:48 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Joerg[_2_]
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Posts: 4,449
Default Stress Analysis in the Design of Bicycle Infrastructure

On 2017-08-14 07:29, sms wrote:
On 8/14/2017 5:48 AM, wrote:

snip

Frank - most major cities in the US have the population and the
density. A really good local bike shop is giving it up after five
years of trying because they just can't sell enough bikes or outsell
the Internet on components.


I receive the publication "Bicycle Reseller." Any shop that tries to
compete with "the Internet" solely on price is doomed. The number of
good bicycles sold online is still very low. The real competition is
getting people that are shopping at Toys R Us, Target, and Walmart to
come to the bicycle shop. Tried to convince my neighbor that he should
buy good kids bikes, even used, rather than bikes from Toys R Us, to no
avail, he came back with two pieces of crap yesterday. I think that some
shops could really do well if they'd accept some lower margins in kids
bikes or offer a guaranteed trade-in value on the next size up, and sell
the used kids bikes.


Bike shop owners told me that department store bikes are what keeps them
afloat at times. People buy them, thinking they scored the super deal.
Until something breaks or needs adjustment. At the big box store all
they get is a blank stare "Ahm, Sir, we aren't really equipped to handle
requests like that".

The other main stream of LBS revenue are mountain bikers. Regardless of
where they bought their bikes or what they cost they break stuff all the
time. I can attest to that. My MTB costs about $0.20/mile to operate
versus $0.10/mile for the road bike and this is with the DIY repair method.


Wish we had a shop like Yellow Jersey, but just as the lease rates in
Madison were too high, the lease rates in the Bay Area would never allow
such a shop.


Up here in Sacramento they would but you'd first have to get in a more
biz-friendly legislature and that ain't gonna happen.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/
 




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