Seeking the most breathable rainjacket

Mark H. wrote:
Greetings!

May I have some recommendations for the absolutely most "breathable"
lightweight rain jacket?

I don't know if there really is such a thing. Most all techno fabrics are
promoted now as breathable, some claim more breathable than others, but what
does that mean? If a fabric is really waterproof, not merely water
resistant, how much breathability can it have? Or can it?

I'd like to have a lightweight rain jacket/shell in which I don't feel
clammy when cycling distances at a modest pace. Am I seeking the Holy
Grail?

Depends on how much you sweat. I find membrane fabrics (Gore-tex)
useless for cycling, but very nice for walking in the rain.

"Mark H." wrote in message
...
Greetings!

May I have some recommendations for the absolutely most
"breathable"
lightweight rain jacket?

I don't know if there really is such a thing. Most all techno
fabrics are
promoted now as breathable, some claim more breathable than
others, but what
does that mean? If a fabric is really waterproof, not merely
water
resistant, how much breathability can it have? Or can it?

I'd like to have a lightweight rain jacket/shell in which I
don't feel
clammy when cycling distances at a modest pace. Am I seeking
the Holy
Grail?

All assistance and admonishments welcome.

Venting and tailoring are what matter and not the magical fabric.
I also think it is more important to pick a good undershirt and
jersey than the perfect jacket because no matter what jacket you
own, you are going to get wet (from the inside or the outside)
after enough time. The trick is to get layers that will dry
quickly and keep you warm when wet. If you are riding in mild
but wet weather, consider one of the mid-weight windstopper foul
weather jerseys (Assos, ExteOndo, Castelli, etc.). Good
breathability and no flapping, but only water resistant -- but
with the right undershirt, you stay relatively comfortable even
when you are wet. -- Jay Beattie.

Mark H. asked:

May I have some recommendations for the absolutely most
"breathable" lightweight rain jacket?

I like the Helly Hansen "Packable Jacket" best:

http://www.hellyhansenclothing.com/

--
"Bicycling is a healthy and manly pursuit with much
to recommend it, and, unlike other foolish crazes,
it has not died out." -- The Daily Telegraph (1877)

Mark H. wrote:
Greetings!

May I have some recommendations for the absolutely most "breathable"
lightweight rain jacket?

I really like the Burley Rapid Rider. Of course, it was discontinued.
Burley may have replaced it with something. This jacket is NOT
breathable. In my experience none of the breathable fabrics work for
cycling. Of course, there're "new" ones out all the time. Just read
any outdoorsey web site, and if you believe the ad copy -- they have
just come out with the perfect thing. The Burley works so well because
of its excellent venting system: long pit zips, zips across the chest,
and a vented back. My second choice is a cheap nylon hooded jacket.
I, surprisingly, got one I like from Performance. It has vented pits,
and folds into a zippered pocket in the back.

Regards,
Larry

Mark H. wrote:
Greetings!

May I have some recommendations for the absolutely most "breathable"
lightweight rain jacket?

I really like the Burley Rapid Rider. Of course, it was discontinued.
Burley may have replaced it with something. This jacket is NOT
breathable. In my experience none of the breathable fabrics work for
cycling. Of course, there're "new" ones out all the time. Just read
any outdoorsey web site, and if you believe the ad copy -- they have
just come out with the perfect thing. The Burley works so well because
of its excellent venting system: long pit zips, zips across the chest,
and a vented back. My second choice is a cheap nylon hooded jacket.
I, surprisingly, got one I like from Performance. It has vented pits,
and folds into a zippered pocket in the back.

Regards,
Larry

Mark H. wrote:

If a fabric is really waterproof, not merely water
resistant, how much breathability can it have?

None worth any athlete's money. First of all, when warm and active, you
sweat liquid water in addition to water vapour. So what you need is not
a breathable fabric, but a drain pipe. Second, for the water vapour,
you need a fan or AC, not a fabric that breathes a few molecules in and
out. Third, when liquid water lands on the jacket from the outside, it
forms an airproof layer which renders any breathability that the fabric
might have had, null. Gore-Tex seems to succeed to some people because
it is multi-layer, and the inner layer or layers have a low thermal
conductivity, and therefore condensation is reduced at that interface.
The teflon membrane (the Gore-Tex itself) has nothing to do with it.

For summer wear, your best bet is something with lots of ventilation:
underarm zippers and two way front zipper, back vents or shoulder vents
also help. Most outdoor-type parkas have a snap-over flap as well, and
for better ventilation you can use the snaps without the zipper.

The key is also what you wear underneath the shell: something that
handles water well, like wool or synthetics, or yes, even cotton in
some forms (stretchy knit) for shorter rides. So, a wool or synthetic
thin jersey, or possibly a stretch-knit cotton T-shirt, underneath a
waterproof or highly water resistant outer layer, highly vented, is the
best for warmer weather. For colder, long sleeve wool or sythetic
jersey, or wool sweater or pile/fleece jacket under the shell. These
have low thermal conductivity and are highly water repellent as well,
so even if the jacket is only highly water resistant, they will not
absorb much.

I'd like to have a lightweight rain jacket/shell in which I don't feel
clammy when cycling distances at a modest pace.

The clamminess comes from what you are wearing next to your skin, not
the shell. Try wool or Lifa-type- not lycra/spandex, which is clammy
even without the shell, in dry weather. The appearance of condensation
on the inside of the shell is affected only by the thermal conductivity
of the fabric, not its "breathability"; then, by any wicking action to
spread the liquid water out and get it away from the inside.
l

"Mark H." wrote:
May I have some recommendations for the absolutely most "breathable"
lightweight rain jacket?

I don't know if there really is such a thing. Most all techno fabrics are
promoted now as breathable, some claim more breathable than others, but
what does that mean? If a fabric is really waterproof, not merely water
resistant, how much breathability can it have? Or can it?

Anything truly "waterproof" can't be breathable. There's always a tradeoff
between breathability and water resistance. I don't think there is any water
resistant fabric (including Gortex) that breathes well enough to keep a
cyclist riding moderately hard from getting clammy. Look for jackets with
vented backs and arm pits.

In warm weather, it might be better to get wet from the rain, than wet and
overheated from wearing rain gear. Either that or slow down to the point
where you're not generating much body heat.

Art Harris

On Thu, 02 Jun 2005 23:18:27 GMT,
wrote:

I'd like to have a lightweight rain jacket/shell in which I don't
feel clammy when cycling distances at a modest pace. Am I seeking
the Holy Grail?

Get a parka with a sinchable hood because that is what you'll need
descending in rain or snow. In fact without a hood, descending larger
hills in the cold becomes impossible. It was one thing that enables
Andy Hampsten to pass frozen riders on his victory in the G d'I over
the Gavia Pass in the snow.

Such parkas are not sold in bicycle shops, but outdoor stores have
them and they are lightweight. Don't get Gore-tex, it doesn't dry
well and it's breathability is useless for a rider on a climb. It
gets wet inside and out and stays that way for the rest of the day.

I just got an REI E1 Elements jacket, which in addition to meeting
Jobst's criteria also has zippers in the underarm area. While I bought
it primarily for hiking/backpacking, it looks like a good bet for wet
weather cycling also.


jeverett3ATearthlinkDOTnet http://home.earthlink.net/~jeverett3

wrote:
Don't get Gore-tex, it doesn't dry
well and it's breathability is useless for a rider on a climb. It
gets wet inside and out and stays that way for the rest of the day.

I've tried them all.



I agree on the Gore-Tex limits of breathability. There's no way it's
going to breath enough for intense efforts. But aren't you attributing
poor fabric properties (not drying out) to Gore-Tex, when it has nothing
to do with them?

Find a true Gore-Tex shell, without soft surface fabric or liner and try
drying it. I've found they dry out plenty quick, but then again they
"breath" even less than the jackets that have a more porous fabric that
you seem to refer to above.

In any case, I don't expect Gore-Tex to keep me dry on a climb, either.

Jan Lindström

Jan Lindstrom writes:

wrote:
Don't get Gore-tex, it doesn't dry
well and it's breathability is useless for a rider on a climb. It
gets wet inside and out and stays that way for the rest of the day.
I've tried them all.


I agree on the Gore-Tex limits of breathability. There's no way it's
going to breath enough for intense efforts. But aren't you attributing
poor fabric properties (not drying out) to Gore-Tex, when it has
nothing to do with them?

Find a true Gore-Tex shell, without soft surface fabric or liner and
try drying it. I've found they dry out plenty quick, but then again
they "breath" even less than the jackets that have a more porous
fabric that you seem to refer to above.

Somewhat confusingly, the one to get is the 3-layer Gore-tex, which is
actualy lighter than the 2-layer because it does not require a
separate fabric liner.

I agree that Gore-tex doesn't help much when you are exerting yourself
heavily, but for moderate and light conditions I find it much more
comfortable than a completely non permeable shell. I have also found
lightweight gore-tex shells to be fast drying. I like 'em. Only
downside is the cost.