Light works

On 29/08/14 09:55, Joerg wrote:
James wrote:
On 29/08/14 08:27, Joerg wrote:


Europeans use hub dynamos a lot. It would be possible but difficult on
my mountain bike because it has a serious disc brake up front. I'd be ok
with a central Li-Ion battery if some company made a better holder than
those flimsy Velcro thingies.

Maybe take a look here...
http://www.sp-dynamo.com/8Xseriesdynamo%20hub.html


When I win the lottery :-)

Is it really that much?


I think Schmidt and Sons in Germany makes something like this but then
you be looking at 100 Euros plus labor. I really don't like to do
spokes. Have done it but hated it.

Mine (SP PV-8) was about $150AUD delivered.

Ah, c'mon, front wheel spokes are easy.

I'd rather have a central battery where you can get a ton of capacity at
same weight. Then the bike can power lights and other gear even at
standstill, like during breaks. For example, when a friend discovered a
cave we were able to take the light off my bike and crawl in. I know, I
know, thou shalt not do that ...


I'll raise your tonne of capacity for, well, infinite capacity while the
wheels keep turning ;-)

For night rides on the MTB, I'd take a strap on head torch.

BTW, most good dynamo headlights have a stand light that keeps the light
going for 4-5 minutes at half strength when you stop. If it runs out,
spin the front wheel a few times to charge the internal capacitor again.


The lights I've seen were all plastic and/or on skinny brackets, those
on the Lumotec lights would never survive. I need something that will
survive even if a rock the size of a fist smacks to it. Happens a lot.
Like Tuesday, barreled down a trail to get home, front wheel squished
off a rock that size, it ricocheted from somewhere ... *KANGGG* ...
smack-dab between my right foot and crank. I stopped and it was still
cradled there. Took a chunk out of the crank and my shoe. Earlier this
summer one ricocheted off and crashed into the handlebar. Then there's
the rocks kicked up by other riders. And the occasional thick Manzanita
branch.


The IQ-Tec Premium light I use has a heavy steel bracket and sturdy body.

http://www.xxcycle.com/busch-and-muller-cyo-premium-front-light-iq-tec-p-80-lux-1752qsndi-04,,en.php


That's the ones I had seen. On a mountain bike there is really nothing
you could fasten it do, you'd have to buy or build a clamp bracket. This
kind of U-shape carrier will not hold up, it'll get bent real soon.

This then.. http://www.starbike.com/en/son-edelux-2-led-front-lamp/


The enclosure itself needs to be metal, aircraft aluminum or something
similar. I've even broken ABS.


http://www.starbike.com/p/Supernova-...QaAqq58 P8HAQ

My MTBing must be very tame. I haven't broken anything for ages. Maybe
I'm just more careful.

--
JS

wrote:
ugh the dynamo devils

no no no

http://www.coloradocyclist.com/bike-...systems?page=3


400 bucks for a lamp? Are they kidding?

I thought about stuff like this:

http://www.amazon.com/Best-Rechargea...=bicycle+light

Then a battery pack like this but preferably bigger:

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00MPEJ2X0?psc=1

This kind is even brighter but too dangerous for MTB riders because of
the sharp fins:

http://www.amazon.com/Lumen-Cycling-...YKSCTYQQG0WYP0

The tail light would probably have to come from a motorcycle store
because I haven't found any really good ones for bicycles.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

On Thursday, August 28, 2014 5:20:33 PM UTC-7, James wrote:
On 29/08/14 09:55, Joerg wrote:

James wrote:

On 29/08/14 08:27, Joerg wrote:





Europeans use hub dynamos a lot. It would be possible but difficult on

my mountain bike because it has a serious disc brake up front. I'd be ok

with a central Li-Ion battery if some company made a better holder than

those flimsy Velcro thingies.



Maybe take a look here...

http://www.sp-dynamo.com/8Xseriesdynamo%20hub.html





When I win the lottery :-)



Is it really that much?





I think Schmidt and Sons in Germany makes something like this but then

you be looking at 100 Euros plus labor. I really don't like to do

spokes. Have done it but hated it.



Mine (SP PV-8) was about $150AUD delivered.



Ah, c'mon, front wheel spokes are easy.



I'd rather have a central battery where you can get a ton of capacity at

same weight. Then the bike can power lights and other gear even at

standstill, like during breaks. For example, when a friend discovered a

cave we were able to take the light off my bike and crawl in. I know, I

know, thou shalt not do that ...





I'll raise your tonne of capacity for, well, infinite capacity while the

wheels keep turning ;-)



For night rides on the MTB, I'd take a strap on head torch.



BTW, most good dynamo headlights have a stand light that keeps the light

going for 4-5 minutes at half strength when you stop. If it runs out,

spin the front wheel a few times to charge the internal capacitor again.





The lights I've seen were all plastic and/or on skinny brackets, those

on the Lumotec lights would never survive. I need something that will

survive even if a rock the size of a fist smacks to it. Happens a lot..

Like Tuesday, barreled down a trail to get home, front wheel squished

off a rock that size, it ricocheted from somewhere ... *KANGGG* ...

smack-dab between my right foot and crank. I stopped and it was still

cradled there. Took a chunk out of the crank and my shoe. Earlier this

summer one ricocheted off and crashed into the handlebar. Then there's

the rocks kicked up by other riders. And the occasional thick Manzanita

branch.





The IQ-Tec Premium light I use has a heavy steel bracket and sturdy body.



http://www.xxcycle.com/busch-and-muller-cyo-premium-front-light-iq-tec-p-80-lux-1752qsndi-04,,en.php





That's the ones I had seen. On a mountain bike there is really nothing

you could fasten it do, you'd have to buy or build a clamp bracket. This

kind of U-shape carrier will not hold up, it'll get bent real soon.



This then.. http://www.starbike.com/en/son-edelux-2-led-front-lamp/





The enclosure itself needs to be metal, aircraft aluminum or something

similar. I've even broken ABS.





http://www.starbike.com/p/Supernova-...QaAqq58 P8HAQ



My MTBing must be very tame. I haven't broken anything for ages. Maybe

I'm just more careful.



--

JS

I would think the bigger issue(s) on a mountain bike would be (1) electric wire fatigue with suspension forks, (2) axle and internal failures on big hit bikes, (3) no stand light, and (4) less options for a bright light (SuperNova is about it apart from some of the Chinese products).

I really wonder how much beating the internals can take -- maybe it's a lot.. I don't do a lot of trail riding at night, but my choice would be a light that works when the bike is stopped and that I can use to see my wounds.

-- Jay Beattie.

On 8/28/2014 9:06 PM, jbeattie wrote:


I would think the bigger issue(s) on a mountain bike would be (1) electric
wire fatigue with suspension forks, (2) axle and internal failures on
big hit
bikes, (3) no stand light, and (4) less options for a bright light
(SuperNova
is about it apart from some of the Chinese products).

I really wonder how much beating the internals can take -- maybe it's a lot.
I don't do a lot of trail riding at night, but my choice would be a
light that
works when the bike is stopped and that I can use to see my wounds.

I guess one can always hypothesize unsolvable problems.

1) Wire fatigue is eminently controllable through fairly simple design.
After all, off-road motorcycles do have wires. 2) Front axles
break... really, how often? 3) Tons of modern LED headlights feature
standlights. 4) How much light do we really need anyway?

As I've said before, if the "more is always necessary" rationale for
headlights were applied to other bicycle equipment, we'd all be on
motorcycle spokes and tires. Bicycle design is about efficiency and
elegance, except for most headlights. Then it switches to sledgehammer
mentality.

--
- Frank Krygowski

On 29/08/14 11:06, jbeattie wrote:


I would think the bigger issue(s) on a mountain bike would be (1)
electric wire fatigue with suspension forks,

We seem to be able to make brake hoses and ABS wheel speed sensors that
handle off road terrain on 4WD motor vehicles. I don't see why a
reasonably well made cable with armour shouldn't be possible to survive
MTB applications.

(2) axle and internal
failures on big hit bikes,

A problem for any hub, but yes would be a problem leaving you in the
dark, perhaps. The one I linked to is made specifically for HD MTB riding.

(3) no stand light,

Key? Many dynamo lights have stand light feature, and as I said, I'd
carry a head torch as well anyway.

and (4) less options
for a bright light (SuperNova is about it apart from some of the
Chinese products).

Uh, bright lights are not even difficult to roll your own, but there are
others...

http://www.theunknownrider.com/2012/...-light-review/

I really wonder how much beating the internals can take -- maybe it's
a lot. I don't do a lot of trail riding at night, but my choice
would be a light that works when the bike is stopped and that I can
use to see my wounds.

I wonder how much beating a battery can take? I remember my sealed
lead-acid battery powered light failed because the battery fell apart
inside - and that was road only use!

--
JS

Joerg wrote:
wrote:
http://www.autospeed.com/cms/A_112922/article.html


So when do bike accessory manufacturers finally wake up and build
something like this? Why do things take so long with bicycles?

Until now all the lights I've tried and seen are between "barely bright
enough" and utter junk.


B&M Luxos U is looking pretty good so far, although I haven't taken it out
for a night ride yet and I'm still wrestling with mounting.

On 29/08/14 13:18, Ralph Barone wrote:
Joerg wrote:
wrote:
http://www.autospeed.com/cms/A_112922/article.html


So when do bike accessory manufacturers finally wake up and build
something like this? Why do things take so long with bicycles?

Until now all the lights I've tried and seen are between "barely bright
enough" and utter junk.


B&M Luxos U is looking pretty good so far, although I haven't taken it out
for a night ride yet and I'm still wrestling with mounting.



I reckon my IQ-Tec Premium 80Lux model *looks* similar brightness to a
motorbike low beam.

--
JS

Joerg schreef op 29-8-2014 0:27:
Frank Krygowski wrote:
On Thursday, August 28, 2014 12:58:45 PM UTC-4, Joerg wrote:
wrote:

http://www.autospeed.com/cms/A_112922/article.html




So when do bike accessory manufacturers finally wake up and build
something like this? Why do things take so long with bicycles?

Until now all the lights I've tried and seen are between "barely bright
enough" and utter junk.

Some of us use hub dynamos and good quality LED headlights. My utility bike
has a Shimano hub dynamo and a Busch & Muller headlight. It gives me
plenty of light. It does a great job of illuminating the road, with a
nice even beam, and I can see it illuminating stop signs nearly a quarter
mile away.

The setup isn't cheap. I paid about $65 for the hub, and the headlight was
a $100 Christmas gift. (I built up the wheel myself.) But I don't expect
to have to replace the setup for the next ten years. To me, it's worth
the expense. Certainly, it would be cheaper if it were standard equipment
on every bike; but we have to face the facts, that most people in
westernized countries use bikes as daytime toys. They wouldn't want to
spend the money for a headlight they'd seldom or never use.

While this is a road bike, last week I used it after dark to inspect some
work we'd recently done in our local forest preserve. I don't know whether
it would work on a wooded off-road trail at 25 mph, but it allowed me to
do fine on the single track trails I was riding at much lower speed.


Europeans use hub dynamos a lot. It would be possible but difficult on
my mountain bike because it has a serious disc brake up front. I'd be ok
with a central Li-Ion battery if some company made a better holder than
those flimsy Velcro thingies.

The lights I've seen were all plastic and/or on skinny brackets, those
on the Lumotec lights would never survive. I need something that will
survive even if a rock the size of a fist smacks to it. Happens a lot.
Like Tuesday, barreled down a trail to get home, front wheel squished
off a rock that size, it ricocheted from somewhere ... *KANGGG* ...
smack-dab between my right foot and crank. I stopped and it was still
cradled there. Took a chunk out of the crank and my shoe. Earlier this
summer one ricocheted off and crashed into the handlebar. Then there's
the rocks kicked up by other riders. And the occasional thick Manzanita
branch.



You have to realize that your commute route is far from usual.

Lou

Frank Krygowski schreef op 29-8-2014 3:52:
On 8/28/2014 9:06 PM, jbeattie wrote:


I would think the bigger issue(s) on a mountain bike would be (1)
electric
wire fatigue with suspension forks, (2) axle and internal failures on
big hit
bikes, (3) no stand light, and (4) less options for a bright light
(SuperNova
is about it apart from some of the Chinese products).

I really wonder how much beating the internals can take -- maybe it's
a lot.
I don't do a lot of trail riding at night, but my choice would be a
light that
works when the bike is stopped and that I can use to see my wounds.

I guess one can always hypothesize unsolvable problems.

1) Wire fatigue is eminently controllable through fairly simple design.
After all, off-road motorcycles do have wires. 2) Front axles
break... really, how often? 3) Tons of modern LED headlights feature
standlights. 4) How much light do we really need anyway?

I think a roadbike with 8 bar inflated 23 mm wide tires on Belgium
cobblestones take a lot more beating than a ATB with 2.5 inch wide
nobby tires with front suspension.

Lou

On Thursday, August 28, 2014 11:42:20 PM UTC-7, Lou Holtman wrote:
Frank Krygowski schreef op 29-8-2014 3:52:

On 8/28/2014 9:06 PM, jbeattie wrote:





I would think the bigger issue(s) on a mountain bike would be (1)

electric

wire fatigue with suspension forks, (2) axle and internal failures on

big hit

bikes, (3) no stand light, and (4) less options for a bright light

(SuperNova

is about it apart from some of the Chinese products).



I really wonder how much beating the internals can take -- maybe it's

a lot.

I don't do a lot of trail riding at night, but my choice would be a

light that

works when the bike is stopped and that I can use to see my wounds.



I guess one can always hypothesize unsolvable problems.



1) Wire fatigue is eminently controllable through fairly simple design.

After all, off-road motorcycles do have wires. 2) Front axles

break... really, how often? 3) Tons of modern LED headlights feature

standlights. 4) How much light do we really need anyway?



I think a roadbike with 8 bar inflated 23 mm wide tires on Belgium

cobblestones take a lot more beating than a ATB with 2.5 inch wide

nobby tires with front suspension.

Maybe, but most of us don't ride on Belgian cobbles -- and look at what they do to road bikes. Paris Roubaix is littered with broken parts.

I don't know if a hub dynamo is a good thing on a mountain bike and defer to those who use them. Personally, I wouldn't bother with one because of all the wiring and additional crap on my bike that would get infrequent use, being that night trail riding is not something I would do often. A battery light would be a more reasonable option, and I could simply shift a light from my road bike for trail riding. I also wonder whether a dynamo would put out enough light when I was picking my way up forested single track at 4mph. It seems to add so much complexity without a real pay-off. The calculus is different on a commuter that gets a lot of night time use.

-- Jay Beattie.