Broke three spokes and now I'm worried!

In article ,
"Robb Monn" wrote:

So on Friday I went for a long ride with a large group of folks here in
Brooklyn. The pace was slow and the vibe was good. That is until I
heard a TWONK TWONK PING!

The broken spokes allowed my wheel to warp to the point that it jammed
in my frame. Down I went and I hit the ground pretty hard. After an
hour of work I managed to get my wheel to turn in the frame and I
limped 10 miles home.

When this happened I was going about 8 mph on a flat. No bumps or
trauma to the wheel for the whole ride up to that point -- which had
been about 15 miles.

I took the bike in to my LBS and asked (based on some googling and
reading online) for them to rebuild my rear wheel. It is a stock wheel
on a cheap bike and my feeling was that I'd like a hand-built,
hand-tensioned rear wheel. I also asked after thicker spokes since I'm
a big guy (235lbs and dropping.) I very regularly ride this bike quite
far from home and don't want a repeat. Also, the bike is relatively
new, bought in May and I've done about 175 miles a week on it since
then.

They *refused* to rebuild my wheel saying that it was unneeded. They
were snobby and rude about it, too. I finally relented and they are
replacing the spokes and trueing the wheel. Their final word: "If the
new spokes break too then we'll know we have a problem." I don't
*want* the new spokes to break. I rode 8000 miles on my last set of
wheels and never had a single spoke break.

So I have two questions:

1.) Any ideas on why my spokes broke? The LBS guy said that I had some
grit on my hub and that was the likely cause -- that the dirt and grit
had ground away at the spokes.

2.) Should I call them and insist on a rebuild or is it really not
needed? I'm planning on riding a century on this bike on September
12th and it would really make me mad if I had some spoke problems that
took me out.

Here's what you need to do. After the spokes are replaced, stand on the
wheel while it is tilted at 30 degrees. Also form the bend of each
spoke where it touches another spoke, as the normally tensioned spoke
won't be sufficiently straight. And don't forget to use linseed oil on
the spoke threads, ordinary oil just isn't good enough.

If you don't believe me, just ask Trevor Jeffrey.

In article , says...


So on Friday I went for a long ride with a large group of folks here in
Brooklyn. The pace was slow and the vibe was good. That is until I
heard a TWONK TWONK PING!

The broken spokes allowed my wheel to warp to the point that it jammed
in my frame. Down I went and I hit the ground pretty hard. After an
hour of work I managed to get my wheel to turn in the frame and I
limped 10 miles home.

When this happened I was going about 8 mph on a flat. No bumps or
trauma to the wheel for the whole ride up to that point -- which had
been about 15 miles.

I took the bike in to my LBS and asked (based on some googling and
reading online) for them to rebuild my rear wheel. It is a stock wheel
on a cheap bike and my feeling was that I'd like a hand-built,
hand-tensioned rear wheel. I also asked after thicker spokes since I'm
a big guy (235lbs and dropping.) I very regularly ride this bike quite
far from home and don't want a repeat. Also, the bike is relatively
new, bought in May and I've done about 175 miles a week on it since
then.

They *refused* to rebuild my wheel saying that it was unneeded. They
were snobby and rude about it, too. I finally relented and they are
replacing the spokes and trueing the wheel. Their final word: "If the
new spokes break too then we'll know we have a problem." I don't
*want* the new spokes to break. I rode 8000 miles on my last set of
wheels and never had a single spoke break.

So I have two questions:

1.) Any ideas on why my spokes broke? The LBS guy said that I had some
grit on my hub and that was the likely cause -- that the dirt and grit
had ground away at the spokes.

Take your wheel and run from this place. If they really believe it was
dirt, they are not very knowledgeable.

2.) Should I call them and insist on a rebuild or is it really not
needed? I'm planning on riding a century on this bike on September
12th and it would really make me mad if I had some spoke problems that
took me out.

There is a way to check. You can stress relieve the wheel. Wear gloves
and eye protection when you do this. If when you do this spokes start to
break, then you have fatigue failures. That's a good sign that you do need
a rebuild. If you do get a rebuild, thicker spokes are not the answer. If
you have a 32 spoke wheel, get a 36 spoke wheel. Use double butted spokes,
I prefer 15/16, and get the wheel built by a competent wheel builder. If
you can't find one, get a copy of the 'The Wheel Book' by Jobst Brandt and
build it yourself. It will take time, but you can do it if you follow the
directions in the book.
--------------
Alex

In article , says...


So on Friday I went for a long ride with a large group of folks here in
Brooklyn. The pace was slow and the vibe was good. That is until I
heard a TWONK TWONK PING!

The broken spokes allowed my wheel to warp to the point that it jammed
in my frame. Down I went and I hit the ground pretty hard. After an
hour of work I managed to get my wheel to turn in the frame and I
limped 10 miles home.

When this happened I was going about 8 mph on a flat. No bumps or
trauma to the wheel for the whole ride up to that point -- which had
been about 15 miles.

I took the bike in to my LBS and asked (based on some googling and
reading online) for them to rebuild my rear wheel. It is a stock wheel
on a cheap bike and my feeling was that I'd like a hand-built,
hand-tensioned rear wheel. I also asked after thicker spokes since I'm
a big guy (235lbs and dropping.) I very regularly ride this bike quite
far from home and don't want a repeat. Also, the bike is relatively
new, bought in May and I've done about 175 miles a week on it since
then.

They *refused* to rebuild my wheel saying that it was unneeded. They
were snobby and rude about it, too. I finally relented and they are
replacing the spokes and trueing the wheel. Their final word: "If the
new spokes break too then we'll know we have a problem." I don't
*want* the new spokes to break. I rode 8000 miles on my last set of
wheels and never had a single spoke break.

So I have two questions:

1.) Any ideas on why my spokes broke? The LBS guy said that I had some
grit on my hub and that was the likely cause -- that the dirt and grit
had ground away at the spokes.

Take your wheel and run from this place. If they really believe it was
dirt, they are not very knowledgeable.

2.) Should I call them and insist on a rebuild or is it really not
needed? I'm planning on riding a century on this bike on September
12th and it would really make me mad if I had some spoke problems that
took me out.

There is a way to check. You can stress relieve the wheel. Wear gloves
and eye protection when you do this. If when you do this spokes start to
break, then you have fatigue failures. That's a good sign that you do need
a rebuild. If you do get a rebuild, thicker spokes are not the answer. If
you have a 32 spoke wheel, get a 36 spoke wheel. Use double butted spokes,
I prefer 15/16, and get the wheel built by a competent wheel builder. If
you can't find one, get a copy of the 'The Wheel Book' by Jobst Brandt and
build it yourself. It will take time, but you can do it if you follow the
directions in the book.
--------------
Alex

Robb Monn wrote:
thank you thank you.

I called the shop and spoke to the manager. He felt that his mechaninc
would have done the right thing in any case -- never allowing a bad
wheel to leave the shop and it was just a matter of the clerk trying to
be helpful. In any case it hurts a little to go in to a shop without a
lot bike mech knowledge and ask for the right thing and have people
tell you you're crazy.

I'm letting this shop do the job since my bike is already there, but
I'm considering moving on. Anyone have a good suggestion for a shop in
downtown Brooklyn?

The **clerk**??? No wonder... That's the whole problem with
the interaction with this LBS, which may possibly be a good
one. Find out the tech's name and next time talk directly
with him. Bypass the unknowledgable buffer.

Robb Monn wrote:
thank you thank you.

I called the shop and spoke to the manager. He felt that his mechaninc
would have done the right thing in any case -- never allowing a bad
wheel to leave the shop and it was just a matter of the clerk trying to
be helpful. In any case it hurts a little to go in to a shop without a
lot bike mech knowledge and ask for the right thing and have people
tell you you're crazy.

I'm letting this shop do the job since my bike is already there, but
I'm considering moving on. Anyone have a good suggestion for a shop in
downtown Brooklyn?

The **clerk**??? No wonder... That's the whole problem with
the interaction with this LBS, which may possibly be a good
one. Find out the tech's name and next time talk directly
with him. Bypass the unknowledgable buffer.

Robb Monn wrote:
thank you thank you.

I called the shop and spoke to the manager. He felt that his mechaninc
would have done the right thing in any case -- never allowing a bad
wheel to leave the shop and it was just a matter of the clerk trying to
be helpful. In any case it hurts a little to go in to a shop without a
lot bike mech knowledge and ask for the right thing and have people
tell you you're crazy.

I'm letting this shop do the job since my bike is already there, but
I'm considering moving on. Anyone have a good suggestion for a shop in
downtown Brooklyn?

The **clerk**??? No wonder... That's the whole problem with
the interaction with this LBS, which may possibly be a good
one. Find out the tech's name and next time talk directly
with him. Bypass the unknowledgable buffer.

On Mon, 16 Aug 2004 20:59:54 GMT, Ted
wrote:

Here's what you need to do. After the spokes are replaced, stand on the
wheel while it is tilted at 30 degrees.

30 degrees from vertical or horizontal? Trying to taco it?

Also form the bend of each
spoke where it touches another spoke, as the normally tensioned spoke
won't be sufficiently straight.

ISTR that the technical term is "stress relieving".

And don't forget to use linseed oil on
the spoke threads, ordinary oil just isn't good enough.

Linseed oil congeals after a while, gluing the nipple to the spoke.
Some people apparently think this is a good ides. Another group
thinks it's fun to suggest linseed oil to others. Linseed oil has one
slight advantage over certain lubricants in that it won't attack tubes
and rim tapes as readily as some other potentially useful lubes will.
There are, however, better choices.

If you don't believe me, just ask Trevor Jeffrey.

Or don't.


--
Typoes are a feature, not a bug.
Some gardening required to reply via email.
Words processed in a facility that contains nuts.

On Mon, 16 Aug 2004 20:59:54 GMT, Ted
wrote:

Here's what you need to do. After the spokes are replaced, stand on the
wheel while it is tilted at 30 degrees.

30 degrees from vertical or horizontal? Trying to taco it?

Also form the bend of each
spoke where it touches another spoke, as the normally tensioned spoke
won't be sufficiently straight.

ISTR that the technical term is "stress relieving".

And don't forget to use linseed oil on
the spoke threads, ordinary oil just isn't good enough.

Linseed oil congeals after a while, gluing the nipple to the spoke.
Some people apparently think this is a good ides. Another group
thinks it's fun to suggest linseed oil to others. Linseed oil has one
slight advantage over certain lubricants in that it won't attack tubes
and rim tapes as readily as some other potentially useful lubes will.
There are, however, better choices.

If you don't believe me, just ask Trevor Jeffrey.

Or don't.


--
Typoes are a feature, not a bug.
Some gardening required to reply via email.
Words processed in a facility that contains nuts.

On Mon, 16 Aug 2004 20:59:54 GMT, Ted
wrote:

Here's what you need to do. After the spokes are replaced, stand on the
wheel while it is tilted at 30 degrees.

30 degrees from vertical or horizontal? Trying to taco it?

Also form the bend of each
spoke where it touches another spoke, as the normally tensioned spoke
won't be sufficiently straight.

ISTR that the technical term is "stress relieving".

And don't forget to use linseed oil on
the spoke threads, ordinary oil just isn't good enough.

Linseed oil congeals after a while, gluing the nipple to the spoke.
Some people apparently think this is a good ides. Another group
thinks it's fun to suggest linseed oil to others. Linseed oil has one
slight advantage over certain lubricants in that it won't attack tubes
and rim tapes as readily as some other potentially useful lubes will.
There are, however, better choices.

If you don't believe me, just ask Trevor Jeffrey.

Or don't.


--
Typoes are a feature, not a bug.
Some gardening required to reply via email.
Words processed in a facility that contains nuts.