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#61
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Bike Share graveyard
On 2017-12-07 09:18, Frank Krygowski wrote:
[...] One time I found out the day before the ride that the restaurant I'd picked out had to close due to an emergency. (a gas leak - lucky it didn't explode!) So I had to quickly throw together a different ride. It required about a mile on a downhill stretch of a new four lane road. Traffic wasn't bad at all ... The last five words are the key. Of course most riders do not mind roads when traffic is light. However, they do hesitate when it looks like this: https://goo.gl/maps/yX2ts3QeNeF2 Nearly every cyclist I know in town, and it's quite a few, refuses to ride through there. The common response it "That is crazy!". I do ride through it even at night because it is the only way to get home from a church meeting without a major detour. I ride with the ship brightly lit, of course. For the more squeamish ones there is the option to ride (not quite legal) or push the bike over the narrow sidewalk on the left. However, often somewhat scary-looking homeless people hang out there. Sometimes they sleep under the bridge sections and if a pitbull charges you'd have no way to escape. [...] -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ |
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#62
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Bike Share graveyard
On Thursday, December 7, 2017 at 9:19:00 AM UTC-8, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 12/7/2017 11:46 AM, Joerg wrote: On 2017-12-06 12:51, jbeattie wrote: On Tuesday, December 5, 2017 at 1:40:47 PM UTC-8, Joerg wrote: On 2017-12-05 09:42, Frank Krygowski wrote: On Tuesday, December 5, 2017 at 10:06:27 AM UTC-5, Joerg wrote: On 2017-12-04 18:51, Frank Krygowski wrote: On 12/4/2017 7:41 PM, Joerg wrote: On 2017-12-04 16:23, John B. wrote: Damn! You are making the public highways look better and better. They will never be better unless you remove the motor vehicles from there. Or add segregated bikes paths like they did he https://goo.gl/maps/NBzpVUA58tq That's not a segregated bike path. That's a shoulder on a road. In most states it's not even considered part of the roadway. I know lots of cyclists never leave the shoulder, but that can bring its own problems, since legal protections often exist only for those operating on the roadway. Now go look for your glasses, put them on and take a peek again but this time farther to the right. In case you still don't see it I have zoomed it in for you here (but then please see an optometrist before operating any vehicle): https://goo.gl/maps/nreBX5Qc7eH2 Well, perhaps you should have posted that first, no? No. Look at the first link. It is clearly visible and I posted it to show how well the separation between road and bike path is done. Also to show that this has bike lanes plus bike path, like other roads in Folsom do. If you didn't see that bike path I suggest to at least not operate a motor vehicle unless your vision has been checked out. It's not really that clear.Â* The separate path is in the shadow, .... When mentioned as separate bike path in my text and still not seeing it that should be of concern. Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* Â*Â*Â*Â* ... and the first thing that the viewer sees is the wide curb lane. "But I didn't see it" is a common excuse after accidents. Got to pay attention. Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* ... BTW, it just ends, right? And then it turns into an ordinary bike lane on Natoma. Not anymore. Google Maps is quite outdated in many areas and is often years behind. There is a seamless bike path all the way into Folsom Downtown. It later veers off the road and goes through fields, very nicely built. Folsom is rather fast in expanding their cycling infrastructure. From El Dorado Hills several cycling facilities to pick from seamlessly go all the way through into the core of Folsom, and then on from there. The reward for them is that people like me leave a chunk of their discretionary money in Folsom. Also, it looks like the major shopping areas are accessible in the usual ways -- on roads. I'm not seeing any separated paths around the central mall-shopping area like the WalMart Supercenter. Riley has a bike lane.Â* Bidwell has nothing. Although I'd have no problem with that nice wide lane. In the inner city there are roads but you can cycle on a parallel path that goes past all the big box stores. For example, this is in the area of your link: https://goo.gl/maps/ddyaaRbJTLE2 Leads past Trader Joe's which carries delicious Italian farmer's bread. If not interested in the stores one can take School Street which has very little traffic. I never mind using non-busy streets but I do mind busy ones. Outside the city core, for example, towards Home Depot, we have bike lanes. I cycled down there yesterday to pick up supplies for my home-brewing. Very pleasant ride, almost all on bike paths while in Folsom. I just had to schlepp the load back up the hill and because pressed for time had to use busy Green Valley Road. Oh, and the supply place is partly under construction because they will open a taproom in spring. Yeehaw! It looks like most of the physically separated lanes go through residential areas. The Humbug-Willow Creek Trail does appear to drop you next to a Peets, so that's worth something.Â* It's better than Starbucks. But you're going to have to ride on the road if you want to go to Jimboy's Tacos. Egads! I don't visit any of those chain restaurant places. If you want that you can go to Dos Coyotes Coffee where you can literally roll off the Willow-Creek bike path and plop into a patio chair. In Folsom it is very easy to prefer shops along bike paths. Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* If you want a taco, you'll have to risk your life on a road.Â* I hope its a good taco. Isn't this good enough? http://doscoyotes.com/ Right at the bike path. Same as others: http://www.skipolinis.com/menu.php?l...ry=New_Entrees https://igx.4sqi.net/img/general/wid...VQ5z85issU.jpg http://www.mexquite.com/ http://www.backbistro.com/ http://www.folsomtaphouse.com/ And on and on. As you can see, plenty of bicycle-friendly choices. Or you cycle a bit farther on the American River bike path with which Willow-Creek connects, cross a cylist/hikers-only bridge and visit these folks: http://fairoaksbrewpub.com/ If I wanted to list the restaurants I can reach by bicycle, I'd have to list every restaurant in town. That's because I'm not afraid to ride on regular roads. I used to lead a fun series of rides for our bike club: "Ethnic Restaurant Ride." The scheme was we'd do a leisurely ride, typically about 25 miles, and eat at some restaurant. Could be Syrian, Italian, Jewish, Chinese, Mexican, Hungarian, whatever - it was a secret until we arrived. We rode country roads, suburban roads, and/or city streets, and I picked quiet routes as much as possible. One time I found out the day before the ride that the restaurant I'd picked out had to close due to an emergency. (a gas leak - lucky it didn't explode!) So I had to quickly throw together a different ride. It required about a mile on a downhill stretch of a new four lane road. Traffic wasn't bad at all and there was plenty of room for the few cars to pass us, but one novice on the ride was absolutely terrified. She'd never ridden a four-lane before and she seemed to have it in her head that it would be fatal. I wonder if she'd been talking to Joerg. Well, the moral of the story is that even in Folsom, the separate paths only go to certain places. https://www.folsom.ca.us/civicax/fil...x?blobid=17412 Any competent "transportational cyclist" (to quote SMS) has to be able to ride on the road. I'm certainly not picking my restaurants based on what is along a separate bike path. Folsom has a lot of empty dirt and new development that allows for the creation of separated bike facilities -- and apparently a tax base willing to support them. In an old, dense urban area, throwing in a bunch of separated facilities is not usually an option. Personally, I avoid them, but I don't doubt that they are attractive to the roadaphobic. So if the people in Folsom like them, great. I find Joerg's excitement about brewpubs on a bike path quaint. Beer is so passe here in the evil, dirty big city. Passing a brewpub or growler fill on a bike is unavoidable in Portland. We go one step further -- we have pubs for bikes. https://tinyurl.com/y72hov6g (note Chris King taps). We have pubs that are bikes. http://pedalounge.com/ https://i.pinimg.com/originals/73/b7...579e91da69.jpg Bike shops that are pubs. http://tubulocity.com/?p=5608 Handmade bikes and beer. http://hopworksbeer.com/handmadebikeandbeerfest/ And yes, bike teams that are beer. http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3084/...e86900b12..jpg So done. -- Jay Beattie. |
#63
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Bike Share graveyard
On 2017-12-07 10:27, jbeattie wrote:
[...] Well, the moral of the story is that even in Folsom, the separate paths only go to certain places. https://www.folsom.ca.us/civicax/fil...x?blobid=17412 Any competent "transportational cyclist" (to quote SMS) has to be able to ride on the road. It's got nothing to do with competency. It is about fun, comfort, pleasantness, healthy air and other aspects of the ride. Just like we rarely steer our cars into the city of Sacramento because that has become a bit too hostile to visitors for my taste (fleecing via parking fees and such). Poeple have choices. ... I'm certainly not picking my restaurants based on what is along a separate bike path. Many people out here do. For me, if there are several places of about equal quality I generally prefer the ones reachable via bike facilities. Same regarding being able to bring in the bike or at least have it parked in view. Home Depot and Lowe's allow me to roll my bike through the aisles. So I buy there. Walmart does not so I don't go there. Folsom has a lot of empty dirt and new development that allows for the creation of separated bike facilities -- and apparently a tax base willing to support them. In an old, dense urban area, throwing in a bunch of separated facilities is not usually an option. It is, they did that in Folsom. They even did that in Sacramento. It takes guts to cut a lane from car users (Freeport Boulevard in Sacramento, for example). [...] -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ |
#64
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Bike Share graveyard
On 12/7/2017 12:42 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-12-07 09:18, Frank Krygowski wrote: [...] One time I found out the day before the ride that the restaurant I'd picked out had to close due to an emergency. (a gas leak - lucky it didn't explode!) So I had to quickly throw together a different ride. It required about a mile on a downhill stretch of a new four lane road. Traffic wasn't bad at all ... The last five words are the key. Of course most riders do not mind roads when traffic is light. However, they do hesitate when it looks like this: https://goo.gl/maps/yX2ts3QeNeF2 Nearly every cyclist I know in town, and it's quite a few, refuses to ride through there. The common response it "That is crazy!". I don't doubt that most cyclists refuse to ride there. Most cyclists in America lack the knowledge and confidence to ride with real competence on anything but a nearly empty road. The thing is, if those cyclists were to take a Cycling Savvy class, riding that or something very much like it would be part of the learning experience. They'd see the teachers and the other students do it with no trouble, and they would do it themselves with no trouble. They would become empowered to ride where they needed to ride, and not to wait for the Good Fairy to come and build a kiddie path for them. Cyclists do have full rights to the road, including roads like that. If everyone would learn that and behave accordingly, we'd be much better off. -- - Frank Krygowski |
#65
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Bike Share graveyard
On 2017-12-07 13:07, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 12/7/2017 12:42 PM, Joerg wrote: On 2017-12-07 09:18, Frank Krygowski wrote: [...] One time I found out the day before the ride that the restaurant I'd picked out had to close due to an emergency. (a gas leak - lucky it didn't explode!) So I had to quickly throw together a different ride. It required about a mile on a downhill stretch of a new four lane road. Traffic wasn't bad at all ... The last five words are the key. Of course most riders do not mind roads when traffic is light. However, they do hesitate when it looks like this: https://goo.gl/maps/yX2ts3QeNeF2 Nearly every cyclist I know in town, and it's quite a few, refuses to ride through there. The common response it "That is crazy!". I don't doubt that most cyclists refuse to ride there. Most cyclists in America lack the knowledge and confidence to ride with real competence on anything but a nearly empty road. Or they know or met one cyclist (in my case several) who got seriously hit out there. The worst one needed years to get back into the saddle because of injuries. She ended up under a full-size pickup truck. The thing is, if those cyclists were to take a Cycling Savvy class, riding that or something very much like it would be part of the learning experience. They'd see the teachers and the other students do it with no trouble, and they would do it themselves with no trouble. They would become empowered to ride where they needed to ride, and not to wait for the Good Fairy to come and build a kiddie path for them. It would make no difference whatsoever. Cyclists do have full rights to the road, including roads like that. If everyone would learn that and behave accordingly, we'd be much better off. Would, could, should. The usual. Not gonna happen when one group sits on a saddle in the open and the other behind a mass of steel. The excuses "I did not see him" or "He suddenly swerved in front of me" usually gets them off the hook unless excessive speed, drugs or booze was involved. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ |
#66
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Bike Share graveyard
On 12/7/2017 4:18 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-12-07 13:07, Frank Krygowski wrote: On 12/7/2017 12:42 PM, Joerg wrote: On 2017-12-07 09:18, Frank Krygowski wrote: [...] One time I found out the day before the ride that the restaurant I'd picked out had to close due to an emergency. (a gas leak - lucky it didn't explode!) So I had to quickly throw together a different ride. It required about a mile on a downhill stretch of a new four lane road. Traffic wasn't bad at all ... The last five words are the key. Of course most riders do not mind roads when traffic is light. However, they do hesitate when it looks like this: https://goo.gl/maps/yX2ts3QeNeF2 Nearly every cyclist I know in town, and it's quite a few, refuses to ride through there. The common response it "That is crazy!". I don't doubt that most cyclists refuse to ride there. Most cyclists in America lack the knowledge and confidence to ride with real competence on anything but a nearly empty road. Or they know or met one cyclist (in my case several) who got seriously hit out there. The worst one needed years to get back into the saddle because of injuries. She ended up under a full-size pickup truck. Isn't it funny? People hear of one person who got hurt riding a bike - about half the time by doing something illegal or dumb - and they say riding is very dangerous. At last count, I've known 9 people who died while riding in or on motor vehicles, and more injured that way. I don't think that's unusual. Yet there's very little fear of driving or riding in motor vehicles. The thing is, if those cyclists were to take a Cycling Savvy class, riding that or something very much like it would be part of the learning experience. They'd see the teachers and the other students do it with no trouble, and they would do it themselves with no trouble. They would become empowered to ride where they needed to ride, and not to wait for the Good Fairy to come and build a kiddie path for them. It would make no difference whatsoever. If they are people like you who already know everything, it might not make any difference. But people who are willing to learn can and do gain knowledge, confidence and empowerment. See http://cyclingsavvy.org/2011/05/i-am-no-road-warrior/ And it does them practical good. Among other things, it teaches them to recognize hazards and avoid them. This is a story about a bike lane that didn't work, but knowledge that did. http://cyclingsavvy.org/2017/12/the-...saved-my-life/ Cyclists do have full rights to the road, including roads like that. If everyone would learn that and behave accordingly, we'd be much better off. Would, could, should. The usual. Not gonna happen when one group sits on a saddle in the open and the other behind a mass of steel. The excuses "I did not see him" or "He suddenly swerved in front of me" usually gets them off the hook unless excessive speed, drugs or booze was involved. That's your usual shtick, Joerg - imagining some catastrophe that MAY happen (especially if you don't know how to lessen the risk) and treating it as if it's a 100% certainty. It must baffle you that I'm still alive after all those decades of riding on roads! (Well, no, I take that back. I don't believe you think that deeply.) -- - Frank Krygowski |
#67
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Bike Share graveyard
On 2017-12-07 16:26, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 12/7/2017 4:18 PM, Joerg wrote: On 2017-12-07 13:07, Frank Krygowski wrote: On 12/7/2017 12:42 PM, Joerg wrote: On 2017-12-07 09:18, Frank Krygowski wrote: [...] One time I found out the day before the ride that the restaurant I'd picked out had to close due to an emergency. (a gas leak - lucky it didn't explode!) So I had to quickly throw together a different ride. It required about a mile on a downhill stretch of a new four lane road. Traffic wasn't bad at all ... The last five words are the key. Of course most riders do not mind roads when traffic is light. However, they do hesitate when it looks like this: https://goo.gl/maps/yX2ts3QeNeF2 Nearly every cyclist I know in town, and it's quite a few, refuses to ride through there. The common response it "That is crazy!". I don't doubt that most cyclists refuse to ride there. Most cyclists in America lack the knowledge and confidence to ride with real competence on anything but a nearly empty road. Or they know or met one cyclist (in my case several) who got seriously hit out there. The worst one needed years to get back into the saddle because of injuries. She ended up under a full-size pickup truck. Isn't it funny? People hear of one person who got hurt riding a bike - about half the time by doing something illegal or dumb - and they say riding is very dangerous. Nonsense. You tend towards premature conclusions while knowing zero in details. _All_ cases were not at fault. Of the most severely hurt (required hospital stay band had longer term consequences) two were rear-ended in the lane and one hit by a vehicle making an unsafe turn right in front of her. At last count, I've known 9 people who died while riding in or on motor vehicles, and more injured that way. I don't think that's unusual. Yet there's very little fear of driving or riding in motor vehicles. Per mile cyclists get injured more often than motorists. The thing is, if those cyclists were to take a Cycling Savvy class, riding that or something very much like it would be part of the learning experience. They'd see the teachers and the other students do it with no trouble, and they would do it themselves with no trouble. They would become empowered to ride where they needed to ride, and not to wait for the Good Fairy to come and build a kiddie path for them. It would make no difference whatsoever. If they are people like you who already know everything, it might not make any difference. But people who are willing to learn can and do gain knowledge, confidence and empowerment. See http://cyclingsavvy.org/2011/05/i-am-no-road-warrior/ And it does them practical good. Among other things, it teaches them to recognize hazards and avoid them. This is a story about a bike lane that didn't work, but knowledge that did. http://cyclingsavvy.org/2017/12/the-...saved-my-life/ Until they meet that soused guy in the old pickup truck coming up from behind, hell-bent on showing them who is boss in "his" lane. Cyclists do have full rights to the road, including roads like that. If everyone would learn that and behave accordingly, we'd be much better off. Would, could, should. The usual. Not gonna happen when one group sits on a saddle in the open and the other behind a mass of steel. The excuses "I did not see him" or "He suddenly swerved in front of me" usually gets them off the hook unless excessive speed, drugs or booze was involved. That's your usual shtick, Joerg - imagining some catastrophe that MAY happen (especially if you don't know how to lessen the risk) and treating it as if it's a 100% certainty. It must baffle you that I'm still alive after all those decades of riding on roads! (Well, no, I take that back. I don't believe you think that deeply.) As I've said before, I am talking about facts. I was _in_ court in such a case, on the witness stand. The situation was quite clear, the guy brutally pushed a cyclist from the lane into the ditch with his truck when he saw that oncoming traffic got too close. And yes, the lane was taken because it was unsafe to pass there with oncoming traffic. The perp was still let off the hook. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ |
#68
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Bike Share graveyard
SMS SMS
are there use able stats on the Valley's bike sharing ? we can use for comparison to Pigville ? |
#69
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Bike Share graveyard
On Thu, 07 Dec 2017 13:18:49 -0800, Joerg
wrote: On 2017-12-07 13:07, Frank Krygowski wrote: On 12/7/2017 12:42 PM, Joerg wrote: On 2017-12-07 09:18, Frank Krygowski wrote: [...] One time I found out the day before the ride that the restaurant I'd picked out had to close due to an emergency. (a gas leak - lucky it didn't explode!) So I had to quickly throw together a different ride. It required about a mile on a downhill stretch of a new four lane road. Traffic wasn't bad at all ... The last five words are the key. Of course most riders do not mind roads when traffic is light. However, they do hesitate when it looks like this: https://goo.gl/maps/yX2ts3QeNeF2 Nearly every cyclist I know in town, and it's quite a few, refuses to ride through there. The common response it "That is crazy!". I don't doubt that most cyclists refuse to ride there. Most cyclists in America lack the knowledge and confidence to ride with real competence on anything but a nearly empty road. Or they know or met one cyclist (in my case several) who got seriously hit out there. The worst one needed years to get back into the saddle because of injuries. She ended up under a full-size pickup truck. My wife knew a woman that was killed stepping off the bus. She stepped off and was hit by a motorcycle, fell and hit her head on the curb. Busses are dangerious! One of my gunners when I was at Enewetak Atoll had to jump out of three airplanes. Proving that Aircraft are unsafe. My grandmother knew a fellow that was killed when a horse ran away. Horses are unsafe. I bought a new pair of shoes and got a blister. The blister became infected and I had to have part of my little toe amputated. Shoes are dangerious. Both my grandfathers died in bed thus proving that beds are dangerious. Is all that ridiculous? Certainly it is. Just as are your posts about the dangerious roads that you are forced to ride over. I would remind you that Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder results not only from a single traumatic experience but also from continued exposure to what an individual views as danger. If you continue riding on those roads that you just know are so dangerious you may find yourself experiencing one or another of the following symptoms: Flashbacks, Upsetting dreams, even physical reactions to a flash back. -- Cheers, John B. |
#70
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Bike Share graveyard
On 12/7/2017 7:44 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-12-07 16:26, Frank Krygowski wrote: On 12/7/2017 4:18 PM, Joerg wrote: On 2017-12-07 13:07, Frank Krygowski wrote: On 12/7/2017 12:42 PM, Joerg wrote: On 2017-12-07 09:18, Frank Krygowski wrote: [...] One time I found out the day before the ride that the restaurant I'd picked out had to close due to an emergency. (a gas leak - lucky it didn't explode!) So I had to quickly throw together a different ride. It required about a mile on a downhill stretch of a new four lane road. Traffic wasn't bad at all ... The last five words are the key. Of course most riders do not mind roads when traffic is light. However, they do hesitate when it looks like this: https://goo.gl/maps/yX2ts3QeNeF2 Nearly every cyclist I know in town, and it's quite a few, refuses to ride through there. The common response it "That is crazy!". I don't doubt that most cyclists refuse to ride there. Most cyclists in America lack the knowledge and confidence to ride with real competence on anything but a nearly empty road. Or they know or met one cyclist (in my case several) who got seriously hit out there. The worst one needed years to get back into the saddle because of injuries. She ended up under a full-size pickup truck. Isn't it funny? People hear of one person who got hurt riding a bike - about half the time by doing something illegal or dumb - and they say riding is very dangerous. Nonsense. You tend towards premature conclusions while knowing zero in details. _All_ cases were not at fault. Of the most severely hurt (required hospital stay band had longer term consequences) two were rear-ended in the lane and one hit by a vehicle making an unsafe turn right in front of her. At last count, I've known 9 people who died while riding in or on motor vehicles, and more injured that way. I don't think that's unusual. Yet there's very little fear of driving or riding in motor vehicles. Per mile cyclists get injured more often than motorists. And per mile, driving is FAR more dangerous than riding buses. So why are you not yelling about driving being dangerous? More to the point: Per mile, walking is more dangerous than bicycling. This has shown up in data for the U.S. as well in many other countries. Why are you not yelling about walking being dangerous? The thing is, if those cyclists were to take a Cycling Savvy class, riding that or something very much like it would be part of the learning experience. They'd see the teachers and the other students do it with no trouble, and they would do it themselves with no trouble. They would become empowered to ride where they needed to ride, and not to wait for the Good Fairy to come and build a kiddie path for them. It would make no difference whatsoever. If they are people like you who already know everything, it might not make any difference. But people who are willing to learn can and do gain knowledge, confidence and empowerment. See http://cyclingsavvy.org/2011/05/i-am-no-road-warrior/ And it does them practical good. Among other things, it teaches them to recognize hazards and avoid them. This is a story about a bike lane that didn't work, but knowledge that did. http://cyclingsavvy.org/2017/12/the-...saved-my-life/ Until they meet that soused guy in the old pickup truck coming up from behind, hell-bent on showing them who is boss in "his" lane. What a fearful fantasy life you lead! Joerg, people have been hit from behind in the bike lanes you love. More frequently, people in bike lanes have been run over by turning vehicles, as the person in the second link above _almost_ was. She was able to avoid that NOT because there was a bike lane. She was able to avoid that because she had learned something important in a cycling class. So why does that anecdote not register with you? Why are your anecdotes more important? -- - Frank Krygowski |
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