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Stress Analysis in the Design of Bicycle Infrastructure



 
 
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  #111  
Old August 19th 17, 03:17 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
SMS
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Default Stress Analysis in the Design of Bicycle Infrastructure

On 8/14/2017 8:09 PM, jbeattie wrote:

snip

Well, that's just wrong -- particularly for you. AFAIK, property taxes in California may pay a tiny part of certain transportation projects -- like mass transit, highway lighting or pot-hole filling. They're not being used to build bike paths. Look at your tax bill and see if there are any bonds for bicycle infrastructure. And read this: http://www.calbike.org/funding_sources After Prop 13, there are few property tax dollars for transportation projects. Maybe SMS can weigh in on this. But I do know you pay practically nothing for property tax. I probably paid that much 20 years ago for a dinger house in a sketchy part of town.


Oh no, don't get me started on Prop 13, the third rail of California
politics!

The issue with Prop 13 is that it was sold to voters as a way for
homeowners to avoid being subjected to unrealistic property taxes due to
paper increases in their home's assessed value. While I think maybe a
fixed 2% limit was too low in some cases, too high in others, 2% per
year is fair enough. For owner-occupied residential property. Period.

But it was commercial real estate interests that were behind Prop 13.
And owners of commercial property found ways to skirt Prop 13 even when
selling commercial property, to prevent reassessment.

My feeling on Prop 13 is that it should apply solely to owner-occupied
residential property, limit 2. What we have in my city is a lot of
rental property that is paying a pittance in property tax and parcel
taxes, and it's chock full of families with multiple children in the
public schools. They're paying insanely high rent, but that money isn't
going to the schools, or to any public benefit. There is also the issue
of homeowners with very low property tax allowing their adult children
with their own children to take over their house, pay very low property
taxes, yet send the kids to public school. Who subsidizes these kids?
The recent homeowners paying astronomical property taxes.

A house in my neighborhood, and it's not in the rich section of town,
would have property taxes of about $25,000 per year if it were sold today.

The People's Republic of Berkeley did something really smart, they base
parcel taxes on square feet, not parcels. So a 100 unit apartment
building doesn't get away with paying one parcel tax while a 100 unit
condo complex pays 100 parcel taxes. That change to the the tax system
passed 88% to 12%.

I was talking to a CPA yesterday, and she was explaining what is really
wrong with California when it comes to small businesses. It's how
expensive it is to operate as an LLC, and the dual taxation you're
subjected to. The purpose of an LLC is to put a wall between the
businesses assets and the business owner's personal assets. But the cost
of operating as an LLC is so high in California that she advises people
to just operate as a sole proprietorship and to buy a very large
umbrella insurance policy to protect their personal assets, because the
umbrella policy will cost a lot less than paying taxes as an LLC. Jay
would know more about this than I do!


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  #112  
Old August 19th 17, 03:29 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Joerg[_2_]
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Default Stress Analysis in the Design of Bicycle Infrastructure

On 2017-08-18 18:52, sms wrote:
On 8/18/2017 12:52 PM, Joerg wrote:

In essence it is. CalPERS got a blank check. Because of wanton doling
out of increases they are now grossly underfunded. So they send the
government a yearly bill. "This is how many billions we need this year
and this is, therefore, what you owe us".


It's not the "wanton doling out of increases," the increases are
determined by formulas put into place when the employee is hired, no one
increases it "wantonly."



It clearly was. Unions "convinced" the governor back then (Gray Davis)
that a massive increase would easily be covered but the investments.
This was when the stock market was on a roll. Then ... it went bust, as
it cyclically tends to do. And now we have a massive pension problem.
Predictably so.


... Many cities have taken steps to reduce the
pension costs for the long term, but in the short term there will be a
lot of retirees collecting pensions for decades.

The real cause of the CalPERS under-funding is the reduction in the
predicted rate of return on investments. Every time CalPERS reduces the
predicted return, the local and state governments have to ante up the
difference. As an elected official, I now get to worry about this!


Then you should remember that episode.

http://www.latimes.com/projects/la-m...is-davis-deal/


A reduction of 0.5% in the predicted rate of return may not sound like
much, but even for a moderately sized city it can amount to a lot of
money in additional funding. See
https://www.calpers.ca.gov/page/newsroom/calpers-news/2016/calpers-lower-discount-rate.


This is exactly what I told everyone back then would happen and all the
leftists said I was wrong or had their heads in the sand. And now it is
happening.


http://www.latimes.com/projects/la-le-me-richmond-pensions/.


The classic crowding out phenomenon. Also very predictable. This is why
we have horrid streets and Nevada has nice smooth ones.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/
  #113  
Old August 19th 17, 03:37 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Joerg[_2_]
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Posts: 6,016
Default Stress Analysis in the Design of Bicycle Infrastructure

On 2017-08-18 19:17, sms wrote:

[...]


The People's Republic of Berkeley did something really smart, they base
parcel taxes on square feet, not parcels. So a 100 unit apartment
building doesn't get away with paying one parcel tax while a 100 unit
condo complex pays 100 parcel taxes. That change to the the tax system
passed 88% to 12%.


So how much did that increase the affordability of apartments?


I was talking to a CPA yesterday, and she was explaining what is really
wrong with California when it comes to small businesses. It's how
expensive it is to operate as an LLC, and the dual taxation you're
subjected to. The purpose of an LLC is to put a wall between the
businesses assets and the business owner's personal assets. But the cost
of operating as an LLC is so high in California that she advises people
to just operate as a sole proprietorship and to buy a very large
umbrella insurance policy to protect their personal assets, because the
umbrella policy will cost a lot less than paying taxes as an LLC. Jay
would know more about this than I do!


That is exactly what people here are doing :-)

Others go a step further, packing it up and moving the business out of
state. Or they lose out against out of state businesses in the
marketplace. This also evidences itself in where my clients are. A
decade ago most were in California. Now most are in the Houston area.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/
  #114  
Old August 20th 17, 04:47 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
SMS
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Posts: 9,477
Default Stress Analysis in the Design of Bicycle Infrastructure

On 8/19/2017 7:37 AM, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-08-18 19:17, sms wrote:

[...]


The People's Republic of Berkeley did something really smart, they base
parcel taxes on square feet, not parcels. So a 100 unit apartment
building doesn't get away with paying one parcel tax while a 100 unit
condo complex pays 100 parcel taxes. That change to the the tax system
passed 88% to 12%.


So how much did that increase the affordability of apartments?


It neither increased nor decreased the affordability, since rental costs
are based on what the market will bear, not the costs to the property owner.

Others go a step further, packing it up and moving the business out of
state.


Perhaps, but more businesses and people continue to come to California
that leave.

Or they lose out against out of state businesses in the
marketplace. This also evidences itself in where my clients are. A
decade ago most were in California. Now most are in the Houston area.


I don't think that you really want to live in Houston no matter how
cheap the housing is.


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  #115  
Old August 20th 17, 03:26 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Joerg[_2_]
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Posts: 6,016
Default Stress Analysis in the Design of Bicycle Infrastructure

On 2017-08-19 20:47, sms wrote:
On 8/19/2017 7:37 AM, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-08-18 19:17, sms wrote:

[...]


The People's Republic of Berkeley did something really smart, they base
parcel taxes on square feet, not parcels. So a 100 unit apartment
building doesn't get away with paying one parcel tax while a 100 unit
condo complex pays 100 parcel taxes. That change to the the tax system
passed 88% to 12%.


So how much did that increase the affordability of apartments?


It neither increased nor decreased the affordability, since rental costs
are based on what the market will bear, not the costs to the property
owner.


Exactly, and when a parcel tax or whatever other tax is increased it is
simply passed on to the renters - rents go up.


Others go a step further, packing it up and moving the business out of
state.


Perhaps, but more businesses and people continue to come to California
that leave.


I haven't seen evidence of that and someone from the tax board said
otherwise.


Or they lose out against out of state businesses in the
marketplace. This also evidences itself in where my clients are. A
decade ago most were in California. Now most are in the Houston area.


I don't think that you really want to live in Houston no matter how
cheap the housing is.


That is undoubtedly correct. However, if I was younger and not close to
retirement I'd be in Southern Utah or Northern Arizona now. Might still
move there some day in case the politicians go completely coocoo in
California.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/
  #116  
Old August 20th 17, 04:14 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
[email protected]
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Posts: 3,345
Default Stress Analysis in the Design of Bicycle Infrastructure

On Saturday, August 19, 2017 at 7:36:55 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-08-18 19:17, sms wrote:

[...]


The People's Republic of Berkeley did something really smart, they base
parcel taxes on square feet, not parcels. So a 100 unit apartment
building doesn't get away with paying one parcel tax while a 100 unit
condo complex pays 100 parcel taxes. That change to the the tax system
passed 88% to 12%.


So how much did that increase the affordability of apartments?


I was talking to a CPA yesterday, and she was explaining what is really
wrong with California when it comes to small businesses. It's how
expensive it is to operate as an LLC, and the dual taxation you're
subjected to. The purpose of an LLC is to put a wall between the
businesses assets and the business owner's personal assets. But the cost
of operating as an LLC is so high in California that she advises people
to just operate as a sole proprietorship and to buy a very large
umbrella insurance policy to protect their personal assets, because the
umbrella policy will cost a lot less than paying taxes as an LLC. Jay
would know more about this than I do!


That is exactly what people here are doing :-)

Others go a step further, packing it up and moving the business out of
state. Or they lose out against out of state businesses in the
marketplace. This also evidences itself in where my clients are. A
decade ago most were in California. Now most are in the Houston area.


Wouldn't you think that taxation of rental properties would be better tied to rents rather than property values?

When I've written the local paper that the business atmosphere is driving business out of California the responses are that business growth in California has never been higher. Yet even Elon Musk built his battery plant in Nevada.

  #117  
Old August 20th 17, 05:02 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
AMuzi
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Posts: 13,447
Default Stress Analysis in the Design of Bicycle Infrastructure

On 8/20/2017 10:14 AM, wrote:
On Saturday, August 19, 2017 at 7:36:55 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-08-18 19:17, sms wrote:

[...]


The People's Republic of Berkeley did something really smart, they base
parcel taxes on square feet, not parcels. So a 100 unit apartment
building doesn't get away with paying one parcel tax while a 100 unit
condo complex pays 100 parcel taxes. That change to the the tax system
passed 88% to 12%.


So how much did that increase the affordability of apartments?


I was talking to a CPA yesterday, and she was explaining what is really
wrong with California when it comes to small businesses. It's how
expensive it is to operate as an LLC, and the dual taxation you're
subjected to. The purpose of an LLC is to put a wall between the
businesses assets and the business owner's personal assets. But the cost
of operating as an LLC is so high in California that she advises people
to just operate as a sole proprietorship and to buy a very large
umbrella insurance policy to protect their personal assets, because the
umbrella policy will cost a lot less than paying taxes as an LLC. Jay
would know more about this than I do!


That is exactly what people here are doing :-)

Others go a step further, packing it up and moving the business out of
state. Or they lose out against out of state businesses in the
marketplace. This also evidences itself in where my clients are. A
decade ago most were in California. Now most are in the Houston area.


Wouldn't you think that taxation of rental properties would be better tied to rents rather than property values?

When I've written the local paper that the business atmosphere is driving business out of California the responses are that business growth in California has never been higher. Yet even Elon Musk built his battery plant in Nevada.


If you tie the tax to rents, you'll get low "rents" and
exorbitant "key fees" as in other cities. We humans a
devious species.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


  #118  
Old August 20th 17, 05:34 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
JBeattie
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Posts: 5,870
Default Stress Analysis in the Design of Bicycle Infrastructure

On Sunday, August 20, 2017 at 8:14:53 AM UTC-7, wrote:
On Saturday, August 19, 2017 at 7:36:55 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-08-18 19:17, sms wrote:

[...]


The People's Republic of Berkeley did something really smart, they base
parcel taxes on square feet, not parcels. So a 100 unit apartment
building doesn't get away with paying one parcel tax while a 100 unit
condo complex pays 100 parcel taxes. That change to the the tax system
passed 88% to 12%.


So how much did that increase the affordability of apartments?


I was talking to a CPA yesterday, and she was explaining what is really
wrong with California when it comes to small businesses. It's how
expensive it is to operate as an LLC, and the dual taxation you're
subjected to. The purpose of an LLC is to put a wall between the
businesses assets and the business owner's personal assets. But the cost
of operating as an LLC is so high in California that she advises people
to just operate as a sole proprietorship and to buy a very large
umbrella insurance policy to protect their personal assets, because the
umbrella policy will cost a lot less than paying taxes as an LLC. Jay
would know more about this than I do!


That is exactly what people here are doing :-)

Others go a step further, packing it up and moving the business out of
state. Or they lose out against out of state businesses in the
marketplace. This also evidences itself in where my clients are. A
decade ago most were in California. Now most are in the Houston area.


Wouldn't you think that taxation of rental properties would be better tied to rents rather than property values?

When I've written the local paper that the business atmosphere is driving business out of California the responses are that business growth in California has never been higher. Yet even Elon Musk built his battery plant in Nevada.


Property taxes are tied to rents in a way because property values for multi-family are based on return. The value is rent-driven. A beautiful building in a depressed rental market is worth less than a falling-down slum in the Bay Area.

Building a battery plant in Nevada makes sense. What's a little heavy metal in the groundwater in a place where they were lighting off nukes? Actually, apart from the regulatory landscape, its easier preventing pollution in a desert because there are not the same groundwater concerns, and dirt is cheap.

California has made a decision not to attract dirty businesses. Some of these businesses, like coal export (a big issue around here) also involve unpredictable markets and employers who come and go and leave a big mess.

-- Jay Beattie.
  #119  
Old August 21st 17, 01:11 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
SMS
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Posts: 9,477
Default Stress Analysis in the Design of Bicycle Infrastructure

On 8/20/2017 7:26 AM, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-08-19 20:47, sms wrote:
On 8/19/2017 7:37 AM, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-08-18 19:17, sms wrote:

[...]


The People's Republic of Berkeley did something really smart, they base
parcel taxes on square feet, not parcels. So a 100 unit apartment
building doesn't get away with paying one parcel tax while a 100 unit
condo complex pays 100 parcel taxes. That change to the the tax system
passed 88% to 12%.


So how much did that increase the affordability of apartments?


It neither increased nor decreased the affordability, since rental costs
are based on what the market will bear, not the costs to the property
owner.


Exactly, and when a parcel tax or whatever other tax is increased it is
simply passed on to the renters - rents go up.


No, that's not the way it works. It's what the market will bear, not
what it costs the property owner. A property owner that paid $1 million
for an apartment building charges the same rent as an owner of an
identical building that paid $5 million. One just makes more money.

But it's immaterial. Apartment building owners and residents should not
be subsidized by owners of single family homes or condos, which is the
way it is now. Apartment building owners want it both ways--they don't
want to pay their fair share of property taxes or parcel taxes, and they
also don't want rent control. In other words, they're fine with lobbying
the government to subsidize their businesses, but not with the
government limiting how much they can charge for their product.

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  #120  
Old August 21st 17, 01:18 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
SMS
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 9,477
Default Stress Analysis in the Design of Bicycle Infrastructure

On 8/20/2017 8:14 AM, wrote:
On Saturday, August 19, 2017 at 7:36:55 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-08-18 19:17, sms wrote:

[...]


The People's Republic of Berkeley did something really smart, they base
parcel taxes on square feet, not parcels. So a 100 unit apartment
building doesn't get away with paying one parcel tax while a 100 unit
condo complex pays 100 parcel taxes. That change to the the tax system
passed 88% to 12%.


So how much did that increase the affordability of apartments?


I was talking to a CPA yesterday, and she was explaining what is really
wrong with California when it comes to small businesses. It's how
expensive it is to operate as an LLC, and the dual taxation you're
subjected to. The purpose of an LLC is to put a wall between the
businesses assets and the business owner's personal assets. But the cost
of operating as an LLC is so high in California that she advises people
to just operate as a sole proprietorship and to buy a very large
umbrella insurance policy to protect their personal assets, because the
umbrella policy will cost a lot less than paying taxes as an LLC. Jay
would know more about this than I do!


That is exactly what people here are doing :-)

Others go a step further, packing it up and moving the business out of
state. Or they lose out against out of state businesses in the
marketplace. This also evidences itself in where my clients are. A
decade ago most were in California. Now most are in the Houston area.


Wouldn't you think that taxation of rental properties would be better tied to rents rather than property values?


That's fine too.

When I've written the local paper that the business atmosphere is driving business out of California the responses are that business growth in California has never been higher. Yet even Elon Musk built his battery plant in Nevada.


The responses are logical. A single example of a manufacturer building a
factory in another state is not evidence of anything. Nevada is giving
$1.3 billion to Tesla in return for the factory locating there.

Unlike the Tesla automobile factory, which is benefiting other local
businesses, suppliers and service providers (hard to find a machine shop
to do small jobs anymore in Fremont), the battery factory will not
create many jobs from suppliers and service providers. Nevada is
estimated to lose $183,000 per job that is created.


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