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  #11  
Old July 30th 06, 03:41 PM posted to rec.bicycles.racing
internaute
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Posts: 8
Default Learning with the news


"Donald Munro" a écrit dans le message de news:
.. .
internaute wrote:


it is said that testoterone injection make the guy very horny, that

makes
him all excited (aroused? pardon my english), excited to climb moutain,
excited to **** deep and hard and from behind the podium girls. so I

think
that the best dope would be a night with these podium girls with their

mini
skirt


Surely you mean without their mini skirt ?


oh well I don't think they would stay longer with their skirt, I would
fondle their tits, eat their pussy and **** them all the night ...So... it's
just to say that sexy girls are in fact the best dope in life


Ads
  #13  
Old July 30th 06, 04:01 PM posted to rec.bicycles.racing
Simon Brooke
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Posts: 4,493
Default Learning with the news

in message , Donald
Munro ') wrote:

internaute wrote:


it is said that testoterone injection make the guy very horny, that
makes him all excited (aroused? pardon my english), excited to climb
moutain, excited to **** deep and hard and from behind the podium
girls. so I think that the best dope would be a night with these
podium girls with their mini skirt


Surely you mean without their mini skirt ?


If you find a miniskirt an impediment there's something very wrong with
your technique.

--
(Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

Morning had broken, and there was nothing we could do but wait
patiently for the RAC to arrive.
  #14  
Old July 30th 06, 07:14 PM posted to rec.bicycles.racing
Michael Press
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Posts: 1,100
Default Learning with the news

In article
.com,
wrote:

Michael Press wrote:
In article
. com,
wrote:

Michael Press wrote:
In article
.com,
"Linda Lou" wrote:

I'm sorry, but what kind of scientist is this guy Black? It's not very
clinical or objective to inject himself with testosterone and describe
his feelings as proof of the results. Does he do these experiments in
his garage? Is his dog his lab assistant?

Plus, he's one "scientist" refuting the results of several studies
cited in the media.

A good scientist will always experiment on himself. The
report you may take as you will.

Once read an account of a scientist who purposely had
himself bitten by a black widow spider. Two days of agony.

And of course it was double-blind and with a placebo control.

One has to wonder about the credibility of people who grasp at
non-science to further their position.


What are you talking about? You are blind to what I am
getting at.


Excuse my attempt at humor.


Apologies. I missed it.

To wit, a silly investigator using
himself as a test bed for conducting an experiment cannot be without
subjective involvment. And the original poster should not have been
"non-science" to further his position.


Certainly a procedure carried out upon oneself falls short
of many experimental design ideals. But, how is a
scientist to determine the consequences of black widow
poison? Interview victims certainly. Ask for volunteers?
Ludicrous. Therefore he must make himself the victim. His
report is credible. He was monitored by people qualified
to observe and log vital signs. His own account of his
experiences are worth at least as much as other victims,
and better than most.

When thinking about Science we sometime try to ignore the
subjective, but the subjective does not go away. Best to
accept this and watch for the subjective. It is only the
hidden subjectivity that corrupts an investigation.

When I say that a good scientist experiments upon himself
I am thinking of two things.

1) Ethics. He or she should be prepared to undergo
procedures he or she proposes to carry out on test
subjects.

2) Self-knowledge.

I applaud the gent who injected himself with testosterone
to observe the effects. His observations are at least as
valuable as those who inject testosterone as a means to an
end; better in my opinion.

--
Michael Press
  #15  
Old July 30th 06, 08:33 PM posted to rec.bicycles.racing
RicodJour
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Posts: 3,142
Default Learning with the news

Michael Press wrote:

Certainly a procedure carried out upon oneself falls short
of many experimental design ideals. But, how is a
scientist to determine the consequences of black widow
poison? Interview victims certainly. Ask for volunteers?
Ludicrous. Therefore he must make himself the victim. His
report is credible. He was monitored by people qualified
to observe and log vital signs. His own account of his
experiences are worth at least as much as other victims,
and better than most.

When thinking about Science we sometime try to ignore the
subjective, but the subjective does not go away. Best to
accept this and watch for the subjective. It is only the
hidden subjectivity that corrupts an investigation.


Subjective conclusions, whether hidden or blatant are still essentially
worthless. They don't prove anything.

When I say that a good scientist experiments upon himself
I am thinking of two things.

1) Ethics. He or she should be prepared to undergo
procedures he or she proposes to carry out on test
subjects.


Ethics? I know what the word means in most cases, but I don't follow
you on this one.

A single person study provides little if any benefit. Subjective
information, perhaps, but not something that would constiture medical
research with respect to creating anti-doping controls. That's what
we're talking about, right?

Testing something on yourself and extrapolating to how the populace as
a whole would react is stupid. Reporting your dabbling in drugs to the
media as a scientific "proof" is beyond stupid. Ethics be damned.

2) Self-knowledge.

I applaud the gent who injected himself with testosterone
to observe the effects. His observations are at least as
valuable as those who inject testosterone as a means to an
end; better in my opinion.


Timothy Leary? Is that you....?

Frankly, that would be a lot more interesting - Le Tour de LSD. If
anyone at all makes it to the finish line it's a miracle!

R

  #16  
Old July 30th 06, 10:01 PM posted to rec.bicycles.racing
Donald Munro
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,811
Default Learning with the news

Michael Press wrote:
To wit, a silly investigator using
himself as a test bed for conducting an experiment cannot be without
subjective involvment. And the original poster should not have been
"non-science" to further his position.


Certainly a procedure carried out upon oneself falls short
of many experimental design ideals. But, how is a
scientist to determine the consequences of black widow
poison? Interview victims certainly. Ask for volunteers?
Ludicrous. Therefore he must make himself the victim. His
report is credible. He was monitored by people qualified
to observe and log vital signs. His own account of his
experiences are worth at least as much as other victims,
and better than most.

When thinking about Science we sometime try to ignore the
subjective, but the subjective does not go away. Best to
accept this and watch for the subjective. It is only the
hidden subjectivity that corrupts an investigation.

When I say that a good scientist experiments upon himself
I am thinking of two things.

1) Ethics. He or she should be prepared to undergo
procedures he or she proposes to carry out on test
subjects.

2) Self-knowledge.

I applaud the gent who injected himself with testosterone
to observe the effects. His observations are at least as
valuable as those who inject testosterone as a means to an
end; better in my opinion.


Following in the footsteps of Dr. Albert Hofmann.

  #17  
Old July 30th 06, 11:17 PM posted to rec.bicycles.racing
Ryan Cousineau
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,383
Default Learning with the news

In article ,
Donald Munro wrote:

Michael Press wrote:
To wit, a silly investigator using
himself as a test bed for conducting an experiment cannot be without
subjective involvment. And the original poster should not have been
"non-science" to further his position.


Certainly a procedure carried out upon oneself falls short
of many experimental design ideals. But, how is a
scientist to determine the consequences of black widow
poison? Interview victims certainly. Ask for volunteers?
Ludicrous. Therefore he must make himself the victim. His
report is credible. He was monitored by people qualified
to observe and log vital signs. His own account of his
experiences are worth at least as much as other victims,
and better than most.

When thinking about Science we sometime try to ignore the
subjective, but the subjective does not go away. Best to
accept this and watch for the subjective. It is only the
hidden subjectivity that corrupts an investigation.

When I say that a good scientist experiments upon himself
I am thinking of two things.

1) Ethics. He or she should be prepared to undergo
procedures he or she proposes to carry out on test
subjects.

2) Self-knowledge.

I applaud the gent who injected himself with testosterone
to observe the effects. His observations are at least as
valuable as those who inject testosterone as a means to an
end; better in my opinion.


Following in the footsteps of Dr. Albert Hofmann.


And Dr. Barry Marshall:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barry_Marshall

Ulcers: they can be cured,

--
Ryan Cousineau http://www.wiredcola.com/
"I don't want kids who are thinking about going into mathematics
to think that they have to take drugs to succeed." -Paul Erdos
  #18  
Old July 31st 06, 02:43 AM posted to rec.bicycles.racing
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,092
Default Learning with the news

Michael Press wrote:

Certainly a procedure carried out upon oneself falls short
of many experimental design ideals. But, how is a
scientist to determine the consequences of black widow
poison? Interview victims certainly. Ask for volunteers?
Ludicrous. Therefore he must make himself the victim. His
report is credible. He was monitored by people qualified
to observe and log vital signs. His own account of his
experiences are worth at least as much as other victims,
and better than most.

When thinking about Science we sometime try to ignore the
subjective, but the subjective does not go away. Best to
accept this and watch for the subjective. It is only the
hidden subjectivity that corrupts an investigation.

When I say that a good scientist experiments upon himself
I am thinking of two things.

1) Ethics. He or she should be prepared to undergo
procedures he or she proposes to carry out on test
subjects.

2) Self-knowledge.

I applaud the gent who injected himself with testosterone
to observe the effects. His observations are at least as
valuable as those who inject testosterone as a means to an
end; better in my opinion.


Experimenting upon oneself is generally an expedient
one is driven to for a test that might not be ethical to
conduct upon other subjects. For example, poisons, or
proving that yellow fever is transmitted through mosquito
bites.

However, experimenting with the psychological and
physiological effects of testosterone is in a different
category. The drug is already regularly used in clinical
practice, so there are plenty of subjects available. But
the real issue is that the average Principal Investigator
is already well-enough supplied with ego, aggressiveness,
and feelings of power, confidence, control, and domination.
One man's sacrifice in the name of science is another
man's good excuse for getting a high.

Ben
If you can't follow the money,
follow the ego.

 




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