Question from a defacto newb: road vs cyclocross, what the former hasgoing for it?

On Dec 3, 9:41*pm, Tim McNamara wrote:
In article ,
*Clive George wrote:

On 04/12/2010 03:08, Norman wrote:

As far as I can tell, most cross bikes are rebadged tourers
with slightly higher bottoms brakets and no rack/fender
holes.

That seems unlikely to me. Is the geometry of most cross bikes closer to
tourer or racing?

Racing. *Modern cross bikes have a lower BB than used to be the case,
because with clipless pedals there's no need to be able to pedal with
the toe clips and straps pointing down. *The head tube might be a bit
slacker than a road bike.

My Gunnar Crosshairs also functions quite well as a road bike; I used it
in many road races, crits, training rides, etc. *And it worked well for
brevets and I rode it on a tour in the Alps with a Carradice saddle bag.

I ride my cross bike to work every day and on weekend rides when it is
sloppy out. It does have a significantly higher BB than my racing or
touring bike, so it requires a more flexible hip to swing one's leg
over the saddle. TT is very slightly shorter because it is a smaller
frame, but that is made up by the stem. It has slightly more slack
angles and much longer wheelbase. It is heavier than my racing bike,
but my best riding buddy has a 17lb cross bike for racing --- which is
lighter than my road racing bike. For him, the big difference is tire
profile and brake performance. Cantis with STI are not good, but my
bike has discs -- which are fussy and require adjustment as pads wear
but which do stop well in all weather. Nothing stops as well as dual
pivots in dry weather. If I had only one bike, it would be my cross
bike -- with several sets of wheels and tires, but on dry days, I love
my racing bike for hilly rides. -- Jay Beattie.

On Dec 5, 9:44*am, Frank Krygowski wrote:

Most important, your bike will more closely match the ads in
Buycycling magazine!

- Frank "unable to gave a smarm-free answer" Krygowski

On 12/05/2010 11:44 AM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On Dec 3, 9:25 am, wrote:
On Dec 3, 5:30 am, Anton wrote:

Aside from vbrakes is there any difference between cross and road
bikes?

I need to find a reason to get a roadbike after having switched to a
vbrake based flatbarred cross
that takes up to about 700x38 tires. I mean, there've got to be some
advantages to offset the inferior brakes,
limited rubber choices for a mainstream user. What are they?

Bottom bracket height, top tube length, and clearances for large tires
are your big differences. Most cross bikes use canti brakes, as they
tend to fall further back from the rim for mud clearance. I happen to
really dig v-brakes, as they're powerful and a cinch to set up right.
Depends on how much glop you plan on riding in.

If you want drop bars, a cross bike is far more practical than a road
bike. Many can serve light touring and commuting duty. You can put
fast slicks on them or knobbies. With a road bike, you're usually
limited to 25mm tires, blech.

I agree on the "blech" regarding 25mm tires. And I prefer either V-
brakes or classic cantilevers to close-clearance dual pivots.

But advantages to modern road bikes? Well, with a road bike you're
likely to have a weight savings of maybe a couple percent of the total
bike+rider weight. You can get lots more of its parts made of the
material du jour. The frame is more likely to feature tubes with
trendy, swoopy shapes (which are different from the trendy, swoopy
shapes in the frame tubes of a 1951 Schwinn). It will be easier to
count your spokes, should you get the urge. You won't be tempted to
sully your bike with practical things like racks or bags, so it won't
be disgraced by showing up at a grocery store.

Most important, your bike will more closely match the ads in
Buycycling magazine!

- Frank Krygowski

The main difference between my 'cross bike and my touring bike is simple
geometry. For JRA I have found that I prefer the touring bike. I keep
the 'cross bike around primarily in case I can sucker someone about my
size into going for a ride with me

The most noticeable differences are the higher BB and different head
tube angle on the 'cross bike - touring bike is noticeably lower (had to
remember I couldn't pedal around corners anymore!) and more
stable/easier to ride hands off.

nate

--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

On Dec 5, 11:55 am, Nate Nagel wrote:
On 12/05/2010 11:44 AM, Frank Krygowski wrote:



On Dec 3, 9:25 am, wrote:
On Dec 3, 5:30 am, Anton wrote:

Aside from vbrakes is there any difference between cross and road
bikes?

I need to find a reason to get a roadbike after having switched to a
vbrake based flatbarred cross
that takes up to about 700x38 tires. I mean, there've got to be some
advantages to offset the inferior brakes,
limited rubber choices for a mainstream user. What are they?

Bottom bracket height, top tube length, and clearances for large tires
are your big differences. Most cross bikes use canti brakes, as they
tend to fall further back from the rim for mud clearance. I happen to
really dig v-brakes, as they're powerful and a cinch to set up right.
Depends on how much glop you plan on riding in.

If you want drop bars, a cross bike is far more practical than a road
bike. Many can serve light touring and commuting duty. You can put
fast slicks on them or knobbies. With a road bike, you're usually
limited to 25mm tires, blech.

I agree on the "blech" regarding 25mm tires. And I prefer either V-
brakes or classic cantilevers to close-clearance dual pivots.

But advantages to modern road bikes? Well, with a road bike you're
likely to have a weight savings of maybe a couple percent of the total
bike+rider weight. You can get lots more of its parts made of the
material du jour. The frame is more likely to feature tubes with
trendy, swoopy shapes (which are different from the trendy, swoopy
shapes in the frame tubes of a 1951 Schwinn). It will be easier to
count your spokes, should you get the urge. You won't be tempted to
sully your bike with practical things like racks or bags, so it won't
be disgraced by showing up at a grocery store.

Most important, your bike will more closely match the ads in
Buycycling magazine!


My road racing bike has 36-spoke wheels, classic steel frame, 7-speed
freewheel, downtube shifters, single pivot brakes, etc., but is
dramatically lighter than any of my other bikes. It's a blast to
sprint, with tight geometry and corners great, too.



The main difference between my 'cross bike and my touring bike is simple
geometry. For JRA I have found that I prefer the touring bike. I keep
the 'cross bike around primarily in case I can sucker someone about my
size into going for a ride with me


As much fun as the racing bike is to ride, it is definitely optimized
for smooth pavement, and I get off most taking weird cut-throughs over
the widest possible variety of, um... surfaces :-) I do this on
whatever I'm riding, and the touring bike (LHT) acquits itself
admirably - considering its versatility otherwise.

My favorite bike to ride is definitely the full-rigid Stumpjumper -
which is also a fine road bike with smooth tires.

The most noticeable differences are the higher BB and different head
tube angle on the 'cross bike - touring bike is noticeably lower (had to
remember I couldn't pedal around corners anymore!) and more
stable/easier to ride hands off.


Bakaesque alert: Today I rode the wheeljie bike to the store for more
wine. There were two guys - one younger than me and one older - with
aluminum and carbon road bikes. (Beautiful clear sky w/ light wind
today.) They were still there as I was leaving, so I sort of joked
how, one day, I was going to dump it right there by the front door
getting on my bike with groceries in one hand. The older guy tells me
to swing my leg over first and take off straddling the bike. I did
so, and said yeah, I see what you mean - thanks! Then rolled off the
front porch into the parking lot and took my hand off the bar. A car
was coming up Main, so I veered left (still no hands) to go around
behind it. There's a big pole there in the parking lot, and I swept
around it to the right in a pretty tight arc onto main behind the car
(still no hands). It was at this point that I noticed I was leaned
over pretty far - what with no hands on the bars and a big box of wine
in my left, thought for a moment how it might be to fall over right
there, straightened up, turned left and headed for home.

On Dec 4, 1:25*am, landotter wrote:
On Dec 3, 5:30*am, Anton Success wrote:

Aside from vbrakes is there any difference between cross and road
bikes?

I need to find a reason to get a roadbike after having switched to a
vbrake based flatbarred cross
that takes up to about 700x38 tires. I mean, there've got to be some
advantages to offset the inferior brakes,
limited rubber choices for a mainstream user. What are they?

Bottom bracket height, top tube length, and clearances for large tires
are your big differences.

I'm not keen on the increased BB height for road use. With the seat
(saddle) adjusted properly the ground is further away, and can be a
stretch to get your foot on it. Track stands become second nature.

JS.

On Dec 5, 12:49 pm, James wrote:
On Dec 4, 1:25 am, landotter wrote:

On Dec 3, 5:30 am, Anton Success wrote:

Aside from vbrakes is there any difference between cross and road
bikes?

I need to find a reason to get a roadbike after having switched to a
vbrake based flatbarred cross
that takes up to about 700x38 tires. I mean, there've got to be some
advantages to offset the inferior brakes,
limited rubber choices for a mainstream user. What are they?

Bottom bracket height, top tube length, and clearances for large tires
are your big differences.

I'm not keen on the increased BB height for road use. With the seat
(saddle) adjusted properly the ground is further away, and can be a
stretch to get your foot on it. Track stands become second nature.


My wheeljie bike is like that. That's why I'm afraid of dumping it
climbing on with groceries in one hand at the sto

http://i53.tinypic.com/jihxk0.jpg

On Dec 3, 11:41*pm, Tim McNamara wrote:
In article ,
*Clive George wrote:

On 04/12/2010 03:08, Norman wrote:

As far as I can tell, most cross bikes are rebadged tourers
with slightly higher bottoms brakets and no rack/fender
holes.

That seems unlikely to me. Is the geometry of most cross bikes closer to
tourer or racing?

Racing. *Modern cross bikes have a lower BB than used to be the case,
because with clipless pedals there's no need to be able to pedal with
the toe clips and straps pointing down. *The head tube might be a bit
slacker than a road bike.

My Gunnar Crosshairs also functions quite well as a road bike; I used it
in many road races, crits, training rides, etc. *And it worked well for
brevets and I rode it on a tour in the Alps with a Carradice saddle bag.

--
Gotta make it somehow on the dreams you still believe.

It the new cable pull ration on 105 more suitable to V-brakes, or
less. I know they changed the leverage ratio.

Dan O wrote:
On Dec 5, 12:49 pm, James wrote:
On Dec 4, 1:25 am, landotter wrote:

On Dec 3, 5:30 am, Anton Success wrote:

Aside from vbrakes is there any difference between cross and road
bikes?

I need to find a reason to get a roadbike after having switched to
a vbrake based flatbarred cross
that takes up to about 700x38 tires. I mean, there've got to be
some advantages to offset the inferior brakes,
limited rubber choices for a mainstream user. What are they?

Bottom bracket height, top tube length, and clearances for large
tires are your big differences.

I'm not keen on the increased BB height for road use. With the seat
(saddle) adjusted properly the ground is further away, and can be a
stretch to get your foot on it. Track stands become second nature.


My wheeljie bike is like that. That's why I'm afraid of dumping it
climbing on with groceries in one hand at the sto

http://i53.tinypic.com/jihxk0.jpg

Nice Nishiki Dan. Reminds me of my 1992 Miyata Triplecross even down to the
paint colour. It definitely appears to have braze-ons for the fitting of a
cheap aluminium rack. Surely a rack with a pair of equally cheap Basil panniers
would solve your grocery getting problems.
PH

On Dec 6, 1:57 am, "Peter Howard" wrote:
Dan O wrote:
On Dec 5, 12:49 pm, James wrote:
On Dec 4, 1:25 am, landotter wrote:

On Dec 3, 5:30 am, Anton Success wrote:

Aside from vbrakes is there any difference between cross and road
bikes?

I need to find a reason to get a roadbike after having switched to
a vbrake based flatbarred cross
that takes up to about 700x38 tires. I mean, there've got to be
some advantages to offset the inferior brakes,
limited rubber choices for a mainstream user. What are they?

Bottom bracket height, top tube length, and clearances for large
tires are your big differences.

I'm not keen on the increased BB height for road use. With the seat
(saddle) adjusted properly the ground is further away, and can be a
stretch to get your foot on it. Track stands become second nature.

My wheeljie bike is like that. That's why I'm afraid of dumping it
climbing on with groceries in one hand at the sto

http://i53.tinypic.com/jihxk0.jpg

Nice Nishiki Dan. Reminds me of my 1992 Miyata Triplecross even down to the
paint colour. It definitely appears to have braze-ons for the fitting of a
cheap aluminium rack. Surely a rack with a pair of equally cheap Basil panniers
would solve your grocery getting problems.

True, but I need to be able to get my feet down off the back when I
flip it over popping wheeljies.

On Sun, 05 Dec 2010 13:07:34 -0800, Dan O wrote:



My wheeljie bike is like that. That's why I'm afraid of dumping it
climbing on with groceries in one hand at the sto

http://i53.tinypic.com/jihxk0.jpg

* * *
Dan O,

Nice Bicycle... Might you take the time and post more photos and provide
some specification on your ride?

JR the postman