Judge commends cyclist for his bravery in clinging onto car door tostop drunk driver

On 09/12/2020 15:37, JNugent wrote:
On 09/12/2020 09:35, TMS320 wrote:
On 09/12/2020 02:21, JNugent wrote:
On 08/12/2020 19:31, colwyn wrote:
On 08/12/2020 17:50, JNugent wrote:
On 08/12/2020 14:19, wrote:

The 42 year old, who admitted dangerous driving and drink
driving, had no recollection of the crash, which happened after
Mr Veracruz had spotted him driving the wrong way down the dual
carriageway road amd (SIC) decided to follow him on his bike.

So he too was then going in the wrong direction on a
dual-carriageway?

Where did you read that? you can follow someone on the correct side
of a dual-carriageway

That in itself is possible.

But it is not possible to try to stop the vehicle, open a door of the
vehicle and attempt to remove the ignition key whilst on the
opposite carriageway, anything up to forty feet away.

Your turn... try to wriggle out of that.

and where do you suggest is it stated, that he was on his bike when
he tried to open the door and apply the hand brake?

The fact that the vehicle weas *moving*?

You have this idea that the cyclist was riding alongside a moving car
and managed to open a door and lean in... Therein lies a very
significant practical problem even you should be able work out with a
bit of thought.

He was doing it from forty feet away on the opposite carriageway, with
his arms stretched across the centre reservation?

Someone else has already pointed that out.
The other poster called JNugent had not pointed that out.

The other JNugent was totally confused between the first act of
following the car and the second act of trying to stop the driver at an
opportunity when the car was momentarily motionless.

The other JNugent clearly had the idea that the cyclist must have
crossed to ride on the wrong carriageway for some distance, while
attempting to stop the car while it was moving.

But your namesake will never admit to this. I am surprised you haven't
pointed the error out to him.

rolls eyes

On the other hand, knowing you have no grasp of practical matters, try
reading the sentence following the one containing the word 'stop'. It
contains another fact.

Where was that, in the huge bit you have (for some reason) decided to snip?

You are quite capable of looking back to the original post. (Or are
you..? It seems not.)

On 09/12/2020 16:13, TMS320 wrote:
On 09/12/2020 15:37, JNugent wrote:
On 09/12/2020 09:35, TMS320 wrote:
On 09/12/2020 02:21, JNugent wrote:
On 08/12/2020 19:31, colwyn wrote:
On 08/12/2020 17:50, JNugent wrote:
On 08/12/2020 14:19, wrote:

The 42 year old, who admitted dangerous driving and drink
driving, had no recollection of the crash, which happened after
Mr Veracruz had spotted him driving the wrong way down the dual
carriageway road amd (SIC) decided to follow him on his bike.

So he too was then going in the wrong direction on a
dual-carriageway?

Where did you read that? you can follow someone on the correct side
of a dual-carriageway

That in itself is possible.
But it is not possible to try to stop the vehicle, open a door of the
vehicle and attempt to remove the ignition key whilst on the
opposite carriageway, anything up to forty feet away.
Your turn... try to wriggle out of that.

and where do you suggest is it stated, that he was on his bike when
he tried to open the door and apply the hand brake?

The fact that the vehicle was *moving*?

You have this idea that the cyclist was riding alongside a moving car
and managed to open a door and lean in... Therein lies a very
significant practical problem even you should be able work out with a
bit of thought.

He was doing it from forty feet away on the opposite carriageway, with
his arms stretched across the centre reservation?
Someone else has already pointed that out.

The other poster called JNugent had not pointed that out.

You really are beyond salvation, aren't you?

You know full well that another poster ("colwyn") had claimed that the
cyclist had been following the car, which was apparently going the wrong
way on a carriageway, by cycling (thus, according to "colwyn", in the
correct direction) on the opposite carriageway.

He admittedly didn't go as far as attempting an explanation of the up
close stuff from forty feet away and with a centre reservation between
them, but it at least allowed colwyn to rest safe in the "knowledge"
that the cyclist wasn't cycling in the wrong direction on a one-way
carriageway.

The other JNugent was totally confused between the first act of
following the car and the second act of trying to stop the driver at an
opportunity when the car was momentarily motionless.

Stopping a car while it's motionless?

How does that work?

The other JNugent clearly had the idea that the cyclist must have
crossed to ride on the wrong carriageway for some distance, while
attempting to stop the car while it was moving.

Either he did or he didn't. You and A N Other seem to have different
views on that.

But your namesake will never admit to this. I am surprised you haven't
pointed the error out to him.

rolls eyes

On the other hand, knowing you have no grasp of practical matters,
try reading the sentence following the one containing the word
'stop'. It contains another fact.

Where was that, in the huge bit you have (for some reason) decided to
snip?

You are quite capable of looking back to the original post. (Or are
you..? It seems not.)

Have you finished?

[Fat chance.]

From another source:
QUOTE:
A HEROIC cyclist was dragged along the road as he desperately tried to stop a drink driver going the wrong way down a dual carriageway.

Fabio Veracruz was so concerned when he saw Martin Davis’s erratic driving that he followed the car on his bike, a court heard.

While the vehicle was still moving, Mr Veracruz yanked the driver’s door open and tried to grab the handbrake while yelling ‘stop!’

But sozzled chef Davis (pictured), 41 — who had spent the night drinking with friends on September 25 — ignored his pleas and accelerated, pulling the cyclist along the road in Worcester.

Mr Veracruz managed to stand on the open door while clinging to the roof. Davis then ploughed into a pole which smashed the window, showering both himself and Mr Veracruz in glass.

Breath tests showed Davis was more than three times the legal drink-drive limit. Judge Nicholas Cartwright said: ‘Mr Veracruz, thankfully, was not more seriously injured having put himself at considerable risk to apprehend a dangerous driver.’

At Worcester crown court, Davis admitted dangerous driving and drink driving. He was handed a suspended eight month jail term, banned for 28 months and has to pay £500 to Mr Veracruz, plus £1,240 in costs.

https://www.metro.news/cyclist-clung...-chef/2250002/

On 09/12/2020 17:39, wrote:
From another source:
QUOTE:
A HEROIC cyclist was dragged along the road as he desperately tried to stop a drink driver going the wrong way down a dual carriageway.

Fabio Veracruz was so concerned when he saw Martin Davis’s erratic driving that he followed the car on his bike, a court heard.

While the vehicle was still moving, Mr Veracruz yanked the driver’s door open and tried to grab the handbrake while yelling ‘stop!’

But sozzled chef Davis (pictured), 41 — who had spent the night drinking with friends on September 25 — ignored his pleas and accelerated, pulling the cyclist along the road in Worcester.

Mr Veracruz managed to stand on the open door while clinging to the roof. Davis then ploughed into a pole which smashed the window, showering both himself and Mr Veracruz in glass.

Breath tests showed Davis was more than three times the legal drink-drive limit. Judge Nicholas Cartwright said: ‘Mr Veracruz, thankfully, was not more seriously injured having put himself at considerable risk to apprehend a dangerous driver.’

At Worcester crown court, Davis admitted dangerous driving and drink driving. He was handed a suspended eight month jail term, banned for 28 months and has to pay £500 to Mr Veracruz, plus £1,240 in costs.

https://www.metro.news/cyclist-clung...-chef/2250002/

QUOTE:

....driver going the wrong way down a dual carriageway...

....he followed the car on his bike...

While the vehicle was still moving, Mr Veracruz yanked the driver’s door
open and tried to grab the handbrake...
ENDQUOTE

That is highlighted for the benefit of any deluded person who "thinks"
that the cyclist was either going the correct way on the correct
carriageway (in which case the above would have to be a total
fabrication) or didn't try to engage with the car while it was moving
(which is clearly stated above).

Thanks to Mason for providing it (again).

On 09/12/2020 17:26, JNugent wrote:
On 09/12/2020 16:13, TMS320 wrote:
On 09/12/2020 15:37, JNugent wrote:
On 09/12/2020 09:35, TMS320 wrote:
On 09/12/2020 02:21, JNugent wrote:
On 08/12/2020 19:31, colwyn wrote:
On 08/12/2020 17:50, JNugent wrote:
On 08/12/2020 14:19, wrote:

The 42 year old, who admitted dangerous driving and drink
driving, had no recollection of the crash, which happened after
Mr Veracruz had spotted him driving the wrong way down the dual
carriageway road amd (SIC) decided to follow him on his bike.

So he too was then going in the wrong direction on a
dual-carriageway?

Where did you read that? you can follow someone on the correct side
of a dual-carriageway

That in itself is possible.
But it is not possible to try to stop the vehicle, open a door of the
vehicle and attempt to remove the ignition key whilst on the
opposite carriageway, anything up to forty feet away.
Your turn... try to wriggle out of that.

and where do you suggest is it stated, that he was on his bike when
he tried to open the door and apply the hand brake?

The fact that the vehicle was *moving*?

You have this idea that the cyclist was riding alongside a moving
car and managed to open a door and lean in... Therein lies a very
significant practical problem even you should be able work out with
a bit of thought.

He was doing it from forty feet away on the opposite carriageway,
with his arms stretched across the centre reservation?
Someone else has already pointed that out.

The other poster called JNugent had not pointed that out.

You really are beyond salvation, aren't you?

Is it the first or second JNugent writing this?

You know full well that another poster ("colwyn") had claimed that the
cyclist had been following the car, which was apparently going the wrong
way on a carriageway, by cycling (thus, according to "colwyn", in the
correct direction) on the opposite carriageway.

Yes. Perfectly logical.

He admittedly didn't go as far as attempting an explanation of the up
close stuff from forty feet away and with a centre reservation between
them, but it at least allowed colwyn to rest safe in the "knowledge"
that the cyclist wasn't cycling in the wrong direction on a one-way
carriageway.

Clearly there was no need to. There must be something you missed.

The other JNugent was totally confused between the first act of
following the car and the second act of trying to stop the driver at
an opportunity when the car was momentarily motionless.

Stopping a car while it's motionless?

There is nothing in the article about stopping the car while it was in
motion.

How does that work?

A cyclist opening a car door and reaching for the handbrake while it is
motion? Well, I am sure no one here ever imagined you had trick cycling
skills. Please explain the steps to an ordinary cyclist.

The other JNugent clearly had the idea that the cyclist must have
crossed to ride on the wrong carriageway for some distance, while
attempting to stop the car while it was moving.

Either he did or he didn't. You and A N Other seem to have different
views on that.

But your namesake will never admit to this. I am surprised you haven't
pointed the error out to him.

rolls eyes

On the other hand, knowing you have no grasp of practical matters,
try reading the sentence following the one containing the word
'stop'. It contains another fact.

Where was that, in the huge bit you have (for some reason) decided to
snip?

You are quite capable of looking back to the original post. (Or are
you..? It seems not.)

Have you finished?
Then you haven't gone back to read it. It would save a lot of time if
you did so rather than carried on arguing.

On 09/12/2020 17:26, JNugent wrote:
On 09/12/2020 16:13, TMS320 wrote:
On 09/12/2020 15:37, JNugent wrote:
On 09/12/2020 09:35, TMS320 wrote:
On 09/12/2020 02:21, JNugent wrote:
On 08/12/2020 19:31, colwyn wrote:
On 08/12/2020 17:50, JNugent wrote:
On 08/12/2020 14:19, wrote:

The 42 year old, who admitted dangerous driving and drink
driving, had no recollection of the crash, which happened after
Mr Veracruz had spotted him driving the wrong way down the dual
carriageway road amd (SIC) decided to follow him on his bike.

So he too was then going in the wrong direction on a
dual-carriageway?

Where did you read that? you can follow someone on the correct side
of a dual-carriageway

That in itself is possible.
But it is not possible to try to stop the vehicle, open a door of the
vehicle and attempt to remove the ignition key whilst on the
opposite carriageway, anything up to forty feet away.
Your turn... try to wriggle out of that.

and where do you suggest is it stated, that he was on his bike when
he tried to open the door and apply the hand brake?

The fact that the vehicle was *moving*?

You have this idea that the cyclist was riding alongside a moving
car and managed to open a door and lean in... Therein lies a very
significant practical problem even you should be able work out with
a bit of thought.

He was doing it from forty feet away on the opposite carriageway,
with his arms stretched across the centre reservation?
Someone else has already pointed that out.

The other poster called JNugent had not pointed that out.

You really are beyond salvation, aren't you?

You know full well that another poster ("colwyn") had claimed that the
cyclist had been following the car, which was apparently going the wrong
way on a carriageway, by cycling (thus, according to "colwyn", in the
correct direction) on the opposite carriageway.

He admittedly didn't go as far as attempting an explanation of the up
close stuff from forty feet away and with a centre reservation between
them, but it at least allowed colwyn to rest safe in the "knowledge"
that the cyclist wasn't cycling in the wrong direction on a one-way
carriageway.

The other JNugent was totally confused between the first act of
following the car and the second act of trying to stop the driver at
an opportunity when the car was momentarily motionless.

Stopping a car while it's motionless?

How does that work?

The other JNugent clearly had the idea that the cyclist must have
crossed to ride on the wrong carriageway for some distance, while
attempting to stop the car while it was moving.

Either he did or he didn't. You and A N Other seem to have different
views on that.

But your namesake will never admit to this. I am surprised you haven't
pointed the error out to him.

rolls eyes
Â*
On the other hand, knowing you have no grasp of practical matters,
try reading the sentence following the one containing the word
'stop'. It contains another fact.

Where was that, in the huge bit you have (for some reason) decided to
snip?

You are quite capable of looking back to the original post. (Or are
you..? It seems not.)

Have you finished?

[Fat chance.]


Alert Cyclist observes person unsteady on his feet
Notices driver opening car door with bottle in hand **
Cyclist notices car turning wrong way on dual-carriageway
Cyclist decides to prevent accident and follows unsteady driver *
cyclist catches up with driver who temporarily slowed to a crawl
cyclist drops his bike and sprints to car and yanks at door to take keys
driver prevents cyclist from immobilising car by accelerating
Cyclist still holding on to roof of car but suffers injuries when driver
looses control
and crashes into lamp post.

Well, that is the story as far as I understand – simpels,
but I suspect truculence will have another version

* either on the correct side of road or heaven forbid cycling on the
footpath
** I expect you know better!

I am off to spoon-feed drugs to the dog now!

On Wednesday, December 9, 2020 at 7:56:04 PM UTC, colwyn wrote:

Alert Cyclist observes person unsteady on his feet
Notices driver opening car door with bottle in hand **
Cyclist notices car turning wrong way on dual-carriageway
Cyclist decides to prevent accident and follows unsteady driver *
cyclist catches up with driver who temporarily slowed to a crawl
cyclist drops his bike and sprints to car and yanks at door to take keys
driver prevents cyclist from immobilising car by accelerating
Cyclist still holding on to roof of car but suffers injuries when driver
looses control
and crashes into lamp post.

That's more or less the gist of it.
Hero cyclist also gets £500 compo from the criminal driver in court after being praised by the judge.

On 09/12/2020 20:28, wrote:
On Wednesday, December 9, 2020 at 7:56:04 PM UTC, colwyn wrote:

Alert Cyclist observes person unsteady on his feet Notices driver
opening car door with bottle in hand ** Cyclist notices car turning
wrong way on dual-carriageway Cyclist decides to prevent accident
and follows unsteady driver * cyclist catches up with driver who
temporarily slowed to a crawl cyclist drops his bike and sprints to
car and yanks at door to take keys driver prevents cyclist from
immobilising car by accelerating Cyclist still holding on to roof
of car but suffers injuries when driver looses control and crashes
into lamp post.

That's more or less the gist of it. Hero cyclist also gets £500 compo
from the criminal driver in court after being praised by the judge.

When one reads such articles it requires an application of "what is a
practical possibility" test to the stories until something fits.

The first article says that that the cyclist "shouted at the driver to
try and make Davis stop, and then opened the door and attempted to apply
the handbrake." Then "Davis made “no response� and drove off at a
speed..." Then "The judge told Davis that after the cyclist had tried to
engage the handbrake, “What you did was to put the car in gear and drive
off...""

It doesn't say the cyclist tried t make the car stop. It says he tried
to make Davis stop. I don't read that the cyclist tried to get into a
moving car. It doesn't pass the test.

The second article just sexed it up.