Browsing archives - to ashtabula or to 3 piece

It seems that there are lots of opinions about the ashtabula style crank
versus the 3 piece deals. I have an ashtabula in my daily ride now, and I
have a 3 piece that I am thinking about installing. Besides weight, and the
availability of replacement chain rings, bearings and other such parts what
are other disadvantages of the old style cranks? This bike will NEVER be
raced, I use it mostly for transportation. Maybe 200 miles a week. With
proper maintained what would the lifespan of the chain rings bearings and
cup / cones be? I know chains wear out pretty often. And replacing a chain
is not that big of a deal as far as maintance goes.But if the chain rings
will be gone in a few thousand miles it will probably be worth my time and
effort to upgrade to the 3 piece crank.

Ken
--
More of my mind dribblings: http://mind-dribble.blogspot.com/
And my homepage: http://kcm-home.tripod.com/

Ken Marcet wrote:

It seems that there are lots of opinions about the ashtabula style crank
versus the 3 piece deals. I have an ashtabula in my daily ride now, and I
have a 3 piece that I am thinking about installing. Besides weight, and the
availability of replacement chain rings, bearings and other such parts

There is NO problem getting "chain rings, bearings and other such parts"
for Ashtabuloid cranks. http://harriscyclery.com/opc

what
are other disadvantages of the old style cranks?

They are heavier. To me, though, the biggest disadvantage is the skimpy
selection of pedals in the 1/2" threading they use.

I was fortunate to find a pair of SPD pedals for my Mead Ranger, but I
don't know where to get any more of them, alas.

http://sheldonbrown.org/ranger.html

In their favor, these cranks are VERY durable, and are much easier to
service than any other type of crank. They require no specialized tools.

This bike will NEVER be
raced, I use it mostly for transportation. Maybe 200 miles a week. With
proper maintained what would the lifespan of the chain rings bearings and
cup / cones be?

Probably longer than yours or mine! Steel chainrings basically never
wear out. They're also dirt cheap, easily available.

The bearing parts are cheap and very readily available, at least in the U.S.

Sheldon "OPC" Brown
+----------------------------------------------+
| If it was God's purpose to create Humanity |
| in his own image, we must conclude that he |
| is omniscient, omnipotent and incompetent. |
+----------------------------------------------+
Harris Cyclery, West Newton, Massachusetts
Phone 617-244-9772 FAX 617-244-1041
http://harriscyclery.com
Hard-to-find parts shipped Worldwide
http://captainbike.com http://sheldonbrown.com

"Sheldon Brown" wrote in message
...
Ken Marcet wrote:

It seems that there are lots of opinions about the ashtabula style crank
versus the 3 piece deals. I have an ashtabula in my daily ride now, and
I
have a 3 piece that I am thinking about installing. Besides weight, and
the
availability of replacement chain rings, bearings and other such parts

There is NO problem getting "chain rings, bearings and other such parts"
for Ashtabuloid cranks. http://harriscyclery.com/opc

what
are other disadvantages of the old style cranks?

They are heavier. To me, though, the biggest disadvantage is the skimpy
selection of pedals in the 1/2" threading they use.

Well I have been using a low quality set of department store pedal, I think
they are union brand, but if I thought I needed to upgrade these perhaps the
adapters here http://sheldonbrown.com/harris/pedals.html would be a good way
to upgrade them.

I was fortunate to find a pair of SPD pedals for my Mead Ranger, but I
don't know where to get any more of them, alas.

http://sheldonbrown.org/ranger.html

In their favor, these cranks are VERY durable, and are much easier to
service than any other type of crank. They require no specialized tools.

To me this is a very big plus, you can service them on the side of the road!


This bike will NEVER be
raced, I use it mostly for transportation. Maybe 200 miles a week. With
proper maintained what would the lifespan of the chain rings bearings
and
cup / cones be?

Probably longer than yours or mine! Steel chainrings basically never
wear out. They're also dirt cheap, easily available.

Oh I thought that they wore out similar to chains.


The bearing parts are cheap and very readily available, at least in the
U.S.

Well I really can't see myself taking this bike outside of the U.S.

Sheldon "OPC" Brown
+----------------------------------------------+
| If it was God's purpose to create Humanity |
| in his own image, we must conclude that he |
| is omniscient, omnipotent and incompetent. |
+----------------------------------------------+
Harris Cyclery, West Newton, Massachusetts
Phone 617-244-9772 FAX 617-244-1041
http://harriscyclery.com
Hard-to-find parts shipped Worldwide
http://captainbike.com http://sheldonbrown.com

On Fri, 25 Mar 2005 10:31:31 -0500 "Ken Marcet"
wrote:

It seems that there are lots of opinions about the ashtabula style crank
versus the 3 piece deals. I have an ashtabula in my daily ride now, and I
have a 3 piece that I am thinking about installing.

I agree with everything that Sheldon said, but are you sure that the
3-piece crank that you have in mind will work in this frame? They
generally take completely different hardware and aren't
interchangable.

There are (or were...) cotterless adapters for one piece bottom
brackets. I thought they were rare, so it seems unlikely that you have
one.

-
-----------------------------------------------
Jim Adney
Madison, WI 53711 USA
-----------------------------------------------

Unless you're trying to save some weight or want to go clipless (both
may be serious considerations), there's no real advantage to making the
conversion to three piece. One piece cranks last forever, particularly
the nicer forged old "real" Ashtabulas (and some older more obscure
types). But even the cheaper ones are pretty durable unless you'll be
doing BMX tricks.

Chainrings from about 36t to 48t are widely available, from cheap,
durable Wald and Pyramid steel, to expensive (and fancy) BMX alloy
types. You could probably even get a spider with two sets of holes to
use either 110 or 130 BCD chainrings. I've seen duals and triples, in
typical ranges, generally riveted together. If you really want one of
these type of chainring, you can often find them in the dumpster on
trash day, usually with a whole bike attached.

Bottom Brackets for one piece cranks are generally plain, but perfectly
functional. Replacements are generally cheap, less than $20 for the
nicest sets.

Three piece bottom brackets for one piece BB shells are around.
Biketools sells three different versions (three widths) relatively
inexpensively:
http://tinyurl.com/5dt9v
I've seen similar cartridge bearings that were marketed to the BMX
crowd. But they're significantly more expensive and harder to find.

On Fri, 25 Mar 2005 10:31:31 -0500, "Ken Marcet"
may have said:

It seems that there are lots of opinions about the ashtabula style crank
versus the 3 piece deals. I have an ashtabula in my daily ride now, and I
have a 3 piece that I am thinking about installing. Besides weight, and the
availability of replacement chain rings, bearings and other such parts what
are other disadvantages of the old style cranks?

From experience: In heavy use, they tend to break at the end, from
the pedal bore to the side or tip, particularly if a lot of riding is
done off the saddle. It's not so common that you should summarily
discontinue ever riding such a bike, buit it's a consideration,
particularly if you're not exactly a lightweight.

With
proper maintained what would the lifespan of the chain rings bearings and
cup / cones be? I know chains wear out pretty often. And replacing a chain
is not that big of a deal as far as maintance goes.But if the chain rings
will be gone in a few thousand miles it will probably be worth my time and
effort to upgrade to the 3 piece crank.

Not knowing how much wear is present on the sprockets, it's very
difficult to predict the amount of life likely to be remaining in
them. Most such units never get ridden far enough to put any serious
wear on them; corrosion often removes more material than friction on
such bikes. The sprockets are likely to be good for 3 to 5 chains'
worth of usage starting from new. As a rough guess, possibly as much
as 25000 miles if ridden often, not ridden in sandy or dusty areas,
and maintained well. On the other hand, the sprocket service life
could be as little as 3000 miles if maintained poorly and ridden in
snady, dusty environs most of the time; even less if grossly
neglected. Once again, that's starting from new. If youi're assuming
a start from used, it's hard to predict unless you can measure the
accumulated wear.

My advice: Ride the current setup until the sprockets or crank
require replacement, and then choose the repair path that gives the
best combination of economy and satisfaction.

--
My email address is antispammed; pull WEEDS if replying via e-mail.
Typoes are not a bug, they're a feature.
Words processed in a facility that contains nuts.

wrote in message
ups.com...
Unless you're trying to save some weight or want to go clipless (both
may be serious considerations), there's no real advantage to making the
conversion to three piece. One piece cranks last forever, particularly
the nicer forged old "real" Ashtabulas (and some older more obscure
types). But even the cheaper ones are pretty durable unless you'll be
doing BMX tricks.


This bike is used for transportation mostly and the inexpensive platform
"union" pedals are fine for me.

Chainrings from about 36t to 48t are widely available, from cheap,
durable Wald and Pyramid steel, to expensive (and fancy) BMX alloy
types. You could probably even get a spider with two sets of holes to
use either 110 or 130 BCD chainrings. I've seen duals and triples, in
typical ranges, generally riveted together. If you really want one of
these type of chainring, you can often find them in the dumpster on
trash day, usually with a whole bike attached.


Yeah I saw two of them like that yesterday, and yeah they had the whole bike
attached to them.

Bottom Brackets for one piece cranks are generally plain, but perfectly
functional. Replacements are generally cheap, less than $20 for the
nicest sets.

"Jim Adney" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 25 Mar 2005 10:31:31 -0500 "Ken Marcet"
wrote:

It seems that there are lots of opinions about the ashtabula style crank
versus the 3 piece deals. I have an ashtabula in my daily ride now, and I
have a 3 piece that I am thinking about installing.

I agree with everything that Sheldon said, but are you sure that the
3-piece crank that you have in mind will work in this frame? They
generally take completely different hardware and aren't
interchangable.

Well I found several conversion kits that will work to install the 3 piece
in this frame.


There are (or were...) cotterless adapters for one piece bottom
brackets. I thought they were rare, so it seems unlikely that you have
one.

-
-----------------------------------------------
Jim Adney
Madison, WI 53711 USA
-----------------------------------------------

"Werehatrack" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 25 Mar 2005 10:31:31 -0500, "Ken Marcet"
may have said:

It seems that there are lots of opinions about the ashtabula style crank
versus the 3 piece deals. I have an ashtabula in my daily ride now, and I
have a 3 piece that I am thinking about installing. Besides weight, and
the
availability of replacement chain rings, bearings and other such parts
what
are other disadvantages of the old style cranks?

From experience: In heavy use, they tend to break at the end, from
the pedal bore to the side or tip, particularly if a lot of riding is
done off the saddle. It's not so common that you should summarily
discontinue ever riding such a bike, buit it's a consideration,
particularly if you're not exactly a lightweight.

Well I might have a few to lose, but I am no heavyweight! And I try to stay
in the saddle as much as possible.


With
proper maintained what would the lifespan of the chain rings bearings and
cup / cones be? I know chains wear out pretty often. And replacing a
chain
is not that big of a deal as far as maintance goes.But if the chain rings
will be gone in a few thousand miles it will probably be worth my time
and
effort to upgrade to the 3 piece crank.

Not knowing how much wear is present on the sprockets, it's very
difficult to predict the amount of life likely to be remaining in
them. Most such units never get ridden far enough to put any serious
wear on them; corrosion often removes more material than friction on
such bikes. The sprockets are likely to be good for 3 to 5 chains'
worth of usage starting from new. As a rough guess, possibly as much
as 25000 miles if ridden often, not ridden in sandy or dusty areas,
and maintained well. On the other hand, the sprocket service life
could be as little as 3000 miles if maintained poorly and ridden in
snady, dusty environs most of the time; even less if grossly
neglected. Once again, that's starting from new. If youi're assuming
a start from used, it's hard to predict unless you can measure the
accumulated wear.


Well they look really good to me, like you say its hard to tell, but they
don't have the telltale points at the peaks and the "valleys" look normal.

My advice: Ride the current setup until the sprockets or crank
require replacement, and then choose the repair path that gives the
best combination of economy and satisfaction.

--
My email address is antispammed; pull WEEDS if replying via e-mail.
Typoes are not a bug, they're a feature.
Words processed in a facility that contains nuts.