IMBA Advocates Illegal Night Riding!

On Fri, 27 Aug 2004 14:19:01 GMT, bizbee wrote:

..On Fri, 27 Aug 2004 02:34:51 GMT in
, Mike Vandeman
graced the world with this thought:
..
..One thing I noticed is that some parks say day use only, but the parking lots
..remain open so I imagine they are just trying to prevent overnight camping.
..
..Keyword: imagine
.....and, as is typical, you base an entire argument on the imagination
..of one person, who is quite clearly wrong, and then go on to rant
..about it, robbing anyone who reads your rant of a minute of their
..lives they'll never get back.
..Ask yourself this: Has any park service, from city to federal, ever
..put up signs that you know of, in order to "try to prevent" someone
..from doing something, but stating otherwise?
..If they didn't want overnight camping, but night use was OK, the sign
..would read "no overnight campers." Then the enforcing service would
..come in and cite everyone caught camping overnight. The sign says "day
..use only." That's exactly what it means, trust me. As it stands, I
..imagine that if you're caught doing anything there after dark,
..you'll be cited. He's just lucky so far... if he even uses these parks
..at night. And, if he doesn't, why not? He "imagines" it's OK, and the
..signs are meant for someone other than him...
..
..Just how does one go about "closing" a parking lot, anyway? Roll it
..up? Cover it with a tarp? A simple "no use after dark" sign isn't
..enough, it has to be made physically impossible to use? If someone
..leaves their keys in their car, is it OK to just drive it away? The
..light is red, but there's no cars, so it's OK to run it? Surely these
..things are only advisories, right?
..
..In this particular case, I think we're talking about a comment from a
..cyclist who quite obviously doesn't wear a helmet... and you actually
..believe what he says. Notice, he doesn't say that he parks his car in
..the lot and then goes riding... I especially like the part where you
..leave a little tag with a rotating dial on it, stating what time
..you'll be returning, so the "patrolling ranger" (this means a whole
..new shift of rangers can be hired to patrol at night, too, more baby
..sitters making $60K a year to clean idiots off of the countryside) is
..aware of what they're doing. Of course, bike riders would never camp,
..right?
..
..Then there's the comment about mountain biking at night would
..definitely make the park safer at night.... hmmm... so will closing
..it... and... safer for what? Who?
..All you've done is regurgitate a letter from an idiot, and try to
..present it as some kind of proof that this organization backs his
..opinion because they were the recipient.

No, because he wrote it over his official "IMBA Rep" signature, making it an
official act of IMBA.

If this guy is the president
..of the local chapter, my guess is he's the only person in that
..chapter.

===
I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to
humans ("pure habitat"). Want to help? (I spent the previous 8
years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)

http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande

MV blathers:

"One thing I noticed is that some parks say day use only, but the parking
lots
remain open so I imagine they are just trying to prevent overnight camping."

He just admitted ignoring the ban. Learn to read. QED

Ummm..... Care to show me where he says he _used_ the trails at night in that
quote?
Idiot.
And learn to use QED properly.

Steve

On 29 Aug 2004 13:50:13 GMT, ospam (Stephen Baker) wrote:

..MV blathers:
..
.."One thing I noticed is that some parks say day use only, but the parking
..lots
..remain open so I imagine they are just trying to prevent overnight camping."
..
..He just admitted ignoring the ban. Learn to read. QED
..
..Ummm..... Care to show me where he says he _used_ the trails at night in that
..quote?

It's implied. Look it up in the dictionary.

..Idiot.
..And learn to use QED properly.
..
..Steve

===
I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to
humans ("pure habitat"). Want to help? (I spent the previous 8
years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)

http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande

MV blurts:

Hmmm. He was at the park after dark. Otherwise, he wouldn't have noticed that
the parking lot was still open. He implied that he used the park.
===

No, he could as esaily have been driving past the park, and noticed the parking
lot was unlocked. Have you never driven/walked past a store and been able to
tell if it was open or not?

Steve

MV blathers:

It's implied.

You need to work on that reading comprehension thing again, Mikey-boy.

On Sun, 29 Aug 2004 00:24:58 +0000, Mike Vandeman wrote:

On Fri, 27 Aug 2004 15:37:13 -0700, "Jeff Strickland" wrote:

.You're an idiot Vandeman. Day Use DOES NOT mean use during the daytime only,
.it means no over night use. Sheesh!

Hint: Day is not the same as night. DUH!

First off, IANAL, and this is all just my opinion..

However, in this country (UK) the legal meanings of daytime and night-time
seem to have no clear definition. However, most statutory guidance seems
to have adopted something similar to the following definition of
night-time: the period during which the adult population can reasonably be
expected to be asleep, or is preparing for sleep.

Most local authorities seem to interpret the night-time period to be 11pm
until 7am. Therefore "daytime use only" could logically be construed to
mean between 7am and 11pm. In the middle of winter, this would include
about 5-6 hours in the evening during which it is dark.

From the wording of the original post, which is relaxed in style and
language, it seems very likely that the IMBA representative
actually meant riding while it was dark, rather than at night per say.
After all, mountain bikers are people too and many enjoy their sleep.

A rigid interpretation of the word 'night' as meaning when the park is
closed, over the more common use in a relaxed English style where it is
often taken to mean the hours when it is dark, would seem unreasonable.

Therefore it seems to me that the IMBA representative was simply promoting
riding in the EVENING while the park was still open, which would be in
keeping with 'daytime use'. Apart from being the only time that people
with 9-5 jobs can actually get to the parks, this is likely to reduce the
probability of trail use conflicts as there are very few other users
around.

Most of the parks here are open during winter evenings, despite the fact
that is is dark. They usually close the car park gates when they
shut, as a visible sign to dissuade people from entering.

Riding in the dark evenings while the park is open seems like a sensible
suggestion to me, provided they take sensible precautions in case they
sustain a debilitating injury.

DUH!

2trax.

.
.All that is needed is for the rider to return before the ranger comes around
.to lock the gate. I think thej original poster has an excellent idea to ride
.without impacting hikers, all he need to do is get back to the car before
.the rangers come around to lock the gates. A Day Use park is going to be
.open from 0800 to 2100, or some such time - the actual time is not
.important, only the idea that there is an opening time and a closing time is
.important to understand. Visitors are not allowed to remain past closing
.time, that is they can use the park for a day at a time, not several days
.continuously. Of course, you can go back day after day, but you can not
.remain there continuously through an entire 24 hour period.
.
.
.
.


===
I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to
humans ("pure habitat"). Want to help? (I spent the previous 8
years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)

http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande

On Fri, 03 Sep 2004 02:05:41 GMT, Mike Vandeman
wrote:



ALL mountain bikers think mountain biking is harmless. They don't have a clue
about basic biology. Many animals are forced to be nocturnal, due to the
presence of too many people during the day. And now you want to take the
nighttime ALSO? Mountain biking is immoral and criminal.

.DUH!
.
.2trax.
.


Well Mike , here I am Training my Son to be a Criminal !
http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=46260

Took him on his first Night Mt bike ride last night
and we Road in to "the Vietnam" that is land Owned by Mt bikers , for
Mt Bikers .

On Sun, 05 Sep 2004 00:10:17 GMT, JJG wrote:

..On Fri, 03 Sep 2004 02:05:41 GMT, Mike Vandeman
..wrote:
..
..
..
..ALL mountain bikers think mountain biking is harmless. They don't have a clue
..about basic biology. Many animals are forced to be nocturnal, due to the
..presence of too many people during the day. And now you want to take the
..nighttime ALSO? Mountain biking is immoral and criminal.
..
...DUH!
...
...2trax.
...
..
..
..Well Mike , here I am Training my Son to be a Criminal !
..http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=46260
..
..Took him on his first Night Mt bike ride last night
..and we Road in to "the Vietnam" that is land Owned by Mt bikers , for
..Mt Bikers .

It's still criminal.
===
I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to
humans ("pure habitat"). Want to help? (I spent the previous 8
years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)

http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande

On Sun, 05 Sep 2004 15:15:49 GMT, Mike Vandeman
wrote:

On Sun, 05 Sep 2004 00:10:17 GMT, JJG wrote:

.On Fri, 03 Sep 2004 02:05:41 GMT, Mike Vandeman
.wrote:
.
.
.
.ALL mountain bikers think mountain biking is harmless. They don't have a clue
.about basic biology. Many animals are forced to be nocturnal, due to the
.presence of too many people during the day. And now you want to take the
.nighttime ALSO? Mountain biking is immoral and criminal.
.
..DUH!
..
..2trax.
..
.
.
.Well Mike , here I am Training my Son to be a Criminal !
.http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=46260
.
.Took him on his first Night Mt bike ride last night
.and we Road in to "the Vietnam" that is land Owned by Mt bikers , for
.Mt Bikers .

It's still criminal.

LIAR !!

as usual

JJG wrote in message
...
On Sun, 05 Sep 2004 15:15:49 GMT, Mike Vandeman
wrote:

On Sun, 05 Sep 2004 00:10:17 GMT, JJG wrote:

.On Fri, 03 Sep 2004 02:05:41 GMT, Mike Vandeman
.wrote:
.
.
.
.ALL mountain bikers think mountain biking is harmless. They don't have
a clue
.about basic biology. Many animals are forced to be nocturnal, due to
the
.presence of too many people during the day. And now you want to take
the
.nighttime ALSO? Mountain biking is immoral and criminal.
.
..DUH!
..
..2trax.
..
.
.
.Well Mike , here I am Training my Son to be a Criminal !
.http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=46260
.
.Took him on his first Night Mt bike ride last night
.and we Road in to "the Vietnam" that is land Owned by Mt bikers , for
.Mt Bikers .

It's still criminal.

LIAR !!

as usual

CEPHALOPOD !!

i can make unfounded claims too

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