Bicycling Magazine - Time to Vent!

"Jon Bendtsen" wrote in message

Try Randonneuring?

"Randonneuring is long-distance unsupported endurance cycling. This
style of riding is non-competitive in nature, and self-sufficiency
is paramount. When riders participate in randonneuring events, they
are part of a long tradition that goes back to the beginning of the
sport of cycling in France and Italy. Friendly camaraderie, not
competition, is the hallmark of randonneuring."

You do talk miles, so you might be from USA
http://www.rusa.org/

I like the concept. The whole "sag wagon" deal is just wrong. You wouldn't
go hiking with an SUV following you.

"Jeff Grippe" wrote in message
m...

"Edward Dolan" wrote in message
news:e9udnf9XQfejV37UnZ2dnUVZ_tudnZ2d@prairiewave. com...

All you ever see in the bike shops anymore are mountain bikes (hybrids)
and some few road bikes. As Jeff says, touring has indeed gone out of
fashion if it was ever in fashion. The truth is that bike touring is hard
work and the enjoyment to be derived from it is strictly for connoisseurs


I don't have a problem with mountain bikes or hybrids. Before I discovered
recumbents, I rode mountain bikes and they were a big step up from road
bikes and drops

Mountain bikes are for off-road. Hybrids are fine for roads and streets, but
still not ideal for touring. Nothing beats a properly set up touring bike
for touring. A touring bike needs to be comfortable, but also fairly fast
too. The vast majority of cyclists should be getting hybrids for the kind of
riding they do. Recumbents would be even better of course, but the ignorance
of the common folk is insurmountable.

By the way, 75 miles is plenty to do in 1 day. 100 mile days are for
jerks.

I've only done one century and feel no need to ever do another. I don't
know if I'd go as far as say that its for jerks. It is however, for much
younger people then me. As I said, I'm in no hurry. Back in 2005, 40-50
mile days were quite adequate. If I were planning a long multi-day ride I
would plan 40-50 mile days and I wouldn't plan to ride every day.

Yes, I agree ... 50 to 60 mile days can be just right as it leaves plenty of
time for poking about and doing things on your own.

Regards,

Ed Dolan the Great - Minnesota
aka
Saint Edward the Great - Order of the Perpetual Sorrows - Minnesota

"Peter Clinch" wrote in message
...
Jeff Grippe wrote:
Touring is out of fashion.

Not obviously more so than it was...

Solo touring where you carry all of your own gear and camp is the rarest
form of bicycle touring. Very few ever attempt it.

I remember years ago there was a bike touring magazine. They couldn't
stay
in business

But to what degree is magazine subscription an indication of the
vitality of a pastime? To some extent, but not any further... I don't
think any serious bike tourist is actually that short of ideas on where
to go and the bike and bags work the same as they did last year, so what
do you actually put in it? I think there may be a significant
proportion of cycle tourists who'd rather just get on their bikes and do
it rather than read about someone else doing that. There's no calendar
of events to follow, touring bike technology isn't evolving at anything
like the rate of MTBs and even where you /do/ have those advantages
magazines tend to get a bit samey after a few issues.

It is fun to read about the misadventures of others doing a bicycle tour.
Some of it is quite hilarious.

The current fashion, probably largely due to Tour du France and other
racing
events is shorter and faster (although oddly enough, judging by its
length,
the Tour du France really would be considered touring).

Do they stop for cakes when there are patisseries? No. Then it isn't
proper cycle touring! ;-)

Riders these days are in A or B or whatever groups while someone like me
(if
I were still riding) would be in W, X, Y, or Z. I'd do my 80-100 mile
days
but it would take me all day and I was never in a hurry. But that is not
the
current fashion. Pity

I don't see any shortage of folk doing big, slow days and it's easier to
buy a good touring bike now than it was a few years ago IMHO.

Touring bikes are quite rare in the bike shops in the US, but perhaps making
a bit of a comeback.

I have done many group bike tours and they always break down to most
everyone going as fast as they can and a few slow pokes bringing up the
rear. Before a tour is over, I am on a first name basis with all the sag
drivers.

All the fun of doing a group bike tour is getting acquainted with your
fellow riders. This is best accomplished if you are going slow and have all
the time in the world to chat. It is important that you keep the chat
confined to the day's activities and be pleasant. This is easy enough to do
when you are having fun on a bike tour. Anyone who does a group bike tour
and wants to turn it into a race is simply crazy!

Regards,

Ed Dolan the Great - Minnesota
aka
Saint Edward the Great - Order of the Perpetual Sorrows - Minnesota

"Jon Bendtsen" wrote in message
...
Jeff Grippe wrote:
Touring is out of fashion.

I remember years ago there was a bike touring magazine. They couldn't
stay
in business and when they went out, my subscription was converted to
Bicycling. I was not pleased as I had no interest in the kind of things
that
Bicycling covered. I used to read the touring magazine from cover to
cover,
however.

The current fashion, probably largely due to Tour du France and other
racing
events is shorter and faster (although oddly enough, judging by its
length,
the Tour du France really would be considered touring).

Riders these days are in A or B or whatever groups while someone like me
(if
I were still riding) would be in W, X, Y, or Z. I'd do my 80-100 mile
days
but it would take me all day and I was never in a hurry. But that is not
the
current fashion. Pity

Try Randonneuring?

"Randonneuring is long-distance unsupported endurance cycling. This
style of riding is non-competitive in nature, and self-sufficiency
is paramount. When riders participate in randonneuring events, they
are part of a long tradition that goes back to the beginning of the
sport of cycling in France and Italy. Friendly camaraderie, not
competition, is the hallmark of randonneuring."

You do talk miles, so you might be from USA
http://www.rusa.org/

All group rides in the US are supported one way or another. What you are
talking about is proper bike touring which is extremely rare in the US. Such
rides are rare because they are hard to do. If you carry your own camping
gear, they are especially hard to do. The other solution is to carry a heavy
wallet and stay in motels and eat in restaurants. That becomes quite
expensive - and it is still hard to do.

We Americans like supported group bike tours because it takes most of the
hard work out of it. After all, cycling should be fun, not an endurance
ordeal. Check out Ragbrai to get an idea of what Americans like to do.
http://www.ragbrai.org/

Regards,

Ed Dolan the Great - Minnesota
aka
Saint Edward the Great - Order of the Perpetual Sorrows - Minnesota

"ATP*" wrote in message
...

"Jon Bendtsen" wrote in message

Try Randonneuring?

"Randonneuring is long-distance unsupported endurance cycling. This
style of riding is non-competitive in nature, and self-sufficiency
is paramount. When riders participate in randonneuring events, they
are part of a long tradition that goes back to the beginning of the
sport of cycling in France and Italy. Friendly camaraderie, not
competition, is the hallmark of randonneuring."

You do talk miles, so you might be from USA
http://www.rusa.org/

I like the concept. The whole "sag wagon" deal is just wrong. You wouldn't
go hiking with an SUV following you.

I once tried to combine cycling and hiking on a tour I was doing in the
American West. My God, it just did not work at all! These two activities are
the opposite of one another and if you try to combine them, all they do is
clash.

Hiking is for going slow and contemplating nature. Cycling is for going
somewhat fast and staying focused on traffic and other road hazards.
Sometimes I think the only enjoyable part of cycle touring is when you are
stopped and spending some time viewing your surroundings.

Doing a supported bike tour is the only way to go if you truly enjoy
cycling. The sags are in the rear and unobtrusive and you only use them if
you need them. A hundred and one things can go wrong on a bike tour, and
having some backup is an excellent idea. Concepts be damned ... it is all
about reality!

Regards,

Ed Dolan the Great - Minnesota
aka
Saint Edward the Great - Order of the Perpetual Sorrows - Minnesota

"Edward Dolan" wrote in message
news

"ATP*" wrote in message
...

"Jon Bendtsen" wrote in message

Try Randonneuring?

"Randonneuring is long-distance unsupported endurance cycling. This
style of riding is non-competitive in nature, and self-sufficiency
is paramount. When riders participate in randonneuring events, they
are part of a long tradition that goes back to the beginning of the
sport of cycling in France and Italy. Friendly camaraderie, not
competition, is the hallmark of randonneuring."

You do talk miles, so you might be from USA
http://www.rusa.org/

I like the concept. The whole "sag wagon" deal is just wrong. You
wouldn't go hiking with an SUV following you.

I once tried to combine cycling and hiking on a tour I was doing in the
American West. My God, it just did not work at all! These two activities
are the opposite of one another and if you try to combine them, all they
do is clash.

Hiking is for going slow and contemplating nature. Cycling is for going
somewhat fast and staying focused on traffic and other road hazards.
Sometimes I think the only enjoyable part of cycle touring is when you are
stopped and spending some time viewing your surroundings.

Doing a supported bike tour is the only way to go if you truly enjoy
cycling. The sags are in the rear and unobtrusive and you only use them if
you need them. A hundred and one things can go wrong on a bike tour, and
having some backup is an excellent idea. Concepts be damned ... it is all
about reality!

Regards,

Ed Dolan the Great - Minnesota
aka
Saint Edward the Great - Order of the Perpetual Sorrows - Minnesota

I like the idea of riding alone and relying on no one, or at least the
illusion of doing so.

"ATP*" wrote in message
...

"Edward Dolan" wrote in message
news

"ATP*" wrote in message
...

"Jon Bendtsen" wrote in message

Try Randonneuring?

"Randonneuring is long-distance unsupported endurance cycling. This
style of riding is non-competitive in nature, and self-sufficiency
is paramount. When riders participate in randonneuring events, they
are part of a long tradition that goes back to the beginning of the
sport of cycling in France and Italy. Friendly camaraderie, not
competition, is the hallmark of randonneuring."

You do talk miles, so you might be from USA
http://www.rusa.org/

I like the concept. The whole "sag wagon" deal is just wrong. You
wouldn't go hiking with an SUV following you.

I once tried to combine cycling and hiking on a tour I was doing in the
American West. My God, it just did not work at all! These two activities
are the opposite of one another and if you try to combine them, all they
do is clash.

Hiking is for going slow and contemplating nature. Cycling is for going
somewhat fast and staying focused on traffic and other road hazards.
Sometimes I think the only enjoyable part of cycle touring is when you
are stopped and spending some time viewing your surroundings.

Doing a supported bike tour is the only way to go if you truly enjoy
cycling. The sags are in the rear and unobtrusive and you only use them
if you need them. A hundred and one things can go wrong on a bike tour,
and having some backup is an excellent idea. Concepts be damned ... it is
all about reality!

I like the idea of riding alone and relying on no one, or at least the
illusion of doing so.

I liked the idea of it too until I actually did it. No matter how well you
plan it, things start to go wrong almost from the beginning. The weather
alone can be a major hassle.

You can ride alone on a supported group tour if you want. No one will bother
you. It is damn nice to not have to look for a campsite and have to cook at
the end of a long day. It is especially nice not to have to carry 40 to 60
pounds of camping gear, extra clothing, food, etc. I can't think of a single
disadvantage of a supported group tour except that you have to touch base at
the end of every day. Being independent is vastly overrated in any event.

Most of us do our cycling alone 95% of the time. It is quite nice to get
together with other cyclists and do a week long ride together. These rides
are mostly not expensive and you will be roughing it more than you think.
Yet you are safe on these type of rides. Women especially like them because
of the safety factor. Women should never be cycling alone on a tour. Way too
dangerous!

Regards,

Ed Dolan the Great - Minnesota
aka
Saint Edward the Great - Order of the Perpetual Sorrows - Minnesota

Edward Dolan wrote:
[...] Women should never be cycling alone on a tour. Way too
dangerous!

Stories of a woman riding her tadpole solo to Alaska and Mexico:
http://www.crazyguyonabike.com/directory/?o=3Tzut&user=Heidiho&v=XA.

--
Tom Sherman - 42.435731,-83.985007
LOCAL CACTUS EATS CYCLIST - datakoll

Erness Wild wrote:
stratrider wrote:
The neighbor gave me a copy of Bicycling Magazine's 2009 Buyers Guide
Issue. Perhaps some have seen it. They kicked the tires on hundreds
of bikes; kids, mountain, road, hybrid, trekking, commuting,
touring... EVERYTHING except recumbents. I am not much for conspiracy
theories, but the obvious omission of recumbents looks like a very
intentional conspiracy of silence. They found space on this issue to
"differentiate" all of these diamond framed bikes but not a single
mention of the word recumbent. Talk about slicing the cheese with a
sledge hammer! Give me a break! I am heading to Rodale Press (about
a 3 hour bike ride) to knock some sense into a block head editor!
Who's with me?

Jim Reilly (Stratrider)

It's worse than that in my area, I've been to several bicycle shops and
none of them want to know about recumbents. There must be a reason, they
can't use price as a reason because most good diamond frame bicycles are
way up the scale in price now a days.

Google search this group for "Dick Ryan". As he points out, most bike
shop employees have a strong aversion to recumbents.

--
Tom Sherman - 42.435731,-83.985007
LOCAL CACTUS EATS CYCLIST - datakoll

"Tom Sherman" wrote in message
...
Edward Dolan wrote:
[...] Women should never be cycling alone on a tour. Way too
dangerous!

Stories of a woman riding her tadpole solo to Alaska and Mexico:
http://www.crazyguyonabike.com/directory/?o=3Tzut&user=Heidiho&v=XA.

Anyone who would keep a day by day account of a bicycle tour is as crazy as
a Minnesota loon. It is best to stay as far away from such types as
possible - and never read their rambling nonsense or you might end up as
crazy as they are. A once over lightly is all anyone ever has to read about
a bicycle tour.

Regards,

Ed Dolan the Great - Minnesota
aka
Saint Edward the Great - Order of the Perpetual Sorrows - Minnesota