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#381
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Should Cyclists Pack Guns?
Mike Young wrote:
"Wayne Pein" wrote in message For criminals, it's to impose personal will by threat or actual use of deadly force. For law abiding citizens, its for self defense from criminals. For you, it's to stuff in your mouth and remove yourself from the gene pool. Funny. Your earlier messages prompted me to ponder on how society coddles the weak, and interferes with Darwinian natural selection. Have a nice ride today. Be careful out there; the impatient poke behind you could be me. BTW, self defense *is* imposition of personal will. Seems to me that those who have to rely on an engine are the weak. Bicyclists are the strong. But, I'll be careful. BTW, if you are the impatient poke behind me you should think twice about being an idiot. I might be packing a gun and would hate to be forced to impose my personal will. Wayne |
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#382
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Should Cyclists Pack Guns?
"evelyn" wrote in message oups.com... On May 2, 4:55 pm, wrote: On May 2, 2:12 pm, evelyn wrote: I've taken self defense classes, karate classes and finally a class to be certified to carry a fire arm. I'm not living in the fairy tale world where nothing bad ever happens. Even in rural, country communities, crime can occur. Of course it _can_. We hear that sort of thinking all the time - the fact that no, disaster is NOT literally impossible. It's that kind of thinking that gets people driving 1000 miles because they're afraid of flying, or never riding bikes because they're afraid of getting hit by a car. Problem is, such thinking often puts people into worse conditions than the one they fear. Don't fly, get in a car crash instead (much more likely). Don't bike, die of heart disease while sitting safe on your couch. Just like crime, getting hit by a meteorite can occur. Having a tree topple on you as you ride by can occur. So can having an earthquake crack the road open and swallow you. But when the odds of a particular danger get low enough, it's just not worth worrying about. What do you suggest women do? The first thing I'd suggest is simply not being afraid! It's not that bad out there! IMO, taking a self-defence class is fine. I believe the few bad guys that are out there are influenced by a person's confidence, or lack of same. Staying out of really sketchy neighborhoods makes sense to me too (although I routinely ride through some that scare more timid folk). But I'm struck by the fact that I've never, ever, in 30+ years of cycling, met a man or woman who felt the need to have a pistol ready at their side. Somehow all those people are surviving. Maybe you should observe what most cyclists do, and imitate that? Why do I? Again, this is America and if I want to carry a weapon for protection, I have that right. I don't have to be like others, I'm my own person. I am fully capable of handling my weapon and I am perfectly within the law to carry it. In Virginia, I can carry a concealed weapon. Therefore, I will continue to carry it, no matter what other people may say. - Frank Krygowski I would add that it may make you feel over confident. Police can tell you. A person coming through your door with a knife while you are sitting 12 feet away watching TV with a gun beside you will be able to kill you before you can fire even once. That is why they killed so many people with knives only I believe. With no element of surprise it is alot harder I would say. But like riding with a helmut you probably take chances you would not because you feel safer when you are not. |
#383
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Should Cyclists Pack Guns?
Statements like "it only takes one time" indicate you're not
being realistic. that I would find realistic. Just like whenever I am on the road |
#384
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Should Cyclists Pack Guns?
"Wayne Pein" wrote in message ... Stephen! wrote: Wayne Pein wrote in news:4638b259$0$9929 : Hey Boy, "Sharing" by your and other's definition seems to mean, "Bicyclists stay right in the lane so motorists can pass." CVC 21202. Any person operating a bicycle upon a roadway at a speed less than the normal speed of traffic moving in the same direction at that time *shall* ride as close as practicable to the right-hand curb or edge of the roadway NC§20-146(b) “Upon all highways any vehicle proceeding at less than the legal maximum speed limit shall be driven in the right-hand lane then available for thru traffic, or as close as practicable to the right-hand curb or edge of the highway...” In NC bicyclists use the right lane, or if the lanes are not marked then, like other vehicles, as far to the right as practicable. Your state attempts to be discriminatory to bicyclists. However, practicable means that the bicyclist chooses what that distance is. And, the "normal" speed of traffic is subject to interpretation. If bicyclists are traffic, which they are, then "normal" is bicyclist speed. Further, your statute doesn't explicity say motorists can pass in the same lane. It merely implies it. I doubt that statute would hold up in court. Wayne Yeah, I do not see any cyclists shaking their fists and honking because cars are going faster than normal for him. Count your blessings. |
#385
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Should Cyclists Pack Guns?
On Thu, 03 May 2007 09:19:59 -0400, dgk wrote:
On Wed, 02 May 2007 13:47:37 -0700, Turby wrote: On 2 May 2007 10:00:40 -0700, wrote: On May 2, 12:10 pm, Turby wrote: On 2 May 2007 07:23:29 -0700, wrote: Again - so many fearful people in this country. It's kind of sad. Yeah, it is. The statistics say that one out of three women in America will be sexually assaulted in her lifetime. Oh? Do you have a citation for that? There are plenty of cites. It doesn't take much effort to find them. As the CDC page points out, the stats are variable and difficult to pin down, but the one thing that sticks out is that rapes are entirely too common. I can't think of anyone I knew who was murdered, and almost no one who was robbed at gunpoint, but I know numerous women who were raped. http://tinyurl.com/mnemk http://www.cdc.gov/ncipc/factsheets/svfacts.htm http://tinyurl.com/eu2pu http://www.rainn.org/statistics/index.html http://www2.ucsc.edu/rape-prevention/statistics.html http://www.feminist.com/antiviolence/facts.html Let's look a closer at the stats: "Around the world at least I women in 3 has been beaten, coerced into sex or otherwise abused in her lifetime. Most often the abuser is a member of her own family. (John Hopkins School of Public Health 2000)" It does not say "one out of three women in America will be sexually assaulted in her lifetime". The first cite says, "1 out of every 3 American women will be sexually assulted in her lifetime." Lumped into that figure are those who have been beaten, coerced into sex, or otherwise abused. These are still outrageous numbers by the way, I do not mean to minimize that. Which is the whole point. We can quibble all day about the numbers, but no matter which ones are right, they're all ridiculously high. The final line is the breaker here though. Most often a member of her own family. Yeah, but - 1/3 are by strangers, and 1/4 are in a public place. Those are still big numbers. The odds of someone jumping out while you're on your bike and dragging you off and raping or assaulting you are absurdly small. Sure, it can happen. But please don't make it seem like there is any realistic chance that it will happen. But it does happen. 99.9% of men never have to even consider it, but for women , it is a real concern. In 59 years, only twice might I have used a gun in self-defense - once in Morocco and once in Nigeria Carrying in both those places was out of the question, and I found better ways to defuse the situation. Yet many men feel it necessary to carry here in the US. I submit the threat of sexual assault on women is far greater than the odds of any man needing to use a gun for self-defense. These women you know of who were raped, were they just hauled off the street or was it someone they knew? Both. -- Turby the Turbosurfer |
#386
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Should Cyclists Pack Guns?
On 3 May 2007 05:33:08 -0700, evelyn wrote:
Whatever. I do believe being groped, penetrated by anything, or sodomized is rape. Ladies, do you agree? The government doesn't. Groping is not rape. Penetration is the key. There is a _huge_ difference. http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/glance/rape.htm Rape - Forced sexual intercourse including both psychological coercion as well as physical force. Forced sexual intercourse means penetration by the offender(s). Includes attempted rapes, male as well as female victims, and both heterosexual and homosexual rape. Attempted rape includes verbal threats of rape. -- Turby the Turbosurfer |
#387
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Should Cyclists Pack Guns?
wrote in message oups.com... On May 3, 8:02 am, evelyn wrote: On May 2, 4:55 pm, wrote: You're correct, it's permitted. I wasn't disputing that. I was disputing the supposed need to carry it, and wondering about the fearful mental state that makes one think a gun is needed. That's all. Statements like "it only takes one time" indicate you're not being realistic. Watch out for those meteorites! - Frank Krygowski "Watch out for those meteorites", now that's being realistic. |
#388
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Should Cyclists Pack Guns?
"nash" wrote in message news:Fgo_h.156287$DE1.6632@pd7urf2no... "evelyn" wrote in message oups.com... On May 2, 4:55 pm, wrote: I would add that it may make you feel over confident. Police can tell you. A person coming through your door with a knife while you are sitting 12 feet away watching TV with a gun beside you will be able to kill you before you can fire even once. want to bet, |
#389
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Should Cyclists Pack Guns?
On May 3, 12:49 pm, Turby wrote:
The first cite says, "1 out of every 3 American women will be sexually assulted in her lifetime." Really, that's not much of a citation. I see no source for the number, and no clue as to how it was determined. It's impossible to tell if it has any validity. Those of us on the rec.bicycles.* groups are very familiar with impressive-sounding numbers that have no validity. The most famous (in our sphere) is an almost universal claim that a certain style of hat will reduce certain injuries by "85%". Unfortunately, there was only one tiny study that concluded that, and it's been shown to be completely bogus. It's also been refuted by many other studies. Yet the claim persists by those in the business of making such claims. So, tracking down the original source of that claim may give us some idea as to its validity. At the moment, it sounds very fishy - unless, once again, the definition of "sexual assault" extends to things even the most timid and shy 16-year-old guy tries on a first date. - Frank Krygowski |
#390
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Should Cyclists Pack Guns?
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