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#61
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Horst link bending forces
lou.holtman wrote:
From 105 and up it is hard to tell the difference when clean. I think I can tell the difference between 105 and DA especially shifting in front and braking. But is it worth the price difference? I don't know but Shimano have to realize that they make their profit because the regular cyclist buys DA components and I think it's a shame that they don't offer the proper gearing for the regular cyclist in DA quality. "Proper gearing for the regular cyclist", is that some casette/chainrings configuration that the pros have different? -- underground experts united http://user.it.uu.se/~embe8573 |
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#62
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Horst link bending forces
On 2/7/2018 9:33 AM, Emanuel Berg wrote:
lou.holtman wrote: From 105 and up it is hard to tell the difference when clean. I think I can tell the difference between 105 and DA especially shifting in front and braking. But is it worth the price difference? I don't know but Shimano have to realize that they make their profit because the regular cyclist buys DA components and I think it's a shame that they don't offer the proper gearing for the regular cyclist in DA quality. "Proper gearing for the regular cyclist", is that some casette/chainrings configuration that the pros have different? Yes. |
#63
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Horst link bending forces
lou.holtman wrote:
From 105 and up it is hard to tell the difference when clean. BTW does this refer to shifting in particular? Shimano 105 5800 consists of a casette, a crankest, a chain, front and rear derailleurs, shifters, brake levers, and rim brakes. -- underground experts united http://user.it.uu.se/~embe8573 |
#64
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Horst link bending forces
sms wrote:
From 105 and up it is hard to tell the difference when clean. I think I can tell the difference between 105 and DA especially shifting in front and braking. But is it worth the price difference? I don't know but Shimano have to realize that they make their profit because the regular cyclist buys DA components and I think it's a shame that they don't offer the proper gearing for the regular cyclist in DA quality. "Proper gearing for the regular cyclist", is that some casette/chainrings configuration that the pros have different? Yes. Maybe that is a signal as good as any the regular cyclist doesn't have to bother with DA? -- underground experts united http://user.it.uu.se/~embe8573 |
#65
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Horst link bending forces
On Wednesday, February 7, 2018 at 6:45:35 PM UTC+1, Emanuel Berg wrote:
lou.holtman wrote: From 105 and up it is hard to tell the difference when clean. BTW does this refer to shifting in particular? Yes and braking. The weight and appearance difference are obvious. Lou |
#66
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Horst link bending forces
lou.holtman wrote:
BTW does this refer to shifting in particular? Yes and braking. Can you get DA with discs? -- underground experts united http://user.it.uu.se/~embe8573 |
#67
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Horst link bending forces
John B. wrote:
I think it is pretty much a fact of modern life. Try build and selling a Mercedes automobile :-) Or even labeling something as "Made in U.S.A." I found a 2009 catalog from Nishiki, and it is still difficult to get a clear reading... They have a couple of carbon road bikes, and they say "all Nishiki road bikes are hand-built in Gothenburg". With their aluminium frames, they say they are "hand wielded". If you "build" a bike somewhere, that cannot exclude the most important part, the frame, right? On the most expensive model, the "Limited Carbon", the frame is HM-90 carbon, HM = "high modulus", and this refers to surplus epoxy being extracted when it starts to harden... to get the same strength but lighter still. As for materials, aluminium/aluminum 6061-T6 is another "alloy designation" I'm aware of... I'd hope that you would be aware of 6061 aluminum alloy. It was first introduced in 1935 :-) The alloy on their more expensive frames is 7005-T6. Here is what Wikipedia says: 7005 is an aluminium alloy used primarily for less expensive bicycle frames, due to its relative ease of welding and manufacture, it not requiring expensive heat treating. It has similar physical properties to 6061 aluminium alloy, except it has a higher density of 2.78 g/cm^3 (as opposed to 2.70 g/cm^3 or ~= +3%), and depending on the temper, may be slightly stronger. It does not need to be precipitation hardened, unlike 6061, but can be cooled in air. [1] BTW what does it mean when aluminium is "reduced"? Is the the equivalent of butted steel tubes? [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/7005_aluminium_alloy -- underground experts united http://user.it.uu.se/~embe8573 |
#68
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Horst link bending forces
lou.holtman wrote:
Yes and braking. The weight and appearance difference are obvious. DA has a pedal as well I just learned. Again looking thru the Nishiki 2009 catalog the most expensive model is all DA, the second is also all DA, but the next one down the line is not "all Ultegra", instead the rear derailleur is DA, then it is Ultegra, then further down the RD is Ultegra and the rest is 105, and so on, so I suppose the RD is the component component that people check out first? Also I don't know how this is to be interpreted, either it is a wonder of backward compatibility, or it is an indication nothing really new under the sun... -- underground experts united http://user.it.uu.se/~embe8573 |
#69
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Horst link bending forces
On Wed, 07 Feb 2018 18:33:55 +0100, Emanuel Berg
wrote: lou.holtman wrote: From 105 and up it is hard to tell the difference when clean. I think I can tell the difference between 105 and DA especially shifting in front and braking. But is it worth the price difference? I don't know but Shimano have to realize that they make their profit because the regular cyclist buys DA components and I think it's a shame that they don't offer the proper gearing for the regular cyclist in DA quality. "Proper gearing for the regular cyclist", is that some casette/chainrings configuration that the pros have different? From what I read Dura Ace offers, in 10 speed, 11-21/11-23/11-28/12-23 and 12-27, cassettes and chain wheel combinations in a number of combinations, the lowest of which seems to be 50/34 teeth. They also offer 7 different length of crank arm ranging from 165 to 180mm. That should keep most road cyclists happy. -- Cheers, John B. |
#70
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Horst link bending forces
On Wednesday, February 7, 2018 at 7:33:08 PM UTC+1, Emanuel Berg wrote:
lou.holtman wrote: BTW does this refer to shifting in particular? Yes and braking. Can you get DA with discs? -- underground experts united http://user.it.uu.se/~embe8573 Yes in the latest version. Lou |
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