Ride an SUB not an SUV

"George Conklin" wrote in
rthlink.net:

And
besides, people will always use their cars for shopping even if
they

Not me. In Germany I always used the basket on my bicycle.

Going shopping every day for something to eat is a total waste of
time.

I enjoyed going every day because my organic grocer was also a good friend
and we liked to talk and talk about everything, but I really only needed to
go maybe every 4th day. I'm a bachelor so a basket holds enough. If I were
feeding a family, then I would have taken my bicycle trailer, all four
paniers, or a backpack in addition to the basket.

Nate Nagel wrote in
:

And
besides, people will always use their cars for shopping even if they

Not me. In Germany I always used the basket on my bicycle.

Going shopping every day for something to eat is a total waste of
time.

Eh, I could see it being less wasteful, if it could be done in a quick
and easy manner on the way home from work.

There's the spirit!

However, trying to shop at
any supermarket near me is a colossal waste of time and fills me with
a deep loathing of my fellow man; if I had to do it more than once a

Well, in Germany the small medeival walled village where I lived was very
pretty with rivers and covered wooden bridges. It was a pleasure any excuse
to ride through it.

week I'd be up in a tower with automatic weapons. There are so many
things to hate about shopping for food, but mostly the teeming masses
of people who operate a shopping cart exactly how they drive (i.e.
badly, and usually blocking your way) and the long checkout lines are
the main peeves.

LOL

I know what you mean. I'm not in Germany anymore. I'm in LA, now. Buying
would be no fun if I were working and therefore buying them at the rush
period at a normal grocery store.

I'll let you in on a secret. The health food stores and organic food stores
are far less crowded and the food a much better quality, and I think I save
money because I can eat less while getting more nutrition.

In article ,
Doc O'Leary wrote:
In article ,
"Jack May" wrote:

A car does not have to stop and pick up people ever mile or so.

Neither does mass transit.

Again, you're getting caught up in the
current model of car-centric, bad transit planning. Stop bothering me
with things we all know are done wrong and lets move on to thinking how
they can be done right.

And again you've got no specifics.

Prove it. Demonstrate that moving just the people *must* take more time
than moving the people *and* their cars.

The burden of proof is on you to show a system where it doesn't.
Because in most real life as-they-are-today systems, transit takes longer.

You provide no evidence. I've asked for this before, but the very
minimum you can do is figure out your own door-to-door commute time and
distance. I think you will be very fortunate if you find your average
speed ends up exceeding a whopping 25mph. Are you really suggesting
that no other form of travel could possibly beat that?

Takes me 20-30 minutes to get to work in traffic. Distance is 9.5
miles, straight line. Sure enough, quite slow. But the road distance
is about 17 miles. So when are your mass-transit air vehicles going
to be available?

Taking transit, BTW, would be an exercise in futility. It's actually
possible, but it would be a three bus ride taking hours.
--
There's no such thing as a free lunch, but certain accounting practices can
result in a fully-depreciated one.

In article , Dan wrote:

I'll let you in on a secret. The health food stores and organic food stores
are far less crowded and the food a much better quality, and I think I save
money because I can eat less while getting more nutrition.

I shop at night at small independent grocers... seems to do the trick.

"donquijote1954" wrote in
ups.com:

Wrong. It looks horrible because the population of the US isn't
dense enough to make it work. This is a *gig* country.

Right. And the population isn't dense enough, because the government
has for so many years subsidized cheap gas and roads, triggering
insane suburban sprawl. So now instead of a pleasant walk or bicycle
ride to work each morning, you have to buy a car, pay for insurance,
pay for gas, and sit for hours in traffic. And to pay for all those
things you have to work even harder. A crappy government policy has
made you a stressed wage slave, and made tons of money for car
companies, insurance companies, and oil companies. America the
beautiful indeed.

Does anyone running for the White House with these ideas? How about
Congress? Well, at least for commissioner or bicycle coordinator.

Ron Paul for President!

Tough luck. It seems nobody thinks about the simple guy anymore. Or
maybe they get paid to look the other way.

True. They are selling out America to the globalists for bribes.

Brent P wrote:
In article , Dan wrote:


I'll let you in on a secret. The health food stores and organic food stores
are far less crowded and the food a much better quality, and I think I save
money because I can eat less while getting more nutrition.


I shop at night at small independent grocers... seems to do the trick.



Don't have much in the way of either around here, unless you count Whole
Foods (which is pretty much a normal supermarket in terms of Things That
Annoy Me) or Trader Joe's (which is not bad, but it's small and limited
in selection) but what is working for me is the co-op thing, I give my
neighbor a couple hundred bucks at the start of the season and I get
fresh veggies every week. There is a little grocery store/ 7-11
knockoff owned by an Asian family, but I'm not a big fan of the place...

I may start growing my own vegetables next year, I doubt it will happen
this year though (too many other things to clean up/fix first)

nate

--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

"Pat" wrote in
ps.com:

Wrong. It looks horrible because the population of the US isn't
dense enough to make it work. This is a *gig* country.

Right. And the population isn't dense enough, because the government
has for so many years subsidized cheap gas and roads, triggering
insane suburban sprawl. So now instead of a pleasant walk or bicycle
ride to work each morning, you have to buy a car, pay for insurance,
pay for gas, and sit for hours in traffic. And to pay for all those
things you have to work even harder. A crappy government policy has
made you a stressed wage slave, and made tons of money for car
companies, insurance companies, and oil companies. America the
beautiful indeed.

Does anyone running for the White House with these ideas? How about
Congress? Well, at least for commissioner or bicycle coordinator.

Tough luck. It seems nobody thinks about the simple guy anymore. Or
maybe they get paid to look the other way.

You've got cause and effect wrong. People don't drive cars because
the gov't subsidizes roads. The government builds roads because
people drive cars. Given a choice, most people prefer to NOT live in
cities -- especially the downtowns. Wait a minute. People DO have a
choice and they DO chose not to live in downtowns.

In Europe, the town centers are not the crime centers, so you can live
there safely. Also, many offices tend not to be down town, but off in the
forest where it's pretty.

And, people don't use things just because they're subsidized. People
use things because it makes the most sense for them. Look at
condoms. They can be gotten for free from a number of sources, but
people don't use them even in the face of the theat of HIV. Lots of
kids and other people don't use any form of birth control -- which can
also be obtained for little or no cost -- even in the face of
pregnancy. Do people have more kids just to take advantage of the tax
credit for them? Of course not.

Maybe they think the quality of life has gotten so bad, that they don't
care if they die from doing the only thing that's fun. I've seen a lot of
teens who don't care anymore. It's what has spawned the anarchist teen
culture in Europe.

I don't need condoms for spiritual reasons that preclude using other
people merely for sex.

Bikes are great for some people. But for the vast majority of people
they are pretty impractical. But if you like it and it works for you,
bike-on.

It's not the bicycle that is impractical, but the car culture that is in
their way, correct?

-
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"Matthew T. Russotto" wrote in message
t...
In article
,

Prove it. Demonstrate that moving just the people *must* take more time
than moving the people *and* their cars.

The burden of proof is on you to show a system where it doesn't.
Because in most real life as-they-are-today systems, transit takes longer.

Plenty of trips in Portland are quicker using transit than by using car -
especially when you factor in finding a parking spot.

Will *every* trip by transit be shorter? No, not any more than every trip
by car will be shorter.

In article ,
Baxter wrote:


"Matthew T. Russotto" wrote in message
et...
In article
,

Prove it. Demonstrate that moving just the people *must* take more time
than moving the people *and* their cars.

The burden of proof is on you to show a system where it doesn't.
Because in most real life as-they-are-today systems, transit takes longer.

Plenty of trips in Portland are quicker using transit than by using car -
especially when you factor in finding a parking spot.

That's Portland, where the planners went out of their way to make life
difficult for drivers.

Will *every* trip by transit be shorter? No, not any more than every trip
by car will be shorter.

The truth of those two statements don't mean the modes are
equivalent. Most trips are faster by car.
--
There's no such thing as a free lunch, but certain accounting practices can
result in a fully-depreciated one.

"George Conklin" wrote in message
hlink.net...

"Doc O'Leary" wrote in message
...
In article ,
"Jack May" wrote:

"Doc O'Leary" wrote in message

Ok, it has to stop every 2 blocks or maybe even 3 to pick up and drop off
people. You forget I grew up on mass transit and you can't lie to me.

Does no good George. O'Leary is obviously stone cold crazy. He cant
understand even the simplest explanations.