How the Typical Mountain Biker Treats Horses and Other Trail Users

On Wed, 4 Feb 2009 07:55:30 +0000 (UTC), Beej Jorgensen
wrote:

Mike Vandeman wrote:
No, only hikers. How little you idiots understand.

I was talking about horses with humans riding atop them. For your sake,
I should have been clearer. But if you're for that, I stand corrected.

Good. I have never promoted either horseback riding OR hiking.

-Beej
--
I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to
humans ("pure habitat"). Want to help? (I spent the previous 8
years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)

Please don't put a cell phone next to any part of your body that you are fond of!

http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande

On Tue, 3 Feb 2009 20:56:41 -0600, "DI" wrote:


"Mike Vandeman" wrote in message
.. .
On Tue, 3 Feb 2009 05:50:45 -0800 (PST), Siskuwihane
wrote:

Horses are native to North America and have a right to go wherever
they like. Bikes have no rights whatsoever. DUH!
--

That's one of the most dumbest statements I've ever heard

Wrong again, they were brought over by Spainish explorers.

That's one of the most dumbest statements I've ever heard! Tthe horse
evolved in North America and was wiped out, along with the mammoth, by
early humans. Go stand in the corner.
--
I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to
humans ("pure habitat"). Want to help? (I spent the previous 8
years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)

Please don't put a cell phone next to any part of your body that you are fond of!

http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande

"Mike Vandeman" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 3 Feb 2009 20:56:41 -0600, "DI" wrote:


"Mike Vandeman" wrote in message
. ..
On Tue, 3 Feb 2009 05:50:45 -0800 (PST), Siskuwihane
wrote:

Horses are native to North America and have a right to go wherever
they like. Bikes have no rights whatsoever. DUH!
--

That's one of the most dumbest statements I've ever heard

Wrong again, they were brought over by Spainish explorers.

That's one of the most dumbest statements I've ever heard! Tthe horse
evolved in North America and was wiped out, along with the mammoth, by
early humans. Go stand in the corner.

The horse as we know it was not the one wiped out, and who knows it was
wiped out by humans, it may have been from global cooling. Just another
dumb statement by MV


--
I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to
humans ("pure habitat"). Want to help? (I spent the previous 8
years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)

Please don't put a cell phone next to any part of your body that you are
fond of!

http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande

Mike Vandeman wrote:
Good. I have never promoted either horseback riding OR hiking.

Would it be fair to say you are against these activities taking place
off the city streets?

-Beej

On Feb 3, 9:01*pm, Mike Vandeman wrote:
On Tue, 3 Feb 2009 05:50:45 -0800 (PST), Siskuwihane

wrote:
On Jan 31, 11:09*pm, Mike Vandeman wrote:
\"I have lived in Marin since the 50s and have been riding horses here
since 1962. *I would like to share two of my experiences of why I
believe that horses and bicycles on single track trails are oil and
water. *snip BSTwo horses weighting 1000 lbs. with
riders perched on top, making them about 7 ft. tall and she couldn't
see us. *I rest my case."

2000 lbs of horses on a trail, imagine the damage cause by those
animals and yet Michael J. Vandeman is defending them instead of
trying to get them banned.

Horses are native to North America and have a right to go wherever
they like. Bikes have no rights whatsoever. DUH!

But you claimed the native horses were wiped out by early humans,
these are not native horses, thus they do not belong.

On Wed, 4 Feb 2009 10:56:10 -0600, "DI" wrote:


"Mike Vandeman" wrote in message
.. .
On Tue, 3 Feb 2009 20:56:41 -0600, "DI" wrote:


"Mike Vandeman" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 3 Feb 2009 05:50:45 -0800 (PST), Siskuwihane
wrote:

Horses are native to North America and have a right to go wherever
they like. Bikes have no rights whatsoever. DUH!
--

That's one of the most dumbest statements I've ever heard

Wrong again, they were brought over by Spainish explorers.

That's one of the most dumbest statements I've ever heard! Tthe horse
evolved in North America and was wiped out, along with the mammoth, by
early humans. Go stand in the corner.

The horse as we know it was not the one wiped out, and who knows it was
wiped out by humans, it may have been from global cooling. Just another
dumb statement by MV

You just don't want to admit that you were dead wrong.
--
I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to
humans ("pure habitat"). Want to help? (I spent the previous 8
years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)

Please don't put a cell phone next to any part of your body that you are fond of!

http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande

On Wed, 4 Feb 2009 18:04:38 +0000 (UTC), Beej Jorgensen
wrote:

Mike Vandeman wrote:
Good. I have never promoted either horseback riding OR hiking.

Would it be fair to say you are against these activities taking place
off the city streets?

No. I just don't promote them. You can't be against EVERYTHING! The
most important thing is to reduce the human footprint, by eliminating
mountain biking and designating areas that are off-limits to all
humans.

-Beej
--
I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to
humans ("pure habitat"). Want to help? (I spent the previous 8
years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)

Please don't put a cell phone next to any part of your body that you are fond of!

http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande

On Wed, 4 Feb 2009 16:18:31 -0800 (PST), Kayak44
wrote:

On Feb 3, 9:01*pm, Mike Vandeman wrote:
On Tue, 3 Feb 2009 05:50:45 -0800 (PST), Siskuwihane

wrote:
On Jan 31, 11:09*pm, Mike Vandeman wrote:
\"I have lived in Marin since the 50s and have been riding horses here
since 1962. *I would like to share two of my experiences of why I
believe that horses and bicycles on single track trails are oil and
water. *snip BSTwo horses weighting 1000 lbs. with
riders perched on top, making them about 7 ft. tall and she couldn't
see us. *I rest my case."

2000 lbs of horses on a trail, imagine the damage cause by those
animals and yet Michael J. Vandeman is defending them instead of
trying to get them banned.

Horses are native to North America and have a right to go wherever
they like. Bikes have no rights whatsoever. DUH!

But you claimed the native horses were wiped out by early humans,
these are not native horses, thus they do not belong.

We need to restore the horse to North America, just as we need to
restore the grizzly to California, because we wiped out both of them.
Humans belong here a heck of a lot less than horses. Selfish people
like mountain bikers can't understand doing anything to benefit some
one else, or wildlife.
--
I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to
humans ("pure habitat"). Want to help? (I spent the previous 8
years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)

Please don't put a cell phone next to any part of your body that you are fond of!

http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande

On Feb 4, 11:54*pm, Mike Vandeman wrote:
On Wed, 4 Feb 2009 16:18:31 -0800 (PST), Kayak44





wrote:
On Feb 3, 9:01*pm, Mike Vandeman wrote:
On Tue, 3 Feb 2009 05:50:45 -0800 (PST), Siskuwihane

wrote:
On Jan 31, 11:09*pm, Mike Vandeman wrote:
\"I have lived in Marin since the 50s and have been riding horses here
since 1962. *I would like to share two of my experiences of why I
believe that horses and bicycles on single track trails are oil and
water. *snip BSTwo horses weighting 1000 lbs. with
riders perched on top, making them about 7 ft. tall and she couldn't
see us. *I rest my case."

2000 lbs of horses on a trail, imagine the damage cause by those
animals and yet Michael J. Vandeman is defending them instead of
trying to get them banned.

Horses are native to North America and have a right to go wherever
they like. Bikes have no rights whatsoever. DUH!

But you claimed the native horses were wiped out by early humans,
these are not native horses, thus they do not belong.

We need to restore the horse to North America, just as we need to
restore the grizzly to California, because we wiped out both of them.

Maybe we should also restore polio while we're at it.


Humans belong here a heck of a lot less than horses.

If you really believed that, you would have removed yourself from this
planet a long time ago. You're still around because you are selfish.


Selfish people like mountain bikers can't understand doing anything to benefit some
one else, or wildlife.

See above.

On Feb 3, 7:51*pm, Mike Vandeman wrote:
On Tue, 3 Feb 2009 06:10:38 -0800 (PST), Marz
wrote:



On Jan 31, 10:09*pm, Mike Vandeman wrote:
\"I have lived in Marin since the 50s and have been riding horses here
since 1962. *I would like to share two of my experiences of why I
believe that horses and bicycles on single track trails are oil and
water. *A few months ago I was riding on the wonderful new trail that
Open Space completed last summer. *I was on a single track, on the
side of a hill and a woman on a bike was bearing down on me quite fast
wearing an ipod. *She was intent on looking where she was going,
gazing at the trail directly infront of her. *I realized she did not
see me and I yelled at the top of my lungs and she could not hear me
because of the ipod. *She finally saw me just before crashing into my
horse. * Last week the same thing happened to me in the almost same
spot. *A biker was coming towards my friend and I *going quite fast,
looking at the trail directly in front of her which I am sure you have
to do so you do not hit rocks or ruts. *It was obvious that she did
not know we were there. *We both yelled at her and she came to a
screecing stop about 30 ft. in front of us. *She was very nice and
apologetic and said, "I'm sorry, I never saw you because the bushes
block my view of the horses." *Two horses weighting 1000 lbs. with
riders perched on top, making them about 7 ft. tall and she couldn't
see us. *I rest my case."
--
I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to
humans ("pure habitat"). Want to help? (I spent the previous 8
years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)

Please don't put a cell phone next to any part of your body that you are fond of!

http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande

More lies from Mike.

Impossible, since I doidn't write it. LIAR!
--
I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to
humans ("pure habitat"). Want to help? (I spent the previous 8
years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)

Please don't put a cell phone next to any part of your body that you are fond of!

http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande

But you spun it adding your own context making it a lie.